A Case for Moderation

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136 Amjum_m

Good read. I can understand everything said in your post as i have followed the same path. Being a minority in Pakistan is not a pleasant thing and one can never reach the goals they would like to achieve. There have been times when i have been frustrated by Pakistani-Muslim Canadian`s who are very vocal on their rights. I would like to ask them if the ``cat got their tongue(s)`` when they were in Pakistan and when minorities were treated badly.

If you go to the churches in Karachi you`ll notice that they have grown small as most people have moved to the west. These Christians who moved here were mostly Anglo-Indians and Goan`s of Pakistani origin. The Christians that are left behind are mostly Punjabi Christians i.e. Muslims that converted in Punjab and have moved to other parts of the country. Their numbers have increased and are considered the most vocal among Christians. (vocal for their rights) They are the ones that are now filling in the gaps that occurred by people moving to the west.

Corruption is the biggest problem that faces Pakistani Christians as this is the same problem that Pakistan faces. Bishops and priests have be known to buy cars, houses and other material things from the money that is donated to the Church. Even though Punjabi Christian priests and bishops have be known to do the same but i think the future belongs to these people. The PC`s (commonly known in the Christian circle for Punjabi Christians) are very committed in their beliefs and are the future of Christianity in Pakistan. I have a feeling that they will be the ones that will make sure that Christians in Pakistan get what they deserve.

Till then minorities will be third class citizens.

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doublec:
well said on most accounts. I was living in the U.S. when 9/11 occurred, and it is true that during the days after the atrocity all Qurans were sold out in bookshops and online. Whether this has anything to do with a rise in converts cannot be verified - however, the American people have to be commended on their approach to actually learn about another religion and about people who had just attacked them.
The rights or wrongs of American foreign policy can be debated - and most objective analysts will agree that their have been many policies which have caused a great deal more harm than good. However, as many documents and countless research has proved - many of these policies are carried out in secret without the knowledge of 99% of the citizens of the country. For us to blame the American people - who on a whole are open minded - and are themselves a victim of paranoia, a biased media and a one sided school system - for us to blame them is ludicrous and unfair.
Injustice in the world are beyond any man`s control - and what must be admitted is the part we play and have played in contributing to our own downfall - unless we can balance both sides of the equation we can never have the answer.
Take care.
P.S. - i see a canadian flag waving on your personal page - is it fair to assume you are a resident of Canada??

Echoboom:

did you read the fine print:

Disclaimer
The BBC is not responsible for the content of external websites.

I just finshed reading all post in this article and have to ask you if you are coming up with an article that explains how to get Pakistan out of the troubles that she is in? You have said a lot in the posts below but it is high time you prove not to me but to yourself that you have a solution to the problems. If you have then lets see it. If not then why be negative to someone who at least has the courage to try to make a difference?

Vertex..... to you, yes, but not to me or many......

doublec,

`` first 19 Muslims destroy two beautiful buildings killing numerous people first 19 Muslims destroy two beautiful buildings killing numerous people...``

The WTCs were many things, but never were they beutiful. They were an eyesore.

doublec:131

It is good to ask. Thanks.
That was BBC. july 4 2004

http://cgi.bbc.co.uk/radio4/womanshour/2004_27_tue_05.shtml

# 129 Mr. boom box.... er i mean echoboom wrote:

Since the destruction of the twin towers there`s been a keen interest in America in the study of Islam, copies of the Koran are said to be flying out of book shops and significant numbers of Americans, particularly women, are said to be converting to the faith.

How ironic..... first 19 Muslims destroy two beautiful buildings killing numerous people and then flock to convert to the same religion. I presume you read this somewhere but is there any logic in what is said? It`s like saying that Palatines started converting to Judaism after the war in that region.

Gibran,

Just read you letter in Dawn (online). Keep up the good work.

To other who oppose what he says:

At least he has the guts to say such things not only on Chowk but also in Dawn. At least he is better off that most arm-chair warriors/politicians/or know it all people here on Chowk. Don`t discourage people who have more spark than yourselves.

It is these kind of news which the Secularist Musharrafs & Shaukat Aziz type of illiterates supress in Pakistan.

They know not as yet, that they are an endangering species, soon to be endangered.

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Click here
these voice interviews are worth listening to.
Why has there been a surge of interest since September 11?

Sunday 4 July was American Independence Day, and a 20 ton block of granite was lowered into place at Ground Zero in New York. It`s inscribed with a tribute to the people who died on September 11 2001 and will be the cornerstone of the building that will replace the World Trade Centre.

