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Pakistan Travelogue II

Parag Vohra April 5, 2005

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#684 Posted by arjun_m on April 13, 2005 6:15:48 am
Manto: jinnah is dead...and whatever vision he had of pakiland is dead...

This is pakiland today...a pakiland where half the provinces are rules by an ally of the taliban....

`Talibanization` fears in Pakistan

Activists blocked a co-ed road race last week, as religious parties geared up for local elections in July.
By Owais Tohid | Correspondent of The Christian Science Monitor
ISLAMABAD, PAKISTAN – More than five years since President Pervez Musharraf`s coup, religious extremists are moving to the forefront in challenging Pakistan`s political order.

Last week, hundreds of extremist demonstrators armed with bamboo sticks blocked a 10K road race near the finish line to protest the participation of women runners. A gun battle with police ensued, leaving several people wounded.

In a surprise to many here, the incident took place not in the conservative tribal areas, but in the country`s Punjab heartland. In reaction, protesters picketed Parliament Monday, calling on the government to ``save the society from Talibanization.``

Pakistani people are Islamic and they will not allow the government to contradict Islamic teachings,`` says Hafiz Hussain Ahmed, central leader of the Muttahida Majlis-e-Amal (MMA), an alliance of religious extremist parties. ``The enlightenment and moderation are to promote Western culture.``

The religious parties gained political victories in the wake of the US wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

The MMA now rules the Frontier Province and emerged as a major coalition in the southwestern Balochistan Province.

In some areas, strict Islamic laws have introduced gender segregation in schools, banned music, and prevented male medical technicians from examining women.

Activists have also defaced billboards that show women models. Religious political leaders also have plans to implement a hisba law, which would set up a religious police force along the lines of the ousted Taliban.


Reform, then reversal

But Musharraf`s vision of enlightened moderation has many hurdles to clear in a country where extremists long enjoyed the support of successive governments and the powerful military establishment.

And Musharraf`s government has been criticized by rights activists and the media for backing off previously announced reforms, including the abolishment of the draconian Hudood Ordinances, a blasphemy law, and a separate column for religion in passports.

Some argue that the ``flip-flops`` further strengthen extremists.
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#685 Posted by MantoLives on April 13, 2005 6:43:25 am
Re: # 684

Agreed...
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#683 Posted by MantoLives on April 13, 2005 6:00:10 am
Harish Hyd

Here is the exact quote:

``The Muslim League denounces the fratricidal war that has broken out in Calcutta``

This was a statement issued by Jinnah...

Time Magazine in its issue on 26th of August 1946 said:

Mohamed Ali Jinnah had picked the 18th day of Ramadan for ``Direct Action Day`` against Britain`s plan for Indian independence (which does not satisfy the Moslems` old demand for a separate Pakistan). Though direct, the action was supposed to be peaceful.

Like other Indian leaders, Jinnah denounced the ``fratricidal war.``


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#682 Posted by veeresh on April 13, 2005 5:52:55 am
Well, Yasser and others, this movie. Do let me know if you want a copy?


There will be a `premier` screening of WAPSI at India International Centre, Lodhi Road, New Delhi, on the afternoon of April 16th, 2005 The screening will start at 4:00 pm to be followed by a discussion with the filmmaker. All are invited.


+++

WAPSI (the returning...)
A film by Ajay Raina.
Produced By: Public Service Broadcasting Trust.
Duration: 60 Minutes.

SYNOPSIS
In the times of a yet another thaw in the relationship between India & Pakistan, an Indian `Lover Of Cricket` finally manages to go across to the other side of the `Line of Control` (LOC) ...to journey through the heartland of Pakistan.

Much in the style of Al Biruni, a Persian scholar, who visited this part of India more than a 1000 years ago to encounter an alien culture which he had called `Al Hind`, this is an account of the filmmaker`s travels through that part of `Al Hind`, which is now a foreign country and a most bitter foe.

