“Final” solution?

Do we recognize a communalist literature??

It is a fact that most of the time Indians fail to recognize racist and communalist assertions because of the universal acceptance of the communal stereotypes that are carefully cultivated by our culture.
So when the RSS fascist makes sweeping remarks about the Muslim collective beliefs and intentions it is on the same footing with the shrill about tolerating ``Hindus``. It is imperative that the muslim intelligensia in the country should refrain from re-inforcing those very stereotypes that RSS communalist wants us to believe because this rabble rousing deviates the focus of IMs from the main issues of economic , educational and political empowerment.
So do we need to counter RSS communalism with our own brand of communalism???

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#102 by Stuka

At times I find it very amusing that my criticisms of India have led to my being labelled ``Khalistani`` or ``Pakistani; at others I find it annoying; If only compartmentalizing things into black or white could be a panacea for the world`s ills.

``It is the very same democracy you hold in contempt that has led to a form of stability and progress in India. ``

I wish you wouldn`t put words into my mouth stuka. Did I mention anything about the economic condition in India? India has probably ``progressed``. What I find irksome is its being very fervently labelled time and again as ``a great democaracy``. The ban on the final solution in India just confirms this view of mine. I think it is legitimate to challenge the democracy of India. Why cannot people like Rakesh Sharma be allowed to express their opinion freely? why don`t the widows of 1984 and of Gujrat who await justice have their voices ever heard? In my opinion, a democracy should be more conducive of the voices of the dispossed. Empathise. Put yourself in the shoes of these people and ask yourself if they have the same optimism of Indian democracy and justice as you do. And in doing so, could you not constantly compare India to Pakistan as many people interacting here are very eager to. As if by doing that, the ills of India become somewhat smaller in comparison.

Yes, India has ``stabilized`` and ``progressed`` to some degree, but at what cost? I understand the point you make about the Cultural Revolution in China. Maybe progress does come at some cost. However, I am no supporter of the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution in China. Why the need to constantly compare? Does that make things in India more legitimate and justifiable? China implemented the one child policy. Would you recommend the forceful implementation of the same in India? China has ``progressed`` economically (in the cities), but its Human Rights record is very bleak. Comparison might not be such a great indicator of ``progress`` after all.

I think that the growing popularity of the RSS and similar fascist groups is a cause for alarm indeed. ``Progress`` of India not withstanding. I reiterate my opinion that the ban should be lifted on this documetary and that the voices of the dispossed need to be brought to light and heard.

As for ``stability`` in India, I am critical of that too, what with the trouble in the Northeast and communal flare ups ever so often. From a purely economic prespective however, you could probably make a point of India`s stabilization.

I appreciate your post but I still continue to hold my opinion ``challenging`` the ``democracy`` of India. Human rights violations should not be ignored, not in India, not the world over.

Simran

cant wait to hunt them down eh? dont worry we all now live in pakistan.

#127 gujju1

Hindvi ,

Thats their punishment for being anti-India. Do you have family in India ?``

and i am supposed to tell you so that you can met out the same punishment to them?


#137 by gujju1 on October 8, 2004 2:52pm PT

Hindvi ,

so you admit you and your folks are anti-India.

**********************************************************************



Judgement delivered we are now in the mood for some mutilation and abortions eh?

Farzana Versey

Post#135

I have not really understood that post. Not sure how it answers the question/s I raised earlier in my post.

Anyway, thing that I am glad about is that you have responded. Really. For, I was having some different thoughts and have been toying with the idea as to shall I write (questioning, as well) now (post/s on not getting reply from you on this, and perhaps some more:) ), or let it be ....

Chances are/were that for a while, I would have waited more...after that, I do not know if I would have even remembered about raising the topic....:)

Farzana Versey

Quote:

`` In case you have not yet read the news, `Final Solution` has been passed by the Indian Censor Board finally without any cuts. ``

Sorry, I have absolutely no idea as to what is meant by the above.

I came to this board on reading HP`s recommendation/his post which was on your article/board. That is all. Other than that, have no idea. Just responded to few posts, here.

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The following is a link to RSS video mentioned by someone here.

http://www.dailyherald.com/special/passagefromindia/video/rss3-1.mov

I do not understand the language they are using. Can someone translate their song please unless it is a duplication of the hate literature mentioned above?

Ballu Khan: Excellent posts. Do not let anyone silence you.

i feel like taking a bath after reading this article because I feel soiled. BUT! The author should stick to one field and not try and be clever...you can ruin your credibility by coming out with cr@p like the 9/11 was commited by Mossad. get a grip of yourself!

Gujju

``Hindvi ,

Thats their punishment for being anti-India. Do you have family in India ?``

and i am supposed to tell you so that you can met out the same punishment to them?

rajsinghi1 (#116):

I have already written an article on co-opting and colonisation of the Muslims, and there were discussions there. My post here was only in response to the complete turn-around by one interactor who was making loud proclamations to fellow Indians to stay away from my incendiary views...on this board he is justifying those very views...in posts #126,128,129.

In case you have not yet read the news, `Final Solution` has been passed by the Indian Censor Board finally without any cuts.

#124 by Urstruly
“Give and take a few hundereds, the number 18,000 is the federal government number.”

Federal govt in Pakistan would admit to killing people? That is news to me. The numbers HE quoted were from an edhi site I believe, and that too for one year, 1800 odd. Where are those Federal Govt numbers?
I think you are confusing the whole thing with an operation against the Dakoo Sains in “Dadu, Mehr, Nawabshah and the jungles that are around the banks of river sindh called ``Kachcha`` in 1995-96.

I was in Sindh during the crackdown from 1979 to 1983 and actually was politically active and traveled all over Sindh. Nobody ever complained of a large scale army operation similar to the ones that took place in East Pakistan or even in Balochistan. Yes! The army was rounding up PPP and other progressives from different parts of Sindh some of them were harshly treated and during the MRD movement they did open fire in Dadu and some other places but saying that they killed 30,000 or 18000 people is a gross exaggeration.

My family lives in Sindh and in the interior of Sindh. I am positive about what I know and what took place. I think you are relying on rumors.

Opposing the army is a right thing to do but believing in rumors and stories to justify your opposition to the army is a little too much for comfort.

Dost Mittar

Post#123

Quote:

`` I got stuka`s point re. desai right but made an error in deduction re. sitara-e-imtiaz``

Morarji Desai could not have even thought that far even if he wanted to. When it is said, he thought or proposed Bangladesh should not have been created and J&K problem could have been solved or J&K in lieu of creating Bangladesh.

He did say Bangladesh should not have been created but that was because of two different reasons. One, his hatred for Mrs Gandhi . Whatever she had done, he had to oppose. Second, being a misguided soul in this respect, he truly believed that Bangladesh should not have been created. At least, India should not have played any role in that. He was looking at this from a humane angle and that was one of the reasons why he gave orders to R&AW not to indulge in certain activities against Pakistan. It had nothing to do with his having any foresight at all.

One of his statements when he became PM was, Women make mess of/in politics..words to this effect. Probably it was Mrs Bhandarnaike in Sri Lanka who was the PM or President, and Mrs Thatcher who objected to his this statement. He took back his statement and kind of apologised but, he never apologised to ladies in India who also had objected. And perhaps, they objected before objections got raised from overseas.

One wouldn`t expect any foresight in matters of nation building, geo politics from the likes of him.

Dost Mittar


Following is from Hindu paper/magazine..

.......
On a representation made by the non-government organisations working among the riot victims, the delegation said the officials had informed them that the State Government had agreed to remove the anomaly in compensation to the victims of the Godhra tragedy and the post-Godhra riots. They also informed the delegation that compensation to the victims of the train tragedy would be reduced from Rs. 2 lakhs to Rs. 1 lakh per deceased, on par with the amount of compensation declared for the victims of the post-Godhra riots.

---

Following is from Times of India..

Earlier, announcing a relief package for the riot victims, Vajpayee announced that the next of kin of the nearly 820 persons killed in the Gujarat riots would be paid Rs 1.5 lakh compensation each, of which Rs 1 lakh would be borne by the PM`s Relief Fund.
.............

Following is from Tribune..

