More Cobwebs

trhis is all rubbish
there is no text book better than Quran, and we should learn and understand what It is saying to us, and try to evolve science using Quran, our ancestors did, why cant we,
All the great muslim scholars and scientist of Islam were scholars of Quran too, they did invent and evolve science, no body called them mullah,
Till now mullaism is being taught to us thats why we know there is some specie as mullah, but Quran does not tell us that, Quran is to read by every person, not jut by mullahs,
We need well educated people with the know of our Ideology to write textbooks for us, else these books will create another generation who will be GHULAM of angraiz, thats what they want.
When Tatari conquered Iraq they burned all the libraries and books ..does anyone think WHY??

humairshah # 1

(We need well educated people with the know of our Ideology)

There is no consensus as to our Ideology - MMA`s & PPP`s points of views differ.

(When Tatari conquered Iraq they burned all the libraries and books ..does anyone think WHY??)

The Tataris managed to ransack Baghdad because the Muslims were too busy with their holy books and resolving their religious issues.

``....When Tatari conquered Iraq they burned all the libraries and books ..does anyone think WHY?? ............``

Could you please enlighten us with the answer to this WHY?

Some objections by Mullas on the curriculum:

Why on one page there is talk about Prophet; and on the next page the story about `Daboo`- the dog?

Why Hazrat Aisha is called first lady?

Why there is a love story in Class 8 book?

Why Condaliza Rice spoke to Pakistani education Minister Zubaida Jalal on Education Curricula?

Why Pakistan ideology? and Islamic Ideology? is not there in books of every subject?

What is the use of giving the history of Mohenjo Daro. It should be only Islamic history?

The TV Panel Discussions have three types of panalists:

The Liberals on the TV discussions sound meek, apologetic and do not call a spade a spade except some like Hamida Khuro.

The confused semi-liberals like the Muslim Leaguers give wishy washy excuses as if trying hard not to sound unislamic.

The bearded Mullas or the Hijabans on the Panel keep confidently thrusting out their illogical arguements. While they denounce the BJP for doing this in India, they confidently keep pleading to do the same here.

Overall, the end affect on the audience is benign, I think, - and audience gets up with the impression that the Mullas are taking it a bit too far and they could at times be quite stupid.

good observations of insecurities nazarhayatkhan.

a friend had asked for a book recommendation. i was telling him about naguib mahfouz- known as the greatest arabic novel writer and nobel prize winner, and began to state a bit of the author`s history and that his throat was slit by fundos. when asked why, i told him the author had written a book `children of gebalawi` in which after going through fictional tales of adam, moses, jesus and mohammed, the author concluded with a final fictional tale depicting `science` as the new religion and indirectly revealed the `murder of god`. the friend was immediately turned off and refused to read anything by the author. i know, my mistake. anyhow, i could find most all Mahfouz books in Pakistan except `children of gebalawi`.

Ideologies are enemies of truth. Any curriculum based on ideology is only a pack of lies.

It`s a good and timely article by Beena Sarwar. I am serving as a lecturer in Englsih at one of Islamabad`s Model colleges where we teach classes from 6 to 12. One issue that`s being left out is that last year Federal Board introduced Punjab Text Book Board`s books for class 9 and this year for class 10. Previously we had interactive books on English Published by some private publisher. The books from Punjab Text Book Board are cheap and rubbish. Their bad quality is simply mind-boggling. It seems as if somebody has translated articles from Urdu or something. The whole book can be easily finished within one month. Model Colleges have Oxford Guided English for Pakistan Series from Class 6 to 8. Now our studnets in class 9 and 10 who have studied much more difficult Oxford Series books in their junior classes laugh at the books and teachers. We Englsih tecahers feel ashamed at these books. May God save us from curriculum wing.

NHK # 4 - You wrote ``The Tataris managed to ransack Baghdad because the Muslims were too busy with their holy books and resolving their religious issues. ``

NHK - you should stick to commenting on topics you ACTUALLY know about. It is the illiterate `educated` people like you who need to be reformed before you go about `reforming` the rest of the population. This is the most stupidest, dumbest, baseless, and corrupt explanation of the sacking of Baghdad I have ever heard. Instead of wasting your time oozing out these absurdities, why don`t you spend some time surfing internet and finding about the history of mongols. tartars, baghdad ect. It will give you a proper context of history before you make a fool of yourself.

Zain Malik

Beena,

Is it the same on all these privately run schools? i mean is there curriculum filled with all this stuff as well?

There seems to be so many diff kinds of schools in Pak offering diff kinds of qualifications, O Levels, A levels, and Pak qualifications, among others. Are these schools due to cr*ppy govt standards or have risen due to elite ppl wanting something better, or both?

Homo_Absurdus

You are right, Pak Govt English books are rubbish, i sat down one day with my cuz in Faisalabad and corrected half her English books, she was surprised at the mistakes and so was i... is there no regulatory body that checks for correct English?

Zain Malik, Ballu Khan and nazarhayatkhan:

History books written by well reputed historians like Justice Amir Ali (A concise history of the Saracens), state that at the time Hilakoo`s forces had encircled Baghdad for final assault, Shia and Sunni Muslims were involved in religious debates as to who is right. These debates almost always resulted in violence. There was so much of sectarian violence that the Caliph instructed that all the citizens of Baghdad be disarmed. Needless to mention, Hilakoo`s forces entered the city unresisted and killed Muslim men and women at will.

