Beena Sarwar February 20, 2005
#65 Posted by rahul_capri on February 25, 2005 8:06:19 pm
ana,
I already said that I am not disagreeing with u. Firstly, the concept of honour and women as the sole bastions of it is so much ingrained into our thinking that it just cant be reasoned away so simply. Secondly, if a woman is feeling devastated by rape, whatever the reasons may be, I am nobody to judge her and tell her how she is supposed to feel. This would be condescending in the same vain as referring to rape as gross violation, and life shattering experience etc. Though, In my humble opinion most of the trauma felt by a woman is because of the feeling that she is ``polluted``,and her honour has been compromised and that the society feels the same way. The woman is part of the same patriarchal society that has made such norms, yet another tool to exercise control over woman and make them weak in power relationships. This culminates in the double whammy of rape.Aside from the trauma that the rape victim may feel without any societal overtones, there is this back breaking and life shattering burden of the societal stigma of rape.
While those idiots who wish to kill her because she was raped deserve the same punishment as the rapists, on the other hand lets not be too judgmental about her state. If she wants help , she will seek it out from medical institutions, besides she always has her family to turn to. Here, I couldnt agree more with doublec that support structures should be in place.
But I only have complete disregard for that school of thought that presupposes that her life has been shattered beyond repair and she would never be the same again.
I already said that I am not disagreeing with u. Firstly, the concept of honour and women as the sole bastions of it is so much ingrained into our thinking that it just cant be reasoned away so simply. Secondly, if a woman is feeling devastated by rape, whatever the reasons may be, I am nobody to judge her and tell her how she is supposed to feel. This would be condescending in the same vain as referring to rape as gross violation, and life shattering experience etc. Though, In my humble opinion most of the trauma felt by a woman is because of the feeling that she is ``polluted``,and her honour has been compromised and that the society feels the same way. The woman is part of the same patriarchal society that has made such norms, yet another tool to exercise control over woman and make them weak in power relationships. This culminates in the double whammy of rape.Aside from the trauma that the rape victim may feel without any societal overtones, there is this back breaking and life shattering burden of the societal stigma of rape.
While those idiots who wish to kill her because she was raped deserve the same punishment as the rapists, on the other hand lets not be too judgmental about her state. If she wants help , she will seek it out from medical institutions, besides she always has her family to turn to. Here, I couldnt agree more with doublec that support structures should be in place.
But I only have complete disregard for that school of thought that presupposes that her life has been shattered beyond repair and she would never be the same again.
#66 Posted by djkewl on March 1, 2005 7:16:14 am
ex president reagan to rape victims quote... (Relax and enjoy it)
#66 Posted by djkewl on March 1, 2005 7:16:16 am
ex president reagan to rape victims quote... (Relax and enjoy it)
#67 Posted by kardesh on March 2, 2005 6:38:34 pm
In Pakistan, the army does what it wants and no one can question it. Ask the Bengalis, the Baluchis, the Mohajirs. Why should Shazia expect any better?
#68 Posted by XeroxKhan on March 28, 2005 9:14:39 am
Pakistani women fare no better (or worse) than a bucket. Functional, often neglected and always misused.
Islam dictates the second class status of women in general and wives in particular.
If this is how the ``muslim`` women are treated, what could be the fate of a ``non-muslim`` woman in a country like Pakistan?
Similar to what Dr. Shazia did, ``ALL PAKISTANI WOMEN`` should flee the country.
Islam dictates the second class status of women in general and wives in particular.
If this is how the ``muslim`` women are treated, what could be the fate of a ``non-muslim`` woman in a country like Pakistan?
Similar to what Dr. Shazia did, ``ALL PAKISTANI WOMEN`` should flee the country.
#69 Posted by waterbearer on December 22, 2005 12:56:07 am
To # 63 (rahul capri)
Yes I definitely agree when you say pitying the victim and saying her life is shattered is equal to considering rape destroyed her honor. And I too feel that`s the ultimate stupidity. But I think that sometimes, victims become devastated even not considering their ``lost`` honor. I mean, when I was 14, I experienced the sexual harassment or so-called ``eve-teasing`` for the first time in my life. It felt so weird and I could not tell anybody about it, even my sister and her friends, least of all my parents. It wasn`t because I was trying to protect my izzat or whatever, it was because I was completely repelled. If I myself was so shaken by that little incident, how much would a rape victim feel? And this comes from someone whose friends and family consider to not at all be sensitive or emotional.
