The Alternative Muslim Identity

HP #135:

well said sir!

we are on the same page

Re: # 144

Wah Wah Mr. Echodoom!

Kya baat hai!

Another gem of your brilliant speech.

How do you ever think of such beautiful remarks.

dost-mittar #130:

I think that there is a difference in your and my `manzil`. If I understand your post correctly - and I may not - you seem to consider insaaniyat as a pit-stop on way to becoming a Muslim. For me, the manzil will arrive when I seize being a Sikh or a Hindu and become an Insaan.

maybe yes, maybe not:)

you refer to my oft repeated mantra pehlay insaan, phir musalmaan: pehlay Khuda, phir Rasool: pehlay ta`aleem phir tafheem

some points to consider first:

* make your own appropriate substitutions for musalmaan, Khuda, Rasool from your faith or practice...i use this because i was born into this faith but it should not be confined to islam ony!
* organised religion has been hijacked by vested interests. ( am talking of major religions not minor off-shoots which maybe mostly peaceful)
* these vested interests have inculcated an air of extreme intolerance
* it is this ingrained and inbred intolerance that is causing most of the mayhem and destruction in our world

imho the way to fight this is to return to the `cave` and re-emerge again;)...hence emphasis on pehlay... aur phir...

rgds

t

Whereever Sharia is supreme & established; wherever Khusraas & HijRRas do not masquerade as ``humanists``, where-ever muslims are are shedding mental colonialism & not trying to be westoxicated...


Iran executes five rapists
Five men convicted of abducting, raping and robbing women were taken yesterday to the Teheran neighbourhoods they had terrorised and hanged in public.
This is what free people do http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2002/09/30/wiran30.xml

Re: # 141
What does Dave Chapelle have to do with this?


What are you trying to say. Lost me Dude.

Re: # 139
Do explain what you mean by your brilliant phrase.
My nerves are doing what????????

By the way, your cynicism stinks!
Perhaps if you cleansed your thinking, you might stop mistaking your cynicism for hypocrisy on the parts of those courageous women like Muhtarma Mukhtair, and Muhtarma Asma Jahangir.

These are the true daughters of Pakistan.

And you Sir, some bafoon with really poor writing skills and choice of vocabulary.

Try to contribute something constructive for a change.

Look at Dave Chapelle.In a happy home.Does him being muslim have anything to do with him getting messed up in the head?.I wouldn`t know.And, then one can read this article and also come to the same conclusion and assume...........

Kaal ji:
#126

“A humanist ought to work to weaken this discriminatory power of religion.”

I agree and this is why I`m wary of attributing labels while establishing religious identities. I think we become engaged in the same kind of discrimination we are trying to stand up against. I know for many people it is important to have tangible ideas to align themselves to but I think it’s just more divisiveness in the making.


dost-mittar:
#130

``For me, the manzil will arrive when I cease being a Sikh or a Hindu and become an Insaan.``

sigh...i really like that idea. yet another uphill battle. damn these uphill battles! :)

#134 shoresahib think your nerves are jangling

132 T, yes the fight is on. It is some 20 years too late. For in the meantime there have been thousands of women and others who suffered. As long as this didnot effect the elite and middle classes, these things were swept under the carpet. It was in other words not a problem.

Fundementally, you need to decide on what it is you want. What is the big issue? Is it the removal of mushy? Is it the restoration of Civil Rule? Is it the restoration of law and order? Is it the creation of a just society? Is it the developing of a society on modern scientific principles? The big idea is missing. That is the problem.

Mai and rape are fine as issues. These can become rallying cries for a cause, but what is the cause? Mai and rape can be tackled at different levels - the mundane level is one of sexual equality, and the infringement of rights (as is done in the west), at a more higher level it is an issue to bring about a GREAT REVOLUTION in society. This is not clear. All that can be seen is hysteria.

Dont get me wrong here, I am not supporting rape, I wish the guys who did this and many others to be taken and castrated with a public rape before BY WOMAN and after by a bunch of animals (that is a very good punishment in the macho society).

#126:

faux religious pride has caused enough mayhem, death and destruction

have never read about civility causing death or misery in all of history...insaniyaat...whichever way one approaches it, breeds tolerance

religion mostly breeds intolerance, sooner or later in the hands of its vested interests

Re: # 133
tsk tsk tsk..... Do u envy not getting the feeling that you have a brain at all.

As Sister Mary Cecille used to say, Tumharay Dimagh mein Bhoosa bhara Hai kya?

#132 by temporal

“it has provided a rallying platform for those who oppose hudood ordinance, mullah rule, army rule...a vast army out there!”

Read my post from the Mai board.

Mukhtaran Mai vs. the Rest of Pakistan

#26 by HP on June 15, 2005 12:31pm PT

But the real benefits are:

The Human rights commission in Pakistan would gain instant international approval, recognition, and many donations.

The plight of women in Pakistan would be highlighted and that would be a huge blow to Islamist and the Mullah in Pakistan.

Her visit would provide another great opportunity to open yet another assault on Hudood and Zina laws. These laws must be repealed in Pakistan.

It may also provide an opportunity to get Blasphemy law out of the books in Pakistan.

Overall people Christina Rocca by pressuring the Pak govt has set the stage for a major assault on the fundamentalists and fundamentalism in Pakistan.

All Pakistanis and Indians on this site to please consider showing up at her appearances in your city, whenever she comes to the US. Donate money and if possible, alert local newspapers and media about her visit to your city.

Re: # 128
Get your nose checked.

The only smell is the stench of your rotting brain.

kalachakra:126

..``samajh ke bina insaaniyat insaaniyat nahi hai. bachpanaa hai...``

very well put--except it is not bachpana but ``jahiliyat``

it is ``let them eat cake`` syndrome.

It is this organised, politicised do-gooding which gives these peter-pans the fuzzy warm-glow that they have brains.

i-m:

you posted this on unplugged and in my thread there also

here is my response from there:

#1 by temporal on June 21, 2005 10:35am PT

you are discussing it

we are discussing it

and yes

mukhtaran issue has assumed a bigger purpose

it has provided a rallying platform for those who oppose hudood ordinance, mullah rule, army rule...a vast army out there!