Excerpts from the interview:

Q: The state government is giving compensation of Rs 2 lakh to next of kin of the victims of the Godhra carnage and Rs 1 lakh for those killed in the communal flare-up afterwards?

A: The Godhra incident was not communal violence but terrorism. It was a Congress MLA who in 1992 moved a resolution in the state assembly for giving Rs 1 lakh compensation to the victims of communal violence. The compensation is being given according to the law.

---

Apparently, later on (after the announcement) they agreed to compensate on equal basis.

hindvi

good suggestion. I have decided that the German version of my biography will be titled ``Mein Kempf en Swine``

[...-Modi`s statement had the same effect on murderous mobs that Rajiv`s comment about the big tree falling and the earth shaking had after his mother`s assasination...]


http://www.fisiusa.org/fisi_News_items/Godhra/godhra058.htm

...Inquiries reveal that no one from the paper had met the Gujarat Chief Minister on the day he is supposed to have quoted Newton`s law to its correspondent to justify the revenge killings of the minority community in Ahmedabad and other places in the state. The paper`s editors too have concluded that the said quote was `invented` by the correspondent to indicate `the attitude of the Modi government.` Indeed, it was all a cooked up job to justify what the paper`s deputy bureau chief in New Delhi said at a gathering of secularist scribes to `fight the fascist forces and not to give them any space in `our` papers.`..

On Cultural Colonization and Racism:

The present global stratification and make-up has been dictated in totality by the colonization and conquest of European nations. Although direct colonialism has largely ended, we can see that the ideology of colonialism has lingered in the identity of people within the general cultural sphere as well as the institutions of political, economic, and social practices. Colonization or the “colonial complex” is:
the “colonial complex”: (1) colonization begins with a forced, involuntary entry; (2) the colonizing power alters basically or destroys the indigenous culture; (3) members of the colonized group tends to be governed by representatives of the dominate group; and (4) the system of dominant-subordinate relationship is buttressed by a racist ideology.(Marger;2000:132)
This process has created the identities of both the colonized and the colonizer with pathological effects. It has destroyed both the lives and the cultures of the colonized and implanted a culture of destruction upon all inhabitants, both the colonized and the colonizer. There are two reasons for exploring the pathology of colonization; first we must understand the creation of the present social, political and economic dichotomy we face, but more importantly we must understand the psychological problems created by colonization, so we as humans can deconstruct the present Leviathan we live in and create a world based on cultural diversity, liberty, and mutual aid.


The Nature of Colonization


Empires, Land, and Cultures
The Ideology of Colonization
Colonization is based on the doctrine of cultural hierarchy and supremacy. The theory of colonialism is the domination by a metropolitan center which rules a distant territory through the implanting of settlements. It is the establishment and control of a territory, for an extended period of time, by a sovereign power over a subordinate and “other” people which are segregated and separate from the ruling power. Features of the colonial situation include political and legal domination over the “other” society, relations of economic and political dependance, and institutionalized racial and cultural inequalities. To impose their dominance physical force through raids, expropriation of labor and resources, imprisonment, and objective murders; enslavement of both the indigenous people and their land is the primary objective of colonization.
Another technique used to subdue the native population is the sacking of cultural patterns; these cultural values are stripped, crushed and emptied. The colonialists see their culture as a superior culture; usually tied to either Cultural Evolutionary or Social Darwinist theories. In an attempt to control, reap economic benefits, and “civilize” the indigenous peoples the colonialist dismantle the native cultures by imposing their own. There is a destruction of the cultural values and ways of life. Languages, dress, techniques are defined and constructed through the ideology and values of the colonialist. Setting up the colonial system does not destroy the native culture in itself; the culture once fluid, alive and open to the future becomes classified, defined and confined through the interpretation, imposed oppression, and values of the colonialist system. At this point the native culture turns against it’s members and is used to devalue and define the identity of the native population.
Their constant and very justified ambition is to escape from their colonized condition, an additional burden in an already oppressive status. To that end, they endeavor to resemble the colonizer in the frank hope that he may cease to consider them different from him. Hence their efforts to forget the past, to change collective habits, and their enthusiastic adoption of Western language, culture and customs. (Memmi;1965:15)

The Question of Land and Resources
Human History is rooted in the earth, everything is centered around or is connected to our use of land and territory. This has meant that much of human activities has revolved around the territory they live in and extract resources from. This has lead some cultures to desire more land and obtain new territory; therefore they must deal with the indigenous peoples of that land. At a very basic level colonialism is the desire for, settling on, and controlling of land that a culture does not posses; land that is lived on an owned by other people. Edward Said points out the rate at which Europe acquired lands at the end of their colonial reign.
Consider that in 1800 Western powers claimed 55 percent but actually held approximately 35 percent of the earth’s surface, and that by 1878 the proportion was 67 percent, a rate of 83,000 square miles per year. By 1914, the annual rate had risen to an astonishing 240,000 square miles, and Europe held a grand total of roughly 85 percent of the earth as colonies, protectorates, dependencies, dominions, and commonwealths. (Said;1993:8)

It was not only the acquisition of land that drove colonialism, but there was also a desire for natural resources and labor. The colonialist countries needed raw materials to support their growing economies. Places such as, the Americas and Africa offered natural resources they could utilize for manufacturing - as well as opened up new markets to sell their goods. Political structures of the colonial countries both economically and militaristically backed the establishment and maintenance of the colonies, but it can not be ignored that a high percentage of the funding for the colonies were provided by emerging capitalists; the Europeans extended their power by promoting merchant houses and chartered companies. In settler colonies like Kenya and Mozambique, there was a plantation-based export-commodity production of products like cotton, tea, coffee and sugar. Places like South Africa and Zaire were exploited for their gold and diamond mines. For the economies of the colonialist states the resources were harvested by the native populations (either through direct slavey or extreme wage-slavery).


http://www.geocities.com/anthropologyresistance/colonization.html

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Does RSS Colonization Exist?

Even if we forget the Chakravarti Kings who invariably went on Ashwamegha Yagnas invading every Dasyu Land or butchering every tribal who refused to bow down to the Khastriya King it is amply clear from the writings of Savarkar and Golwalkar that RSS’s Hindutva is nothing but Brahmanism in guise.(1)

So what does RSS Colonizer wants? RSS Colonization attempts to ‘control’ the culture and religious practices of (muslim) or other minorities through a grand cultural narratives about a fictional ‘pure’ colonizing culture which hinges upon the traditional Brahminical polarities of Arya versus Anarya, Arya versus Dasyu, Arya versus Dravids, Dwija versus Shudra and Astika versus Nastika .

It works on a ‘fictionalized’ and ‘romanticized’ historiography of Hindu history which probably never existed and is projected in its grand narrative as a Cultural standard for all the Indians to follow. However, they forget that such a narrative that forces a standardization of Indian culture by subtracting (Muslim) or other minority Cultures (Urdu, Salwaar Kameej , Kabaabs , Khayaal, Sitar or Sarod) cannot be accepted by the Indian Muslims.

This brings us back to the question of RSS Fascism and it’s irritation towards the non-Arya Dharma. Classical Modernity led to the emergence of the metaphysic of individual rights as being somehow in-alienable and a more fundamental `given` which transcends the collective religions. RSS Fascism wants to re-gain the metaphysical supremacy over this modern ‘Cartesian Individual’ by de-bunking this inalienable-rights-theory and subsume the individual and cultural liberties within the purview of their totalitarian state. In short, the private and personal affairs of the individuals and the various cultural groups would become subservient to those in control of this fascistic Hindu state- so you cannot celebrate Valentine’s day or wear Jeans on the streets because the Fascistic state wants a totalitarian control over how you even twitch any muscle of yours.

In case we propagate this thesis that RSS’s Hindutva includes IM-s who occupy this land, it is like endorsing the notion of Indian nationality as constituted by the Indian constitution and the Acts and Rules thereof. If this cultural nationalism is defined in such broad perspective then Hindutva is a redundant ideology because it gets subsumed under the concept of Indian Nationhood.

