A Space of One’s Own

Re: #64

1: I`m sorry sir, but my posts DID NOT ``contain vulgarity verging on pronography``. They were blunt comments about some anti-muslim Muslims here, and some DID read those posts before they were deleted, and you can see their post where they refer to my deleted posts.

Believe it my friend, they did. Unfortunately I don`t have saved copies to paste them here again. This is the same modus operandi as beliefnet.net and MWU. My essay you read on another board was rejected by the chowkstaff. Furthermore, I`ve not seen any article here that talks positively about the real Islam. Most of them are calling for Islam to be changed and/or eliminated - the current jargons of the neocons and their supporting politicians.

2: Perhaps they also did appear, but were deleted when I saw them. The reason I suspect those were deleted is because echoboom and khamkhwa have historically supported my views. I have no reason to believe they would counter me this time, because my views remain the same as the day I became a member of this portal.

temporal:
(chusni)

but how do i know what you are saying to be true. that is, moulvi echoboom is the chusni.

if it is true, moulvi echoboom has a very notorious lighter side. i mean `chusni`, what an imagination.

nt:

here`s my understanding. islam sees sexual intermingling as a taboo, that is, something which is defined to be real but is not actually real. for example, a sikh cutting is kais is an example of a taboo.

in modren societies, in which law and order is strong, the benefits of sexual intermingling and liberty are far far more than it`s few draw backs (sexual predator phenomenon). in the context of these societies, you cannot show that sexual freedom is overall a bad thing. Can you?

but let`s come to the real point. let`s say that sexual feelings are something evil. islam says that to keep people pure, it restricts their interaction. i say that the more people get starved of sex, the more their sexual feelings become accumulated and the person becomes so desparate that no wonder he looks at moon and imagine it`s a big breast and looks at every hole he can find as if it is well....... this is where your context of dealing this issue comes from. since you represent the starved and desparate side, you take even a little matter involving sex to be a thing of paramount importance. it is you who looks at players` bosoms while a fulfilled guy will watch the game.

so, it is a stupid that islam`s policy to reduce something actually increases it many fold.

sometimes, i wonder how stupid looking the laws of almighty can get.

A fascinating insight. A highly regarded Professor of Islamic Law and holding top position in his field speaks.

Islamic Law IS the answer, says David Forte: Advisor to the Vatican (Pope) and President Bush.
Date: 2005-03-09
David Forte, a consultor to the Pontifical Council for the Family and an adviser to President George Bush on Islamic affairs, shared with ZENIT why he believes there are facets of Islamic law that are hospitable to the development of free societies.

Forte is a law professor at Cleveland-Marshall College of Law at Cleveland State University and author of ``Studies in Islamic Law: Classical and Contemporary Application`` (Austin & Winfield).

Interview with David Forte

``hUm huay kaafir, toa voh kaafir musalmaaN ho gaya``
The times they are a`changin`...

Burquaas, Abayaas, and Hijaabs are in--big time.

Glorious and heart warming news that the Paki english press, on `pause` since their Daddys abandoned them, prefers not to know.

But what can you do . Facts are Facts--and internet & e-mails are whirring & buzzing.

---

``hUm huay kaafir, toa voh kaafir musalmaaN ho gaya``
tr:
``When I abandoned Islam and became a kaafir (for her sake), she embraced Islam``!

paraphrase :
in Musharraf`s Raushan-Khayalistan

``We embraced our master`s creed to please and appease him , but Lo and behold! he turns around and embraces another creed.!

READ and ENJOY!

Click here

nts # 59:

Deleting my blunt posts, and their corresponding posts by echoboom and others, are further proof of this portal being another mouthpiece for anti-muslim agenda on the information war front, because these punks CAN`T HANDLE THE TRUTH!


1: unless your posts contain vulgarity verging on pronography, i find it hard that chowkstaff would delete your posts...if you have saved them try posting them again

the following query pertains to the underlined portion of your quote above:

2: how do you know this? the corresponding posts by others...in response to your posts...that never appeared here according to you?

rgds

t

mj #52:

how do you prove the chusni/echoboom duality?

duality?

these two nicks are amongst a plethora of nicks this abdul-hate used/uses on chowk

rgds

t

#59 by ntsyed

Syed uncle,

Sexual predators are everywhere even in the most pious muslim countries. But under the garb of protecting women ( your mothers, sisters, daughters as you invariably describe) from men, you are making them more vulnerable and utterly unprepared to face the big-bad-world. That`s the real damage of gender segregation.

