My darling abaya!
Sameen Tahir Khan March 23, 2005
#77 Posted by hamidm2 on March 26, 2005 3:17:59 pm
malik,
......... i never said that wearing an abaya causes obesity - all i said was that most pakistani ( it might not apply to arabs and aborigine) women i know started wearing an abaya once they got a little fat in the behind .......and mrs hamidm agrees with me ............ on the other hand i am constantly perplexed by younger and more shapely women in hijab, tight jeans and even tighter blouses (full sleeves, of course) - what is the purpose of that ?........... any healthy male will never get past their j-lo behind and britney breasts to look at their hair and arms - astagfruallah! ............ the logic of the mullahs escapes me ..........
......... i never said that wearing an abaya causes obesity - all i said was that most pakistani ( it might not apply to arabs and aborigine) women i know started wearing an abaya once they got a little fat in the behind .......and mrs hamidm agrees with me ............ on the other hand i am constantly perplexed by younger and more shapely women in hijab, tight jeans and even tighter blouses (full sleeves, of course) - what is the purpose of that ?........... any healthy male will never get past their j-lo behind and britney breasts to look at their hair and arms - astagfruallah! ............ the logic of the mullahs escapes me ..........
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#76 Posted by echoboom on March 26, 2005 3:14:16 pm
French Muslim Band Sings Against Racism, Terror
By
Hadi Yahmid, IOL Paris CorrespondentPARIS, March 26 (IslamOnline.net) – In France, rap music no longer conjures up images of hip-hopping boys and girls or doped teenagers after aMuslim band has given it a new look.
Singing primarily against terrorism and racism, Din Records seven members are priding themselves on being Muslims moved by the sufferings of their fellow Muslims from Palestine to Chechnya. Other rap bands are united by drugs, but we are united by prayers,” the band’s vocal Medine said on the band’s Web site.
Established
in 2002, the band denounces the injustice done to Muslims in the
occupied Palestinians territories, Iraq, Afghanistan and Chechnya.
It
also condemns terrorism and expresses heartfelt sympathy with the
oppressed worldwide.
Din
Records songs, which topped France’s music charts and sold briskly,
include “Jihad” “9/11,” “Guantanamo” and “The School of
Life.”
“We
want to give voice to the sufferings endured by Muslims throughout the
past three years in the aftermath of the attacks,” Medine says.
“9/11”
The
9/11 ditty, which has been banned by the French TV, shows a mixture of
the havoc caused by 9/11 attacks in New York and Washington and the
destruction caused by the US troops in Afghanistan and Iraq.
It
also features the deplorable conditions of the Palestinians and the
wide-scale destruction of their lands and homes by the Israeli
occupation army.
“I
keep looking for the root of the world’s disasters/Only to find out
that the storm is blowing everywhere,” read the song’s lyrics.
the eyes are fixed on the twin tower/You don’t understand anything
neither do I/But listen to the story from the very beginning…From
September to September…From Ramallah to Manhattan…From Kabul to
Baghdad,” they say.
The
song says that the 9/11 attacks have had their domino effects on
Muslims in France with the secularism drive picking up steam.
In
the country of the three-color flag, you have to be secular and
enlightened/You must respect the values of the republic/Muslims are
not allowed to wear beards or take on the hijab in schools.”
And
it hits out at the media blitz against Muslims.
In
the newspapers, they accuse us of inciting violence, war crimes/They
accuse us of being against the Americans though the Americans are
rallying behind Michael Moore,” the US filmmaker who directed the
anti-Bush “Fahrenheit 9/11.”The
song also touches on the torture and sexual abuse of Iraqi prisoners
by US soldiers.
Two
or three million dollars and we will forget about Abu Gharib,” the
scene of the pornographic and shocking practices meted out to Iraqi
prisoners by US soldiers.
Guantanamo
The songs “Guantanamo” and “The School of Life” have to do with
the humiliation of Muslims in the West.
The
storm is blowing down Islam and the residents of the suburbs, who are
marginalized in transports because of their hijabs/And those young
people with beards, who are banned in airports/It is a plausible
reason for Islamophobia,” read the lyrics of “Guantanamo”.The
School of Life” adds: “They tell me that I belong in the third
generation of immigrants/Though I have been born here and lead a
simple life/Indeed, [the Hijri year] 1425 is a minaret for our
fathers, mothers and brothers.”