The journey to Pakistan is a journey of return of various kinds - to Nostalgia, hate, metaphor and reality. A song of hope, love, longing and betrayal. A lament about how the `idea` of Pakistan has tormented only the `minorities` in the Two Nations, which once were one. Starting from India`s capital Delhi, it takes a detour via Kashmir, Gujarat and Indian Punjab. It travels back and forth between memory and history to explore the `idea` of Pakistan, the story of it`s making, what it has become and how it affects Indians and Pakistanis, who in spite of the divide, remain connected to each other through Hate and through Love.

Quoting from Al Biruni`s preface to his book about India, this film is ``nothing but a simple historic record of facts... the theories of the Pakistanis as they are, ...and in connection with them similar theories of Indians in order to show the relationship existing between them...``

BIO NOTE OF THE FILMMAKER:
Ajay Raina, Alumni of Film Institute, Pune, a Kashmiri, has been making Documentary films for last 12 years. His last film about journey back home to Kashmir, ``Tell them, the tree they had planted has now grown.`` won The Golden Conch Award, The RAPA award and the IDPA silver trophy in 2002. It has had numerous public screenings and has been screened at various festivals in India and abroad.

Ajay Raina,Bombay, India
E- Mail: ajayraina@vsnl.com / ajayraina@vsnl.net Tel: 91 22 28414339

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#681 Posted by MantoLives on April 13, 2005 5:18:18 am
From Blitz the Congress Mouthpiece in praise of Direct Action Day:


The worst enemies of the Muslim League cannot help envying the leadership of Mr Jinnah. Last week`s cataclysmic transformation of the League from the reactionary racket of the Muslim Nawabs, Noons, and Knights into a revolutionary mass organisation dedicated, by word if not be deed, to an anti-Imperialist struggle, compels us to express the sneaking national wish that a diplomat and strategist of Jinnah`s proven calibre were at the held of the Indian National Congress. There is no denying the fact that by his latest master-stroke of diplomacy Jinnah has outbid, outwitted and outmaneuvered the British and Congress alike and confounded the common national indictment that the Muslim League is a parasite of British Imperialism

Now why would a Congress Newspaper praise Jinnah if Direct Action Day was all that you are making it out to be...

The fact is that Calcutta was an exception... a well thought out plan by the Congress which sabotaged the League`s programme for temporary political gain....


More on Direct Action

It is funny how Indians here use the word `Direct Action` as if it means some kind of violence in of itself... Infact in the examples of `Direct Action` ... this website speaks of `Non-violent Direct Action` by Gandhi and Martin Luther King Jr....

http://www.free-definition.com/Direct-action.html

Direct Action simply means civil disobedience... as Dr. King put it:

``Nonviolent direct action seeks to create such a crisis and foster such a tension that a community which has constantly refused to negotiate is forced to confront the issue. It seeks so to dramatize the issue that it can no longer be ignored.``


Now consider H V Hodson`s description of the League Programme:

``The working committee followed up by calling on Muslims through out India to observe 16th August as direct action day. On that Day meeting would be held all over the country to explain League`s resolution. These meetings and processions passed of- as was manifestly the Central league leaders` intention- without more than commonplace and limited disturbance with one vast and tragic exception... what happened was more than anyone could have foreseen.``

(Page 166 `The Great Divide`)


Explaining Direct Action Jinnah made it clear that the direct Action will not be in any form but in peaceful form...


``16th August is not for the purpose of resorting to Direct Action in any form or shape, Therefore I enjoin upon the Muslims to carry our the instructions and abide by them strictly and conduct themselves peacefuly and in a disciplined manner.``

Press Release Jinnah 14th August 1946


1) K B Sayeed`s Formative Phase Page 154

2) Jinnah Papers Volume 5

3) Transfer of Power, Mansergh Volume 8 Pages 158-248
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#679 Posted by MantoLives on April 13, 2005 4:31:20 am
Since you gentlemen insist on repeating the same questions which have been answered... I must respond with the same answers...

