A Space of One’s Own

Re: # 19

Yes our societies moral decline started with Z A Bhutto and his jiyalas....
...the 70`s opened flood gates of moral decay.....and we are still unable to arrest that decline....thats why..... the likes of MMA react the way ...they did in Gujranwala....

.....I`d say... till the 70`s Our country was not only developing Industrially, but also intellectually just look at the literray giants that era produced... they had depth ...and were progressive in their thought and every thing was contructive....

Lahore still has some of that element in it..., But the unfortunate decline.....from
culturally rich , and of proud traditions to morally bankrupt and narssictic behaviour is more prominent in Karachi.....

When I was in School ... we had a bunch senior girls , those in 9th and 10th , who use to come to the school on bikes.... It was the late 60`s.... and we were then residing
in Nazimabad then an upcomming middle class area......There was a Sports complex of a sort at the very place where there is now the Sind Sports Board. Just adjacent to
Govt College... , and we use to go there and watch Atheletes training.... and there were quite a few female atheletes too... sitting in the small garden of Govt School.... it was a treat.. and some of the boys in our gatherings even dreamnt of becoming Gymnasts and athelete... But Alas came Z A Bhutto ..... and his cotiere of Jiyalas
and since then.... there is nothing but steady decline ...in moral values...
... But I think.... this downfall has been arrested a bit during Mursharaf`s era....But for how long that is to be seen.

The minimum decency requirement for a nation is how do the women of the nation are treated and how they feel about it.
The upper limit of the decency is determined by how the hapless animals of the nation are treated.
Prior to Zia Pakistan was not friendly to India but it was a decent nation. After him

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draw your own conclusion.

Societies do not change overnight. According to the laws of social dynamics there has to have an action first to cause the reaction.

My mother told me, when we were kids, that she rode bike to college in sixtees in Lahore along with other girls; she was inspired by her aunt who was a professor at a girls college in a small town (at that time) around partition and then became principle at the same college and rode bike to work throughout 50s and 60s until her knee-joints permitted. No one in that town ever raised a finger.

But then came the 70s and elections campaigns started for the 1970 election. (This is as per my parents). PPP planned one of its campaign stop in that small town, mentioned above. Incidently, the city square, where the campaign speeches were scheduled to be delivered was situated just in front of the said girls college. Some of the prominent PPP campaigners among other were Hanif Ramay, Kosar Niazi, Shoaib (I`m forgetting his last name, he later became finance minister in Bhutto Cabinet), Sheikh Rashid, probably Jehangir Badar and couple of other shuhday mirasi along with them. Now these esteemed wanna-be people`s representatives insisted that they would hold the campaign meeting inside the girls college and not in front of it. These people tried to enter the girls college despite the fact that city`s responsible people repeatedly requested them not to. But these people were high on the ``power-of the-people-with-us`` nonsensense and refused to listen to the reason. Soon the exchange of words turned into jootebaazi; the word spread rapidly in the small city and people came out with hockeys, clubs, and cricket bats, and of course joota`s and chased the Jialas out of the city. It is their good luck that nobody got killed.

But that incident pointed to the things to come in the Pakistani society. The same people who had no problem raising finger at a women riding bike, who happened to be their daughters` teacher, had big problem with the people who came to tell them how to lead their life.

My mother tells me that during 60s and even in early 70s, her cousins and friends were movie buffs, and they regularly used to go to cinema theaters in groups and at that time no one would even dare to whistle or harass a lady in the cinema or on the way to the cinema. Cinema used to be a family entertainment in those days. But then came 70s. And it started to look that the awami intellectual and liberal film makers had only one agenda under their belt i.e. to show that how each and every prostitute has a heart of gold and how each and every household in Paksitan should have a prostitute as their daughter-in-law. It seemed that Pakistani liberal intelligentia was obssessed with this agenda that how each prostitute and mirasi should have a dignified life in society. The movies in 60s that used to revolve around ordinary household and family issues like saas-bahu, dewar-bhabi, baap-beti, behn-bhai, shohar-biwi aur bachay, now started showing the culture of hira mandi and how in their heart each and every prostitute is infact a potentially good wife, sister, and daughter-in law.

