Train from Pakistan, 2004: The Return

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So because J&K had/has a much higher average newspaper readership than whole of Pakistan so Kashmiris were Nazis? Yeah right. These Pakis are really desperate.

Ref KKK #156

[I had the Hindi script from the sign translated by a self-proclaimed expert from Hindoostan. It says that this is a regional urine collection point for bottling and distribution. That is why they charge Rs. 1-00 for serious business but allow free urination for eventual consumption. Apparently this is a very profitable business in india, responsible for the bulk of its impressive economic growth. The large number of NRIs ensures a ``healthy`` and reliable foreign market also. That explains the impressive hard currency postition in India. The more Indians piss the ``shinier`` the country gets.]

If in fact the urine is collected and bottled, I am sure there is good economic reason behind it.

In Lancashire, I was told that in the 1700s the mills used to pay the local folks money to bring their urine which was used -- due to its ammonia content -- to wash woolens to get rid of excess lanolin in the wool. The Methodists got twice the going rate because they didn`t drink while the others used to process beer into weak urine.

In China, hospitals in big cities routinely ask pregnant women to bring their urine in because biochemical companies process it to separate specific enzymes out of it.

Even the hair offered at Tirupathi in the South is processed: the longer hair is made into wigs and the shorter ones processed to extract chemicals.

On the other hand, India is the biggest producer of sugar today as well as has the highest number of diabetics. If I were you, I will be careful of the ``Mellow Yellow`` soda if it were bottled in India for sale in Pakistan. You never know how the bania makes his money!

rsridhar #164 In real life people - Indian and Pakistani - have better things to do than this ``oneupmanship``. The interesting question I think is: why do these India-Pakistan oneupmanship threads get 100 or 200 or 300 posts (including my own) while better written threads on more varied subjects (science, poetry, culture) float by unnoticed, with perhaps a 10-20 posts, tops (see, e.g., the thread by Mohammed Gill on science).

I for one certainly did not come to chowk with any intention of writing anything negative about India. And I know a lot of other pakistanis, including HP and Salim (ex kkandk), joined chowk the same way.

So let me try to do a bit of open introspection on the question of why I am contributing to this veeresh article rather than discussing more substantive things on the Gill thread (e.g.). I think there are two reasons, (1) It is doesnt require much time or effort to amuse oneself shooting down some of veeresh`s far out remarks (and he does provide ample opportunity to do that with comments about his tipping at 100% and so forth). (2) A handful of posters from India write such pretentious posts that one is tempted to do the next best thing to showing them the door (which of course is not possible on chowk), and that is to show them the mirror (as I was doing with mohar earlier on). In both cases, of course, it is a lot easier to do this than to put together a thoughtful response to a better written article on a more substantive subject, e.g. something by Gill, to use the earlier example. (of course, at times i have been very glad to discuss something more serious too).

Anyway, I dont take these chowk interactions too seriously, and certainly have no hatred towards india or indians. In fact, i am quite aware of my deep ancestral roots in india, am thrilled by the socio-economic changes taking place in india, and have no doubt that Pakistan and India relations are bound to have better days ahead. I may add that it is not just india - there is no country in the world that I have not been too and not fallen in love with their culture and language. After all, life is too short to be spent hating anyone (let alone an entire community of people) anyway. I do feel strongly about issues like terrorism, and I think that is rightly so, and it is not with any joy that i say that you cannot reason with terrorists or terrorist apologists. Shakespeare said something about how we stret and fret an hour upon this earthly stage and then are heard no more. So, I for one would rather spend this hour appreciating and enjoying all that I see around me, rather than finding fault and pointing fingers and hating other people. And if it includes having a bit of fun pricking pretentions of some indian chowkies, then that is not too bad as long as one stays within reason.

So I wish you and all other chowkies (indian and pakistani) all health and success in your real lives. All i hope is that those among your contrymen who feel compelled to point out shortcomings in other people`s religion or country, they take the time to do some introspection themselves on why they feel compelled to do this and why they think it is OK.

Finally, I do appreciate your courteous posts and thank you for that.

tahmed32: Using obscenities is simply an admission of defeat. Go ahead and use **** as much as you want. It only hurts your credibility, if you have any left, that is. Honestly, I dont see what is so wrong with picking up the good points from others peoples/cultures; In the case of India, it particularly makes sense as there is considerable overlap, both in the genetic and memetic sense.

the article series is only a series of experiences and subjective impressions. the author didnt see women in jeans and t-shirts in lahore. maybe he was at the wrong place at the wrong time.

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Ref saint #125

[If Pakistan really wants to bleed India , my advice would be to bribe the Prime Minister and the Finance Minister of India and the rest of the ruling class to bring back nehruvian socialism.... ]

Actually, Pakistanis don`t have to lift a finger. Manmohan Singh the Neutered has to get permission from Jyoti Basu before he can even take a leak!

Kkkandk

Post#137

Just adding a bit to my previous post...