The
International Helsinki Federation for Human Rights (IHF) said in a
recent report that Muslim minorities across Europe have been
experiencing growing distrust, hostility and discrimination since
9/11.
Pre-existing
patterns of prejudice and discrimination have been reinforced and
Muslims have increasingly felt that they are stigmatized because of
their beliefs,” said the report.
ByHadi Yahmid, IOL Paris CorrespondentPARIS, March 26 (IslamOnline.net) – In France, rap music no longer conjures up images of hip-hopping boys and girls or doped teenagers after aMuslim band has given it a new look.
Singing primarily against terrorism and racism, Din Records seven members are priding themselves on being Muslims moved by the sufferings of their fellow Muslims from Palestine to Chechnya. Other rap bands are united by drugs, but we are united by prayers,” the band’s vocal Medine said on the band’s Web site.
Established
in 2002, the band denounces the injustice done to Muslims in the
occupied Palestinians territories, Iraq, Afghanistan and Chechnya.
It
also condemns terrorism and expresses heartfelt sympathy with the
oppressed worldwide.
Din
Records songs, which topped France’s music charts and sold briskly,
include “Jihad” “9/11,” “Guantanamo” and “The School of
Life.”
“We
want to give voice to the sufferings endured by Muslims throughout the
past three years in the aftermath of the attacks,” Medine says.
“9/11”
The
9/11 ditty, which has been banned by the French TV, shows a mixture of
the havoc caused by 9/11 attacks in New York and Washington and the
destruction caused by the US troops in Afghanistan and Iraq.
It
also features the deplorable conditions of the Palestinians and the
wide-scale destruction of their lands and homes by the Israeli
occupation army.
“I
keep looking for the root of the world’s disasters/Only to find out
that the storm is blowing everywhere,” read the song’s lyrics.
the eyes are fixed on the twin tower/You don’t understand anything
neither do I/But listen to the story from the very beginning…From
September to September…From Ramallah to Manhattan…From Kabul to
Baghdad,” they say.
The
song says that the 9/11 attacks have had their domino effects on
Muslims in France with the secularism drive picking up steam.
In
the country of the three-color flag, you have to be secular and
enlightened/You must respect the values of the republic/Muslims are
not allowed to wear beards or take on the hijab in schools.”
And
it hits out at the media blitz against Muslims.
In
the newspapers, they accuse us of inciting violence, war crimes/They
accuse us of being against the Americans though the Americans are
rallying behind Michael Moore,” the US filmmaker who directed the
anti-Bush “Fahrenheit 9/11.”The
song also touches on the torture and sexual abuse of Iraqi prisoners
by US soldiers.
Two
or three million dollars and we will forget about Abu Gharib,” the
scene of the pornographic and shocking practices meted out to Iraqi
prisoners by US soldiers.
Guantanamo
The songs “Guantanamo” and “The School of Life” have to do with
the humiliation of Muslims in the West.
The
storm is blowing down Islam and the residents of the suburbs, who are
marginalized in transports because of their hijabs/And those young
people with beards, who are banned in airports/It is a plausible
reason for Islamophobia,” read the lyrics of “Guantanamo”.The
School of Life” adds: “They tell me that I belong in the third
generation of immigrants/Though I have been born here and lead a
simple life/Indeed, [the Hijri year] 1425 is a minaret for our
fathers, mothers and brothers.”
The
International Helsinki Federation for Human Rights (IHF) said in a
recent report that Muslim minorities across Europe have been
experiencing growing distrust, hostility and discrimination since
9/11.
Pre-existing
patterns of prejudice and discrimination have been reinforced and
Muslims have increasingly felt that they are stigmatized because of
their beliefs,” said the report.
