General Musharraf goes on Struggling for Legitimacy

Ever wondered why dictators while having Total Power project themselves as humble folks destined to lead their countries? Why is that guys like Laloo, a cabinet minister desperately trying to hold on to his chair, shows such arrogance of power? If you dont know their background you`ll easily mistake Laloo as a dictator and Mushy a mere humble politician.

Why? Ever wondered?

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why pick-up and beat-up journos who are against national interest? book them under treason.

#13 by labyrinth1 on May 24, 2005 4:31pm PT


Mushraff that he is someone who won`t sacrifice national intrest.


That`s easy to do when you keep changing what constitutes a vital national interest..

He`s already accepted that India isn`t going to redraw borders in Kashmir....

#13 by labyrinth1

[although you are someone who belongs to a totally different country let me tell you and this is something even the press reps. in Pakistan accept there is more freedom of press then anyother so-called first world country.]

According to the Freedom House in its report on the situation with freedom of press around the world, 75 (39 percent) out of the 194 countries were rated as ‘free’, 50 (26 percent) ‘partly free’ and 69 (35 percent) as ‘not free’. Five countries improved in category while two declined. In addition to Ukraine and Lebanon, Guatemala and Guinea-Bissau moved from Not Free to Partly Free, while Namibia moved from Partly Free to Free. Only two countries - Pakistan and Kenya - registered a negative category shift in 2004, moving from Partly Free to Not Free.

Does that tell you something bhai-jaan? Its tell us that notwithstanding the sanguine picture you paninted, the press in Pakistan has been more repressed than it was last year.

labyrinth1 #13

`` babu bhai-jan,
comeon we are a nation which I assume is selfish in giving credit , I think one should be fair and not extreme in criticizing anything - credit should be given where its due Mushraff although someone who is from army did lots of good for the country . No one is perfect so there are good and bad things about everyone... ``

I will give credit to Musharraf that he has made the best of a bad situation. The guy is a good tactician and has good short term vision. I doubt he is a strategic thinker or a visionary. I doubt he can survive without American backing.

Does anyone think that Indian special forces can retrieve Dawood Ibrahim and bring him to Mumbai where he will meet justice?.If not ,as an Indian tax payer, i pray to God that my government is supporting the independence movement in Baluchistan with our tax-rupees, so as to cause maximum damage to the pakistani army establishment , in retribution for them doing the same to India and harboring, aiding and abetting dangerous criminals such as Dawood Ibrahim.


Musharaf will stay as long as his employer wants him to stay.If he`s lucky and plays his cards right , he will probably be allowed to live out the rest of his life in New Delhi.After all, he`s an Indian Citizen by birth, like Zia too.I guess Zia didn`t play his cards right and was hostile to India.So, `OFF` he went when he was no longer needed in pakistan.Musharaf seems to be doing the right thing.He is a good employee.Let`s see.

why should Mushraff change? is my question

harish ,
bhai - shaib , although you are someone who belongs to a totally different country let me tell you and this is something even the press reps. in Pakistan accept there is more freedom of press then anyother so-called first world country. As far as Dawood Ibrahim is concerned yes, he is somoene we had been using and he is one of our main contact in India - the Indians knows it , Americans know it ( because he has helped even Americans in India let me assure you ) and the world knows it - so as far as any journalist writing about national intrest is concerned thats a no - no in any country and this is excatly I along with 2/3 of Pakistan lauds Mushraff that he is someone who won`t sacrifice national intrest.
babu bhai-jan,
comeon we are a nation which I assume is selfish in giving credit , I think one should be fair and not extreme in criticizing anything - credit should be given where its due Mushraff although someone who is from army did lots of good for the country . No one is perfect so there are good and bad things about everyone...

Who suceeds Musharraf

labyrinth1 #8

`` reply 5,6,7 and to all Mushraff critics, ``

I dunno if I am a Musharraf critic.

