Ten Myths about Ragging

Interesting article.

I agree with some of your comments to a great extent when it comes to sexual raggaing. However i have to say that if done under some rules and regulations it can have positive effects. I myself come from a military background so i am speaking from my own experience of ragging. In Pakistan Military the following general rules apply:
1. No touching while ragging
2. No abusive language which targets anyone other than the person ragged i.e family etc
3. No targeting personal beliefs i.e. religion

Also if properly ragged then it has benefits. Ragging just for the sake of ragging is of literally no use at all. However it serves as a great tool for military purposes, i.e. brainwash the person and mold his mind for the army life. As Shivam says that it makes one not strong but sensless so little things don`t effect him. Well that is true, military requires a tough mind.

I myself agree with the fact that ragging brought me closer to my course mates and to my seniors, those who ragged me became my close friends.

However this is all useful if this thing happens in a controlled environment as in Military where deviation from these rules can even in some cases result in whitdrawl from the Army hence it is very very closely monitored.

On the other hand it if applied in a civilian environment i.e. non military, i personally think it is of no use and can be a very traumatic experience as it only comes out as Rule of The Jungle i.e. No Rules. Hence i think it should be stopped in those cases. But i know as well as any one else this is not going to happen tomorrow.

Ragging helps in taking the edge of freshers. It helps them blend into a team environment. I am ofcourse against excessive beating up of students that passes for ragging but find nothing wrong in a little bit of horseplay.

I agree with the author. Ragging is a pointless that should be done away with.

#2, I have never become friends with any seniors who hurled abuses at me during ragging. I have no respect for them.

I haven`t ragged any of my juniors and treated them the way I wanted to be treated by my seniors.

Shivam,

Excellent article. This tradition is a black spot on our society`s so called modern and educated face and worse part is that courts have to step in to stop something so obviously disgusting. Equally surprising is people`s (read well educated) support for raggingand their casual attitude towards this malice. This Such incidents leave a lasting impression on a young mind and as we are seeing now, encourages them to become ``better raggers`` ( worse animals) than their seniors. These are acts of sexually repressed cowards who take advantage of freshers.

Surprisingly, worse ragging cases happen in Engineering and Medical colleges where supposedly ``better`` students go.

Stuka #3,

Why do you need to insult and make somebody feel like nothing to help them blend into a team environment?

The best case against ragging I`ve herd, ever!

Personally I believe ragging is all about domination. It`s a power trip. The gratification you get by being in control of someone is worth killing for. As history has been our witness, dictators of this world have killed millions to be in control of the general populace. What could be sweeter than power over others?

I`m glad i`ve never been ragged :|

One incident that I think about in remembering my undergrad years was of James Callaghan, a frosh kid who underwent a frat hazing. His hazing initiation required him to swallow exorbitant amounts of alcohol. He never survived it and died.

Callaghan`s death was the result of many behaviorisms fostered and encouraged in these fraternal microcosms; others ranged from the usual being catcalled at when walking to your classes to date rape incidents. There are some frats and sororities that value public and community service, academic and cultural excellence, tolerance and inclusion. And then there are other frats which are little more than the extension of high school...powered by booze and mistaken entitlement.

How they are funded is beyond me. Perhaps old boy conservatives can enlighten us as to why they should be financially supported?

saminashah

yeah it was pretty rough in the era prior to first world war.

There had been a scandal and an injunction passed against ragging the year before, so in my first year seniors kept their distance. Even in hostels, faculty members took turns `patrolling`. So the way it ended up was that we did not even get acquainted with our seniors as we should have.

The scandal the previous year has been that a fresher guy had been taken to a hotel and mistreated there, so perhaps all the hullabaloo was justified. A minority of out-of-control jerks ought not define college culture for everyone, but that is what happens, unfortunately.

Urstruly,

But much different before the invention of the wheel, nahin? Can you tell us about your childhood?

Sadna #11,

You think you can not get close to your seniors without ragging? How do you get close to your own batchmates? Do you take turns ragging each other? :)

MaheshG #13
``You think you can not get close to your seniors without ragging?``
I don`t understand how you inferred that about what I think. Read a bit carefully, please?

``You think you can not get close to your seniors without ragging?``
No of course not, but in our case that had to wait for the second year(our first 2 sems. were combined). Since there was a standing government order against ragging, any fresher could have complained and gotten seniors into trouble even for simply talking. So they kept their distance as I said.

Sadna #14,

Okay :)

I hope you are not lamenting that government issued an order against ragging.

What happened in your case was only a temporary blip that comes with any new order.

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all you guys are missing the point:

ragging is a way to establish the ranking of a new male in the pack

dogs, wolves, apes, humans all define the hierarchy of the pack

better to do it formally than to duke it out!