Gender segregation affects men too though it`s not that obvious. And anyway it`s outside the scope here.

[You may recall my questions on another board about the rising statistics of rapes and other female exploitations in the US, Europe, India, and other secular nations... to date none of my worthy opponents have come up with an answer.... TO DATE]

I`m only amazed at your ignorance. Let me put it very bluntly here: In Pakistan, the number of cases of female exploitation is more or less equal to the female population. Except for those who travel in big cars with tinted glasses. Even these women cant venure out alone, but in their comfort it`s only a minor issue for them.

But of course you wont agree because, in your book, female exploitation may only be of sexual kind, if at all. I wont be surprised if you go ahead and claim that female exploitation is zero in Pakistan. Because for you, anything short of penetration resulting in ejaculation isnt really a sexual assault. And even then, couldnt it be that the woman is wanton? Oh yes! Case dismissed; woman honor-killed; female exploitation count back to zero.

ntsyed #59 I am afraid you and I are still not in agreement. i.e. you write ``I`m not a fan of the traditional mullah either, most of them follow culture before Islam. ``

The problem is the term ``traditional mullah``, which implies that there is such a thing as a ``modern mullah`` who presumably is enlightened. In saying this, you ignore what I wrote in my post, so let me repeat: There is no room for a priestly class in islam - traditional, modern or ultra-modern. Period.

If you disagree with this, kindly say so explicitly. If not, then kindly explain which Sunnah overrides the Quran (which comes down very severely against intermediaries between the individual and God. Kindly also explain why the Quran is wrong when it claims to be a book to make things simple and that it is a complete message.


you write ``I`m only a fan of Quran and authentic Sunnah. ``
Kindly explain why the Quran is wrong when it says it is the complete message that was revealed to the holy prophet, and why it requires to the ``help`` of the sunnah (regardless of which ones you consider ``authentic`` vs ``inauthentic``), particularly when this ``help`` comes accompanied by ``consultants`` in the form of mullahs.

You write ``I mean, what these mullahs and the rest are doing is exactly how islam applies to people with this particular situation and intellect. what do you suggest?``

I suggest that ``mullahs and the rest`` have NOT been given the job of determining ``how islam applies to particular situations. They have arrogated this position - and the accompanying illegitimate power it gives them - for themselves. And in doing so, mullahs have rejected the Quran, which clearly places responsibility upon the individual for his/her understanding.

you write ``Is islam a riddle that only a few selected ones can solve? why is that? why is the book not written for allah ditta of jand? `` The book IS indeed written for ``allah ditta of jand`` - or at least for ``allah ditta of the arabian deserts``. As the Quran says, it is ``arabic Quran`` that does not say anything that has not already been revealed, but that it is in arabic in order to bring the message to people who are not familiar with the other languages.

In reference to the ridiculous arguments surrounding women’s sports and their spectators.

Now, when men watch women playing tennis, some will have perverted thoughts, some might find it attractive and nothing else, and most will watch for the sake of the sport. There is nothing wrong with admiring a woman as long as they don’t stare and purposely make her uncomfortable. If the men want to fulfil any of their sexual desire visually there really is no shortage of porn that is easily accessible. I do feel men these days are more use to the idea of sex and female flesh than ever before in time thanks to our media and internet (of course there are exceptions). When a woman decides to take up sport, or get into the media for that fact, she has already prepared herself for the few perverted animals that lurk. Women today are not that stupid, and they don’t need a man to decide whether male spectators should attend sport events in which they participate. Nor do they need men dictating whether society is safe enough for them to walk around in. like the author of the article (that everyone has forgotten about) argues, that it is up to the women to get out in society in order to win their ‘public space’. No man propagated women’s rights. It was the women who got up and started the feminist revolution. Now our rights as women, is our dimension and we should be able to decide.

And another point, why are men forgetting that women find men sexually attractive as well? So keeping with the argument that women are equal to men, and so it is wrong for men to admire a woman (insinuating women are helpless and can not fight) therefore they should be banned from women sports, then should women be banned from watching cricket matches? Because just like men, women have a sexual appetite as well, don’t forget the women and their attraction to Imran Khan.