The above accounts are also supported by Maulana Ahmad Hassan Nadvi (?) in his historical narration of the Fitna-e-Tataar.

Zain: The Tatari fitna may have started a century ago and subsequently may have led to an entirely different background, but NHK is right. He is referring to one sensitive matter concerning Muslims at the time of invasion of Baghdad by Hilakoo`s army.

Beena Sarwar - In the presence of CRISIS level issues in Pakistan, your obsession with zeroing-in ONLY on the religiuos aspect of texts is baffling to say the least.

After all, it is not because of the ``religious` shades in our textbooks that 75% of our population is illiterate; that our university graduates drive cabs in New York; that our `urdu medium` students work in cycle workshops; that we have fewer PhDs than Egypt, Israel and Iran (three other countries with MORE `religious` shades in their textbooks).

It is hightime that we Pakistanis stop flapping our tails at the slightest whims of foreign countries. Perhaps Dignity 101 should be a course added to ALL children`s curriculum.

The article was good....the topic Beena picked was even better. Information regarding ``commitee members`` was new for me. God help you all Pakistanis if your curriculum is to be reviewed by such people. The more I read about your educational system and the kind of people running it the more depressing it gets. If the moderate think tanks in your country don`t stand up against the spreading disease (maulvis and maulanas) nothing is going to change in this screwed up country.

humairshah # 1
``there is no text book better than Quran.......try to evolve science using Quran......these books will create another generation who will be GHULAM of angraiz, thats what they want``

Are you one of those committee members??? You moron! Yeah next time my 5 year old asks me about dinosaurs i`ll tell him to read quran because humairshah the great thought so.

LONG LIVE MUSHARRAF AND LONG LIVE USA!

ahmadzai # 10 - You have your facts somewhat right. However, NHK in his confused zeal to bash anything religious jumbles the FACTS of history. He stated that ``The Tataris managed to ransack Baghdad because the Muslims were too busy with their holy books and resolving their religious issues. ``

He conveniently forgot to mention a traitor who instigated and hastened the collapse of Baghdad. When Caliph Al-Muta`sim began preparing an army to stop the invasion, his minister Al-Alkami tricked him by convincing him to make friends with the invaders. Al-Alkami wrote secret letters to the Tatars promising them to halt any resistance against them provided that they appointed him as a Caliph and allowed him to establish his own Shia` state in Baghdad. When Al-Alkami misinformed Caliph Al-Muta`sim and made him think that a peace agreement had been reached with the Tartars, Al Muta`sim left with his minister, scholars, and leaders to Baghdad to meet the leader of the Tatars, who killed them all, and captured Baghdad. After that the Tatars killed Al-Alkami too because they knew that a person who betrays his country wouldn`t spare his enemy.

Did NHK forget to mention this because in Al-Akami he sees himself and people like himself? I have said this before, and I repeat again, we muslims have been damaged more by the slaves in our midst than any superpower of anytime.

And let me remind NHK that tatars and mongols converted to ISLAM ! They not only converted to Islam but were directly responsible for 4 of the most progressive empires of that time: The Moghals, The Ottomans, The Safavids, and The Mamluks. This is another inconvenient fact that NHK either does not know or does not wish to state here.

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Huma_Mir #11, # 13 - YOU STOLE MY THUNDER ! Bravo ! Very eloquent, concise and too the point. I might add that Tartars (or Tatars) are historically considered to be the branch who controlled crimean region and who eventually ruled Russia. Whereas Mongols are considered to be a branch which took over asia and middle east.

Excellent Job !!! Thanks !

Zain Malik

agreeing with #13 huma_mir

this article and so many other articles keep forgetting that the reason we have just started to talk obsessively about educational reforms is very seasonal itself. it will all change once the political situation changes. Cowasjee in his article `Intolerance? bigotry? ignorance? ` on jan 25, 2004 talked briefly about how the curriculum has been getting `reformed` as it suited our governments interests. which i believe are inextricably tied to the Imperialistic endeavors of US. when it suited them we added all the elements of militancy and hatred to our curriculum and when it is no longer serving them we have now decided to take it out. i dont think we should have any kind of hatred in curriculum but when has it ever been about educating our masses? we are only talking about it now because our madressahs and schools do not US agenda anymore. as far as we are concerned we dont have an agenda. and the curriculum never served our needs.

btw Beena, i have read the transcript of Rice, and i do believe that she didnt just mention our minister and Pak. in a passing remark. it was an answer to a question posed by the interviewer as to how we can EDUCATE those muslims who hate us! and how can we export democracy and Civilize them.

its an age old mission of colonialism. the occident only recognizes its existence with the creation of an orient.ie. good/bad, civilized/barbaric.

also, they are the sponsors of the reform. with millions in aid to our education system. so we will be advertising their logo. thats how it works. when you take somone else`s money you do as you are told.

finally, according to cultural relativist perspective, education systems are embedded in cultures. they can only be Reformed in reference to their contexts. other countries or cultures cant make them perform better. so even if we leave out all the negativity regarding US`s agenda, US interference will only mess our education system the way British interference did.