However, any attempt to define or re-define Hindutva is welcome provided:

1. It does not impinge upon the freedom and rights of the IM-s to practice their faith and their cultural practices nor forces them adapt practices alien to their culture or religion ( like greeting each other with ‘Ram Ram’ or ‘namaste’ or chant Gayatri Mantras as prayers in the educational institutions)

2. Does not alter the existing power relations between the IM’s and the Indian State.

Finally, RSS would probably never get the votes of IM-s until they realize that IM-s are ‘EQUAL’ partners in nation building and that they cannot dispossess them of their Tehzeeb and in the guise of assimilation.

P.S- How do you recognize a Communalist ? - When he first dares you to denounce his rival!


1.http://www.countercurrents.org/dalit-ilaiah050304.htm
“you call it Hindutva or Arya Dharma or Sanatana Dharma or Hindusim,
Brahminism has no organic link with Dalit-Bahujan life, world-views,
rituals and even politics. To give you just one example, in my childhood
many of us had not even heard of the Hindu gods, and it was only when we
went to school that we learnt about Ram and Vishnu for the very first
time. We had our own goddesses, such as Pochamma and Elamma, and our own caste god, Virappa. They and their festivals played a central role in our
lives, not the Hindu gods. At the festivals of our deities, we would sing
and dance--men, women and all-- and would sacrifice animals and drink
liquor, all of which the Hindus consider `polluting`”

Does RSS Colonization Exist?

Even if we forget the Chakravarti Kings who invariably went on Ashwamegha Yagnas invading every Dasyu Land or butchering every tribal who refused to bow down to the Khastriya King it is amply clear from the writings of Savarkar and Golwalkar that RSS’s Hindutva is nothing but Brahmanism in guise.(1)

So what does RSS Colonizer wants? RSS Colonization attempts to ‘control’ the culture and religious practices of (muslim) or other minorities through a grand cultural narratives about a fictional ‘pure’ colonizing culture which hinges upon the traditional Brahminical polarities of Arya versus Anarya, Arya versus Dasyu, Arya versus Dravids, Dwija versus Shudra and Astika versus Nastika .

It works on a ‘fictionalized’ and ‘romanticized’ historiography of Hindu history which probably never existed and is projected in its grand narrative as a Cultural standard for all the Indians to follow. However, they forget that such a narrative that forces a standardization of Indian culture by subtracting (Muslim) or other minority Cultures (Urdu, Salwaar Kameej , Kabaabs , Khayaal, Sitar or Sarod) cannot be accepted by the Indian Muslims.

This brings us back to the question of RSS Fascism and it’s irritation towards the non-Arya Dharma. Classical Modernity led to the emergence of the metaphysic of individual rights as being somehow in-alienable and a more fundamental `given` which transcends the collective religions. RSS Fascism wants to re-gain the metaphysical supremacy over this modern ‘Cartesian Individual’ by de-bunking this inalienable-rights-theory and subsume the individual and cultural liberties within the purview of their totalitarian state. In short, the private and personal affairs of the individuals and the various cultural groups would become subservient to those in control of this fascistic Hindu state- so you cannot celebrate Valentine’s day or wear Jeans on the streets because the Fascistic state wants a totalitarian control over how you even twitch any muscle of yours.

In case we propagate this thesis that RSS’s Hindutva includes IM-s who occupy this land, it is like endorsing the notion of Indian nationality as constituted by the Indian constitution and the Acts and Rules thereof. If this cultural nationalism is defined in such broad perspective then Hindutva is a redundant ideology because it gets subsumed under the concept of Indian Nationhood.

However, any attempt to define or re-define Hindutva is welcome provided:

1. It does not impinge upon the freedom and rights of the IM-s to practice their faith and their cultural practices nor forces them adapt practices alien to their culture or religion ( like greeting each other with ‘Ram Ram’ or ‘namaste’ or chant Gayatri Mantras as prayers in the educational institutions)

2. Does not alter the existing power relations between the IM’s and the Indian State.

Finally, RSS would probably never get the votes of IM-s until they realize that IM-s are ‘EQUAL’ partners in nation building and that they cannot dispossess them of their Tehzeeb and in the guise of assimilation.

P.S- How do you recognize a Communalist ? - When he first dares you to denounce his rival!


1.http://www.countercurrents.org/dalit-ilaiah050304.htm
“you call it Hindutva or Arya Dharma or Sanatana Dharma or Hindusim,
Brahminism has no organic link with Dalit-Bahujan life, world-views,
rituals and even politics. To give you just one example, in my childhood
many of us had not even heard of the Hindu gods, and it was only when we
went to school that we learnt about Ram and Vishnu for the very first
time. We had our own goddesses, such as Pochamma and Elamma, and our own caste god, Virappa. They and their festivals played a central role in our
lives, not the Hindu gods. At the festivals of our deities, we would sing
and dance--men, women and all-- and would sacrifice animals and drink
liquor, all of which the Hindus consider `polluting`”

Urstruly

Call it ``My Struggle with swine``

HP

Give and take a few hundereds, the number 18,000 is the federal government number. The interior sindh, especially Dadu, Mehr, Nawabshah and the jungles that are around the banks of river sindh called ``Kachcha`` had virtually become no-go areas right after the Movement for Restoration of Democracy (MRD) in interior sindh in 1983 and the way it was brutally suppressed by military. From mid 80s to early 90s the highways used to stop working fron North of Nooriabad upto Shikarpur or even Larkana from dusk till dawn. THe phrase ``Dakoo SaiN`` was coined by the establishment who lumped all political dissidents into this category. The night time raids on punjabi settlements were common in mid to late eighties. That is when I used to go there.

hindvi

I am thinking about including my wild boar story in my biography titled ``My Struggle``

stuka, rajsinghi:
I got stuka`s point re. desai right but made an error in deduction re. sitara-e-imtiaz.

gandiv:
-I distinctly recall the air of unease at the call of the bandh. My wife was to fly to Bombay that day and we switched her to a Delhi bound flight upon advice by the hosts in Bombay. Yes, the reaction was expected in Bombay too.
-Modi`s statement had the same effect on murderous mobs that Rajiv`s comment about the big tree falling and the earth shaking had after his mother`s assasination.
-yes, some police officers did do their job (firing at hindu mobs) but weren`t they transferred by Modi?
-the half-compensation was not a rumour, but an announcement by the state govt.

#121 hindvi

if you have not, read Bahl`s (tehelka fame) novel bunker # 13. no, its not well written (it apparently got an award for worst writing of an erotic scene ), and fictional, but describes what all our fujis are upto, like rapes, drug-trafficking, wepon smuggling etc. they are our own blood, and therfore i suspect morally as corrupt as the wider society.

but then, someone has to do the job of fighting the militants, while taking the paki journos around for famous wazani rogan josh.

Stuka

Post#111

Quote:

``Desai was against the creation of Bangladesh, his point was that we should use the issue to settle our own dispputes with Pakistan and not break the country in two. ``

He was against anything and everything which did not help him in PM of India..:)

When he became PM, and when the whole world was pleading Zia not to execute Bhutto, this coward gave the statement that it is Pakistan`s internal matter.

He gave instructions to R&AW not only not to indulge in certain activities in Pakistan but he went much beyond that.

Award that he got from Pakistan was for rendering services like these...And this is the same person who was called mole of CIA in India, by Seymour Hersh. Yes, case was settled outside the court but Seymour Hersh has not changed his statment, IIRC.

Ballu Khan,

This taken ditto from an article by Shamshul Islam from the site http://indianterrorism.bravepages.com.
It`s obvious that you wouldn`t expect anything better about India from these guy at this site.

Now let`s look at the context of the statements quoted from Golwalkar`s book, which was written in 1947. That was the time when the wounds of participation were afresh and the images of the trains coming from Pakistan full of dead bodies, horror stories of countelss girls missing, women raped, childrens killed. The anger towards Jinnah and the rioting Muslims, for what they did to India was still in air. It was easy for anyone to get caught in the web of hatred.

This is not at all to justify Golwalkar`s opinion about Germany or its attitude towards minorities. Its abhorable and nobody gives a damn about that.

But remember, India is a democracy and everyone has a right of free speech unlike Pakistan, where Mullahs and the army reserve it.

There are all kinds of opinions in India as long as its within the limits of law.

The only places I could find people using Golwalkar`s speech were all India haters` site.
95% of people in India (including me until now) don`t know about Golwalkar or his references about race. I am sure RSS has much wider base than 5%.

