I Have Heard That People Look At Her In Amazement

This is one of my favourite pieces of Urdu poetry. But what I mean to say is this:
``When the violin repeats what the piano has just played, it cannot make the same sounds and it can only approximate the chords. It can, however, make recognisably the same `music`, the same air but it can do so when it is as faithful to the self logic of the violin as it is to the self-logic of the piano.

Language too, is an instrument, and each language has its own logic. I believe that the process of rendering frome language to language is better conceived as the `transposition` than as a `translation` implies a series of word-for-word equivalents that do not exist across language boundaries anymore than piano sounds exist in the violin.

The notion of word-for-word equivalents also strikes me as false to the nature of poetry. Poetry is not made of words but of word-complexes, elaborate structures involving, among other things, denotaions, connotations, rhythms, puns, juxtapositions and echoes of the tradition in which the poet is writing. It is difficult in prose and impossible in poetry to juggle such a complex intact across the barrier of language. What must be saved, even at the expense of making four strings do for eighty-eight keys, is the total feeling of the complex, its `gestalt`.``

Your translation was enjoyable but it still needs improvement; you see, nothing is perfect. Good luck.

For a background on Faraz please visit

http://www.tribune-intl.com/features_cont/story2.htm

Ras

ZahraJ #53
``What a joke!....``
Take it easy.

What a joke! All the *intellectuals* are putting their heads together to convert a love poem into something else. For god`s sake, it`s a poem where the poet describes a woman and her attributes. No need to complicate it.

This is as usual a good poem by faraz but not of an aesthetic level one would expect.
First of all most Ghazals , as a convention as well as for artistic merit, are either of 5 couplets or seven. Extending to so many couplets as here gives an impression of quafia-bundee for two reasons: 1) the meloncholy and reflective mood of ghazal cannot be retained 2) Affects the ``genuiness`` of feelings for the elusive beloved (man, woman, idea, God, creed, or whatever is yearned for & is NOT within grasp)..and seems kind of a rant.

The joy this poem gives is because of the style in which simple and easily understandable vocabulary has been used. Hence its immense popularity. Women, Faraz`s principal constituency, like it for obvious reason..the unambigous reference to female features and traits.

The main theme of the Ghazal-numa-nazm is ``taking up the challenge`` The elusive beloved could be a woman, man, democracy, world peace , God etc etc for the reader.

Meaning that if ``she`` is so demanding and has such high standards and values then I, the poet, the lover is no less either. ``Let me try my skills, my handsomeness, my love-lines etc etc ``. In short and in blunt terms that the poet is not the one shying away to put everything on line to win over such a beloved.

Another way of explaining this is that it is a prelude to a sort of ``soyambar`` except that in true ghazal ethos & beauty one gets to picks ones own elusive beloved.

So please read again & enjoy: 4 & 8 from bottom is (makeeN not maseeh) AND it is (Chashmgee rather than the other word ) respectively

The end.

Asif..
`` it is clearly hyperbolic praise of an idealised beautiful woman..``
Yes it is.But IMHO there is one more layer to the poem.
``sunaa hai log use aa.Nkh bhar ke dekhate hai.n
so us ke shahar me.n kuchh din Thahar ke dekhate hai.n ``
The second line of each couplet is an exercise in narcissism;a celebration of the fakkadpana or the vagabond heart of the poet. Probably most of Urdu shairi is a touch narcissistic.

``I Have Heard That People Look At Her In Amazement``

That wouldn`t happen if she were inside a burqa!

#48: Your post should have been addressed to the mystic personality on board (poster # 43 and #44). I think he got carried away in his trance mode and misread your drift. Thanks.

ZAhra,

Thanks for your comments. I don`t think though that this poem can be read in a mystical way at all; it is clearly hyperbolic praise of an idealised beautiful woman--there are no deep sufiyaana messages to be had. Faraz, as far as I am aware, is mostly a poet of love and beauty and not Love and Beauty.

i dont wanna dsicourage ur effort or hurt ur feelings but the truth is ,,,maza nahee aya....

Talha: As I said earlier, this is a loaded poem. It can easily impact the well being of some sensitive souls. Thank you for validating my point :)

Echo: I am sorry I did not completely understand your note. Somehow, I can figure out your excuse, but that`s just a guess. Unfortunately, it`s neither appealing in terms of its reasoning nor validates the castle you were building in the air on another board. I am sure you can do better than that.

zahra jee,

I shouldnt be answering this but I cant help but comment. Sometimes peotry and other symbolic art is just a mere shadow of reality. Its difficult for an amatuer like me to explain to you. But there are metaphysical truths being pointed out in this poem. And many great poets and mystics have been attacked by people for being indecent, but it is the inability of the comman man to understand those poems that results in those attacks.

I believe that this poem is in no way talking about the hijab. It talks about the veil. And it isnt necessarily talking about a human beloved. This very poem can be dedicated to God. And how HE hides his JAMAL with thousands of Veils. Veils of ignorance and material distractions.

41:
Bajaa kehtay ho, such kehtay ho, phirr kahiyO kay: haan! KyooN ho?

Kuchh phool rangoaN kee bahaar dikhhaatay haiN, kuchh khushboo phailaatay haiN, kuchh kaantay chubhotay haiN, aur kuchh amraaz phailaatay haiN.

Ub hur ikk ko kaalar pai tO sajayaa naheen jaa saktay naa?.

Kayee haseen monitor kay hijaab meiN hotay haiN ( both genders). Undaikhhay hee unn say mohabbat cee hojaatee hai. ( pakeeza cee qism kee). Ownnership hee tO appreciation kay liyay zarooree naheeN.

Lekin, sunaa hai... ( Allah! hum tO kuchh keh bhee naheeN saktay)

faqat:

`` Iss dil kaa kyaa karooN, kay beheltaa kaheeN naheeN``

Corretion:) zahra je I thought you were referring to Naqshbandi in your interaction and thus i commented. Ignore my comment.

peace
talha

#40: Would Imam Ghazali approve of the following poem by Faraz? Should not a hijab be necessary for the said character in the poem? There is way too much emphasis on ``Suna Hae``. It seems the whole world knows about this. Hazratae` Nasah: Is that permissible religiously to exhibit the beauty that should stay behind a well put together hijab?

That`s a very loaded poem. Since you have expressed your leanings in a certain direction on another board, I wanted to understand the flow. When you are projecting yourself to represent certain bent of mind and you are vehement in your stand then should not you be consistent in that representation? This is just an off the cuff question. In his drunken mode, Faraz can write many things that are not even decent from any angle(in my view). Well, you can certainly give him a lot of credit for putting a charming spin to the indecent *stuff* in life. With all said, I could definitely appreciate ``Dilae` MuN Musafirae` MuN`` for its depth of expression.