One Day At a Time

Absolutely correct. We need to read the message ourselves rather than waiting for others to explain things to us. How many times do you consult somebody befor commiting a crime a sin an act you know is wrong. So how come to make a correction in your behaviour u need to consult an intermediary and that also after the manual on how to correct yourself ha been provided to you. Picking up the Quran and reading it for oueselves is the most difficult thing for most of us. Why. Because we are sacred to let go of our own fallicies and wrong beliefs and traditional hand me downs, scared to react and to accept that we might have been wrong and even more sacred of standing up and correcting ourselves because we don`t have the guts to face upto the criticism we will attract in doing so. The example we need to take from the Prophet is that he stood up to adverstiy in its highest form for his beliefs. Not how long his beard was how haigh his shalwar was when he prayed and whether he said 20 nafils or 50 nafils during his prayers.

Good posts generally on this thread. particularly sameer and ralph.

I see Hamidm hasnt changed a bit. I would bet my year`s paycheck (not much) that you are probably the most religious muslim on this site.

Salams Temporal Sahib and Ramadan Mubarak

I read this before reading your article, Anas bin Malik(r.a) says, ``The aim of the ulema is to understand and of fools to quote`` :)

I think there are plenty of true ulema around, who have also inherited the spiritual knowledge from the Prophet SAW , its just that these days we take pseudo ulema`s to be ulema and ignore the true ones. Its our ignorance and pride that does not allow us to learn from the true ulema. If we sincerely search for the Truth, it will surely be revealed to us.

Perhaps the fault lies not within the Ulema, but within ourselves


For some reason the majority of Chowkies have limited knowledge of Islam and its spirituality. Everyone here seems to be ranting:) rather than acting. Chowk isnt the intellectual place that it once used to be.

By the way, none of this was directed at you Temporal Sahib. Hope you have a spiritual Ramadan:)

``A hungry inner self is dearer to God than seventy heedless worshippers`` Prophet Muhammad SAW

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..... fasting makes a man gassy, but doesn`t necessarily make him a good insaan.........

............ actually it can make him irritable, bloated, depressed, sexually impotent, schizophrenic and in extreme cases suicidal - that`s when he straps on an explosive belt and goes for a walk after asar ............. but seldom, almost never, does depriving oneself of food, water and sex make anyone more spiritual or, to quote temporal, a good insaan ........

............ now, personally i don`t have anything against getting up for an early breakfast and gorging on parathas and paye, but it is the heartburn and bad breath that sets in around nine in the morning that is a little troublesome .......... and, in my case, since lunch is the most important thing i do all day, it ruins my day .......... so i try to have a light salad instead which, as a good muslim, is bad for my self-esteem because eating meat is what differentiates me from the horrible hindoos and other foul vegetarians ......... if my ancestors had wanted to eat ghass bhoons they would have stayed hindoo ......... talking about my ancestors - their poor spirits must be in terrible agony during the holy month of ramadhan as they watch their progeny starve thmselves because of some alien arab god`s silly injunctions ..............

....... but somehow i can survive lunch, or the absence thereof, but it is nigh impossible to go through thirty plus happy-hours without incurring a major financial loss ......... according to a conservative estimate by the muslim libation society it can cost a moderate muslim about 10 dollars extra, or 300 for the month, to drink after iftaar .......... so i decided to take a page out of my rebel catholic friend`s book - you see, he had a serious falling out with the church over vatican-II and left the seminary to get his mba ......... anyway, he gives up tonic for lent and for ten days drinks gin straight up - mind you, no martinis since that would be cheating!.........

.......... i have a lot more to say, specially about sex during ramadhan, but i am feeling a little gassy ............

#9 by temporal
nobody had ever claimed that Islam is a complete system-HP

“recall Muhammed’s (saw) words from his last sermon on the mount calling on Allah and Muslims to bear witness?”

The prophet said: “religion is complete”. He never said it is a “complete system”.
You can spin it whichever way you want but nobody expected from a simpleton, as you put it, to force some to read more than what he said.

The issue is: you are suggesting beating up on a barely educated mullah who derives livelihood from religion. I doubt that you have any formal religious education still; you know a whole lot more about religion than mullah could ever dream off. You are suggesting competing with mullah, IMO, there is no need for that. For a person or persons, who defiantly had access to better education, mullah is not the competition. The competition is with the groupthink that he has become symbol of.

After reading the same ``teachings and purpose`` for fasting year after year, I am convinced that namaz teaches basic algebra like 2 + 2 = 4 rakats for fajar and 4 + 4+ 2+ 2 + 3 + 2 = 17 rakata for Isha.

They are nothing but pre-Islamic existing rituals practiced by the Bedoin Arabs that were accepted and regimented with some changes.

One does not have to learn the stuff of grade II morals and ethics - to be taught by teacher in a lecture or two - through crude, hard and harsh ways of daily and a month yearly observing rituals at age 40, 50, 60 or even above 70. If a person did not learn insaniyat in first ``formative`` 75 years of his life, is not going to learn it from fasting in the years 75-80.

The pupose of this or any other ritual is - well just plain and simple - rituals, which means keep renewing the belief of submission to a religious ideology or philosophy.

All religions are full of dogma, absurdities, oppressions, and injustices. Islam more than most other religions but not uniquely so.

Islam`s uniqueness, and its greatest evil, lies in darkening the hearts and minds of `moderate` and `dormant` Muslims.

The `moderates` and `dormant` followers of other religions work hard to escape the limits of outdated dogma, economic, social, political injustices and divisions prescribed by their religions. The `moderate` and `dormant` Muslim dedicates his or her life divining justifications of these Islamic evils and absurdities.

