Tsunami

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rsridhar: I am not sure that your criticism of the oil rich Arab countries is particularly valid: saudi arabia announced yesterday it was tripling its contribution to $ 30 million - relative to its population (25 million), this is almost exactly the official aid of $350 million announced by the US. No doubt private contributions from the US will amount to much more (one actress alone, Sandra Bullock, pledged $1 million). Tiny Qatar promised $10 million, which is not chickenfeed for a country that size. I despise the ways of the saudis as much as you do - but let stick to the facts and not beat on them at ever opportunity. Of course money is not everything, and the services being provided by men and women of the US carrier strike force Abraham Lincoln in terms of delivering water and food and medicine via helicopter - and taking away wounded people to local hospitals, and the large US hospital ship being brought to the area - are priceless in terms of saving lives. But, at this time of tragedy, the goodness in people of ALL faiths and nationalities has come out. All I hope for is that we all learn something from this, and try to rise about our petty concerns as I try to point out in the article.

This is a time when people from across the world have come together at the place of the tragedy - in India, I saw a hindu who was saved from being swept away by two muslims, and the three of them said that despite the communal strife in that area they felt like brothers. Also in that place, mosques were opened up to all flood refugees - hindus, buddhists as well as muslims.

rsridhar #132 Your post to Raka points to the dangers of reaching conclusions based on the words of a commentator like Limbaugh who is well known for his extreme biases, rather than using your own common sense. Thus, Limbaugh ignores (1) the role played by neighboring Malaysia (from where a large number of volunteer doctors are in sumatera) and by Pakistan (which, as I have mentioned, was very timely - and thus invaluable in terms of saving lives - in case of maldives); and (2) the giving capacity of countries - Turkey is not oil rich, and as I already pointed out the saudi contribution matches the official figure of the US if one takes into account their relative populations.

It doesnt say much for this indian website suleikha if this is how they are playing politics in the face of human tragedy. Limbaugh`s nonsense may be music to their ears, but it is still nonsense.

#128 by Rakapo$h
Ha, ha.
Now, what makes u defend those Saudi idiots, i wonder?
Muslim nations apathy has not gone unnoticed. It was mentioned by some commentators on CNN. Also, this news piece:
http://www.sulekha.com/news/nhc.aspx?cid=411532

(Top radio talker Rush Limbaugh stepped into the breach on Tuesday, detailing for his audience the relatively stingy response from brother nations.
• Saudi Arabia - $10 million. ``That`s like an afternoon shopping spree in Paris for a member of the Saudi royal family,`` noted Limbaugh.

• Iran pledged a puny $627,000 - a small fraction of what they`re spending on their nuclear weapons program.

• Wildly wealthy Qatar - just $10 million of their petrodollars.

• The United Arab Emirates - $2.6 million.

• Kuwait - $2 million.

• Libya - $2 million.

• Turkey - $1.25 million.

Compare that to the $350 million in government aid pledged by the Great Satan (America), not to mention hundreds of millions more from private U.S. donors.)
Now, another piece of info. Have u heard of the hugging saint. She is famous among spiritual circles and even visited Pak. Do u know how much she donated for the cause?
22 million dollars! This is more than the donations from all muslim nations so far! This news was in Khaleej Times. Check the following redirect:
http://www.sulekha.com/news/nhc.aspx?cid=411459.
Money matters in times like this. The world has seen the caliber and the ``so called brotherhood`` among muslim nations. It is just pathetic.
Sridhar

re:#129 by tahmed32
I stand by what i said even though i was wrong initially in assuming that no aid was given by Arab countries. I am talking about Oil rich Arab countries, so please do not bring in Pak or India into this. Both are poor nations and whatever they do is to be appreciated. Indians alone have raised 70 million dollars for the South. This is on top of govt and foreign aid.
But the contributions from Oil rich Arabs has been abysmal. One hopes things will improve after the proposed summit that is to take place soon where nations will spell out how much aid they are giving.
Sridhar

SR #124 Life on earth is indeed much more fragile than most of would like to believe. The earth`s crust itself merely floats upon a core of molten metal whose power we sometimes get a glimpse of in the form of volcanoes, earthquakes, and (now) the tsunami. Tens of thousands of asteroids and comets go around the solar system - in the asteroid belt beyond Mars, and in the icy Kuiper Belt (of which the planet Pluto is considered a part) and beyond that the Oort cloud (home to countless comets). It is only a question of time before one of these heads our way - and the only thing that would stand between our extinction as a species (like the mass extinctions that resulted in the end of the rule of the dinosaurs due to an asteroid hitting the yucatan penisula 65 million years ago). There have been other times of mass extinctions - including the precambrian mass extinction 600 million years ago. The appalling thing is that today we are going through another period of mass extinction - the cause this time being purely the spread of mankind in areas occupied by animal species before.

