Cost of Questioning

Yes yes, I agree with all. Very clear. Very lucid.

I am for equality. This bad thing was promoted by General amoung many good things he has and been doing.
IT IS TOTAL AGAIST SPIRIT OF DEMOCRACY THAT UNLESS YOU HAVE SOME STUPID DEGREE PAPER YOU CANOT STAND AGAINST ELECTION> IT IS VIOLATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS.
SO I DO NOT MIND PEOPLE BUYING DEGREES. WHAT ONE CAN DO THEN YOU ARE TOLD TO BE STUPID AS YOU HAVE NO DEGREE PAPER. LET people have fake papers who cares.
Dam stupid lafangebazi by educated people and army election rulers and people like YLH ( IF i write they will say i am bised being without stupid degree paper)who are educated should send letters to HQ to stop stupidity. We have half educated people who are damn fools

#1
ahmedmadani, you have all the right to express yourself but Pakistanis have enough of this madrassa mentality. You don`t seem or sound very brilliant.

Great work Salman. I can tell you that the general trend in Pakistan is to hush up such scandals. Whisleblowers, regardless are very small and those who do put their careers at great risk.

Its a very sad situation.

Very good work Baset!

i am glad to see this type of an objective investigative work in pakistan. also surprised to see it.

also: there are a few other aspects of objective analysis that we should practice in our society. for instance, after identification of a problem, the identification of its solution, and the development of systemic safeguards to prevent the recurrence of that problem.

i know these are different stages and this article was supposed to contribute for just one of these phases, but we should also see contributions on those lines.

inevitably, there are a few consequences of this whole drama.

- the impact on students of QAU on any such controversy needs to be considered here. how would a student be motivated to do painful hardwork to earn a terminal degree, or any degree for that mattter, when there are strong suspicions of the qualifications earned by the institution`s chief.

- what would be the impact of that gentleman on the new-coming faculty or on existing faculty? how can a person lead others with a fractured or dissipated credibility.

- also how sad is the fact that an institution of higher education gets such an ignoble and ill-famed birth. should we do something for it?

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aside from the objective problem solving:
there are some bitter facts we need to open our eyes about too:

- did anybody question why it became prudent to simply `regard` all such pieces of sub-ordinary services as ``universities`` or ``degree granting authorities``. what prompted anyone to see the NIML as an NUML, what was it doing so superb that it became essential to make it independent? and how was its ``superb performance`` affected under the umbrella of QAU?

these are real questions before we start painting boards for the pappu university of kheti-bari, and lallu-panju university of modern patangbazi, feeka univ of chats, and dhenga univ of culinary arts, etc. almost everyday i fear reading news about such exciting creative ideas of our fellow pakistanis who are so bent upon making world records of idiocy. and all so called advanced countries dont get the idea of breaking their hundreds of departments and institutes to create a swarm of `centers of excellences`!

- systemically, perhaps it is quite an imperative to get the military be treated for its psychological disorders. well, one may argue quite reasonably why shouldnt the whole country receive such a treatment. but frankly, military qualifies for preferntial attention because the reach and effects of a sick military mind is much more than that of any civiilian mind.

our military does not seem to easily understand the plausibility of the argument that a good operational command of a few corps or intelligence offices do not grant any vision to any mind. so appointment of generals and colonels and civil servants for academic leadership positions only speak of the intellectual and logical bankrupcy of a nation where there is no strong tradition of having technorat advisory committees whose recommendations are considered important.

take it light but do not take it non-seriously! ;-)

with kind regards,

khayal !

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I hope an appraisal of our ministers and members of assembly would follow.

Great work Mr. Baset. I’m sure Dr. Isa would be reinstated.

God bless our nation!

The good thing now is that Dr.Saify - ex VC KU did tried to control these rouge elements and the situation today is very much under conrtrol - and I think and let me assure you all from KU point of view fake degree`s from KU specially is history thanks to Dr.Saify and his team - plus the new VC - Pirzada Qasim

I lived in KU ( Karachi University ) campus as my mom was Dean of one of the depts. and was involved and still is involved in hard-core decision making of KU ( till today ) - let me asure you about that `fake degree(s)` were and is a part of atleast KU today . I remember a price which I checked last year , the price list is as follows..:
a ) Science Degree ( attested and verified only once ) - Rs. 38,000 - cash
b ) Arts Degree ( attested and verified twice ) - Rs- 15000
c) BA or MA in either Bangoli or Sindi - Rs.10000 - list goes on -
this is all done in Admin. Block of KU and no Prof. I am aware is involved in this scam but only junior staff from respected Depts. -
Paper Leaks- are done by the same group -

I lived in KU ( Karachi University ) campus as my mom was Dean of one of the depts. and was involved and still is involved in hard-core decision making of KU ( till today ) - let me asure you about that `fake degree(s)` were and is a part of atleast KU today . I remember a price which I checked last year , the price list is as follows..:
a ) Science Degree ( attested and verified only once ) - Rs. 38,000 - cash
b ) Arts Degree ( attested and verified twice ) - Rs- 15000
c) BA or MA in either Bangoli or Sindi - Rs.10000 - list goes on -
this is all done in Admin. Block of KU and no Prof. I am aware is involved in this scam but only junior staff from respected Depts. -
Paper Leaks- are done by the same group -

Mr. Baset

Good effort but as you and I know very well that for the powers that be in Pakistan i.e. for the ruling class, the law-abiding people like Isa or you and me are nothing more than earthworms. The wailing thru the the articles like these fall on their deaf ears and is nothing more than the wiggle of earthworms. I hope you understand that the status quo cannot be changed without an all out struggle against this sytem of lawlessnes, corruption, and oppression that sucks our blood and makes us leave our country. It is sad but it is truth.