Direct Action Day

Now Hindus objected to the proclamation of a holiday and made extensive, secret preparations to attack Muslims. Neither the Intelligence Branch concerned with the activities of terrorists and revolutionaries, nor the Criminal Investigation Department, both of which were manned almost wholly by Hindus. gave the Prime Minister any information regarding these preparations and he was caught unawares.113 On 16 August at the Ochterlony Monument Maidan, whilst he was addressing a crowd, gathered from all parts of Calcutta and the suburbs, he received news that processions were being obstructed and attacked by the Hindus and anti-Muslim riots were taking place in many areas. It was the Muslim holy month of Ramadan (fasting). Suhrawardy ordered the Muslims to disperse and go back to their homes. The crowd was very large, many with children in their laps, having come from all over the city, from the neighbouring areas of Howrah and the 24-Parganas, and from the Jute and Cotton Mill areas. As the crowd was returning home they were set upon by the Hindus, provoking an anti-Muslim riot on a scale far greater than the one in 1926.

The Commissioner of Police, a Britisher, did not know Calcutta and its problems and was unable to deal with the situation with only a small police force. The Riot Commission, which was set up by the British government as a result of the riot, reports that immediately after the riot began the Prime Minister rushed to Lalbazar Police Headquarters to attain first hand information and, being apprised of the grave situation, demanded deployment of the army on the very first day of the riot.114 But Governor Burrows rejected the demand, primarily to divert the strong anti-British sentiments, generated during the Rashid Ali Day, observed in Calcutta in June 1945 and which he hoped would worsen Hindu-Muslim relations.115 Captain Ali was a member of the Indian National Army, which had been created by Subash Chandra Bose to fight the British during the Second World War. He was caught, tried and sentenced to a seven-year jail term. Captain Ali had sought Muslim League support during his trial and Suhrawardy, defying a government ban, headed a large protest procession, along with other top League and Congress leaders.116

The Governor also turned down Suhrawardy`s suggestion to put pickets between Hindu and Muslim localities, creating a bulwark which would help to separate the two communities (a suggestion adopted much later, when the damage had already been done and a number of Muslim localities had been destroyed and thousands of Muslims massacred). Instead, Burrows heeded the advice of the Commissioner of Police that the civil power was capable of dealing with the situation and that there was no need to deploy the army. It was only when Suhrawardy threatened to resign that the Governor reluctantly pretended to agree and three or four days later merely ordered the army to stand by. Suhrawardy, accompanying the Governor and the army commander on a tour of inspection on 18 August, showed them an area of Calcutta, Suvabazaar , which was strewn with the bodies of dead Muslims. This was predominantly a Hindu area, with some Muslim houses and shops. The army had had no knowledge that this was a riot area and the Commissioner of Police, himself, had had no information that there had been riots there. It was a ``big discovery`` of ``wholesale slaughter`` of Muslims and the Governor and the General were deeply shocked.117
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#673 Posted by rsridhar on April 13, 2005 4:04:25 am
re:#665 by Mantolives
Leave aside Calcutta. Give me one instance where your Jinnah went to the villages and stopped rioters instead of just sitting on his stinky butt and issuing statments.
Sridhar
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#674 Posted by MantoLives on April 13, 2005 4:16:50 am
Re: # 673

Had you been reading instead of stinking up the board, you would know that there were several occasions when Jinnah went to riot affected areas.... I`ve quoted atleast 2 above (one of which was quoted directly from an Indian source) ... Jinnah is credited by H V Hodson for bringing the situation under control in the aftermath of the creation of Pakistan.

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#672 Posted by rsridhar on April 13, 2005 4:00:08 am
re:#652 by Mantolives
You are clearly biased.
Gandhi did everything to stop violence in Calcutta. So, where was the question of Congress gaining?
Muslim league gained by every violence unleashed. It always could turn back and say: look, We are now being targeted by hindus. Did we not say we can`t live with them?
You are just twisting the facts.
Sridhar
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#676 Posted by MantoLives on April 13, 2005 4:22:59 am
Re: # 672

What did Gandhi do.... like I said you are mixing up years now... Gandhi did didly squat in 1946 with Calcutta... It was as Patel gloated... a victory for the Congress that more Muslims were killed than the Hindus. Your reading of history is Simplistic and Wrong .... Muslim League lost out Calcutta and Bengal had to divided because of this strategy by the Congress...

You still haven`t answered the questions...

Like I pointed out earlier your history is like a B Rate Hollywood movie.... with no calculations for reality and nuances... had you read history you would know that the Congress was invited to make a ministry at the center in the immediate aftermath of Calcutta violence.... which is what Congress wanted all along.