The corollary is, this person or his idea is not central to the workings of RSS as you claim to be.

If you want you can take extreme opinions from a small minority and use it as a weapon against majority, but then we can see the whole point behind your argument.

If Golwalkar`s ideas expressed in 1947 were followed in India as you claim here, then instead of Muslim population increasing from 7% to 15% it would have been .7% as has happened to Hindus in Pakistan and Bangladesh.

Other than quoting from Golwalkar`s musings in 1947 do you have anything that proves his relevance in today`s RSS?

Stuka you are joining the wrong tag team, no evidence is enough for this party, anyway read here what a brave indian american girl did:



Gritty journey to Kashmir leads to Sundance honor

Lauren Gard, Special to The Chronicle
Saturday, January 31, 2004

---

When Shilpi Gupta didn`t receive an honorable mention at the Sundance Film Festival awards ceremony a week ago, she was disappointed. But moments later, the first-time filmmaker found herself on stage, behind the podium. Never mind an honorable mention -- she`d won the Jury Prize.

Gupta`s 24-minute documentary, ``When the Storm Came,`` tied for top honors in the short filmmaking category, besting 82 films.

``I was so adamant that a documentary wouldn`t win,`` the 26-year-old says a few days later at a cafe near her Berkeley home. ``I never expected even to be at Sundance, much less to win.``

Gupta`s passion for filmmaking is relatively new. The Brown University graduate didn`t spend countless hours playing with her parent`s video camera as a kid; she didn`t even pick it up. It wasn`t until she enrolled in a photography class at age 15 that she thought at all about the kind of stories she could tell through a lens. Eight years later, Gupta began classes in the documentary program at UC Berkeley`s Graduate School of Journalism, having nixed law school at the last minute.

Gupta`s parents emigrated from India before she was born, but the Long Island, N.Y., native spent six weeks there every summer as a child. Still, she doesn`t speak Hindi, and she never set out to do her masters` project in India. In fact, she was so wary about being typecast as an Indian American filmmaker that she hesitated when she tripped across the idea for ``When the Storm Came`` during a trip to India in 2002. She`d won a Berkeley Human Rights Center fellowship to document the ways in which women and children suffer in regions of conflict. Tensions between India and Pakistan over control of Kashmir had been mounting for decades and paramilitary groups were growing increasingly visible along the border. Within a few days of her arrival in Srinagar, the summer capital of Jammu-Kashmir, she caught wind of a mass rape that had occurred more than a decade earlier in Kunnan Pushpora, a tiny village at the foothill of the Himalayas.

``They were known as the rape village,`` she recalls. ``It was the most talked-about story in the valley.`` And although numerous local social service agencies had promised, at the time, to help the village heal, none had. An estimated 36 women had been raped in one night, purportedly by Indian Security Force officers in search of militants. Finding none, villagers say, the officers dragged the men out of the houses and raped the women. Gupta spent a day in Kunnan Pushpora and promised to return.

Four months later, she arrived with her three-person crew -- classmate Turaya Bryant, a translator and a driver -- in a hut with a family of nine. For two weeks they slept on thin mattresses on the mud floor and didn`t bathe for a week. The single lightbulb in the small room where some interviews took place was so weak that a gas lantern and flashlight were needed to film the shots. The experience, she says, was amazing. The women performed the hard work in the village, trekking through the surrounding hills to the jungle, climbing trees and cutting wood. Gupta and Bryant went with them, struggling to keep up. Gupta says she was amazed by both their mental and physical strength.

``These were mostly women who were 30 years older than us, but we were dying. I was trying to run in front of them and shoot, but it was hard,`` Gupta says. Her relationship with her host family proved the most fascinating part of her journey, even in moments of trepidation -- like the time when an aunt from a more militant region of Kashmir paid a visit. When Gupta asked her translator what the family was talking about, he turned to her and said: ``The aunt asked if you are from the same America as Osama bin Laden did his great act in.`` Gupta often told people outside the village she was Canadian.

Gupta felt the stigma of being an American -- ironic because the film itself is largely about the stigma of that one brutal night. ``The whole world heard that scream,`` says a man whose wife and daughters were raped. In a culture where arranged marriage is the norm, finding a husband for a rape victim is nearly impossible. Many women who married outside the village return, unable to tolerate their taunting in-laws. Even young boys, not yet born in 1991, struggle to maintain their dignity beyond Kunnan Pushpora.

Sundance`s Mike Plante, one of three short-film programmers who watched 3, 500 entries in order to whittle the number to 83, described Gupta`s film as ``one of those things you are looking for, and it is finally there.``

``For somebody in film school in America to be doing something like this is pretty amazing,`` he says. ``Her documentary was about one of the forgotten subjects, and she knew how to present it. You could see she had a deep respect for the people.``

Jon Else, head of the documentary program at the Graduate School of Journalism at UC Berkeley, where Gupta is a third-year student, calls ``When the Storm Came`` an astonishingly important film.

``It`s important because those villages in Kashmir and those women have long ago fallen off the international radar, and certainly the radar in America,`` says Else, who works with about 10 students a year on their documentary masters` projects. ``Shilpi`s great accomplishment is that when no one else would, she got herself to that village and told their story.``

Gupta learned Wednesday that her film has also been awarded the silver prize in the student Academy Awards and the second prize in the student Emmy Awards. But she isn`t finished yet. Gupta admits that at Sundance, with thousands of strangers bearing witness to the intimate details of the Kashmiri subjects` lives, she felt a bit like she was exploiting them. Although she completed the film eight months ago, no one in Kunnan Pushpora has seen it.

There are no televisions in the village. Gupta is applying for grants so she can go back and share the film with the residents, perhaps even document her subjects` reactions to it and expand it into a feature-length film. Funding is hard to come by -- Gupta estimates she`s spent about $10,000 out of pocket to produce the film. If she`s lucky, it will be picked up for national broadcast and pad her pockets for her next venture. If she returns to Sundance, Gupta will no doubt get slightly different treatment.

During her 10-day stint at Sundance this year she got a lesson in humility whenever she entered in the filmmakers` lodge. ``Nobody believed I was a director,`` she says with a laugh. ``People kept asking, `Are you a volunteer or an actress? What film are you in?` ``

``Getting into Sundance has been my dream since I made this film,`` says Gupta. ``And now my goal is to get back there again before I`m 30.``

They turned the lights off and used torches to enter all the homes. When the carnage was over, around 60 women were found lying in their homes either unconsious or weeping in anguish and pain. They had been raped. The victims were old women as well as very young femal children who will now be facing problems for the rest of their lives, if they live this foray by the Indian army. Here we present the testimonies of some of the women who dared to come forward.

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I am Ziatun daughter of Abdul Rahim Dar. It was past midnight. My father was not in the house. I recall more than five soldiers entered my house and kicked open all doors. They turned towards me and pounced on my body like hounds and tore all my clothes. The lights went out and after that it was a never ending nightmare. I am unmarried and my future life looks very bleak. I will never recover from the trauma. Indian army look for militants. They knew I was innocent.


My name is Nisara. My father Gulam Mohomad was dragged away by violent military men. We are two sisters in the house at the time. We were screaming for help and struggling at the same time from the brutal attacks from the alcohol smelling soldiers. The room was dark and the army men were shining torch lights.
Both of us were raped in the room and we have no idea how many of these animals were coming and going in the house. We are both unmarried.



My name is Atiqa Begam. I have four children. It was a bleak, cold night and we were all in bed and sleeping. We were woken up by a group of Indian soldiers who burst in smashing all door and utensils. My screaming children were thrown out through the window outside.
They ransacked the house and came for me all with very harsh blows. I was half unconscious. They molested me in turns . I cannot recall how many people were in the house.



I am an elderly woman. My name is Lassi Begam I have three grown up children. The eldest is a policeman. My daughter Saja is deaf and dumb This night of onslaught by Indian army all my doors were smashed. I showed them the police uniform of my son. They took no notice and in the most degraded manner assaulted me and my handicapped daughter. I have never known anything like this in my sixty years of life. I kept shouting, `Where is our GOVERNMENT ?
My name is Raja Begam. My husband answered the knock on the door . He did not return and next minute a gang of military men burst open into the bedroom, waving guns and bottles. We were frightened and screamed. All my children were muzzled with hand on their mouth and my clothes were pulled and torn. I was thrown on the ground with my head hitting the floor. I was gang raped by all the men in the room. I heard in my state of faint senses laughter and loud noises from the men. I have not recovered.