Matter is not that simple. I fear some mafia responsible for substandard education is trying to get benefit of the situation caused by minor differences of policy makers of HEC.

I fear that if this war causes problems to HEC, it will bring down all positives done by HEC during last few years. And being a direct beneficiary of HEC policies, I will never like the role of these people involved in politics. Dr Isa may be thrown out of COMSTECH because of his political involvement. And it is a simple administration matter. Administration can`t be just all the times. May be, he is a sincere man. But a sincere man lacking wisdom is not acceptable in any case. And his wisdom can be judged the way that he is publically politicizing a sensitive national issue.

The following article published in the JANG gives a little insight into the HEC matters.
http://www.jang.com.pk/jang/jan2005-daily/09-01-2005/editorial/col2.htm

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Also, In response to my question/concerns about HEC performance and the sudden interest of media in HEC after publishing the lists of illegal/substandard institutes of Pakistan, Dr. Sohail Naqvi replied as follows. I had also asked about the fake degrees of MNAs and MPAs.

Mr. Hamid,
HEC can not legally call to check the degree of any person, let alone an MNA or MPA. We will continue to respond vigorously but need all the people everywhere to join us in countering this propaganda. We do not profess to be perfect, but we are certainly trying and working hard to improve things.

regards

Dr. S. Sohail H. Naqvi
Executive Director
Higher Education Commission
Sector H9
Islamabad
Tel: +92 51 444 8369

If quality of PhDs coming out of university was the issue, it must be discussed in HEC meetings. Atta Ur Rehman has been a very dedicated researcher. Although, I have seen people criticizing his policies, but nobody criticizes his sincerity. Also, he has good experience of running one of the best research institutes in Pakistan. If the things were discussed directly with him instead of publishing them in Spider ( a kids internet magazine ), it might have produced better results. But he politicized it and caused a whole propoganda campaign being started against everything of HEC.

Looking at the situation, even if some researchers were planning to return back to Pakistan for attractive offers by HEC, now I doubt that anyone will be willing to return.

things are going bad as far as phds and ms degree`s are concerned, the ms and phd`s comming from paki univ`s even if it`s from lums etc is certainly no match to those from us/uk and in most cases the curriculum of ms in many places offering it, is same as mcs, and in some ``places`` very young ms qualified people are teaching ms ?? i think the true spirit of ms lies with research work which as we all know doesnt exist any where in pakistan, hec should take some serious steps and stop allowing institute at every gali and nukar from offering ms/phd, i think they should set a very very strint benchmark coz this will in no way help pakistan only furhter create the matters worse

as far as fake phd`s are concerned, well i work as a ``place`` in islo and i know that there is some truth to it, not every one who calls him self doctor is a phd, i think their phd degrees should be evaluated and if they are fake they should be treated very very harshly, they are playing with the future of pakistan and that should not be allowed to go on.

I have read the jang article by Jamil-uddin-Aali that you mentioned.
http://www.jang.com.pk/jang/jan2005-daily/09-01-2005/editorial/col2.htm

I was shocked to read his words and I quote:

``Itefaaq key mujhey uss sazish kay aik namwar agent ka naam bhee maloom ho gya hai jinhein un ka moahida mulazmat khatam honay kay baad un kee matloobah toseeh naheen mili hai``

Mr. Aali says that all students doing their PhD from a university in Pakistan will have a ``ghatya`` PhD. I was surprised how he could draw such inferences when no such thing was mentioned or even implied by Dr. Isa`s article. The purpose of Dr. Isa`s article was to question the degree awarded to vice-chancellor of Quaid-e-Azam university.

Spider is not a kid`s magazine. Read the ``About Us`` section in Spider
http://www.spider.tm/jan2005/aboutusn.html

Dr. Atta-ur-Rehman is a sincere person. However, since he is heading an organization that is responsible for dispensing huge public funds, it is necessary for his organization to ensure that those funds do not go wasted, and that quality is duly maintained. HEC is making an effort in this regard, which should be duly supported. HEC`s efforts should also be complimented by creating a public awareness against those people who are trying to use these schemes to their advantage. Dr. Sohail`s email also points in this direction.

this is where should Mr.Pota would have gone ? Courts ? where the judges are used and abused by Government .. going to government means going to bandits themselves and ask them to do justice ! !!!! so the only other option is : going to the press... Thelka.com did it in India .. just because people would know what actually has happened coz of Thelka more then 5o cr people became witness - if Thelka would have given the tapes to CBI , I am sure the evidence would be no evidence-