The same thing happened with TV and the print media. The liberalization resulted in a mass flux of what can be called as cheap literature bordering on pornography.

The society does not live in isolation from media and vice versa. The media shapes the society. When a common man is constantly bombarded with the propaganda that there is not much difference between a prostitute and an ordinary women then it has to take effect in society.

That was the time when the culture of harassing girls and women enroute to work, school, or household chores started. By the mid-70s there were hardly any family or women that continued going to cinemas for entertainment. That was the time when violence against women really started to take shape. There was a time in 60s when Governor Amir Mohammad Khan ordered police to shave any boy or man who had long hair and was caught jay walking and in 70s a time came when kidnapped and raped girls were recvovered by police in the Governor House of Punjab when Mustafa Khar was Governor. That was the time when dead fetuses were occassionally being found near girls hostels in universities througout Pakistan. By the time the liberal awami era ended in 77, the ordinary shareef Pakistani aurat was already held hostage by them and confined to her house because of their harassment. Now she couldn`t go out without a male escort because each street corner was now under control of some shuhda- mushtanda.

That collapse of the society at the hands of liberal elite provided the main impetus for the Nizam-e-Mustafa tehrik. General Zia was a cunning politician at heart. He figured out what people wanted at the time. So when he announced the Islamization of the country the people of Pakistan saw it as a sign of relief from immoral liberal tyrranny. In my opinion, what happened in Zia era, was a reaction to what happened in the liberal awami era. Things could not be brought back to those in 60s but they didn`t remain what they were in 70s either. So I think it will be totally unjust to accuse Zia or his Islamization for the shift in the Pakistani society.

General Zia, despite being a tyrranical dicator, therfore, had a great support and appeal from the conservative majority of Pakistan because he appealed to their system of values. The choice was clear for the people - either you can have a liberal democracy which mocks and destroys every value of the society or have a dictatorship that promises to conserve their values and even promised to bring back the good old days of law and order, and freedom from fear of being harrassed. That is the reason when General Zia died; over one and a half million people showed up at his funeral. In the history of Pakistan that is the second biggest funeral after Quaid-e-Azam died. People came from all corners of the country to pay homage to the one who saved them once.

``in all honesty, i believe that people who get turned on by watching women`s sports are sick perverts and are potential child molesters and rapists``

Whoa hold on a minute there man, getting a hard on from watching womens beach volleyball doesn`t make me a child molester or a rapist. I can appreciate that you`re a father and rightfully protective, but as a man how can you not be turned on by suntanned, oiled up half naked chicks jumping up and down. Or Maria Sharapova for that matter, at the same time I do appreciate their athletic skills, because if I was just looking for cheap thrills than theres no shortage of porn on the net.

ntsyed,

....... this is kind of personal because i am the proud father of two beautiful daughters who participate in competitive sports .......... my older daughter played varsity lacrose through high school and i adjusted my work schedule, travel plans and missed important meetings to make sure i attended as many games as i could ........... are you saying i and other fathers did that because we are sick perverts who enjoy looking at young school girls ????.......... now my younger one has taken up tennis and wants me to watch her practice because she is proud of what little she has accomplished ...... are you saying that i should refuse to do so ?.........

.............. in all honesty, i believe that people who get turned on by watching women`s sports are sick perverts and are potential child molesters and rapists ............ these folks should be behind bars to start with so that the rest of us can go about our lives without fear of some bearded fanatic attacking our daughters on the tennis court ..........

re: various

To answer your curiosity about my watching some secular nut cases making out in public in Pakistan, I would take my childhood approach when I came upon a couple of dogs going at it - throw stones to break them up and find a secure private place, before a young child witnesses and pukes on them.

re #8

hamid, nice to see again.