As I recall, few years ago, I met a Punjabi restauranteur who was running quite sucessful restaurant in one the cities in England. We were having casual conversation. He told me, even though he himself is a Punjabi but does not feel happy on seeing Punjabi customers in his restaurants. Comparative to Punjabis, he prefers Gujrati customers. He even learnt Gujrati so that he could communicate with them not only in restaurant or food related matters but otherwise too. And, he told me that Gujratis leave good tips, too. :)

In the same city, there was another restaurant (actually, a club), owned and managed by Sikh family. This was a big family so almost everyone from the family was working at this place. No, I did not get chance to interact with them on this but did have food there and enjoyed thoroughly. However, some months or maybe a year later when I visited that place again, with mental image of previous visit, I ordered almost the same dishes. When the food came, it was quite different in taste and I went to their chef and asked/told him about it. He admitted, yes, recipe of the food has changed because huge majority of their clientele is Gujratis. No, they had not Gujratised food all the way but some changes did take place. Just to give an idea, they were/this club was doing sales of over $125000 (hundred twenty five thousand) per month.

Now the Sandaas wants to talk about newspapers and readership. The Nazi Germany before becoming Nazi Germany in Taki’s words:

“Wilhelmine society was philosemitic compared to other European countries; had the highest ratio of well-educated citizens anywhere on earth; was the center of the arts, including music and literature; and was in the forefront of scientific and medical discoveries.”

Is the newspaper readership diversion is to show that the monsters of Gujarat were actually well read and well versed in the art of killing and more sophisticated than the Nazi?

btw, the reason why Paki hypocrites keep talking of fake humanism and killers of women and children - they are desperately trying to fudge the fact that the Lashkar e Taiba is an arm of the Pakistani Army which has been killing women and children in J&K since 1993 as deliberate POLICY - this is the French experts and French law-enforcement authorities` reporting, not Indians. And the Lashkar e Taiba operates openly out of Lahore.

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#141 by salim
//...Gujarat had not happened in 2002, we Pakistanis ... would be compelled to admit that that India was a much safer, better-administered, and more humane country....//

I agree. If Godhra/Gujrat had not happened - things would have come out in a different light.

But don`t let that stop you from travelling. I mean - you pakis have almost exterminated hindus,christians and other minorities ..... and yet Mr Veeresh, the big-tipping hindu, travelled there - right? He had a great time it seems ....... Shias/Sunnis butcher each other all the time - and yet many shias and sunnis do travel to pakistan.

So do travel, if you want to.

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Kkkandk

Post#137

Just adding a bit more to my previous post, with one more incident...:)

In the same city, I got quite friendly with Gujrati muslim restauranteur. I think, he is originally from India, but I am not sure. Do know for sure that his wife is not.

Anyway, this man has or had done number of things in his life (including distribution/pirating Indian movies videos) but had not really been sucessful. He also ran a restaurant but did not work out. He used to drink himself and sell A drinks too. Nothing worked. About 5 years ago, he found one restaurant and took that one on lease. His kismet/luck changed. In this new restaurant, he had problems in getting bar/liqoure (spl?) licence and ultimately he could not. But, in the meanwhile, muslim crowd/guests/clientele started getting interested in his restaurant and they started patronising more.Restaurant became sucessful. Around 60% was muslim clientele and rest non muslim. However, overall, over 75% of the clientele was or is Gujratis (including muslims). His wife used to be Chef in the kitchen.

Couple of years ago, when I saw him, number of things we talked about (spent hours together). Among other things, his sale, which was around $31/32000 (thirty one or thirty two thousand) per month. And he was not only quite happy but satisfied too, in financial matters. His wife, who never had been to India prior to this, had been there for 3 times, since they started this restaurant. He himself had been there more. Not only that, they performed Haj too. And it was in a conversation like this, he himself told me about tipping. Btw he is Memon..I myself do not know much about it...

Must say here that since my last over there, I avoid going to his restaurant now for one reason only.:) I know, he will not charge me or ask for money...and knowing that, it is bit embarrasing/does not make it that comfortable... :) Tomorrow is another day! :)

Mantolives

Post#143

Quote:

`` Some objectivity .... after Veeresh`s one sided lies... ``

What lies has he written?

Let me make it very clear here that it is not about Veeresh the individual but the allegation that he lied. What lies he came up with, in this present article/part of travelogue?

One can fully understand two or more individuals having different perceptions, impressions. But alleging that one lied or is lying is a different matter. So what Lies did he come up with?

warpster #145 yes indeed, the facts are cold and hard: if 1 billion people of the world are indians, and if every second indian is as f!ucked up as we have on chowk, we have Indian contributing 500 million fu!cked up individuals in the world. The pakistani contribution would, per my calculations - again based on chowk interactions, which indicates that one out of twenty pakistanis is similarly fu!cked up - would be be a mere 7 million fu!cked up individuals.

I stand in awe at this another great achievement of Indians.