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#671 Posted by rsridhar on April 13, 2005 3:55:49 am
re:#644 by Mantolives
Margaret Burke-White reported things factually, without distortions. If this means she was a Gandhi fan, so be it.
Actually, many foreigners who came close to Gandhi, came to admire him. Ms B-W might have been one of them. This does not automatically mean she is going to be biased in her writings. One can admire someone and yet be critical.
We are talking about what Jinnah`s intentions were during that conference. He made it clear that he was not against violence if it served the purpose (of showing who controlled the muslims). Violence did follow and he did prove his hold on the muslim population. You do not have to be a rocket scientiist to figure out what happened.
Sridhar
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#678 Posted by MantoLives on April 13, 2005 4:25:56 am
Re: # 671

without distortions? Did God tell you this in a dream? Was B-W a human being with her own biases and versions?

Anyone who reads Jinnah`s life knows that Jinnah abhorred violence more than Gandhi did... its only Gandhi made a fetish out of it.




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#670 Posted by harish_hyd on April 13, 2005 2:42:39 am
And since you so love to quote Stanley Wolpert, here is what the man himself has to say about the Direct Action Day violence in Calcutta.

http://www.nytimes.com/books/first/w/wolpert-gandhi.html

``MAHATMA GANDHI fell into ``darkest despair`` on the eve of India`s independence in August 1947. Savage fighting spread from Punjab and the North-West Frontier to Eastern Bengal and Bihar. Brutal violence unleashed a year earlier by Muslim thugs in Calcutta had triggered Hindu counterattacks and the murder of more Muslims in Bihar.``

This should be sufficient to put all your lies and spin as to who started the violence to rest. Or will you now call Stanley Wolpert a liar?
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#675 Posted by MantoLives on April 13, 2005 4:18:29 am
Re: # 670

Listen loser... I have pointed out on several occasions that I don`t quote Wolpert... haven`t quoted him since the year 2001...

He is wrong on the Calcutta issue... if he says Muslim thugs started it.

I have asked you some very serious questions which you`ve failed to answer.
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#669 Posted by harish_hyd on April 13, 2005 2:29:28 am
#665 by Mantolives

[Since it is now conclusively proved that Congress Party was behind the Calcutta disturbances....]

Conclusively proved?? Sure. This joke just made my day.
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#668 Posted by harish_hyd on April 13, 2005 2:17:31 am
#665 by Mantolives

[What did Gandhi do to stop these disturbances Don`t give me nonsense him going to Calcutta in August 1947... we are talking about August 1946....]

FYI, Gandhi did *not* issue the call for Direct Action Day, Jinnah did. So it was incumbent upon Jinnah to make sure that it was *not* violent, and if it did turn violent as it did, call upon Muslims to restrain from indulging in violence. Did Jinnah do it? After nearly 40 interacts from you without answering this question, I believe he did not.

[What did Gandhi DO to stop Major Leaders like Patel from gloating over MORE MUSLIMS dying in CALCUTTA than Hindus?]