Click
for “9/11” video
clip
Click
for Din Records
Web site
#75 Posted by malikjahanzeb on March 26, 2005 2:42:16 pm
xpsyed sahib,
your posts are too lengthy for me because i have a disgracing speed of 1 line per minute while reading english. i desparetly wish that there was an urdu version of chowk.
i mistakenly thought that poeple in US are obese because of abundance of food as compared to countries like pakistan who only eat spirtuality to keep alive. thanks god i am corrected by a brother here that obensity in us is because of lack of hijaab.
i personally think that hamidm is secretly an ally of horrible hindus and says stuff which will suduce innocentt muslims like me away from the religion of my father. i appeal chowk staff to uncover this evil conspiracy.
xpsyed sahib, aap hi kuch kerain.
your posts are too lengthy for me because i have a disgracing speed of 1 line per minute while reading english. i desparetly wish that there was an urdu version of chowk.
i mistakenly thought that poeple in US are obese because of abundance of food as compared to countries like pakistan who only eat spirtuality to keep alive. thanks god i am corrected by a brother here that obensity in us is because of lack of hijaab.
i personally think that hamidm is secretly an ally of horrible hindus and says stuff which will suduce innocentt muslims like me away from the religion of my father. i appeal chowk staff to uncover this evil conspiracy.
xpsyed sahib, aap hi kuch kerain.
#74 Posted by malik99 on March 26, 2005 2:07:25 pm
It is amazing how folks like hamidm can caste aside logic when debating on something they don`t agree with.
If wearing of abaya or shalwar kameez can cause women to gain weight, then why is it that the pants wearing americans are the fattest people to ever walk on earth?!!!
You see, when countered with facts, instead of going back to the drawing table, people like Hamidm scurry around with lame jokes. Hamidm sahib, a consultant should have an open mind (roshan khayal) to do well. If you with your illogic and evidence-free arguments were on any of my projects, I would have not only fired you, I would have also asked your consulting company to re-imburse for the food and beer you dined on my company`s expense.
If wearing of abaya or shalwar kameez can cause women to gain weight, then why is it that the pants wearing americans are the fattest people to ever walk on earth?!!!
You see, when countered with facts, instead of going back to the drawing table, people like Hamidm scurry around with lame jokes. Hamidm sahib, a consultant should have an open mind (roshan khayal) to do well. If you with your illogic and evidence-free arguments were on any of my projects, I would have not only fired you, I would have also asked your consulting company to re-imburse for the food and beer you dined on my company`s expense.
#73 Posted by hamidm2 on March 26, 2005 12:54:48 pm
Re: # 72
urstruly,
alhamdolillah, like mr ntsyed i have retained my ``athletic hunky physique`` and thanks to low-carb beer i am able to consume moderate quantities (as per sharia) without putting on much weight ............ allah has been kind, jazak allah khair ........
........ but i do have a tobe - a gift from the holy land - which i put on every now and then to do my imitation of mumtaz in zidi to entertain the kids ........ they think it is hilarious
urstruly,
alhamdolillah, like mr ntsyed i have retained my ``athletic hunky physique`` and thanks to low-carb beer i am able to consume moderate quantities (as per sharia) without putting on much weight ............ allah has been kind, jazak allah khair ........
........ but i do have a tobe - a gift from the holy land - which i put on every now and then to do my imitation of mumtaz in zidi to entertain the kids ........ they think it is hilarious
#72 Posted by Urstruly on March 26, 2005 12:39:30 pm
Re: # 68 hamidm
I hope this will convince you. Abayas can also hide bear bellys like no other dress.
I hope this will convince you. Abayas can also hide bear bellys like no other dress.
#71 Posted by ntsyed on March 26, 2005 11:33:14 am
Re: # 66
``...........seriously, abayas are fine, the problem is the monomaniacal mindset that drives people to go to such extremes ......... i feel the same way about the poor sikh kid with the rag in his head, the yahoodi with the silly hair locks and the brahmin with the red war paint on his forehead - not to mention the pope in his frock surrounded by cardinals in their dunce hats .......... it is not healthy``
hamidm2, ``the monomaniacal mindset`` is same as endlessly running after money and unending mortal luxuries of this world, especially when one doesn`t know how long he/she will live to enjoy it. At least, for religious people, there`s promise for eternal enjoyment of earned luxuries, vis a vis ``here-today-gone-tomorrow`` nature of worldly gains.