The big question then is: will this current period of mass extinction take down the top dogs (mankind) with it?? The answer is clearly up in the air: as Bill Joy, the brilliant scientist at Sun Microcomputer systems warned in a famous speech before resigning his job doing research in nanotechnology a few years ago - advancements in human technology may easily lead to unintended consequences. So, we can move science forward to protect us from being hit by an asteroid - but in doing so, we also create the possibilities of untended consequences of the kind Bill Joy warned against.

rsridhar: I agree with Raka that you need to check your facts before jumping to conclusions (like some other posters like nasah and parthab whose posts I dont consider worthy of a further comment because not only are they factually wrong - as in case of nasah talking about only seeing asian bodies on western TV, when I clearly recall seeing the bloated body of a western woman vacationer drowned by the tsunami - but also disgusting - as in case of nasah talking about dead bodies in a manner that only a Godless man could talk).

And as Raka points out, muslim countries have in fact been quite forthcoming, although admittedly not at the scale of the US. Raka has already provided some links for you to read. In addition to Sri Lanka - where Pakistan acted promptly by sending in a C-130 laden with goods, and where the Pakistani Edhi foundation contributed a similar amount as well - Pakistan also provided timely aid to the Maldives. As the link indicates, there were two Pakistan Navy ships visiting Maldives at the time which promptly went to work rescuing stranded people with the help of their helicopters and also used their helicopters to drop supplies. This is the link: http://www.defensenews.com/story.php?F=573493&C=mideast

What is really heartening is that in the two places ravaged by brutal civil wars - sri lanka and aceh - even the insurgents and the government are coooperating with one another. While not much is heard of the rebels at aceh, I did read an article on the tamil tigers - who seem to have done a great job of not just not coming in the way of rescue efforts, but of actually actively organizing relief efforts in areas they control and permitting foreign and international agencies to also conduct relief efforts. While it is not clear what role the insurgents are playing aceh - it does seem obvious that they are not coming in the way of relief efforts.

Rakapost #128 Glad to see you keeping the record straight. And I love your great sense of humor. May Allah grant at least ten percent of your common sense and good humor to every chowkie. Amen. Then we would actually have an intelligent discussion take place.

sridhar,
The point was YOU said Saudis didnt send any help to Tsuanmi victims and I proved you wrong.
Now how they choose to spend their other expenditure is entirely their own business. I dont see anything wrong with them opening Islamic schools or distributing copies of Quran. I dont really care if India opens up temples or distributes copies of Geeta around the world either. I didnt see in your cut and paste any suggestions of Saudis funding Al-Qaeda. They are infact affected by Al-Qaeda the most currently and working to get rid of it.

Honestly speaking you can call any country scum of a nation. Its your opinion and doesnt really mean much.

PS: and dont get worked up in shaming me. I dont really have any.

10 questions that immediately spring to my mind in the aftermath of the recent tsunami are:

1.Is it true that some American scientists knew about the approaching disaster but did not act?
2.Is it true that a private phone call from a Singaporean to a coastal village in India saved 4 villages?
3.Is it true that the Indian military hierachy knew about the approaching tsunami after it struck the Andaman islands but did not inform the relevant ministries?
4.Is it true that no action will be taken against them?
5.Is it true that Bush earns more in a day in Iraq than the $350 he has promised to the victims of the tsunami?
6.Is it true that the UN takes such offers of aid with a pinch of salt as only a fraction of the promised aid usually materialises?
7.Is it true that the fury of one religious madman has killed more people in one country - Iraq - than the recent tsunami could?
8.Is it true that big fishing trawling companies will strike it rich because much of tragedy hit the micro fishing community?
9.Is it true that the economy of these coastal areas will improve only if the tourists return in the same numbers, and not if they moved on to different vocations?
10.Is it true that the only small comfort God can give the tsunami affected people now, is probably allowing them to spew at him (and look for other causes and solutions to natural calamities)?

re:#119 by Rakapo$h
O.K, i made a mistake.
So, Saudi Arabia promised some aid.
How does the amount promised compare with the amount spent on propagating a militant variety of Islam. I think u know the answer. If not, check the following article from the Washingtonpost:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/A13266-2004Aug18?language=printer
Excerpt:
(King Fahd issued a directive that ``no limits be put on expenditures for the propagation of Islam,`` according to Nawaf Obaid, a Saudi oil and security analyst. Saudi Arabia now had the money: Its oil revenue had skyrocketed after the 1973 oil embargo. King Fahd used the cash to build mosques, Islamic centers and schools by the thousands around the world. Over the next two decades, the kingdom established 200 Islamic colleges, 210 Islamic centers, 1,500 mosques and 2,000 schools for Muslim children in non-Islamic countries, according to King Fahd`s personal Web site. In 1984, the king built a $130 million printing plant in Medina devoted to producing Saudi-approved translations of the Koran. By 2000, the kingdom had distributed 138 million copies worldwide.