Dear friend, thanks for the advice, I`ll look into it again. meanwhile, I think denial is more unhealthy.

Cheers

Re: #5

sajal, you`re absolutely right - women must have the power granted to them by Allah. At the same time, men (religious & secular) should give up the extra powers they have taken without anyone`s permission.

The solution should be to take away the weapons from the agressor, instead of arming the defender too. Otherwise, the result may never be amicable and peaceful.

#4

hey t,

a) the point is it happens, if you`re connected to the ones who wield power so the beast ... sorry, beat partol could protect you

b) irrelevant to this discussion

c) irrelevant to this discussion

#7
*applause*

Beena nice reading.
# 6,
the poor khallas,phuepees and other bee amman`s in my mainwali,v need to educate the men first simultaneously with women ,so as to know their rights n other rights,thats the only way not women but my mother ,sis,wife n daughter will hav enough public spaces in this country.` right you are only mothers can play the role educate for this matter to their sons.
waise,
MANY PEOPLE THINK THAT CONFIDENCE COME ONLY WITH EDUCATION BUT THAT IS NOT THE CASE. Few days back I saw a sindah villege’s woman on Karachi airport .she came elegantly with the bundle of cotton over her head. she sat in lounge confidently ,least bother about the smart and fashionable people around her. I thought she is the best example of who I am.
Look at Muhktar mai ,the way she is facing the trial.
so fight back and get the space.

I tend to agree with Syed Uncle that many men go to women sports just to enjoy the glam display. And that`s nothing to be ashamed of. ( Tennis fans may not, but beach volleyball? Dont kid me now) Women`s Tennis association actually advised players to dress sexily to attract crowds.

But Syed uncle IS a sick man because he likes to watch young couples making out on beaches. And that`s really really sick. Sir, you should be giving these people privacy they want. You should be ashamed to snooping around invading others` privacy.

Cheers
Kishore

I am not going to doubt Beena but after having lived a major part of my life around Clifton and defense, I feel that her knowledge of Seaview is not very accurate. (Though my visits after 1983 were rare).There was never bad times there and it was always full of families and single girls walking by on the sort of board walk. Someone remembers the ship that came ashore on Seaview? My brother’s apt was just across the street from there.
I still remember some delightful evenings there.

ntsyed,
You are sick! But what more can we expect from a religious nutcase.

ntsyed,

.......... you are a very very sick man if you really belive that `` most male spectators are not interested in the quality of the game or the individual female athletes` skills........... my friend, you have much bigger problems than you realize !!!! ......... please think about it - it is not healthy .......

Re: # 3

Syed Uncle,

If educated people like you talk such rubbish then what about the uneducated and the mullahs who are educated only in kuran?

If these guys can disrupt a girls marathon then I shouldnt be surprised if you bar your daughter from participating in sports.

You say men shouldnt not be allowed to witness women sports; just a hypothetic que:

If the authorities make an exception and allow you as the only man to witness your mini-skirted daughter play tennis, would you go? And in that case would your daughter be ``expending`` her dignity?

[I`ll be the first male with my mother, wife, and daughter to Take Back the Night]

Aila! Dont you get it? Your daughter doesnt want to come with you to take back that damned night. She`d rather go with her boyfriend to a dim-lit restaurant/pub/disco and make out... I mean make out, not just fool around :)

Cheers
Kishore

ASSALAMO ALAIKUM!
Well i fully agree with temporal,
the thing which my country need today is education,awareness and implementation of LAW.As i see my poorest village on this planet( im saying it with some authority as i m working overseas in africa) the poor khallas,phuepees and other bee amman`s in my mainwali,v need to educate the men first simultaneously with women ,so as to know their rights n other rights,thats the only way not women but my mother ,sis,wife n daughter will hav enough public spaces in this country
hav good health n ALLAH`S MERCY AMEEN