Fuji,

The worst types of frats/sororities reflect Lord of the Flies mentalities; and the rationale for them is that ``its a dog eat dog`` world out there...but then how do you explain frats and sororities who work closely with social service programs? In addition, which type do you want as your neighbor/employee/wife/husband/future industry leaders?

Ragging/hazing is abusive behavior. Why dance around it?

shivam,
Good to see you brought your struggle against ragging to chowk.I think you can see that some people will believe that ragging is healthy and ``makes you a man``.Probably these are the day scholars from big cities.The point that cant be emphasised enough is the necessity of tehelka like expose to bring out the ugly face of ragging in front of everybody.I would not be surprised if then I see the so called men peeing in their pants.
Ragging, and degrading tortures like Abu Gharaib, seem like a devious psychological ploy in which the victim is degraded in such a way, that
a) he tends to think that something is wrong with himself
b) tries to cut out that memory with from his mind, and this can have enormous psychological consequences.Cutting away sexual ragging from your mind, will result in shying away from exploring ones sexuality and gender identity.This may result in fear of the unknown which results in bigotry against homosexuals and male chauvinism.
Thanks for writing this excellent article
More later.

my my..looks as if uve been ragged real bad..
but seriously...a good topic uve chosen.

on a side note...atif1 ur i-log is pretty entertaining!!:p

May I briefly respond to some of the interacts on my article on ragging. Firstly, let`s not drift into hazing. Hazing and ragging are different because every fresher has to undergo ragging, whereas only those frehers undergo hazing in Western countries who wish to join certain clubs, called fraternities or sororities. Hazing therefore, is partly voluntary, whereas ragging is forced on you.

Secondly, I was struck by the sexist comments of `nikki7777`. The pointless association of ragging with archaic notions of `manhood` has been dealt with in my article. Yes, MEN should be welcomed with flowers. Why not? The subcontinentaal tradition says that a guest, a newcomer, is like god.

Those of you who are speaking in favour of ragging are requested to clarify whether you have yourself been raggers. If yes, then I can understand why you are justifying ragging. Obviously, your conscience doesn`t allow you to admit that you committed a crime, that you had been sadistic in college.

And to those who have praised my article, many thanks.

The website of our campaign is under construction. In the meantime you can join our maailing list by sending a blank mail to anti-ragging-subscribe@yahoogroups.com. You will get to read a lot more articles that are pro- or anti-ragging. Be prepared for some heart-wrenching stories.

Shivam
shivamvij@gmail.com

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saminashah

I`ve heard that Elvis Pressley was your student. True?

Well written article, Shivam. I like the style of putting things down point-wise. And then running a synopsis at the end. Easier to read and react to.

I think ragging as a tradition had a time and a place in history, which may not really be relevant or required anymore. But then, we can get into another discussion on whether history or tradition have more truth!!

This tradition, in evolved/older institutions, probably had self-correctives, like finessing the difference between exploitation and evolving. In my own case, ragging as a junior for a year on a Merchant Navy training ship helped me evolve highly required survival skills as well as the habit of not assuming anything, always going back to the last known fact before proceeding. It also honed my risk-taking abilities. Most of all, I learnt.

Today, learning (and information) is available from a variety of sources, not just seniors and peers. What would pass of as acceptable a generation ago, would simply not be acceptable anymore. Likewise with ragging.

Finally, I do not think change in ragging scenarios can be enforced. These have to come from within society.

i like the article.

though there are some good points that one gets out of ragging, it is more like the silver linign from a looming cloud.

nevertheless, this teenagish desire to look ``macho`` and ``in`` are sustaining ragging.

I remember my time being ragged. It was no fun. For one reason that i used to refuse to do whatever my seniors used to tell me. That of course led to more hostility on their part. Suffice to say, I never really got to know them and still don`t talk to any, even if i do meet them here or there, and btw, this was Very Mild Ragging, compared to the accounts given here.

Call me over-sensitive, but why should i humiliate myself, to satisfy someone else`s `Power Dreams`. Plus, I was always a little out-spoken for my own good, when younger. :)

This practice of ``making a man out of boys``....never tried it on others, never liked it myself. I`ve grown up to be perfectly well without it. So just a thought but i think others might grow up well without this practice too.

Good Article, and Good Topic.

Shivam,
Ragging is a part and parcel of college and univ life...but the extremes to which it has been taken is most appaling.
When I had stepped into college, I was told that ragging will help me get to know my seniors-something that you had also mentioned in the article. The little ragging (singing, wrong directions to the class, treats in the canteen) did not bring me close to my seniors at all. In univ as well, the ragging was not very extreme with anyone, but it didn`t help towards fostering friendship...
I haven`t been ragged nor have I witnessed any form of extreme ragging. But I do know places where ragging has led to disastrous results.
Any form of activity that hurts people, physically or emotionally is wrong.
A good effort by you all to bring this issue to light.

