Is Islam Anti-Semitic?

Bruce lee: OFCOURSE a group which is enslaved for 400 years and killed can be justified in attacking back.

You dont seem to mind the initial oppression, u just mind the oppressed hiting back, sellout. And since when was rwanda about retribution.

Arjun: And i think someoene is just as justified in killing thousands of americans. the cycle continues.

BruceLee,

``See above, Mr Jihad. Christians and Animists from Africa also have a good case for bombing hairy Arab ass to extinction following the genocides in Sudan, right? I mean, you can understand that too, no? ``

Yeah..I do. And in fact that`s a very good example (although poorly formulated by you)...let me ask: why is it when the state of Sudan commits attrocities, everyone pussy foots around the issue...yet if, say, the Darfur rebels commit a terrorist act in retaliation, they`d be considered the biggest pricks on face of this earth by your ilk. Answer me that...that is the essence of the open challange.

Of course, here`s the catch. IF there were terrorist attacks against Sudan (like the Southerns often do), the West would be mum unless they thought it served their interest. Guess what kind of attitude they`d sport? Yup: you had it comming, so stop bitchin.

---

Arjun,

``A school that counts among it`s illustrous graduates, the hindu nuts who keep saying that any discussion of the killing of innocent muslims in gujrat has to accompanied by a discussion on godhra and past muslims atrocities against their faith......``

Of course, Muslims of India aren`t bombing hindu villages (note: hindus being the majority, and in a position of power) willy-nilly, or sodomising Hindu men in makeshift prisons. Foolish example...try again.

Said school of thought is talking about paralell acts. Terrorism and the American response do not follow each other by a few centuries...


``And I think America is every bit justified in bombing whoever it needs to as payback...If the US armed forces used nukes against the terrorists who were responsible for 9/11, I wouldn`t bat an eyelid... ``

OBL? Is that you?! No wait..your pro-American...damn...had me confused there for a second.

DRUMZ

So anyone who constructs a line of oppression/persecution can legitimately react with violence? You just justified Rwanda and Gujarat, you sap.

fartex

See above, Mr Jihad. Christians and Animists from Africa also have a good case for bombing hairy Arab ass to extinction following the genocides in Sudan, right? I mean, you can understand that too, no?

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Vertex: Exactly!

BruceLee,

It`s been read, and rejected. Neither myself, nor Drumz is subscribing to the Karmic Justification Theory. Rather, we are of the ``don`t bitch when you`re a bigger prick yerself`` school of thought.

But alas, what would you know? Anyone who disagrees with you is automatically cast as a Jihadi...LOL...

Yes, and the open challenge remains: please feel free to condemn state-sponsored slaughter of civilians without any buts, and I`ll gladly welcome you to the camp of the sane-minded.

Arjun: You act as if 9/11 was the worst terrorist attack in the history of the world or somesh1t. You watch too much fox news man. Less then 3000 died. compare that to the TEN THOUSAND people who died in the CITY of Baghdad last year alone. (oh but they werent white people so their death isnt as emotional).

You are looking at this matter through a very personal and emotional lens. This is fine but try and see it as an impartial objective viewer. Amrica is responsible for killions tens of thousands of people. America has 3000 of its own killed. You all whine and nag about the 3000. I am not justifying their murder, im just stating the FACT that it was bound to happen. I would be a damn fool to cry about 3000 americans when prolly 20000 souls were lost in afghanistan and america who were also innocent civilians.

Ballu: Agreed.

Bruce: The catholics must have been to busy raping and pillaging africa or wiping out the natives or enslaving the blacks to drop planes into buildings. The saudis flew the planes because they had the ability to do so. Im curious as to why this one particulr crime bothers u so much. Is it because the dead are white people???

I am not speaking on morality or commenting on righteousness. we are talking about inncents dying for god sakes. All im saying is what the masters have said for ages, you reap what you sow. Americas murders and genocides around the world have come back to haunt them. Try not to be brainwashed by fox news soo much bro. America has killed tens of thousands of muslims, phillipinos chileans, nicaraguans and cubans. Now some of its own have died. Why? as a direct resultof american foriegn policy.

Think outside of good and bad and righteousness and evil (ur beginning to sound like mr bush). See the world for what it is. Right or wrong this was bound to happen. You wanna call it karma u can, i dont want to mystify it. Ill simply deduce it to one nation interfearing in the business of dozens of other countries causing thousands of deaths. For the first time it has had some inocents lost too.

500,000 died in rwanda. But they are kala`s no one cares, lets all b1tch and complain about bin laden and the 3000 american dead.

Tamil Tigers, have used 200 suicide bombings, in a 20 year old civil war that has killed more than 60,000 people. Oh but they are like kalas with straight hair.

3000 americans died and oh my god lets turn the whole world upside down and kill and torture anyone who wears a beard. Lets imprison afghani youth and drop bombs on iraqi weddings and lets b1tch and whine when weve given birth to another terrorist.