``...........seriously, abayas are fine, the problem is the monomaniacal mindset that drives people to go to such extremes ......... i feel the same way about the poor sikh kid with the rag in his head, the yahoodi with the silly hair locks and the brahmin with the red war paint on his forehead - not to mention the pope in his frock surrounded by cardinals in their dunce hats .......... it is not healthy``
hamidm2, ``the monomaniacal mindset`` is same as endlessly running after money and unending mortal luxuries of this world, especially when one doesn`t know how long he/she will live to enjoy it. At least, for religious people, there`s promise for eternal enjoyment of earned luxuries, vis a vis ``here-today-gone-tomorrow`` nature of worldly gains.
#70 Posted by ntsyed on March 26, 2005 11:15:01 am
#57:
“It seems THAT you are a male.”
I’m surprised it took you so long to figure out my gender. Are you using blonde highlights too?
By your own implied admission you did not read the entire message attentively, and responded with unsubstantiated “That was the silliest pro-hijab argument!”
The simple question I posed to you, as I did to another friend here, is for your self-assessment, thus I did not expect an answer since no one else is privy to such information.
“Please keep your sermons brief and succinct. And avoid giving me lectures in future.”
By the way, avoiding lectures can prevent and/or delay graduation, not that it was a lecture; it may have just seemed like it you due to your impatience. But that’s the main trait amongst the proponents of contemporary secularism – impatience, rudeness, and intolerance of others’ arguments, just as you have admitted: “I have very little tolerance for haphazard male sermons.” Yet they claim to believe in freedom of speech.
By the way, it has nothing to do with my gender. What I’ve told you is according to Quran and Sunnah, if you care to study them. A believing woman would probably present similar arguments, because guess what, my mother, sisters, wife and our 14 year old daughter happen to be “women”. And just so you know, none except my mother (nearing 70 and suffering from diabetes) are over-weight, and masha Allah all wear jalabeeb over their trendy dresses that conform to Sharia more than their physiques when stepping outside. My wife and I never forced our daughter to wear hijab or abaya, which she has been taking since the age of 10.
“It`s because of men like you that muslim women are over-weight and clueless on the health of their bodies.”
Who should be responsible for hundreds of millions of over-weight women who are either Muslim and don’t wear hijab, or are not Muslims to being with? Similarly, who should take the credit for properly veiled Muslim women who maintain good health? DUHHHHHHHH!
May be you were too busy squeezing into your tight jeans and missed recent medical reports. Being over-weight and obesity have nothing to do with hijab, but everything to do with gluttony and illnesses such as diabetes and high-cholesterol, and inherited genes.
“I am sure you would love to be an obsese man clad in his long dress. Well and good for you!”
I’m sorry to disappoint you, but I retain my athletic hunky physique as I possessed during my days of ignorance. The title was awarded to me by all the ladies I had been with, which included but were not limited to, drop-dead gorgeous fashion models that walked the walk and talked the talk, if you get my drift. None of them were half-Muslim-half-secular self-proclaimed Progressive Muslim cocktails.
But now I do often don long tunic as did my Prophet (PBUH), and adhere to the prescribed dress code for men otherwise, Alhumdolillah!
“Do not ask others to follow that direction and invite death and illness sooner than needed.”
Again, sorry to disappoint you, but that’s not up to me, or any human being for that matter. It’s what Allah has ordered us to do – inform and invite all mankind to His divine message.
Death and illness cannot be invited by any one even if a person wanted to. These are in strict control of Allah. It’s what comes after death that Allah has allowed mankind to control and steer, which is the frightening part for the non-believers and pseudo believers. Thus, they prefer not to think or talk about it.
“There is nothing wrong in being simple(as the writer appears to be), but there is everything wrong with being out-dated and clueless.”
By that standard, the modern fashion trends resemble pre-Islamic era of jahiliya throughout the world. Back then women circumambulated the K’aba partially or fully nude according to their distorted beliefs and misconceptions of ‘deen-e-Isma’ili’ and ‘deen-e-Ibrahimi’.
“No religion asks its followers to dress up in a scary manner and ignore their well being.”
I couldn’t agree with you more, but fail to see its relevance to Islam. Style is not discouraged in Islam as long as it doesn’t violate the guidelines set by Allah in the Quran. Are you suggesting that believing women, who put on jalabeeb when going out as instructed in the Quran, walk around partially or fully nude inside their homes or at women-only parties? How would you then explain overwhelming number of feminine clothing boutiques across the predominantly Muslim cities and countries.