Whether Gandhi stopped Patel from gloating or not is something we will never know, but since when has gloating caused deaths?
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    #375 stuka
    #371 wasif2
    #370 cayenne
    #369 harish_hyd
    #372 veeresh
    #367 veeresh
    #366 cayenne
    #365 KaalChakra
    #364 HP
    #368 veeresh
    #363 HP
    #362 HP
    #361 rozaiba
    #383 hamidm2
    #406 rozaiba
    #360 MaheshG2
    #358 veeresh
    #357 satyamvada
    #356 jay
    #354 jang
    #352 stuka
    #351 kardesh
    #353 kardesh
    #350 kardesh
    #349 Prashant123
    #348 MaheshG2
    #355 hamidm2
    #347 ana
    #346 MaheshG2
    #345 ana
    #344 MaheshG2
    #343 ana
    #341 khamkhwa.
    #342 kardesh
    #340 kardesh
    #339 MaheshG2
    #374 rkhan
    #373 rkhan
    #338 ana
    #337 kardesh
    #336 ana
    #334 MaheshG2
    #335 kardesh
    #333 kardesh
    #332 kardesh
    #331 MaheshG2
    #330 Raw_Dust
    #329 MaheshG2
    #328 Prashant123
    #327 Prashant123
    #326 stuka
    #325 MaheshG2
    #324 Prashant123
    #323 stuka
    #359 veeresh
    #322 MaheshG2
    #321 MaheshG2
    #320 kardesh
    #319 stuka
    #318 kardesh
    #404 tddysam
    #317 MaheshG2
    #316 KaalChakra
    #315 MaheshG2
    #314 echoboom
    #313 MaheshG2
    #312 MaheshG2
    #310 MaheshG2
    #309 Netizen
    #308 stuka
    #311 Netizen
    #307 stuka
    #306 stuka
    #305 khamkhwa.
    #304 stuka
    #303 cayenne
    #302 MaheshG2
    #299 Netizen
    #298 MaheshG2
    #297 MaheshG2
    #296 MaheshG2
    #295 MaheshG2
    #300 mohar11
    #294 MaheshG2
    #293 arjun_m
    #292 cayenne
    #378 drlokraj
    #291 Faruk
    #290 Faruk
    #286 atif2
    #289 kardesh
    #288 delhiwala
    #285 jang
    #282 kardesh
    #280 atif2
    #287 delhiwala
    #279 delhiwala
    #277 arjun_m
    #276 Faruk
    #283 MantoLives
    #301 mohar11
    #275 Faruk
    #274 arjun_m
    #284 MantoLives
    #273 bongdongs
    #272 nazarhayatkhan
    #271 Dash_Dot
    #270 Dash_Dot
    #268 kaurasach
    #266 hamidm2
    #269 veeresh
    #278 hamidm2
    #264 harimau
    #263 veeresh
    #262 subroto
    #261 subroto
    #260 stuka
    #259 stuka
    #258 hamidm2
    #257 rozaiba
    #265 delhiwala
    #256 hamidm2
    #255 hamidm2
    #254 rozaiba
    #253 veeresh
    #252 veeresh
    #251 rozaiba
    #250 harish_hyd
    #249 stuka
    #248 cayenne
    #247 stuka
    #246 subroto
    #245 subroto
    #244 stuka
    #243 cayenne
    #242 harish_hyd
    #240 harish_hyd
    #281 MantoLives
    #239 veeresh
    #267 delhiwala
    #235 arjun_m
    #234 drlokraj
    #233 danda-peer
    #232 wasif2
    #231 harish_hyd
    #230 harish_hyd
    #236 MantoLives
    #229 harish_hyd
    #241 nb
    #228 malikjahanzeb
    #227 temporal
    #524 impressions
    #226 veeresh
    #225 Prashant123
    #224 Prashant123
    #223 harimau
    #222 satyamvada
    #221 amit
    #219 delhiwala
    #220 rahul_capri
    #218 MaheshG2
    #238 MantoLives
    #237 MantoLives
    #217 dost_mittar
    #214 jang
    #215 rahul_capri
    #213 mohar11
    #211 echoboom
    #210 kardesh
    #209 kardesh
    #208 kaurasach
    #207 stuka
    #206 Raw_Dust
    #205 kardesh
    #216 mohar11
    #204 echoboom
    #203 vivek
    #202 MaheshG2
    #201 kardesh
    #200 amit
    #199 MaheshG2
    #198 echoboom
    #195 MaheshG2
    #197 MantoLives
    #194 MaheshG2
    #192 kardesh
    #191 MaheshG2
    #196 MantoLives
    #190 stuka
