My Pakistan Diary: Lahore Aaya Main Othay Dil Chhod Aaya!

ahmedmadani #173 Welcome back. Sorry to read about the mental depression you have been going through. Although your post was addressed to others on chowk, I would take the liberty of appreciating your honesty in explaining your absence from chowk, and your openness in mentioning a personal matter that many people are afraid to mention to anyone. I pray that you feel better. Even better, I suggest (if you have not already done so) to have your condition checked. Depression and/or other kinds of mental distress are quite common human ailments, and over the past couple of decades there has been a revolution in this field: they have found that most of these can be fixed quite effectively and readily with the help of appropriate medicine.

Please excuse me if I seem presumptuous in suggesting the above. It has always been a pleasure to read your intelligent and humorous posts that are written with great modesty. You are an example and an inspiration for many of us, including myself.

gujjubania:

`Well , you and your friends were generalising Pakistanis as angels and Pakistan as heaven on basis of your experiences in Pakistan . .`

where was this generalization occurring, especially with veeresh?! and perhaps you`ve just selectively ignored to read just how much of a heaven Pakistan really is, in the eyes of Pakistanis themselves!

my good man. . .heaven is a ways away from pakistan right now, and our mullahs and priests don`t even have a key, or the key to it!

and your claim to be `just a middle class guy` and not have any power in india is interesting, when there are fellow indians who would suggest that poor or middle-class pakistani muslims DO have the power to change the status quo in pakistan. hmmmm. very interesting indeed.

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#149 by satyamvada on April 27, 2004 9:06am PT

[Dost-mitter, Farzana and their ilk go on with their lovefest with the pakis.....]

Kindly desist from dragging my name at every opportunity and for no particular reason. If you have read my interactions here, they have nothing to do with a ``lovefest``, and I am honestly not interested in whose is bigger, wider, longer...

- - -
Dear dost-mittarji:

With due apologies, I feel that this `visit to Pakistan` on Chowk`s boards is getting to be a bit much. Is it possible for you to write a travelogue in one installment, rather than stagger it into diaries? What can one say beyond the same thing again and again? I know it happens on almost every board, especially the Indo-Pak quarrels, but my honest assessment is that ennui is bound to set in. Of course, you will be the ultimate judge of how to put forth your thoughts or the views of people more equipped (and tolerant!) will prevail.
Just felt like letting you know my thoughts.

Regards,
Farzana

D.Mitter, V.Malick and Harimau... all of you have recently written and read and enjoyed to some extent. For last almost over 8 months after my retirement I am not well mentally. So never had energy to respond. It took long to come to conclusion I am suffering from depression and anxity disorder. I just have no energy left in me to get up or do any thing. Only halfconcious sleep has been companion. Months went but no change in condition. I always understood as feeling liking sinking ship but no sadness or awareness. Only thing i desired and thought of sleeping, lost kind of sense of eyes and ears. I began to tell wife I am happy enough, want nothing desire nothing wordly or heavenly. I told my daughters not to bother me, they can do nothing as want nothing. Being nonbeliever in religious doctorines of any sort said to myself soul or matter it does not matter. But please stop that music in my mind as whatever my desires unfilled I can satisfy in my mind, but stop that music in my mental mind to wake up , I do not want to wake up. I liked reading South India ganges( Mela) visit by him. I will write some times later when I feel better about all travels by all of you.This 1st time after months used computer type writer. Good day every body.

Dost Mittar

Thats so strange! Do you know what ever became of Harcharn Singh, did he die b4 partition? Did u guys settle in Dilli?

Was your sister married in Lylepur b4 1947 or after? What was LYP like then, was it clean or just as bad as today?

Thank you, Ajeet, Kaurasach, and Dost-Mitter. I always learn.

Anil

dost mittar #170 regardless of who would have come to power if the brits got beaten in 1857 - the mughals or the marhattas or the sikhs - it is doubtful that the indian middle class that led the freedom struggle would have emerged under the kingships as rapidly as it did under the british. the Congress Party, which led the freedom struggle, was itself formed thanks to an english civil servant (Hume), and the freedom struggle was led by indians who were the products of a british education. so, i think the sikhs who helped the brits regain control in 1857 did the entire subcontinent a favor, and there is no need (as i mentioned to kaurasach) to try and belittle the role played by the sikhs.