“Spirituality also does not ask its followers/practitioners to perform negligence towards their own well being.”
Your argument on well being has been answered before. Still, if you insist… probably you’re referring to various cults in the western hemisphere. For your information, Allah and His messengers (PBUT) have instructed us to maintain good health as a gesture of appreciation for this wonderful gift from Allah.
“So, do not exploit Islam for your own purposes.”
This is the funniest one so far. Just how do you see me benefiting in this anonymous forum? At least I don’t see any earthly benefit, although I do hope Allah will reward me in this life and hereafter for carrying out His orders online ;)
“And please put the ``spirituality`` card back in your pocket.”
That’s where your problem seems to stem from – spirituality is maintained in one’s heart and mind, and not in pockets or on bookshelves.
“Your logic and rationale is sick, outdated and requires a major reform. Please look into it.”
If that’s the case, then I hope you would suggest a suitable reform to me. But please don’t tell me what I already know, and I’ve given you a glimpse of where I’ve been and what I’ve done. I’ve spent a major part of my life in the west and know their culture, mindset, politics, religion, and so forth, inside out.
By the way, when was the last time you studied (not just read) the Quran and Sunnah? You seem to be dangerously complacent about the level of information you received as a child.
Complacency leads to arrogance, which is far more deadlier than curiousity. Trust me... I`ve been there and done that. If a person does not attempt to correct it, the consequences range from disappoints and heartbreak to ultimate self-destruction.
”Thanks.”
Please don’t mention it… the pleasure is entirely mine.
Ma`as-salaam
“It seems THAT you are a male.”
I’m surprised it took you so long to figure out my gender. Are you using blonde highlights too?
By your own implied admission you did not read the entire message attentively, and responded with unsubstantiated “That was the silliest pro-hijab argument!”
The simple question I posed to you, as I did to another friend here, is for your self-assessment, thus I did not expect an answer since no one else is privy to such information.
“Please keep your sermons brief and succinct. And avoid giving me lectures in future.”
By the way, avoiding lectures can prevent and/or delay graduation, not that it was a lecture; it may have just seemed like it you due to your impatience. But that’s the main trait amongst the proponents of contemporary secularism – impatience, rudeness, and intolerance of others’ arguments, just as you have admitted: “I have very little tolerance for haphazard male sermons.” Yet they claim to believe in freedom of speech.
By the way, it has nothing to do with my gender. What I’ve told you is according to Quran and Sunnah, if you care to study them. A believing woman would probably present similar arguments, because guess what, my mother, sisters, wife and our 14 year old daughter happen to be “women”. And just so you know, none except my mother (nearing 70 and suffering from diabetes) are over-weight, and masha Allah all wear jalabeeb over their trendy dresses that conform to Sharia more than their physiques when stepping outside. My wife and I never forced our daughter to wear hijab or abaya, which she has been taking since the age of 10.
“It`s because of men like you that muslim women are over-weight and clueless on the health of their bodies.”
Who should be responsible for hundreds of millions of over-weight women who are either Muslim and don’t wear hijab, or are not Muslims to being with? Similarly, who should take the credit for properly veiled Muslim women who maintain good health? DUHHHHHHHH!
May be you were too busy squeezing into your tight jeans and missed recent medical reports. Being over-weight and obesity have nothing to do with hijab, but everything to do with gluttony and illnesses such as diabetes and high-cholesterol, and inherited genes.
“I am sure you would love to be an obsese man clad in his long dress. Well and good for you!”
I’m sorry to disappoint you, but I retain my athletic hunky physique as I possessed during my days of ignorance. The title was awarded to me by all the ladies I had been with, which included but were not limited to, drop-dead gorgeous fashion models that walked the walk and talked the talk, if you get my drift. None of them were half-Muslim-half-secular self-proclaimed Progressive Muslim cocktails.
But now I do often don long tunic as did my Prophet (PBUH), and adhere to the prescribed dress code for men otherwise, Alhumdolillah!
“Do not ask others to follow that direction and invite death and illness sooner than needed.”