I am Munira. My father is Juma Shiekh. I have 2 daughters. This night was like a terrible nightmare --BROKE DOWN
I am Halima Begam. My husband Gulam Rasul was away. I heard this commotion in the village very late in the night. The dreaded noise came very near my house and all my doors were smashed. They were speaking to me in loud voice . I am not educated , I could not decipher what they said or wanted. Next thing I know they pounced upon me like vultures and molested me. I thought I had died. I and my husband are devastated .


I am Rahimi Begam. I was alone in the house. I was petrified when they burst into my small house. I pleaded with them I am a poor woman , please do not harm me. I am innocent. They drank from their bottles and beat me up .. I was on the floor and before long I now realised they were attacking me sexually. I was wanting to die. I pleaded in my language I cried . That had no effect. I had , I reckon a hundred people in my house , on top of me, smothering me and molesting me. I was left in a coma.
I am Jana Begam the widow of Lassa Dar. I have two sons. I was sleeping in my room with my daughter-in-law. we were woken up with loud noises from outside. Suddenly the door was kicked open. We were faced with a lot of Indian, violent, drunk soldiers. They waved bottles at us and threatened with their guns. We did not know what to say. They pounced upon us, threw us on the ground and assaulted both of us. This was the most degrading experience of my life. I wanted to die. Why? I asked have these people come to attack us? I was told they were looking for militants. We are innocent people , poor and live a sheltered life in this remote part of the world. I am still in shock and I never will recover.


I am Shahmal. I am a mother of four and on this night I was alone in the house. We were all sleeping when the onslaught from the military woke us up. We all cried frightened. They tore my clothes off me and in the presence of my children, threw me on the floor and molested me.


I am Jamila. I and my husband with three children were sleeping. It must have been midnight, they took my husband away and raped me in front of my children. We have been attacked four times so far. You come taking statements from us. What is the use?


I am Zaina Begam wife of Jabbar Dar. My husband was grabbed, beaten up and carried away. They came back, ransacked the house, made noises ad drank from bottles. They hit me hard. I was unconscious. There was a big commotion in the village. We thought it was the end for all of us. The Police arrived the next day and took statements. Nothing has been done. We are suffering.
My name is Zarifa Begam. My husband was away and my 5 children were sleeping. It was about 3 in the morning when two Indian soldiers broke open my bedroom door. I was gagged, beaten up and raped. My screams woke my children and they came in to help me. They were pushed into another room with guns and kicks and bolted. I have my whole body hurting from cuts.
Sara Begam wife of Abdul Ahad deposed. It was midnight. I answered a knock on my door. Three men confronted me and shouted `Hands up` in Hindi. I protested that I was alone and there were no militants in my house. They grabbed my hair, pulled it hard, ripped my clothes. What have I done? `We have orders from our officers to do this.` They were violent, they were drunk and they were animals. The night was an ordeal.
My name is Bakhti Begam. My husband is a tailor in the village. It was dead of night. They kicked the door open. They dragged the men from the house and molested us. We were very frightened and tried to struggle, but they beat us up very hard and threw us on the floor. We cannot relate details.
My name is Zooni Begam. My husband Gulam Mohomad Dar was taken away by a group of Indian army in the middle of the night. We had cordon & search by army before, but they never found any guns or militants here. This time they came at night with a surprise and very angry looking. They grabbed hold of my clothes ripped them in pieces and the whole gang set themselves upon me. I suffocated. I could not breath. The aftermath was as if an earthquake had struck us. I have not recouped from the ordeal and never will .
Men in the village were rounded up beaten and locked in a house , while the rampage of their homes and molestation of their homes went on. `` Why do you treat us like this?`` They asked. ``We have orders to rape your women and destroy the village`` The whole village was littered with empty bottles of alcohol. They behaved like animals. There were officers with them, because they had stripes on their uniforms.



This young school-girl was also the victim of this hineous crime.



I am the brother of the Numberdar the headman of the village. My name is Abdul Ahad Shiekh. The army unit is based about ten kilometres from Kunan Pushpora. This was the sixth time they attacked the village. In the past they have been getting everyone out on the road , line them up and search them, men women and children. Then they search the homes , even the animal sties and grain stores for weapons and militants . They never found anything. They have now destroyed the whole village.
I am in the state police force. I was on duty when my officer informed me that I have leave to go home, because there has been trouble in my family. I came here and found that my own sister has been raped by the army . People are still coming to terms after a month of the event . On the morning after the carnage there were about sixty women laid helpless crying, fainted, and in distress. Victims old and young will suffer devastating consequences

Jang,

Thanks for your gesture.

You wrote:
1) more likely than not, approve of handling of riots and post-riot balm-salve operations by Modi Govt.
I am in no position of judging Modi or his actions duing riots. Based on the facts and witnesses, the prevaling law of the land will take necessary actions.

Other than shouting the band-wagon of psuedo-secs crying-modi, you can resort to judiciary if you have any arguments.

2) Gujrati charitable orgs are kind of missing in action in post-riot resettlement operations unlike post-earthquake resettlement operations.

NGOs did tremedous job during post-riot period. Remeber Bilkis Begum reporting from relief camp?

Let me ask you this: How do you picture Kashmir fund box in pakistani mosques that directly funds for the guns and ammunitions for terrorists that kill innocent children and families?

Don`t Muslims in pakistan feel that it`s their duty to support terrorrism?

3) this is because given older history, they believe that Modi did the right thing by teaching a lesson.

Your basic premise that Modi did something doesn`t stand up to task of proving it.
He`s innocent until proven guilty.

Older history of riots, yes, without knowing that all the riots preceding post-godhra had higher number of Hindu casualities, you would wonder yourslef, why was your morale sleeping then? Why didn`t you bother to ask about charities then? What about charities in Kashmir valley? Or in Pakistan? Or in Bangladesh?

And Muslims who have history of 1000 years of murder, mayhem and pillage in India and longer in the world are now turning into morale advocates, sounds stupid, doesn`t it?

I guess you would be equally worried about
* genocide in darfur, sudan,
* mass killings of childrens in Beslan
* ethnic cleansing of Kashmir valley
* taleban`s decree of hindu dress code,
* destruction of Bamiyan Buddha
* Bali bombing
* world trade center
* whole islamic history of violence, murder-mania and pillage

wouldn`t you?

Or may be its morally right for you as per your murder manual.
Your curiosity really stops popping up in all those cases, doesn`t it?
Whats the commong thread behind all these barbaric violence in the wolrd?
Fundamentalist Islam.
Cure it or cut it.

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FArzana Versey

Post#115

Quote:

`` Wasn`t this person making a huge noise when I talked about the colonisation and co-opting of the Muslim in India under the garb of mainstreaming?``

So, in a country when majority tries to bring a minority into mainstream that is equalvalent (spl?) to majority colonising the minority?

Is that how colonisation is understood to be?

I would love to know how muslims in India, are being colonised...or attempts are being made to colonise them..

A digression:

Ref #78:

[We have suddenly forgotten that all the rightful inheritors of Nazism all over the world like RSS et al love to talk about uniformity, assimilation, acculturation etc when their actual intent is the `colonization` of the muslim and other minority communities!
The common thread is fascism and we need not forget this!!!]

I say, is this sarcasm?? Wasn`t this person making a huge noise when I talked about the colonisation and co-opting of the Muslim in India under the garb of mainstreaming? And then this person has quoted Golwalkar...when I had quoted him this same bunch had said that G had no locus standi...

gandivbhai,

let me attempt to narrow my curiosities.

so, do you agree with my premises that gujratis,
1) more likely than not, approve of handling of riots and post-riot balm-salve operations by Modi Govt.
2) Gujrati charitable orgs are kind of missing in action in post-riot resettlement operations unlike post-earthquake resettlement operations.
3) this is because given older history, they believe that Modi did the right thing by teaching a lesson.

so, you can accept the premise, reject it or present an alternative one (or anything else, its your post :-) )

thanks for your inputs on Godhra.