Yes I definitely agree when you say pitying the victim and saying her life is shattered is equal to considering rape destroyed her honor. And I too feel that`s the ultimate stupidity. But I think that sometimes, victims become devastated even not considering their ``lost`` honor. I mean, when I was 14, I experienced the sexual harassment or so-called ``eve-teasing`` for the first time in my life. It felt so weird and I could not tell anybody about it, even my sister and her friends, least of all my parents. It wasn`t because I was trying to protect my izzat or whatever, it was because I was completely repelled. If I myself was so shaken by that little incident, how much would a rape victim feel? And this comes from someone whose friends and family consider to not at all be sensitive or emotional.
#70 Posted by waterbearer on December 22, 2005 12:56:16 am
To # 63 (rahul capri)
Yes I definitely agree when you say pitying the victim and saying her life is shattered is equal to considering rape destroyed her honor. And I too feel that`s the ultimate stupidity. But I think that sometimes, victims become devastated even not considering their ``lost`` honor. I mean, when I was 14, I experienced the sexual harassment or so-called ``eve-teasing`` for the first time in my life. It felt so weird and I could not tell anybody about it, even my sister and her friends, least of all my parents. It wasn`t because I was trying to protect my izzat or whatever, it was because I was completely repelled. If I myself was so shaken by that little incident, how much would a rape victim feel? And this comes from someone whose friends and family consider to not at all be sensitive or emotional.
Yes I definitely agree when you say pitying the victim and saying her life is shattered is equal to considering rape destroyed her honor. And I too feel that`s the ultimate stupidity. But I think that sometimes, victims become devastated even not considering their ``lost`` honor. I mean, when I was 14, I experienced the sexual harassment or so-called ``eve-teasing`` for the first time in my life. It felt so weird and I could not tell anybody about it, even my sister and her friends, least of all my parents. It wasn`t because I was trying to protect my izzat or whatever, it was because I was completely repelled. If I myself was so shaken by that little incident, how much would a rape victim feel? And this comes from someone whose friends and family consider to not at all be sensitive or emotional.
#71 Posted by sabag on November 9, 2006 3:54:06 pm
I agree what is happening with women is sad, but this is not only in pakistan, America has the highest rate of sexual harassment in the world, 4 times higher than Germany, 13 times higher than England, and 20 times higher than Japan. so it is not only pakistan, but the problem is that pakistan is mis represented so much in the media that it seems that such things happen only in Pakistan. I myself have been living in Germany and i know how the situation here is.
You talk about the outrage on publicizing Shaukat hayat case, i say at least there were out rages, there were and still are people to condemn such things, but here in Germany a girl gave birth to a child from her brother and was showed on TV and she said she is proud of it, and there were no outrages no condemnation here in Germany , then what happened to austrian girl Natascha Kampusch, there are many examples in west than what is said about Pakistan but the problem is that what happens in Pakistan is projected more on media than what happens in the west.
And i wonder that these victims of sexual harrasment who flew to canada or america or europe will be safe there, because mostly pakistani people want to go back to pakistan for their growing childern either boys or girls because if they stayed in america or europe they are just unsafe as far as their moral values are concerend.
Here one person commented that in Islam women are given 2nd class status i think he does not had any knowledge of Islam, in my opinion the solution to these problem is only the Islamic sharia.
If today each men and women in pakistan do complete islamic hijab, and after that a capital punishment must be given to the one who sexually harass a women then there is no doubt that this problem will be solved.
You talk about the outrage on publicizing Shaukat hayat case, i say at least there were out rages, there were and still are people to condemn such things, but here in Germany a girl gave birth to a child from her brother and was showed on TV and she said she is proud of it, and there were no outrages no condemnation here in Germany , then what happened to austrian girl Natascha Kampusch, there are many examples in west than what is said about Pakistan but the problem is that what happens in Pakistan is projected more on media than what happens in the west.
And i wonder that these victims of sexual harrasment who flew to canada or america or europe will be safe there, because mostly pakistani people want to go back to pakistan for their growing childern either boys or girls because if they stayed in america or europe they are just unsafe as far as their moral values are concerend.
Here one person commented that in Islam women are given 2nd class status i think he does not had any knowledge of Islam, in my opinion the solution to these problem is only the Islamic sharia.
If today each men and women in pakistan do complete islamic hijab, and after that a capital punishment must be given to the one who sexually harass a women then there is no doubt that this problem will be solved.
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