Again, sorry to disappoint you, but that’s not up to me, or any human being for that matter. It’s what Allah has ordered us to do – inform and invite all mankind to His divine message.
Death and illness cannot be invited by any one even if a person wanted to. These are in strict control of Allah. It’s what comes after death that Allah has allowed mankind to control and steer, which is the frightening part for the non-believers and pseudo believers. Thus, they prefer not to think or talk about it.
“There is nothing wrong in being simple(as the writer appears to be), but there is everything wrong with being out-dated and clueless.”
By that standard, the modern fashion trends resemble pre-Islamic era of jahiliya throughout the world. Back then women circumambulated the K’aba partially or fully nude according to their distorted beliefs and misconceptions of ‘deen-e-Isma’ili’ and ‘deen-e-Ibrahimi’.
“No religion asks its followers to dress up in a scary manner and ignore their well being.”
I couldn’t agree with you more, but fail to see its relevance to Islam. Style is not discouraged in Islam as long as it doesn’t violate the guidelines set by Allah in the Quran. Are you suggesting that believing women, who put on jalabeeb when going out as instructed in the Quran, walk around partially or fully nude inside their homes or at women-only parties? How would you then explain overwhelming number of feminine clothing boutiques across the predominantly Muslim cities and countries.
“Spirituality also does not ask its followers/practitioners to perform negligence towards their own well being.”
Your argument on well being has been answered before. Still, if you insist… probably you’re referring to various cults in the western hemisphere. For your information, Allah and His messengers (PBUT) have instructed us to maintain good health as a gesture of appreciation for this wonderful gift from Allah.
“So, do not exploit Islam for your own purposes.”
This is the funniest one so far. Just how do you see me benefiting in this anonymous forum? At least I don’t see any earthly benefit, although I do hope Allah will reward me in this life and hereafter for carrying out His orders online ;)
“And please put the ``spirituality`` card back in your pocket.”
That’s where your problem seems to stem from – spirituality is maintained in one’s heart and mind, and not in pockets or on bookshelves.
“Your logic and rationale is sick, outdated and requires a major reform. Please look into it.”
If that’s the case, then I hope you would suggest a suitable reform to me. But please don’t tell me what I already know, and I’ve given you a glimpse of where I’ve been and what I’ve done. I’ve spent a major part of my life in the west and know their culture, mindset, politics, religion, and so forth, inside out.
By the way, when was the last time you studied (not just read) the Quran and Sunnah? You seem to be dangerously complacent about the level of information you received as a child.
Complacency leads to arrogance, which is far more deadlier than curiousity. Trust me... I`ve been there and done that. If a person does not attempt to correct it, the consequences range from disappoints and heartbreak to ultimate self-destruction.
”Thanks.”
Please don’t mention it… the pleasure is entirely mine.
Ma`as-salaam
#69 Posted by KaalChakra on March 26, 2005 10:36:36 am
Hamidm2
Thanks! I checked it out online. It doesn`t look that bad! $28.00 will get us a warm wool-blended, neutral colored Fall Dishdasha.
Who knows! Chowk might strengthen the case for Islamic gender-equality by soon publishing an article, ``My Darling Disdasha!``
I can see its perfect ending:
``When I returned home, I raved about my Disdasha to everyone. My wife agreed with me. She had missed my Dishdasha too....It’s so easy to follow just any man on the pretext, oh, I thought it was my husband....But not when your husband is not wearing an Disdasha!``
Enough for me! Although I clearly see Abaya as a social and political tool in the hands of men, rather than a thing of religious value, the Hindu in me is beginning to feel guilty. :)
I also just realized that a fashion-wave of wearing Disdasha in the Islamic world will not be exactly gender equality. A Dishdashaed man could still be recognized from another man, and his man`s neck will still be much freer than a woman`s clad in an Abaya.
That`s it, Hamidm2 ji! When one begins to have so much fun, one`s not being respectful enough. It`s easy to poke fun without making additional easy-to-understand points. With your permission, I will sign off from this board.
Thanks! I checked it out online. It doesn`t look that bad! $28.00 will get us a warm wool-blended, neutral colored Fall Dishdasha.