Stuka

Messages such as at the end of this article are commonly written on walls especially in areas where muslim houses have been burnt, sometimes to scare them, i have read similar ones several times in the indian express and in several commisions of enquiry.

`` The army was facing insurgency there and their abuses are similar to the ones being committed by the Indian security forces in Kashmir now and the even worst crimes being committed by the americans in Iraq. ``

Once again, a comparison is being made here/above more for the sake of it than it has much of substance in reality.
``

True. Dost Mittar u need to be detoxified. :)

Raj Singh, Dost Mittar:

DM construed the opposite of what I was saying. Desai was against the creation of Bangladesh, his point was that we should use the issue to settle our own dispputes with Pakistan and not break the country in two.

Shujaat:

Thank you for interacting.

``Also, some unfair comments were insinuated towards me regarding 9/11, as if I`d claimed thousands of Jews not being present at the WTC during the attacks. I never made mention of this in my article, so I don`t understand how certain people could jump to that conclusion``

The bulk of the article I have no problem with. I agre that Gujarat was a unique case and should be treated as such.

Here`s the issues Ii had with the article:

1. Some of the sources you use are hate sites. Look beyond the coverage of Gujarat on Daltistan.com and you will see what I mean. It would be like my quoting Hinduunity.org for articles on Muslims.

2. The mainstream opinion is that there is no conspiracy amongst western nations to defame Islam on 09/11. You cannot slip that in and avoid holding the entire article suspect. The article should have been confined to the movie and Gujarat alone. The anti Muslim conspiracy theory takes away from the genuine aspect of the movie itself.

3. The ``speech`` that you quoted was widely disseminated on the net and I have read the original by Nussbaum but it has never been corraborated. Not to say it does not exist at all, but this was certainly not as widely disseminated during the riots as you may believe. Not to say that crude language was not used, but certainly not in mainstream political events like you imply.

Regards

dost-mittar,

The articles I posted raises some valid questions on the role of secular mdeia`s biased coverage and failure to handle similar incidents equally when the context is either Hindu or Muslim.

The articles may not contain everything you may like to hear about, but it`s just a piece of information as this whole article claims to be.

You wrote:
``-VHP`s call for bandh, which even then was viewed as a signal of `direct action`; ``
***********
If you look at no. of bandh calls issued by political parties in India and by VHP itself, you would notice that the call stands one among thousands. I condemn the policy of calling bandhs, but then its all political partes involved in this.

In fact if you look at no. of bandh calls issued by parties before 1989, before BJP and VHP came to be wellknown, and its connection with riots, if it happened, then you wouldn`t blame one just one party for all ills.

There was no united call for ``direct actions`` as Jinnah did with the mass killings of 1946, let me know if you have anything that proves otherwise.

-Modi`s reference to Newton`s third law;
************
Mere observation doesn`t make one responsible for the action itself. You can dig at Modi with anything else but just because he quoted newton`s law, he can`t be equated as criminal.

-the police looking the other way while muslims were being butchered;
************
There were 180 deaths of Hindus who died in police firing and not a word about that!

-no response from police to ehsaan jaafri`s calls;
I regret that.

-political leaders, including congressmen, directing the mobs a la jagdish tytler etc. in 1984 in delhi;
That was gruesome, and why tytler or his connivances aren`t tried is questionable.

-modi offering half as much compensation to muslim victims as to the hindu victims;
I don`t know about this. Can you pass on some realiable link that confirms this? Or stop palying the tape otherwise.

-the state govt.`s attempts to protect the criminals as is clear from the best bakery case.
Well, that was the accusation and the cases are moved out and we`ll see that justice prevails.

``There is a common misperception that gujaratis are non-violent. Cowardice and docility should should not be equated with non-violence. ``
Correction, tolerance and respect shouldn`t be counted as dhimmitude.

Nazism and RSS-

Read On-

M.S. Golwalkar:-
, ``German Race pride has now become the topic of the day. To keep up the purity of the Race and its culture, Germany shocked the world by her purging the country of the Semitic Races—the Jews. Race pride at its highest has been manifested here. Germany has also shown how well-nigh impossible it is for Races and cultures, having differences going to the root, to be assimilated into one united whole, a good lesson for us in Hindusthan to learn and profit by``.

``It is worth bearing well in mind how these old Nations solve their minorities problem. They do not undertake to recognize any separate element in their polity. Emigrants have to get themselves naturally assimilated in the principal mass of the population, the National Race, by adopting its culture and language and sharing in its aspirations, by losing all consciousness of their separate existence, forgetting their foreign origin. If they do not do so, they live merely as outsiders, bound by all the codes and conventions of the Nation, at the sufferance of the Nation and deserving no special protection, far less any privilege or rights. There are only two courses open to the foreign elements, either to merge themselves in the national race and adopt its culture, or to live at its mercy so long as the national race may allow them to do so and to quit the country at the sweet will of the national race. That is the only sound view on the minorities problem. That is the only logical and correct solution. That alone keeps the national life healthy and undisturbed. That alone keeps the nation safe from the danger of a cancer developing into its body politic of the creation of a state within a state. From this stand point, sanctioned by the experience of shrewd old nations, the foreign races in Hindusthan must either adopt the Hindu culture and language, must learn to respect and hold in reverence Hindu religion, must entertain no idea but those of the glorification of the Hindu race and culture, i.e., of the Hindu nation and must lose their separate existence to merge in the Hindu race, or may stay in the country, wholly subordinated to the Hindu Nation, claiming nothing, deserving no privileges, far less any preferential treatment not even citizen’s rights. There is, at least should be, no other course for them to adopt. We are an old nation: let us deal, as old nations ought to and do deal, with the foreign races who have chosen to live in our country``.

(from We Or our Nationhood Defined)

Urstruly, HisExcellency

Various posts.

I think Mr. truly has some unreal number form the 1984-1994 periods. True, that was the worst period of violence in Karachi but the dead count suggested here is suspicious and exaggerated. I was not in Pakistan or Sindh at that time but I have had some good associations in Sindh with Sindhi political and admin circles and I know Urstruly numbers are not accurate.
Most of the people died in Pathan-Mohajir clashes and the numbers with army clashes are exaggerated by the MQM. There were only two incidence of Sindhi-Mohajir exchange. One was I believe in 1989 in HYD when some army agents opened fire in HYD. In response, the MQM attacked some Sindhi neighborhoods in Karachi. There is no other reported incidence as far as I can recall, of clashes between Sindhi and Mohajir in Hyd or anywhere else in Sindh. Though the community relations were strained but that is over and done with now.

I am also opposed to the army in Pakistan and have done that since my student days in Sindh and Karachi Universities. But I am going to be fair to them also. We had stories of rape and pillage by the army in East Pakistan and when the army moved in Sindh in 1979, every body feared that things of similar nature could happen in Sindh also. I must say that even though the army was tough with political workers, there is no record of army jawans attacking women, rape or pillage in Sindh. In fact, the army was on its best behavior with women and children throughout 1979 to 1983 timeframe.
The Pakistan army has been involved in two army actions in Balochistan but there have not been any incidence where they were accused of personal misbehavior with women and children. It is true that Pakistani media never carried the news of those army actions but people who were politically active have a very good picture of what took place in Balochistan at that time.
The army did kill several MQM members and I understand from the admin sources in Karachi at that time that MQM was also armed to the teeth and Rangers feared for their lives also.
Still, what army did in Karachi is not condonable in any way but again the army cannot be accused of rape and misbehavior to children. local police was mostly accused of such atrocities.
I think you can understand why the army behaved like a rogue army that it is, in East Pakistan and never in West Pakistan. That is another subject as at what point the army would breakdown and we may see the repeat of what the army did in East Pakistan.

Urstruly, I am kind of surprised at your Bhriya Road narration in 1995. I traveled in Sindh meeting up with my old friends and relative throughout Sindh during Feb-mar 1995 and I did not see any sign of such grave danger. Only issue was traveling during the night when ‘Daku Sian” were in control of Sindh roadways.