#160 by vertex,

``...Wouldn`t know...am not Pakistani...``

Yeah, we know. You`re half kashmiri, right!

Gujju Bania . . .

a) Don`t patronise me.
b) Don`t make assumptions about my being naive.
c) Don`t make any assumptions about your views being mainstream.
d) Don`t make any assumptions about nostalgia or socialism.

Thank you. As a favour to me, please and just answer two questions here, please again, if you would:-

a) What have you done to try to improve or change matters?
b) What have you done towards Kalia`s family, since you use his name all the time?

Think about what I am asking you, and please do not go on the offensive with me when you respond.

noorie:
Yes, Montgomery became Sahiwal.

ally:
Funny, my older sister, 12 years older than me got married to someone from Harcharanpura. In fact, my father owned an ahaata (a plot of land) in Harcharanpura. In case you are wondering, I grew up in Guru Nanak Pura which is across the canal from Harcharanpura. My nanake were in Santpura and my chaachi from Douglaspura.

Some history lessons .....
tahmed#165
`` For all you know, if a brutal fellow had become king you (and pakistanis too) could still be ruled by the mughals.``
The mughal rule had practically vanished by then; Bahadur Shah`s writ did not run outside the Red Fort and he was thereat the sufferance of the British. Outside Delhi, it was the Marhattas to the east and south and sikhs to the west.

ajeet#166
``After this event the Sikhs changed from a peaceful sect and turned to militancy, as a result, with a hundred years all the North India came under the rule of Ranjit Singh.``
You must be thinking of the founding of the Khalsa. Sikhs had taken to militancy under the sixth guru who combined meeri and peeri after Guru Arjun Dev was put to death.
And Ranjit Singh`s rule was limited to Panjab and not of North India. As I pointed out in a previous post, even there it was limited to west of Sutlej and extended south up to Multan. You can say that it roughly approximated the current Pakistan minus the Sindh.

Isn`t it ironic that while Guru Teg Bahadur sacrificed his life for Kashmiri Pandits at Sis Ganj, a Kashmiri brahmin one day became the kotwal of the kotwali next to it; in case you wonder, he was none other than the grandfather of Jawahar Lal Nehru.

anil:
The Kotwali is not there any more. The Sis Ganj gurudwara has expanded to where the kotwali was located.

ally jaan,
glad that you are theek thaak! and all the best with the job search. te jadoN vhi msn te aao, meinu itlaah deyo. kadi kadi mein kuj hor kardi aan, te tainoo salaam karday huay pata chalda ai ke tusi tuR gaye o. : )

jeenday rao!

mittarji:

is the Montgomery you are referring to the one that is known as Sahiwal now? ammi still refers to it from time to time as Montgomery as well. : )

ijaz gul,
i remember padri qadir baksh from the few times he came to our house for chai. you see how small the world is afterall? : )

you said: `The Protestant, Anglican and the Presbyterian Churches in Pakistan are in turmoil. It has something to do with the political economy of being community leaders and office holders. This elite amongst the churches is as corrupt as the worst politicians in the country.`

this is so true, and so sad as well. if we didn`t have this to deal with perhaps we would be a much stronger voice in the community as a whole.

kaurasach #162 Lets try not to confuse facts. Of course the sikhs sided with the brits in 1857. The brits even gave them extra allowance to encourage them to take delhi. And thank your stars that the sikhs sided with the brits. Ever stop to think what would have happened if the brits had lost and the mughals had come back? For all you know, if a brutal fellow had become king you (and pakistanis too) could still be ruled by the mughals. I know this goes against conventional wisdom in india and pakistan, but stick to reality and you will find that conventional wisdom, particularly desi conventional wisdom, is garbage.

anil #157 The possibilities are indeed exciting. There is a straight road from the new lahore airport to the border. Let us hope this peace process moves forward. Opening up of borders would be very good for people living on both sides. Even today i am told there are pakistani firms who have started collaborating with indian firms in meeting foreign orders for textiles. Businessmen move faster than bureaucrats and politicians!!