Who knows! Chowk might strengthen the case for Islamic gender-equality by soon publishing an article, ``My Darling Disdasha!``
I can see its perfect ending:
``When I returned home, I raved about my Disdasha to everyone. My wife agreed with me. She had missed my Dishdasha too....It’s so easy to follow just any man on the pretext, oh, I thought it was my husband....But not when your husband is not wearing an Disdasha!``
Enough for me! Although I clearly see Abaya as a social and political tool in the hands of men, rather than a thing of religious value, the Hindu in me is beginning to feel guilty. :)
I also just realized that a fashion-wave of wearing Disdasha in the Islamic world will not be exactly gender equality. A Dishdashaed man could still be recognized from another man, and his man`s neck will still be much freer than a woman`s clad in an Abaya.
That`s it, Hamidm2 ji! When one begins to have so much fun, one`s not being respectful enough. It`s easy to poke fun without making additional easy-to-understand points. With your permission, I will sign off from this board.
#68 Posted by hamidm2 on March 26, 2005 9:34:06 am
kal,
*I don`t know if there is anything like a male abaya?
............it is called the disdasha or tobe - i call it the night gown ......... there are actually some pakistani men who wear it in public !
*I don`t know if there is anything like a male abaya?
............it is called the disdasha or tobe - i call it the night gown ......... there are actually some pakistani men who wear it in public !
#67 Posted by KaalChakra on March 26, 2005 9:19:29 am
Hamidm2
Agreed, although a cleaner example will be, say, the Islamic cap that we sometimes see people wearing. Female Abaya* is not only deeply symbolic, but also very powerfully functional - functional for women (as discussed here) and functional for men (as not discussed here).
Generally, the functional needs of men come to dominate the functional needs of women, the latter adapting themselves to the former.
*I don`t know if there is anything like a male abaya?
Agreed, although a cleaner example will be, say, the Islamic cap that we sometimes see people wearing. Female Abaya* is not only deeply symbolic, but also very powerfully functional - functional for women (as discussed here) and functional for men (as not discussed here).
Generally, the functional needs of men come to dominate the functional needs of women, the latter adapting themselves to the former.
*I don`t know if there is anything like a male abaya?
#66 Posted by hamidm2 on March 26, 2005 8:57:03 am
kaachakra,
......... personally i don`t have a problem with people wearing abayas or dishdashas as long as they don`t force their fashion on other people and put on proper underwear - it is a little disconcerting to think that he or she might not be wearing anything under the robe ! .......
...........seriously, abayas are fine, the problem is the monomaniacal mindset that drives people to go to such extremes ......... i feel the same way about the poor sikh kid with the rag in his head, the yahoodi with the silly hair locks and the brahmin with the red war paint on his forehead - not to mention the pope in his frock surrounded by cardinals in their dunce hats .......... it is not healthy
......... personally i don`t have a problem with people wearing abayas or dishdashas as long as they don`t force their fashion on other people and put on proper underwear - it is a little disconcerting to think that he or she might not be wearing anything under the robe ! .......
...........seriously, abayas are fine, the problem is the monomaniacal mindset that drives people to go to such extremes ......... i feel the same way about the poor sikh kid with the rag in his head, the yahoodi with the silly hair locks and the brahmin with the red war paint on his forehead - not to mention the pope in his frock surrounded by cardinals in their dunce hats .......... it is not healthy
#65 Posted by KaalChakra on March 26, 2005 8:28:52 am
hamidm2
I understand the pain. Grandpa nathu ram probably thought he was just going to be a `sufi.``
One of my Hindu friends `became a Muslim` in order to marry a Muslim woman, but with his Hindu soul, the fool thinks he can still be a Hindu.
But let`s not hijack this Islamic board in praise of Islamic abaya.
I understand the pain. Grandpa nathu ram probably thought he was just going to be a `sufi.``
One of my Hindu friends `became a Muslim` in order to marry a Muslim woman, but with his Hindu soul, the fool thinks he can still be a Hindu.
But let`s not hijack this Islamic board in praise of Islamic abaya.