Since the destruction of the twin towers there`s been a keen interest in America in the study of Islam, copies of the Koran are said to be flying out of book shops and significant numbers of Americans, particularly women, are said to be converting to the faith.

Sam Hardie met a group of converts in San Francisco to find out more.

Bina:

Wow. I had no idea.

this was simply one of the truest articles i have read in a while. Simply beauitful. I love how you were managed to place all your ideas in this article so perfectly. I am a moderate muslim, growing up in North America, and for the last 4 years I have been having the same arguments about politics, religion and society with my pakistani friends. Finally someone agrees with my ideas and puts on paper my vision of pakistan and my point of view of the problems facing my country. Good Job.

Stuka, Sudan has both oil and gold which certain people in the US and UK would dearly like to have control of.

aquaris

Thank you for comments, dear. As regards your query about killing of Kafirs, please see the following verses of the Quran: -
2.191, 4.89, 4.91, 5.33, 8.39, 8.57(for strike terror (in the hearts) of enemies), 9.5, 9.12.

As a matter of fact Quran is a dated compilation without indication of the dates of different injunctions. For example in the initial Makki period it enjoined patience and prayer, but when the Prophet (PBUH) came into power in Madina, Quran started giving orders for killing (Qattaal) of the kafirs and enemies. See history of Islam and read about the pre-emptive strike against the Jews of Bani Kuraiza. Quran also says`` Those who do not think are worse than animals``. Today Firouns and Yazeeds have been let loose but the Haamaani Mulla won`t allow even a false prophet to exist to tell us as to which order of the Quran is relevant at this time. As for the mad mulla, I narrate here an historical event:-

In the reign of Kublai Kan, a Mongol ruler of China, Islam had made its appearance in that country. It was reported to the Khan that the scriptures of the new religion say that the Kafirs may be killed where ever they are found and they treat us Mongols kafirs. Upon hearing this the Khan called for the religious leader of the Muslims. A mulla appeared in the court. The Khan asked the mulla whether it was correct that your books order you to kill us. The mulla said, `` Yes. It was so``. `` Then why dont you kill me``, said the Khan. ``We will do so when our time comes`` replied the mulla. `` But you know my time is here, the present one`` said the Khan and with this the head of the mulla went rolling, perhaps straight to
the heaven. After this the khan decided to make a preemtive strike and ordered that all muslims be collected and killed to nip the `evil` in the bud. Upon this some sensible muslims went to the Khan and pleaded that they did not treat the Mongols as `Kafirs` as they do believe in some super power (Mongols believed in the sky to be a super power) and thus saved the muslims from the massacre. Today, Chinese rulers do not believe in any super power even but they are our best friends.

A No-Win Situation
By PAUL KRUGMAN

Everyone wants to go to Baghdad; real men want to go to Tehran.`` That was the attitude in Washington two years ago, when Ahmad Chalabi was assuring everyone that Iraqis would greet us with flowers.

More recently, some of us had a different slogan: ``Everyone worries about Najaf; people who are really paying attention worry about Ramadi.``

Ever since the uprising in April, the Iraqi town of Falluja has in effect been a small, nasty Islamic republic. But what about the rest of the Sunni triangle?

Last month a Knight-Ridder report suggested that U.S. forces were effectively ceding many urban areas to insurgents. Last Sunday The Times confirmed that while the world`s attention was focused on Najaf, western Iraq fell firmly under rebel control.

Representatives of the U.S.-installed government have been intimidated, assassinated or executed. Other towns, like Samarra, have also fallen to insurgents. Attacks on oil pipelines are proliferating.

And we`re still playing whack-a-mole with Moktada al-Sadr: his Mahdi Army has left Najaf, but remains in control of Sadr City, with its two million people.

The Christian Science Monitor reports that ``interviews in Baghdad suggest that Sadr is walking away from the standoff with a widening base and supporters who are more militant than before.``(excerpt NYT)

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no wonder yesterday George Bush accidently said war on Terror was unwinnable -- Dad Cheney took the Mongoloid Boy in his Invader shorts -- by his ear -- to a corner and said hey stupido -- do u want another Saigon -- this time we retreat but never say US will lose -- go out and say we will win the War on Terror.......

we will win the War on Terror....we know Terror....we are the Terror of Iraqi children....we will defeat Terror with More Terror...

........................Elect Mr. Terror for FOUR MORE years of Terror....

arjun_m,

Well, as I said, some 50% or more of the US tax payers support a liar and a lunatic, so I`d rather they keep their money to themselves.