`` Agree or not for whatever reason Democratic Leaders acted as Dictators , remember what happened to Jang Group in Nawaz Sharif time ? Mushraff is not Zia because Mushraff supports freedom of speech and media plus wants to get rid of Jehadis - Mushraff is not Yahya because Mushraff is not irresponsible and finally Mushraff is not Ayub because Mushraff stands up for smaller provinces and supports freedom of press ....... legit or not Mushraff is reality ..the fact is my friends here don`t see for unknown reasons is that in 90`s Prime Ministers from PML and PPP lost the plot and acted liked ` khuda`s ` and that Nawaz Sharif was in line to break Pakistan from Punjab because we in smaller provinces started hating Punjab more in Nawaz Sharif`s tenure....Mushraff is a bridge between inter-provisional harmony agree or not!!!! yes, no one wants army infact I hate army presence in civilian affairs but when things should be put in order I would welcome even a jama-dar or a hawal -dar to take Presidency of Pakistan and put things in order - .... there are nothing such a principles and legitimacy in real world - I would like harish , bbabu and shishapa to stop acting like bachays and cry baby. ( thankya , kuch samajh mein ayaa ? ya pehlay wale bhe gayeee? .. hopeless! ) ``

It is true Nawaz Sharif harassed some newspaper groups. Musharraf has harassed journalists. The SAT publisher is in exile in USA. The journalist that helped a French TV crew in the NWFP is in prison.

Why is Musharraf not Yahya ?

Who is Nawaz Sharif ? He was a hand picked appointee of Pakistani military during Zia. He is a product of the establishment. The guy was propped up to counter Benazir and the PPP. When he started to build his own agenda and power base the guy was toppled twice.

As far as inter-provincial relations in Pakistan goes it boils down to resource sharing. Mushy did not create it. I do not think he is going to solve it. Heavy military spending deprives the smaller provinces of development funds. I do not see any reduction in military spending. Musharraf cannot increase the amount of water in the Indus river. Musharraf has an advantage that he can say that he is not a Punjabi. It does not conceal the fact that his main power base has been the Army. Even the civillian lackeys PML-Q is a Punjabi based party.

there is nothing to me to cry about. I am not going to be paying the price !!!

Musharraf will never retire, if he has his way. No dictator likes to retire from the scene. In many countries ex-dictators have faced ruins. Dictators are killed or overtrown. I think Mush will be killed either by the jihadi brigade in Pakistan or the CIA.

#8 by labyrinth1

[Agree or not for whatever reason Democratic Leaders acted as Dictators , remember what happened to Jang Group in Nawaz Sharif time ? Mushraff is not Zia because Mushraff supports freedom of speech and media plus wants to get rid of Jehadis - Mushraff is not Yahya because Mushraff is not irresponsible and finally Mushraff is not Ayub because Mushraff stands up for smaller provinces and supports freedom of press ....... ]

Ghulam Hasnain of the Newsline was abducted from his home in Karachi (you should know since you belong to the same city) and tortured for 3 days because he dared to write about Dawood Ibrahim`s whereabouts. Your President went so far as to call him a traitor because he had betrayed `national interest`. Guess who it was? Mushy of course. As recently as a week ago, some journos were roughed up as they were participating in an event marking the International Press Day (or something of that sort). Freedom of speech? Sure, continue deluding yourself.

As for standing up for smaller provinces, his keen interest in the Kalabagh dam and his threat to Baloch leaders (they will not know what hit them) sure makes him the savior of the smaller provinces.

[there are nothing such a principles and legitimacy in real world -]

Then Nawaz Sharif was doing nothing wrong when he tried to dismiss Musharraf? After all, there is nothing called principles.

[I would like harish , bbabu and shishapa to stop acting like bachays and cry baby.]