#64 Posted by hamidm2 on March 26, 2005 8:16:22 am
kaalchakra,
........... i have known a lot of hindoos for many many years, but the only ``real`` hindoos (like harimau) i have met are here on chowk - the rest of them don`t seem to care or know much about their religion ......... to me hindooism seems to be a sub-chalta-hai laizzez faire sort of hodge-podge of all kinds of stuff ........... the other day someone told me that they buried their dead, ate beef and pork like heathens, and had their elders perform their weddings instead of wasting their money on rent-a-brahmin ............ i was impressed ! .......... unfortunately we muslims don`t have that luxury - we are bound to live by well-documented rules laid out by the bedouins 1500 years ago ........
......... what was great grandpa nathu ram thinking !
........... i have known a lot of hindoos for many many years, but the only ``real`` hindoos (like harimau) i have met are here on chowk - the rest of them don`t seem to care or know much about their religion ......... to me hindooism seems to be a sub-chalta-hai laizzez faire sort of hodge-podge of all kinds of stuff ........... the other day someone told me that they buried their dead, ate beef and pork like heathens, and had their elders perform their weddings instead of wasting their money on rent-a-brahmin ............ i was impressed ! .......... unfortunately we muslims don`t have that luxury - we are bound to live by well-documented rules laid out by the bedouins 1500 years ago ........
......... what was great grandpa nathu ram thinking !
#63 Posted by ZahraJ on March 26, 2005 8:08:12 am
Qibla Hamidm:
You see men CANNOT have everything and LAND in heaven. This is an incomplete equation. If x= men, y = women and z=heaven.
then it is has to be x+y = z. You cannot have x+x=heaven. Any man who entertains this equation needs to be buried alive somewhere near Sahara Desert.
Based on our faith, it is also said that there is atleast (a) woman for every man and there is atleast (a) man for every woman. Ideally, just keeping this logic in mind (and not necessarily following it), I`d say that there should be equal seats for both men and women.
Now, if women lead men toward hell then those seats that are vacated in heaven have to be occupied by someone. My gut feeling tells me that the said seats will go to women for their patience, perseverance and resilience. I changed the dynamics of that equation based on certain criteria. I cannot formulate an equation at this time since I will have to write pre-conditions and some kind of use cases for that purpose to be clear and succinct. I am already knee deep with that on my current project which is in its Requirements Definition Phase therefore my mind needs a break. Sorry for the abrupt conclusion.
Lastly, I am indebted to your kind for their naivety and vulnerability which results in vacating the ``required`` seats for women in heaven.
Thank You!
Please carry on :) :) :)
Happy Easter!
You see men CANNOT have everything and LAND in heaven. This is an incomplete equation. If x= men, y = women and z=heaven.
then it is has to be x+y = z. You cannot have x+x=heaven. Any man who entertains this equation needs to be buried alive somewhere near Sahara Desert.
Based on our faith, it is also said that there is atleast (a) woman for every man and there is atleast (a) man for every woman. Ideally, just keeping this logic in mind (and not necessarily following it), I`d say that there should be equal seats for both men and women.
Now, if women lead men toward hell then those seats that are vacated in heaven have to be occupied by someone. My gut feeling tells me that the said seats will go to women for their patience, perseverance and resilience. I changed the dynamics of that equation based on certain criteria. I cannot formulate an equation at this time since I will have to write pre-conditions and some kind of use cases for that purpose to be clear and succinct. I am already knee deep with that on my current project which is in its Requirements Definition Phase therefore my mind needs a break. Sorry for the abrupt conclusion.
Lastly, I am indebted to your kind for their naivety and vulnerability which results in vacating the ``required`` seats for women in heaven.
Thank You!
Please carry on :) :) :)
Happy Easter!
#62 Posted by KaalChakra on March 26, 2005 7:36:23 am
hamidm2
Your mullahs do not give some of the best women on earth (yours) the choice to marry the world`s best men (us). So I am going to convert them. LOL
But seriously, one can try to transform Islam through temporary fictions like Sufism, or revert to the ever changing Hinduism. The latter is the more efficient, if more courageous, choice. :)
Your mullahs do not give some of the best women on earth (yours) the choice to marry the world`s best men (us). So I am going to convert them. LOL
But seriously, one can try to transform Islam through temporary fictions like Sufism, or revert to the ever changing Hinduism. The latter is the more efficient, if more courageous, choice. :)
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