Exactly how much has been spent to spread Wahhabism is unclear. David D. Aufhauser, a former Treasury Department general counsel, told a Senate committee in June that estimates went ``north of $75 billion.``)
So, Saudi Arabia spent $75 billion dollars over 20 years (this is the minimum amount) or about 4 billion dollar per year, on spreading Wahabism and yet gives only $ 10 million dollars in aid for its muslim brothers in times of need.
And you are out there defending this scum of a nation. Shame on you.
Sridhar

Raka , lets not get too excited shall we....Pakistan`s magnanimous aid effort amounted to a hefty $168k. Thats the sort of money an uncle of mine earns each year doing some coding stuff....

Ahmed sahib, thank you for pointing out the insignificance of our daily lives and the petty details we sometimes get bogged down with.

As you and others rightly point out, we were reminded by the Indian Ocean tsunami how vulnerable our civilization was to natural forces. Tsunamis are nothing new. Yet it seems that none of the effected populations were even remotely aware of the possibility, let alone being prepared for one.

This has made me more acutely concerned about another impending disaster that is coming our way sometime in the not-too-distant future. It is not going to be a world war or a climate change induced famine. No. Famine and war are out. It is going to be pestilence instead. WHO scientists say it is not just ``impending``, but ``imminent``.

I am referring to a mega pandemic of influenza... Yes, that`s right. Nothing exotic like AIDS or SARS, but just a massive worldwide series of common cold epidemics that make up a ``pandemic``. The world could see a much bigger pandemic than the one in 1918-19 which claimed far more lives than did the First World War. Its just a matter of time.

The bird flu virus has successfully ``crossed over`` the so-called ``species barrier``... There have been at least 3 confirmed deaths as a result of human-to-human transmission of the bird flu virus. Now the virus is incubating somewhere and at some future point it will burst out like an out-of-control fire storm. New viruses can lie in wait for years before bursting out of control. (The oldest known HIV positive blood sample, for instance, is from a person who died back in 1954. It wasn`t until 1981 that HIV was even identified.)

Whenever the pandemic hits, it could claim as many as 650 million lives worldwide. (The most conservative WHO estimates are closer to 7 million -- ``IF ALL goes well``.)

The 1918 pandemic claimed almost 50 million lives worldwide. But that Spanish Flu was just a virulent mutant strain of the HUMAN flu virus. The human species had lived with (and adapted to) its lesser virulent mutations for ages. The bird flu virus, on the other hand, is a new pathogen for the homosapien. Any time a new pathogen is introduced into a virgin population, the toll taken by the first wave of the spreading infection is the highest it will ever be again. In time the new host species develops enough immunologic memory so that the population can withstand any subsequent epidemic waves with far less devastation. But the first wave of a new infectious agent spreading through a defenseless population takes the greatest toll. The elderly, the very young and the immune-depressed take a disproportionately larger hit.

650 million is 10% of the 6.5 billion world population and it is a rather reasonable estimate of the death toll a ``first-wave`` pandemic could claim from a ``virgin`` population. The period from getting the infection to full blown disease is only ten days or less. About 30 to 50% of the population could catch the infection. A 20% mortality rate amongst the infected is quite likely. A worldwide pandemic could run its course in less than 18 months.

But stop, some will say. Why do you have to bring up such unpleasent possibilities? None of this doom and gloom is welcome, they will say. Its a New Year... let`s think about the positive.

Okay, let`s do. The silver lining here is that when this pandemic will finally be over, the western world`s looming pension crisis will also have been automatically resolved. The Black Death of the thirteenth century, for instance, was a catastrophic event no doubt, but it also resulted in unprecedented prosperity after it was all over.

...SR

Actress Sandra Bullock contributed $1.0 million to the American Red Cross to help countries hit by the deadly tsunami. She had contributed the same amount to the organization after 9/11. She is a kind soul.

Mohammad Gill

err...
rshridhar..
please check your facts first before you blow your fuse. If you think the muslim world specially the Saudis are going to get any + publicity over this in western media think again.

Saudi donate 10 million dollars

and note that was done on Dec 29th.

Help from Edhi center from Pakistan.

Edhi