Bhai Sahab, we have absolutely no reason to cry. In fact, everytime a Paki bemoans the lack of democracy in Pakistan, I feel like gloating. But then, the fact that India and Pakistan are like Siamese twins (can`t live together, yet cannot be pulled apart) makes me feel for the average Abdul.

reply 5,6,7 and to all Mushraff critics,
Agree or not for whatever reason Democratic Leaders acted as Dictators , remember what happened to Jang Group in Nawaz Sharif time ? Mushraff is not Zia because Mushraff supports freedom of speech and media plus wants to get rid of Jehadis - Mushraff is not Yahya because Mushraff is not irresponsible and finally Mushraff is not Ayub because Mushraff stands up for smaller provinces and supports freedom of press ....... legit or not Mushraff is reality ..the fact is my friends here don`t see for unknown reasons is that in 90`s Prime Ministers from PML and PPP lost the plot and acted liked ` khuda`s ` and that Nawaz Sharif was in line to break Pakistan from Punjab because we in smaller provinces started hating Punjab more in Nawaz Sharif`s tenure....Mushraff is a bridge between inter-provisional harmony agree or not!!!! yes, no one wants army infact I hate army presence in civilian affairs but when things should be put in order I would welcome even a jama-dar or a hawal -dar to take Presidency of Pakistan and put things in order - .... there are nothing such a principles and legitimacy in real world - I would like harish , bbabu and shishapa to stop acting like bachays and cry baby. ( thankya , kuch samajh mein ayaa ? ya pehlay wale bhe gayeee? .. hopeless! )

#4 by labyrinth1

[Yes everyone needs powers I do , I am sure if given a chance you will grab presidency its in human nature ...]

Does that mean what he did was right? Will you condone, if tomorrow another goddamn general overthrows Musharraf and assumes Presidency? Because after all, power is a human weakness? It is precisely because of fools like you (the ones that were jumping with joy on television cameras when Mushy deposed Nawaz Sharif) that Pakistan is condemned to be perpetually ruled by the military.

[I think for now atleast Mushraff is one of the best leaders we ever had !]

The fact that you think there is not one Paki who is good enough to lead Pakistan from amongst 140 million of you (excluding of course the military), as also the fact that Pakis are not mature enough to choose a good leader is a telling statement. No wonder Pakistan is as close to democracy today as it was in 1958 when Ayub Khan took over.

labyrinth1 #4

`` bhay-ya legit or not Mushraff is President, who cares about being legit or not in todays world ? was occupying Iraq legit ? are we living in a ideal world ? here is a guy , whos been more then lucky to be alive and kicking and managing our country ... for me he is someone who had / and is acting as a better leader then others. Yes everyone needs powers I do , I am sure if given a chance you will grab presidency its in human nature ... don`t look at him as someone who just want to stick to the president seat look at Mushraff`s reforms and what actually he has done ... I think for now atleast Mushraff is one of the best leaders we ever had ! ``

Legitimacy counts. No one in India moans about Indira Gandhi even though she did a lot of not so wise things.

Pakistani economy has turned around post 9/11. No one knows what will happens the Americans are done with Osama.

I thought Musharraf would be different when he took power. But I would say that he is no different from Ayub, Yahya or Zia.

BTW what reforms did he exactly introduce ?

Re # 4

``I think for now atleast Mushraff is one of the best leaders we ever had !``

I think if army had never intervened, there is a very good chance that Pakistan would have had many many leaders better than Musharraf.

``Yes everyone needs powers``

And that is why you need and do develop checks and balances in a sustained democracy.

bhay-ya legit or not Mushraff is President, who cares about being legit or not in todays world ? was occupying Iraq legit ? are we living in a ideal world ? here is a guy , whos been more then lucky to be alive and kicking and managing our country ... for me he is someone who had / and is acting as a better leader then others. Yes everyone needs powers I do , I am sure if given a chance you will grab presidency its in human nature ... don`t look at him as someone who just want to stick to the president seat look at Mushraff`s reforms and what actually he has done ... I think for now atleast Mushraff is one of the best leaders we ever had !

Why does Musharraf resemble Yahya Khan ?

Zia lasted 11 years. Ayub Khan lasted 11 years. Who long does Musharraf last ? It is 5 years and counting.

The cartoon was apt. Musharaf cannot stay in power without a pat on the back from Uncle Sam. He has to do a lot of fetching to receive those pats.