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Dost mittar: here is the report

The Citizens Tribunal Report notes, “1.4. Shri Modi played an active role, along with at least three cabinet colleagues, ininstructing senior police personnel and civil administrators that a ‘Hindu reaction was to beexpected and this must not be curtailed or controlled’.On the evening of February 27, two cabinet colleagues of the chief minister, Shri AshokBhatt and Shri Pratap Singh Chauhan, met at Lunavada in Panchmahal district along withothers. In this meeting, the manner and methods of unleashing violence on Muslims wereplanned in detail. 2.1. The facts mentioned in this report clearly establish that chief minister ShriNarendra Modi is the chief author and architect of all that happened in Gujarat after thearson of February 27, 2002. It is amply clear from all the evidence placed before theTribunal that what began in Godhra could have, given the political will, been controlledpromptly at Godhra itself. Instead, the state government under chief minister Shri NarendraModi took an active part in leading and sponsoring the violence against minorities all over Gujarat. His words and actions throughout the developments in Gujarat show that he has been openly defying the Constitution and indulging in actions which are positivelydetrimental to the interests of the country.2.2. Shri Modi was the one who took Godhra to the rest of Gujarat. He was the onewho directed the police and the administration not to act. He was the one who refused tohelp the likes of former Member of Parliament, Shri Ahsan Jafri, and the large number ofpeople in Shri Jafri’s home, who were all butchered later on”.Similarly the NHRC Report also makes a convincing case for state complicity in the violence. “The Police administration on the 28th of February was acting under dictation ofthe BJP politicians. Two senior cabinet ministers were present in the Police Control Room –State Health Minister Ashok Bhatt was at the Ahmedabad Police Commissionerate in Shahibaug for more than three hours on February 28th and the Urban Development minister, I K Jadeja, was in the State Police Control Room at Gandhinagar for four hoursfrom 11 am onwards. Home Minster Gordhan Zadaphia was directly monitoring theprogress of attacks on Muslim localities from the room of Ashok Raina, Home Secretary

Submission to US Commission on International religious Freedoms

by Kamal Mitra Chenoy

June 10, 2002 [ Washington, D.C.]

1. The events in Gujarat from 27 February 2002 mark a turning point=20
in contemporary Indian politics. These have profound consequences for=20
the continuation of India as a multi-cultural, secular society, for=20
survival of democracy, and for the unity and integrity of the=20
country. There have been riots and pogroms in India before but the=20
Gujarat carnage is exceptional in the extent of state sponsorship,=20
official justification and cover-up, the suborning of the state=20
apparatus, and the legitimation of genocide as an instrument of=20
electoral politics.

2. Gujarat has a history of sectarian [communal] violence, going back=20
to decades before Indian independence in 1947. The small town of=20
Godhra is no exception. There was communal tension in the town and=20
the State because of proposed Hindu rites at a disputed site in the=20
town of Ayodhya in Uttar Pradesh. Hindu volunteers travelling in the=20
Sabarmati Express train to Ayodhya or back to Ahmedabad in Gujarat,=20
had reportedly been misbehaving with Muslim passengers, both men and=20
women, for days without any police intervention. Around 7.45AM on=20
27th February some incidents at Godhra station, including the=20
attempted abduction of a teenaged Muslim girl by a Hindu volunteer=20
travelling on the train, led to stone throwing, followed by an attack=20
by a Muslim mob of 2,000 from nearby slums when the train was stopped=20
half a mile away. 1,500 Hindu volunteers on the train countered with=20
stone throwing. Fire bombs were used by the Muslim mob, and one=20
railway coach was burnt leading to the deaths of 59 Hindu passengers,=20
mainly women and children. This incident, which was a communal riot=20
in a town with a long history of communal outbreaks, became the=20
trigger and justification for the carnage that followed.

3. The Chief Minister of Gujarat Narendra Modi, who is also a senior=20
RSS [Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sanghathan: National Volunteer=20
Organization--a Hindu fundamentalist organization] leader, arrived in=20
Godhra and alleged that the attack on the train was planned by=20
Pakistani intelligence [the Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI)]. This=20
charge was repeated a couple of days later by federal Home Minister=20
L.K. Advani, also a Member of Parliament from Gandhinagar, the=20
capitol of Gujarat. Ministers alleged that the same terrorist groups=20
who had attacked the American Center in Kolkata were behind the=20
Godhra attack, and promised to teach them a lesson. Consequently an=20
impression was created with official sanction, that the Godhra=20
Muslims were agents of Pakistan, a traditional enemy. The Chief=20
Minister insisted that the badly charred bodies of the victims be=20
sent for post mortem to Ahmedabad the same night. The time of arrival=20
of the bodies was announced over the government radio and frenzied=20
mobs came to the railway station to receive the bodies. Ram dhuns=20
[religious rites] were performed that night and the next day all over=20
Ahmedabad. The same day, the Vishva Hindu Parishad [World Hindu=20
Council] called for a `bandh` [a total strike including stoppage of=20
traffic] on February 28th in protest against Godhra. The ruling=20
Bhartiya Janata Party [BJP] supported the bandh, and the Chief=20
Minister reportedly told top officials, including from the police, to=20
refrain from interfering with the bandh supporters.

4. On 28th February organized Hindu mobs, sometimes as large as=20
20,000 controlled Ahmedabad, while the police stood by. VHP-Bajrang=20
Dal [an RSS affiliate]-BJP workers organized the mobs and led them.=20
The Minister of State for Home Affairs Gordhan Zadaphia flashed the=20
`V` for victory sign while passing rampaging mobs. Zadaphia and=20
another Minister sat in the police control rooms in Ahmedabad and=20
Gandhinagar for hours, reportedly immobilizing the police and fire=20
brigade but directing the mobs. Mobs were transported by trucks and=20
buses. They had detailed lists of Muslim institutions, commercial=20
establishments, residences and shrines. These were looted and burnt.=20
The information was so detailed that even shops with minority Muslim=20
ownership were identified and attacked. The mobs carried thousands of=20
liquefied petroleum gas [(LPG) cooking gas] cylinders which were used=20
to blow up the properties they attacked. Significantly, these LPG=20
cylinders had been in short supply for weeks. There were widespread=20
attacks on Muslim men, women and children who were hacked with knives=20
and swords, and in many cases, later burnt. There were many cases of=20
rape and gang rape, even of minor girls, and a large number of the=20
victims were then brutally killed. To cite just a couple of=20
instances: a former Congress Member of Parliament Ehsan Jafri who had=20
campaigned against the Chief Minister in an Assembly election weeks=20
earlier, called for help for hours but no help came, instead a huge=20
mob attacked his residential colony in Chamanpura. He was hacked into=20
three pieces and the rioters reportedly urinated on his body. Ten=20
women were stripped, raped, hacked and thrown into fires. Only one=20
survived. In Naroda-Patia where more than 90 people were killed and=20
many women and girls raped, an eight month pregnant women Kausar=20
Bano`s belly was slit open, the fetus extracted and both were killed.=20
The police, in most cases, not only did not intervene to protect the=20
Muslims, but in many cases connived with the rioters. In=20
Naroda-Patia, the Special Reserve Police refused shelter to the=20
Muslims and forced them in the direction of waiting mobs. More=20
Muslims than Hindus were killed in police firing. Curfew was imposed=20
more in Muslim localities than in Hindu ones.

5. Unlike in earlier episodes, anti-Muslim violence spread later even=20
to rural areas, including tribal areas, apart from other urban=20
centers. According to official estimates, less than 1,000 people have=20
died, overwhelmingly Muslim. Informed unofficial figures are much=20
higher around 2,500 but the death toll may be even higher when the=20
list of the missing, particularly in the rural areas, is checked. The=20
property and business losses are colossal and official compensation=20
is selective and niggardly. Very large numbers of Muslims have no=20
viable shelter to return to. Many like those from Naroda-Patia are=20
scared to go back. Hundreds of Muslim shrines have been destroyed and=20
desecrated. The shrine of the medieval saint-poet Wali Gujarati was=20
razed to the ground and a round built over it. More than 100,000=20
Muslims live in NGO-run relief camps throughout Gujarat. The State=20
does not run these camps and provides insufficient uncooked food and=20
other essentials for them. For example, the largest camp in Shah Alam=20
in Ahmedabad has 12,000 inmates but only 22 toilets.