Uniformity is a fond hope.

The roza itself. The Qura`an itself is very clear about when the fast should be broken. ``Attimmuss sayaama ill al layl`` ``aur rozay kou tamaam karo raat kou`` yet different brands of Muslims break their fast at different times.

Interestingly, the time of iftar is one of those very few tings regarding which the books is totally unambiguous and states its position in categorical imperative . . . yet, the Musulmaan . . .

tempu :
well thought out article. aik sahib aie aur kissi sey poocha `masjid kidhar hai `? doosrae aadmee ney jewab diya ... aap shia hain k sunni konsi masjid mein jaana pasand karein gaien. jub pehley shakhs ney jawab mein arz kiya koi see bhi, tau phir doosrae ney poocha ` tau yeh baatein, k aap borre hain ya memon ?` by this time asr kii namaz ka waqt jaata raha .

`Sar peetney walla icon`

P.S. I read one of yr interracts, where you were replying [to i forget who] on your ethics of posting ... `aisee k kissi k agae sharminda na hona parey kiya likha `

tempu you have always been Da Man :)

Ramzaan Mubarak..... lamha lamha ;) pul pul

The question why something supposedly good for you is prescribed only one month of the year is an interesting one. I remember endlessly tormenting my poor mom with this question.

But I think it makes sense, if you accept that cetain practises or forms of discipline that might help us be better people (but not being good/virtuous per se) might just be too much to do all year round. Fasting all year `round, for instance, might not be good for your health, to say nothing of the loss to the economy, if carried out the way it is in Pakistan. So, perhaps one month out of twelve might be a good way to recharge our spirits, if we can do what we do for the right reasons.

Ideally, one day of the week might even be better, i think.

You can`t blame the system, its the followers you have to blame. As Malik99 rightly said it is for the training, because before the next ramadan arrives, our good habits may have rusted. Ofcourse you havent seen any `Muslims` changing after Ramadan because, as you`ve precisely put it, some do use it as a tool just to shed the surplus kgs, then there`s the social status issue, iftar parties [again-some do this for the cheap thrills of social status] etc..
Ramadan is there for us to get our training, but if we`re not careful, we might just end up wasting our time. Its about self-analysis rather than scrutinising other`s actios.

…thanks for the responses so far…will pick two for response…

malik99

..am not disagreeing with the training aspect of ramazaan…my beef is only about the gross superficiality of the whole exercise…instead of cleansing of the soul and body this exercise has become a futile ritual…lip service…here now, gone tomorrow…what do we have to show for the training from the last 1425 ramazaans?

I am frankly tired of this daily mullah bashing that occurs
…agree here also…I have not stopped at mullah bashing…I lay the greater blame on us – on us Muslims who have ceded territory by default – it is we, the semi-educated Muslims who have stopped learning about our religion…as we become aware of our religion clergy’s importance would diminish proportionately…

HP

…in an earlier post you wrote: Throughout the Muslim history, nobody had ever claimed that Islam is a complete system…It is a religion like many other religions and there is nothing superior about it.(104 A Dangerous Gift on August 3, 2004)

…this is contrary to the beliefs ingrained with the majority of Muslims…recall Muhammed’s (saw) words from his last sermon on the mount calling on Allah and Muslims to bear witness?

…So, I have to spend time to learn Islam now,…
…briefly, yes…or let them hijack your religion and suffer the consequences by default

rgds

t

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Should Muslims not strive to be good human beings in other months?

This questions bothers in mind of many people. But Fasting is a ritual which cannot be extended in other months as it has been forbidden in Islam that undue fasts must be avoided. But the cause of Ramzan is to develop internal sympathy for the hungry and needy people. If we start thinking in the way that those formal procedures which are essence of ramzan should be applied and carried out in every rest month then we would be killing the theme of Ramzan.
In fast it is confirmed valid if its done fullfilling religious basics and fundamentals. The lesson given in Ramzan should be enhanced in other months like not lying, pray five times a day. Help needy, poor and feel hunger so do productive work which could help in decreasing poverty.
But what we see actual practise is that with start of Ramzan, the prices of edibles (Basic) shoot and uneasiness among poor start rising. Ramzan sometimes is considered a burden then. Secondly you can see shopkeepers selling with good costumes , practising to sell clean goodies but as Ramzan ends they come back to original states.
So the whole matter is that the good things we practise in Ramzan should also be adopted in other months.
This also carries out a valid point towards ``Aiteqaf``. I myself used to see people sitting in total solitude cut off from world so that with least possible contact to world results in max possible probability of Gunah.
But in comparison a man surrounded by thousands of thing in this world but dutifying the things factually and not sinning s/he should be considered more rewarding. So the conclusion is that ceremonies like Ramzan n Shab-e-Qadr provide man/ woman a margin to pray heartedly to God. And this is a silent contact with man n gd, not letting any matter come in between. But thinking that good things should be acted in few times of month is a wrong idea.

So I agree n say:
Have a good Ramzan! No, have a good day! One day at a time for the whole year!
n Ghalib:
Baskih dushwar hai her kaam ka asan hona
Admi ko bhi moyassar nahin insan hona

If theres one thing i dislike more then a fundamentalist muslim its a moderate Muslim. The fundo at least can hide behind the fact that he is an idiot.

But the rest of you. How can u defend limiting ur lives to the letters in some ancient text?


By natural progression we go from sometimes being sunnu or shia, to seeing all of islam as one, to seeing all of humanity as one.