Re. #52

Dear J,

regarding your comment:

``...simple thing is that islam`s ban on sexual intermingling makes the matters worse than to solve it.``

can you, or anyone here, show me if intermingling of sexes in the hyped-up ``elightened`` societies has alleviated their predicament as preys for sexual predators? Sure it has sold more mace, and provided abundant opportunities for the laywers, but how has it helped the women?

Why is it that western educated men and women continue to embrace Islam in unprecedented numbers, and our educated men and women are running towards morally decrepit defunct western systems? I`ll tell you why, the latter is suffering from Identity Crisis in varying degrees.

You may recall my questions on another board about the rising statistics of rapes and other female exploitations in the US, Europe, India, and other secular nations... to date none of my worthy opponents have come up with an answer.... TO DATE!

Re #45,

tahmed,

I`m not a fan of the traditional mullah either, most of them follow culture before Islam. I`m only a fan of Quran and authentic Sunnah.

Rejecting a system because some fail to follow it as it should be is just as stupid. One should compare the system with predominently or allegedly successful system before rejecting one of them. Under the current circumstances, there is no solution except TRUE Islam for Pakistan - not the politicized Sunni, Shia, version. Following the paths of Marxism and Communism, the secularism has failed miserably as well.

Western democracies have begun to peel off like onion skin right before your eyes, if you care to open them. But I`m sure most here will not open thier eyes until USA reinstates the draft after their allegedly planned incursion in Iran this June/July (read Scott Ritter and Seymore Hersh). Muslim`s failure to enlist will have repercussion that`ll make Bosnian massacre of Muslims look like childs play.

Deleting my blunt posts, and their corresponding posts by echoboom and others, are further proof of this portal being another mouthpiece for anti-muslim agenda on the information war front, because these punks CAN`T HANDLE THE TRUTH!

#56 by Aha_Snark

Quite. But Syed Uncle clarified in his post #16. Made me cringe. Reproduced below.

[To answer your curiosity about my watching some secular nut cases making out in public in Pakistan, I would take my childhood approach when I came upon a couple of dogs going at it - throw stones to break them up and find a secure private place, before a young child witnesses and pukes on them]

Re Temporal # 25:

...and zulfi has to be blamed for opportunism or cowardice of the highest order....(casino, wine, ahmedis etc.)
....

I would like to take the issue of Ahmedis through some perspective:

-The blameworthiness on Bhutto for cannoning Ahmedis as non Muslims stands true as it lead to endless sectarian aggressions.
But I think it should be termed as short sightedness of Bhutto`s inability to predict the consequences . His progressive companions were against this allegation but at that time to adhere with “Islamist”, Mullas of the country and to gain their favor he lined the Ahmedis which resulted in shocked moments against him and sectarian hazard against Shias which were then also demanded to be declared “Kafirs”.
This act also resulted in loss of support of many Enlightened Ahmedis, Qadiyanis as well. But it was a “Karvi Goli” of that Time.
So the blame doesn’t go only to Bhutto but the circumstances and power of fizzy Islamic authorities which spoiled so much even when they were put in transformation and conversion processes.

Re: # 10

``But Syed uncle IS a sick man because he likes to watch young couples making out on beaches. And that`s really really sick. Sir, you should be giving these people privacy they want. You should be ashamed to snooping around invading others` privacy.``

I don`t support ntsyed`s ppint of view, but there`s nothing in his statement that goes to say that he`s a voyeur or that he sought out the sight. If you say that you saw a man urinating by the roadside that doesn`t mean that you`re running around trying to look for men doing so.


Cheers
Kishore

Re: # 4

q2: when did you witness this making out
what difference does that make?

q3: what did you do about it?
and what should be done about it?

What a perfect timing. All this talk about women in sports come at a time when womens marathon is banned in pakistan. Every writer from pakistan talks about the slow and steady move to extrimism and we have a few pathetic indians like stuka and dost mitter talking about how moderate the pakistanis are. This slide to extrimism is transparent even on chowk, the tahmeds and romairs supporting the jihadis and calling them freedom fighters. The latest attack on kashmir bus travellers has been claimed by laskers based in pakistan. Who supports laskers, the sakkat funds fom pak govt. # million trained jihadis, a small part of pak population, what a great interpretation. The fact is that 3 million of them are supported by the millions of temporals and tahmeds who refuse to say, do not kill kafirs in the name of jihad. They know that it is against what the mullahs say and all aso that it is per the book.