Bruce: I am looking at this subject from an objective viewpoint and from a macro level. IM not looking at war from a personal lens. Your comparing apples and oranges. An entity known as the african american is certainly justified in attacking a group labelled as white europeans for what they did because when one group enslaves another for 4 hundred years, it cannot expect to have no reprecussions. Would i like to be the white guy who is being killed, no. But will one group who is being killed for centuries eventually hit back, certainly.

fartex

You didnt read my post properly did you? In particular look out for my riffs off DRUMZ (and your) 9/11 Karmic Justification Theory. Read it again in full and it may make some sense to you, you slap happy Jihadi spunk bag.

BruceLee,

``If you say to me, ``Yes, as a North American/Canadian/Muslim I do not mind if me or my family are slaughtered by psychopaths in retribution for the naughtiness of my religious/national ancestors, that is fine by me, bring it on`` then I concede your point.``

Spinning the same old arguments, I see...you still don`t have a clue do you bud? NO ONE is supporting terrorists...it is YOU who are supporting states in their worse-than terrorist activities. And what do such activities beget? Well whadayknow...more terrorism...

``If not then I would like to ask you why not? The Twin Tower people deserved it, according to you, because they were culpable indirectly by being in the USA, the source of all evil in the world (according to you and lots of others) ``

Justification is NOT the same as rationale. Jeebus...go back to school if such simple concepts boggle your mind. No civilian deserves death from above...from a bomb or a hijacked plane.

Now, praytell, why can`t this same twisted logic be used on behalf of the people who are being bombed in Iraq or elsewhere? After all, apparently they deserved it....

By all mens go after Al-Q. Kill em, capture them, rape them...whatever turns your ilk on dude...but if doing so entails the deaths of tens of thousands, if not more, on the ``other`` side then screw it. Your`re then just being a bigger arsehole than Osama was.

#69 by DRUMZ on October 18, 2004 10:30pm PT

Coming to human pain- only liberal individual rights can ensure that every one`s pain is respected- most of the people in the world who claim to practice the `true` faith are infact devil`s companion.

DRUMZ

Why are poor Catholics/Hindus/Buddhists not flying planes into America yet rich Saudi Muslims are doing so?

Answer the question. I am genuinely seeking your wisdom on this.

DRUMZ

``I dont Support the jihadis, I stated that america was getting what it deserved.``

So you are proposing that along the lines of Karma we can deduce a righteousness to the act of 9/11.

Can we further explore this concept of Karmic retribution?

If Pakistan suffered a loss of life in a terrorist attack on the scale of 9/11, would it be a righteous act due to the ``bad karma`` accumulated by the state of Pakistan say, over the Bangladesh genocide?

Replace ``India`` for ``Pakistan`` regarding its own moral transgressions.

Or has enough bad karma been built up yet?

Who judges the karmic levels of retribution?

Why leave it at that. Are Muslims in Gujarat responsible and culpable for the crimes of Muslim invaders/emperors in India in the past?

Surely there is some Karmic dissonance that requires straightening out there on the basis of your 9/11 Justification theory?

Why stop at Muslims in Gujarat? Why are YOU not guilty because of the Armenian genocide of Christians by Turkish Muslim militias in the last century?

What about the annihilation of indigenous people in North America? As a Canadian citizen will you agree with the righteousness of an act that kills you and your family because you are the member of a society that has historically exterminated large numbers of Native Americans?

Should African-Americans be allowed to kill white people in recompense for the horrors of slavery? The hundreds of thousands of Africans who died on the slave ships and were dumped in the sea? The number of dead is unknowable.

JUST TELL ME THIS

Are you prepared to have you and your family made targets on the basis of the 9/11 Karmic Justification theory that can be applied to other countries/races/religions?

If you say to me, ``Yes, as a North American/Canadian/Muslim I do not mind if me or my family are slaughtered by psychopaths in retribution for the naughtiness of my religious/national ancestors, that is fine by me, bring it on`` then I concede your point.

If not then I would like to ask you why not? The Twin Tower people deserved it, according to you, because they were culpable indirectly by being in the USA, the source of all evil in the world (according to you and lots of others)

What do you say, DRUMZ?

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Arjun: ``What makes ``I feel your pain`` transcend national boundaries? Islam``

Um Wrong. Dont miss the forest for the trees. The problem here is not religion, its that people are too weak to stand up for themselves so they ALIGN themselves with larger groups of equally stupid people. The problem here is human weakness and need for social affiliation. Take Islam out of the picture and wars would be fought for ethnic, cultural, lingusitic, racial or nationalistic reasons. ((((((((by the way, NO ONE has ever countered that point to me))))))))).....How many expatriots of a country send money oversees to fund liberation movements? Im sure the IRA and the Sri lankan Tigers are down.

Also, refrain from personal judgements on my character. Ive probably debated against more muslims and mullahs then all of you guys combined. I was speakin against the taliban back in 95. And no i dont support the pakistani governemnt, bla bla bla. I can basically argue your position or that of the Muslims. Ill debate against you guys because basically anyone can argue against bin laden these days.

I dont Support the jihadis, I stated that america was getting what it deserved. Whoever the ``terrorist`` is is irrelevent to me. Further, im not sure how this position conflicts with my assertion that bin laden and his ilk have a fools understanding of Islam.

Afghanistan is a mess. America did not fullfil any of its promises there. There is no order in the country outside of kabul. Warlords own most of the nation.