Dear nikki7777

Are you sure you were `ragged` in the US? Or was it hazing when you joined ceratin frats?
Anyways, ragging is often in extremes, and people like you who insist that it can be fun, ignore the extremes. You said, ``However, there are always those who will push society`s buttons and there is nothing one can do to prevent that.`` So let the world demolish itself, let society condone everything anti-social, we`ll just enjoy life. That`s what you are saying?

You said: ``There are more pressing problems such as poverty and indifference in our society that seemingly intelligent and caring persons...`` No dear, I leave poverty eradication to even more intelligent people to you. I`m happy being dumb enough to be a human rights activist.

You said: ``A little `horseplay` never hurt a fly!`` But it is not `little`, and it`s not being done to flies. We`re talking about sexual, physical, abuse, we`re talking about mental rape here. All this in the name of ragging. Suicides, and even murders! How can you be so insensitive to it?

You said: ``Moderation in all things is the key to an eventful and productive life, not denial.`` Okay, so we won`t kill 100 people, we`ll be moderate, we`ll kill only 10 in the name of ragging. No?

Dear veeresh,

I don`t agree with you, I mean, even thirty years ago, the seniors you thought you `learnt` from, were adolesecnts only a year older than you, and were only interested in some sadistic fun out of torturing you. However, I respect your memories, and agree that people can have good memories of ragging, specially if they have themselves been raggers! Would you mind putting down your experience of ragging in a detailed essay for our website? Please write to me at shivamvij@gmail.com
Thanks
Shivam

Dear JagDeCat, I`m associated with an anti-ragging campaign being run by an NGO. They are taking out a website on ragging for which they want content. I will be editing the site, the contents of which will also be put in a CD and sent to all sorts of people. I invite you to write about your experience in detail. You can write to me at shivamvij@gmail.com.
Thanks
Shivam

Dear JagDeCat, I`m associated with an anti-ragging campaign being run by an NGO. They are taking out a website on ragging for which they want content. I will be editing the site, the contents of which will also be put in a CD and sent to all sorts of people. I invite you to write about your experience in detail. You can write to me at shivamvij@gmail.com.
Thanks
Shivam

Dear Rahul,

You have raised some interesting points. I want to be personally in touch with you, have to discuss some things about the sexual element in ragging. Can you please mail me at shivamvij@gmail.com or let me have your ID?

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being challenged to venture outside one`s comfort zone can be an opportunity for personal growth.

but these kind of challenges have to be presented in a well-regulated environment (resembling perhaps veeresh`s merchant navy experiences?). college kids are hardly the people to conduct such growth sessions; unless that is, the institution in question has well developed traditions that have been tried and tested (as maybe in the defence academies?) and do not damage individuals ``permanently``

for those who wish to experience very challenging environments (not physical as such but more mental) there are courses conducted by at least one organization that I am familiar with. In a short space one is able to grow and realize new facets of one`s personality. A lot of the processes are extremely uncomfortable but the processes are well designed.

most of the college ragging is silly, amateurish and occasionally goes very very wrong.

veeresh

here is a translation. ragging was good for ts rajendra at your time. now that your son will go to college its not good ;-)

regardless value of ragging for my view is that the bihari`s spoilt it, when they started ragging in hindi and poorbi. ragging in english was more or less civilised. however i must say that guys who attend day-schools tend more likely to be sissies.

i disagree with fuji that its about establishing peckering order. seniors and juniors dont generally belong to the same group so their is no threat. the peckin order stuff is more valid in jail.

I`m really glad to find a coherent account demolishing myths surrounding ragging. I live in a small residential University in Bangalore which till my second year had a tradition of what was called soft ragging. This basically meant that they didnt make u strip...but there was public humilitation usually verbal, some seniors were very unfriendly, and NO ONE ever smiled at you. If you smiled back...you had to cut your smile.

All in all...it was nothing compared to what my friends went through in engineering and medical colleges and within a month it was over.

In my second year, one fachha complained about ragging. The University took strict action and suspended the raggers for a year. The student body was outraged..these guys were`nt doing much..they had made these boys sing. How were we to carry on interaction with first years. In a student GBM someone even proposed a resolution stating that no senior would even speak to a first year.

In the past four years there has been no ragging in law school. and things have remained pretty much the same. However two major changes have taken place.
1) first years use the campus much more freely. My batch used to go into the sanctum of the first year hostel as soon as possible. The new batches can be found int he library, gym, comp lab, gardens till 12:30.
2) The seniors who did`nt rag...which were a large majority have begun interacting with the first years. Earlier since one had to maintain a common front against juniors you either spoke to them as inferiors or didnt speak to them at all. Now...that problem is done away with...

Finally, the sickest thing about ragging is the power kick one gets from putting someone else down. If your only claim to fame is being in the institution a year more than I have, that does not really give you any great rights.