6. The official machinery has been obstructive in registering cases=20
against the allegedly guilty. In most cases, the police have not=20
filed charge sheets. In the relatively few cases in which these have=20
been filed, in most cases the names of the accused are not mentioned=20
and only an anonymous mob is cited, making the cases legally very=20
weak. In the few cases charge sheets have been filed, key BJP=20
operatives have been excluded. And in most of these cases the Muslims=20
are shown as having incited the violence. For example, in the Ehsan=20
Jafri case it is recorded that he fired first on the mob, whereas=20
there is no evidence that Jafri fired at all.=20=20

7. Police officers and civil service officers who controlled violence=20
in various parts of Gujarat were summarily transferred to other=20
areas, and other, more pliable officers posted in their stead.=20
Officers sympathetic to the BJP were posted to investigate crucial=20
cases like Naroda-Patia and Chamanpura. This is a pattern throughout=20
the State.

8. All official propaganda referred to the Godhra incident as a=20
`carnage` and the subsequent violence as `disturbances.` This was=20
true not only of the Chief Minister but also of the Prime Minister in=20
the initial stages. This was intended to explain away the genocide=20
against Muslims as a `natural` reaction to the killings in Godhra. So=20
some 2,500 killings were a `disturbance` while 59 were a `carnage.`

9. In April, well before the violence ceased, the Chief Minister=20
advocated elections to the State Assembly. Clearly the attempt was to=20
cash in on the communal polarization and the antipathy of Hindus=20
towards the minority communities [Muslims, Christians] to bolster the=20
BJP`s electoral prospects. A number of political commentators have=20
alleged that the basic reason for the communal violence in Gujarat=20
was electoral, an attempt to consolidate the Hindu votes. The public=20
outcry against elections in a disturbed and disrupted State, forced=20
the federal government to rule out immediate elections.=20

10. On the basis of such information and analysis, the National Human=20
Rights Commission [NHRC] and various non-official inquiries have=20
exposed the state-complicity and according to some, state-sponsorship=20
of the anti-Muslim violence. It appears that this pogrom and genocide=20
was organized some months prior to February. The preparation of the=20
detailed lists of Muslim properties, institutions and residences=20
would have taken months of prior planning. Similarly, the stocking of=20
LPG cylinders, weapons, organization of transport, deployment of=20
forces, would have taken time and considerable organization.

11. Despite such reports, the BJP State government is contemptuous=20
of such criticism. It dismissed the NHRC report as insulting the=20
sentiments of millions of Gujaratis. Police intelligence has reported=20
that the Chief Minister in recent weeks has campaigned in rural areas=20
implicitly castigating the Muslims on the basis of a Hindu=20
fundamentalist agenda. Just a couple of days ago the Governor of=20
Gujarat, a RSS leader, stated that Assembly elections were now=20
possible. So the cynical game plan of the State government to make=20
electoral gains at the cost of a section of its own electorate has=20
been exposed once again.

12. The Gujarat genocide has very serious implications for Indian=20
democracy. India is the most variegated and diverse society in the=20
world. It has some 3,000 communities speaking some 150 languages and=20
dialects. Any attempt to impose a rigid Hindu fundamentalist agenda=20
on such a diverse people is bound to lead to vigorous resistance,=20
possibly Balkanization. If a State government, like in Gujarat, is=20
able to carry out genocide with impunity, it means that the secular=20
edifice that guarantees multicultural democracy in India has been=20
gravely eroded. This is bound to have a demonstration effect all over=20
the country. Muslims are around 14 % of the population. When a=20
section of the Sikhs who totaled just 2% of the population revolted=20
against Indian rule with Pakistani support, in the 1980`s there was a=20
bloodbath. In the case of Muslims, given the Pakistan-backed=20
insurgency in Muslim-majority Kashmir which has brought India and=20
Pakistan to the brink of war, the threat is even greater. If the=20
Muslims of Gujarat feel that they will not receive justice, as seems=20
very likely, some of them and other co-religionists may be drawn to=20
terrorism to seek revenge. In view of Pakistan`s support to=20
anti-Indian terrorists, there is every possibility of such embittered=20
individuals obtaining foreign support. If rumors about Al- Qaeda=20
presence in Indian Kashmir are correct, then such elements may well=20
link up with Al-Qaeda. After the Mumbai riots in December=20
1992-January 1993, the Mafia don Dawood Ibrahim linked up with=20
Pakistani intelligence and unleashed terrorism in India. So a similar=20
linkage with the addition of Islamic fundamentalists like Al-Qaeda is=20
perfectly conceivable.
13. The just resolution of the Gujarat genocide is thus vital not=20
only for the survival of a multi-cultural, secular, democratic India=20
but also for the stability and peace of the sub-continent. It has=20
possible implications for the global fight against terrorism.

Simran Bibi Kiddan

``A great democracy did someone say? Ha. ``

Nahi nahi, kiddan dee democracy. I think you prefer the democratic means of the Damdami Taksal :)

It is the very same democracy you hold in contempt that has led to a form of stability and progress in India.

I don`t believe in hiding the warts of India. In fact it is good to face them head on. But in a country of a billion we have managed to hobble along and actually make progress. Forget about Pakistan. Why don`t you compare innocents dead in India versus innocents killed in China during the Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution?

Keeping things in perspective, show me any other third world country in Asia or Africa that has actually managed to stabilize this level of heterogenous peoples and still provide a modicum of growth and upward mobility?

You can shove that contempt for democracy in India right where the sun don`t shine.

rajsinghi:
The direct action call of Jinnah has been discussed ad nauseum at chowk. I have no desire to revisit it.

hindvi:
Don`t know about govardhan zaphadia but I wouldn`t be surprised; and yes, Modi did transfer police officers who tried to do their job properly.

Dost mittar

Post#95

Quote:

`` VHP`s call for bandh, which even then was viewed as a signal of `direct action```

Assuming that is the case then are you willing to say that Mr Jinnah was responsible for all the mayhem/massacre riots that occurred after his `direct action` call? Should Mr Jinnah be looked at as contemptibly as VHP is being looked at?

Hindvi

Post#97

Quote:

`` you forgot gordhan Zadaphia sitting in the police control room, thus preventing or misdirecting the police.``

Any credible sources to back this up?

Quote:

`` Also the police itself misdirecting women and children into traps as at naroda. and leading the charges of the sanghis with firings against muslim men and women who were barricading themselves.``

Same as above.

No, not some planted or coloured story in the media. For media`s role has been questionable in the whole affair and it has been admitted by the investigative commitee (I do not recall the name but I think, one of the members was H K Dua, former editor of Hindustan Times) itself.

Jang,

Sorry I inadvertently directed #65 to you instead of wahi_to.

Now About 58:
Your curiosity in understanding the riots is well placed and you should read my recent 3 posts which might cater to some of your curiosity.

The history of riots in Ahmedabad started in 1714 during mughal misrule, whereas RSS was founded in 1925.

BJP became prominent in India since 1989, and Ahmedabad has seen worst riots regularly since 1940s.

Out of total riot casualities 25% are Hindu casualities and nearly half of the total riot incidents were started by Muslims.

Apart from that, I am wondering why you haven`t showed similar curiosity in understanding what went wrong with Muslims of Godhra.

Do they not deserve any attention?

The manner in which the whole community of Signla falia showed the hyena-like unity in attacking the childrens and women of the train, does it not raise any questions in your mind?

Wouldn`t you contrast the hateful announcements from the mosque to stop aid to the victims and kill them instead with the later call to secularism?

The contrast between kicking out the police of Godhra and later accusations that police didn`t protect them, doesn`t it raise any questions in your mind about the brand of secularism they follow?

Has it anything to do with the unusually high number of passports issued in Godhra and visits to Pakistan?

On 62:
Your quote:
-``If this involves lobbying the US for an invasion of Iindia if some freakazoid like you or
-Thackeray or Modi takes power, then God Willing I will do it. ``
-
-well, modi is in power in Guj and Thakrey practically rules Mumbai (he never taked
-gaddi, but acts as a remote control.). god is willing..

Well-known and nothing new.
Tthat`s the ultimate wish of any Pakistani to see India being hurt by Indians, as you`ve already exhausted your best.
And that`s the reason why Farzanas, Wastys and alike regularly put their communal venom in their writings.