    #188 MaheshG2
    #193 MantoLives
    #187 ana
    #186 MaheshG2
    #184 MaheshG2
    #189 MantoLives
    #183 MaheshG2
    #182 MaheshG2
    #185 MantoLives
    #181 ana
    #180 Dash_Dot
    #176 MaheshG2
    #179 MantoLives
    #175 kaurasach
    #178 MantoLives
    #174 amit
    #167 delhiwala
    #165 MaheshG2
    #168 MantoLives
    #161 bongdongs
    #170 MantoLives
    #160 Dash_Dot
    #159 bongdongs
    #166 MantoLives
    #172 MantoLives
    #158 MaheshG2
    #164 MantoLives
    #156 amit
    #163 MantoLives
    #154 ana
    #152 MaheshG2
    #155 MantoLives
    #149 MaheshG2
    #148 MaheshG2
    #153 MantoLives
    #150 MantoLives
    #146 ana
    #151 delhiwala
    #142 kaurasach
    #143 Dash_Dot
    #157 MantoLives
    #144 MantoLives
    #141 MaheshG2
    #137 MaheshG2
    #138 Dash_Dot
    #145 MantoLives
    #140 MantoLives
    #147 delhiwala
    #136 MaheshG2
    #138 MantoLives
    #134 MaheshG2
    #143 delhiwala
    #132 kaurasach
    #137 MantoLives
    #130 malik99
    #129 MaheshG2
    #133 MantoLives
    #128 MantoLives
    #127 MaheshG2
    #126 MaheshG2
    #131 MantoLives
    #120 kaurasach
    #125 MantoLives
    #124 MantoLives
    #119 kaurasach
    #123 MantoLives
    #139 delhiwala
    #118 echoboom
    #117 kaurasach
    #113 kaurasach
    #114 MantoLives
    #112 stuka
    #111 cayenne
    #110 amit
    #115 MantoLives
    #135 delhiwala
    #108 stuka
    #103 stuka
    #107 MantoLives
    #101 amit
    #109 kardesh
    #100 kardesh
    #99 delhiwala
    #105 kardesh
    #162 delhiwala
    #97 kardesh
    #96 cayenne
    #98 kardesh
    #95 MaheshG2
    #94 kardesh
    #93 kardesh
    #91 MaheshG2
    #90 Urstruly
    #106 MantoLives
    #89 jang
    #89 chaltahai
    #88 chaltahai
    #86 kardesh
    #84 kardesh
    #85 veeresh
    #87 kardesh
    #92 veeresh
    #83 jang
    #82 veeresh
    #102 MantoLives
    #81 atif2
    #80 Romair
    #116 MantoLives
    #79 kardesh
    #78 MaheshG2
    #77 atif2
    #75 vivek
    #212 rahul_capri
    #74 MaheshG2
    #122 MantoLives
    #73 Prashant123
    #72 MaheshG2
    #104 MantoLives
    #69 MaheshG2
    #71 MantoLives
    #68 kardesh
    #66 kaurasach
    #65 MaheshG2
    #70 MantoLives
    #64 ana
    #61 MaheshG2
    #60 kardesh
    #59 MaheshG2
    #67 MantoLives
    #58 Prashant123
    #57 vivek
    #62 kardesh
    #56 kardesh
    #53 satyamvada
    #63 MantoLives
    #52 MantoLives
    #54 MantoLives
    #51 vivek
    #50 amrita
    #49 Prashant123
    #48 stuka
    #76 Charlie
    #47 vivek
    #55 MantoLives
    #46 Prashant123
    #45 kardesh
    #44 MaheshG2
    #43 stuka
    #177 delhiwala
    #41 kardesh
    #40 vivek
    #36 kardesh
    #34 MaheshG2
    #33 vivek
    #38 kardesh
    #121 MantoLives
    #32 MaheshG2
    #31 stuka
    #30 KaalChakra
    #29 satyamvada
    #28 kardesh
    #35 delhiwala
    #27 kardesh
    #37 delhiwala
    #26 stuka
    #25 stuka
    #173 delhiwala
    #24 kardesh
    #23 kaurasach
    #42 delhiwala
    #22 stuka
    #171 delhiwala
    #21 kardesh
    #169 delhiwala
    #19 kaurasach
    #20 delhiwala
    #18 ferozk
    #17 ferozk
    #16 delhiwala
    #15 Prashant123
    #14 delhiwala
    #13 kaurasach
    #11 dost_mittar
    #12 Dash_Dot
    #9 Charlie
    #8 fara
    #7 Charlie
    #10 MantoLives
    #6 fara
    #5 MantoLives
    #4 MantoLives
    #3 MantoLives
    #39 delhiwala
    #2 Charlie
    #1 cayenne

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