Advani in Karachi

Re: # 158 feroz
//...The biggest hurdle to the overall solution is the rigidity of the mental prejudices, which both sides have about each other and which makes the leadership in both nations wary of undertaking bold decisions...//

Nope. The biggest hurdle is that - simply there is no middle ground in this dispute. It all boils down to territory. India is NOT going concede any, and pakis find hard to accept that.

There is no win-win formula here. There is only win-lose formula. Of course Pakis can`t win the land in negotiations what they can`t win in war. So they have to loose and they have to come around to accept the loss gracefully. Until then - there would be no peace.

As far as ``mental prejudices`` are concerned - they will remain as they are because they are based on reality and two very different ways of thinking and living. It`s what defines the two countries. It`s a constant and will be there forever.

So what`s happening int the peace process is exactly what should and could happen - It`s going to be this way for short and medium term. There is nothing else that can be done at this point .... or until pakis come around to accept the status quo.

re: Dost-Mittar

I agree, with you that progress in India-Pakistan process of rapprochement has been slow. I think that it would be rather naive to assume that 58 years of hostility and mistrust, will be swept aside after only two years of political dialogue. The biggest hurdle to the overall solution is the rigidity of the mental prejudices, which both sides have about each other and which makes the leadership in both nations wary of undertaking bold decisions.

Ciao

hindvi #156 All you are saying is that Jinnah won with merely 14 runs and not with 40 runs. He did win, you must admit though. And not just win...time is proving him right. Pakistanis are better off as a separate nation. This despite the fact that I am all for peace with India, for appreciation of India`s rich history and culture, for learning from India`s great democratic traditions built up over the past 50 years, and for jumping on to the global market bandwagon alongside India - this is all icing on the cake, which was the formation of Pakistan.

Gandhi was a racist and considered himself the descendents of a German race. He believd in the superiority of white skinned races nd was was careful enough to place himself one step below the white people in racial hierarchy.

Advani`s behavior can be attributed to two causes.

He is just going with the flow of `peace process` politics these days....i.e. staying with the public sentiment to further personal political interests.

OR

Its his kunjar genes doing the talking.

Either way he is bound to fail. Kasmiris Bahmans (Nehru dynasty) are smarter at kanjarpana and haramzadgi. They are worse kanjars and will win a duel with this lesser kunjar.

Re # 163

I also heard that Gandhi was aware of some Jewish blood from one of his great great
grandfathers on his mother`s uncle`s aunt`s side. And he did not want that to be known
and all his negatives and quirks stemmed from that and him wanting to hide that.
So I have heard.

Re: # 166

Gandhi wasn`t alone with this disease of racial superiority of one over the other. The most prominent and most influential Muslim in this regard is none other but Sir Syed Ahmad Khan who was staunch believer in the racial superiority of one race over the other. As a matter of fact in an article in his own journal Tehzib-ul-Ikhlaq he propounded that the civility (or civilization) in people is directly proportional to the color of their skins. According to him White were the superior, yellow (Chinese/Japs) were on the second rung, Desi were on third rung and blacks were somewhere in between humans and animals. Gandhi mirrored his point of view but considered himself German. But I think Sir Syed was the most influential in this regard that he created an army of Michael Jacksons such as hamidm and baanders like yourself who still beilieve from the core of their hearts the superiority of white people.

So we are advised by Urstruly (#163) that Gandhi was a German, and indeed a German racist Nazi.

And we are advised by Shipshapa (#165) that not only was Gandhi a Nazi, he also had Jewish blood in him.

Clearly the level of discourse on Chowk has risen so such intellectual heights, it is now at stratospheric levels (along with pot smoke).

ha! ha!

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Re: # 169

I read the excerpt in the book ``Sir Syed Ahmad Khan - Shakhsiyat aur tehrik - ek tanqeedi jaizaa`` (Sir Syed Ahmed Khan - Personality & Movement - A critical Review). I am forgetting author`s name, but he is an Indian Muslim and member of Sir Syed Academy. He refers this excerpt to a certain issue of Tehzib-ul-Ikhlaq with its date of issue and article name. I can get you that information over the weekend, since the book is in library, if you like.

urstruly: Have you read this article by Sir Syed Ahmed Khan?? If so, kindly provide a link so I can see for myself what he is saying.

Re: # 170 Echo

Yes I agree to what you say.

See, the vassalage is of two types - mental and physical. A nation can be a vassal either physically or mentally. The mental vassalge is ultimate vassalage. Today, the whole palestinian nation is under physical vassalage but when a seven year old palestinian boy comes face to face with an Israeli tank, each and every pore of his body screams that ``I am a free man`` but when the nuclear armed Pakistani fauji kisses american ass and licks the boots of genocidal maniac like advani, every pore of his body screams that ``I am a vassal``. Syed is the root cause of this evil.

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Re: #103 ROmair
``90s killed Pakistan economically. And the poverty rate at 2000, was 33% and getting worse. Due to this, Pakistan fell from being ahead of South Asia on HDI (other than Sri Lanka) to being behind.``

Historical HDI (Human Development Index) values for selected South Asian countries (from UN HDR 2004)

Year India Pakistan Bangladesh
1975 0.411 0.346 0.345
1980 0.437 0.373 0.363
1985 0.476 0.405 0.388
1990 0.514 0.444 0.417
1995 0.548 0.473 0.445
2000 0.579 no data 0.497
2002 0.595 0.497 0.509

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[ Dost Mittar : ``Avenger: Do you seriously want us to believe that a brahmin was a bonded labour?`` ]

What makes you think that being a brahmin is/was a safeguard against poverty ? Its quite a story. If you are interested , I will let you know . For now , keep in mind that most people in India were poor by the time the British left India - regardless of their caste or creed.

When India became free in 1947 , over 80% of the population lived in absolute poverty , almost on the brink of starvation. Life expectency was 25 years. Millions died of starvation every month.

(Today , 23% of the population lives in poverty. Life expectency is almost 60 years.)

My grandfather was one of those 80% Indians living in utter poverty.