Bunty aur Babli: The latest RSS-BJP tango

call her hypocrite if you want, but at least farzana had the guts to produce the entire letter, and not some chowkie with multiple nicks who takes bits and pieces and gives it his own spin.

i don`t agree with farzana`s definition of refugees when it comes to the kashmiri pandits, but you know, i do agree with her on this. she has written about this subject before here on chowk, it is NOT new news. and it is NOT a response to this article. and guess what? most everyone`s opinions on this thread have been the usual name-calling and sarcasm because their views are already ``colored`` by farzana`s previous articles.

i`m not defending her, as she is perfectly capable of defending herself. i`m just observing that as the usual, people are more than happy to call her names rather than try to understand where she`s coming from. if you believe it`s just a yawn and believe that a man in a powerful position such as advani is incapable of being manipulative for his own good and the good of his party, more so than anyone else then so be it. but calling her a hypocrite is rather rich coming from some of you, and especially from the multiple nicked suhailqazi.

#76 by FarzanaVersey

“For someone who has signed in a few days ago, you sound like one who knows his way around here.”

His way? Are you sure about the gender Farzana? Isn’t this our old friend vowing to never come back and still putting RSS propaganda on Ilogs while working as full time RSS spokesperson!

All this sympathy for Kashmiri pundits from peolple that are happy to kill all kashmiris because all they want is Land!

Behind every Kashmiri pundit story, there are thousands of other stories that have never been told. If people wanna talk about Pundits, lets talk about them but on the right thread!

[``Welcome to Chowk, SuhailQazi (nice little Muslim nic you got here)``]

Thank you , thank you ....

[``Your post (which has nothing to do with this article) and the way it has been formatted clearly tells me what is going on here...and who you might be``]

I`m just a fan. Feels good to be recognised though. Appreciate that.


[``it is indeed interesting to note that the Kashmiri Pandit machinery is quite active.``]

Not quite as active as the Paki-sympathiser machinery actually...just about chugs along time to time...


[``this forum is not for any further discussion on this subject. Most of you are not adding any additional insight except for the old name-calling.``]

I beg to disagree . Just exposing the hyprocrisy of the writer. As I said , it is interesting how certain self-appointed conscience keepers of Indian secularism can be so stone hearted and insensitive when the roles are reversed , i.e. , victimised minority is hindu while the oppressive majority is muslim.

#77

I have a a Kashmiri Hindu friend (originally from Srinagar). Recently his sister was visiting (she must be in her early 20`s), you should hear her talk about muslims!!! the wounds are deep.

IF 69 is true - Hypocrite! one phrase used for such persons is ``Plate pissers``.

We have dear Kashmiri friends (Dhars) who are large hearted, hospitable, successful professional and honest. They had many muslim friends.

It turns out the `friends` and neighbors chased em out and occupied their houses and properties. They live as refugees in Delhi and Bengal. Now, they don`t interact or allow muslims in their homes.

Now Kashmiri muslims doing paper mache and rug business in Delhi are venomous thieves. Thats a story for another day.

Welcome to Chowk, SuhailQazi (nice little Muslim nic you got here):

For someone who has signed in a few days ago, you sound like one who knows his way around here.

Your post (which has nothing to do with this article) and the way it has been formatted clearly tells me what is going on here...and who you might be. Since my views are quite known to people here, it is indeed interesting to note that the Kashmiri Pandit machinery is quite active. Just this morning I received a long letter that was diverted to me in response to mine...anyone who wishes to check the letters can go to the www.asianage.com site, now for the response; my letter might be in the right-hand panel. Or heck, I will just post both for you...as they appeared...instead of the editing and interpolations in the post.


The Asian Age - News Worldwide- June 20

Ominous signs

Sir, While one can understand the dilemma of the minorities in the Kashmir Valley, the ground realities need to be examined closely. Aditya Rangroo (Homeless Pandits, June 18) ought to realise that the Pandits’ plight is not only the doing of the militants. Besides, the Kashmiri Pandits cannot be called refugees because they chose to leave. And in that they had governmental support. As recently reported, Mr Jagmohan, as governor of Jammu and Kashmir, helped the Pandits to leave the Valley. He even gave them air tickets and provided them with transport, and organised financial help. A few additional facts may be of interest: traditionally, the governor of Jammu and Kashmir has always been a Hindu, as also the head of the police force, whose selection is passed by the Union home ministry. From 1947 to 1989, the Pandits had pretty much say in government matters. They are mainly professionals, not artisans or small businessmen. They have a great deal of support from abroad. Everyone knows that the Pandits are not the only ones targeted. Their religious places are not the only ones threatened. It was after all a Muslim who blew up Charar-e-Sharif. And are not the killings continuing in the Valley even after the Pandits left? Interestingly, after the Nadimarg massacre of 24 Pandits, Rs 1 lakh compensation was immediately announced. How many Kashmiris from the majority population who are killed on a daily basis have been financially compensated? There are not many Pandits ``on the roadside,`` unlike what Mr Rangroo says. I wonder why he is complaining about the public ``busy talking about Yasin Malik.`` These people are the conduit between the locals and the governments of India and Pakistan; unfortunately, no Kashmiri Pandit organisation is in the Valley to represent their cause. This calls for self-examination rather than passing the buck.

Farzana Versey, Bandra, Mumbai
- - -
The response:
June 22

Not refugees?


Sir, While one can understand the reasons for publishing Farzana Versey’s letter Ominous signs (June 20), the root causes of the sizeable ``migration`` of Kashmiri Pandits need to be investigated carefully. Since they themselves chose to leave after a hundred or two of them were killed by militants initially, what term should be used to describe them, if not refugees? Will Ms Versey be happy with ``migrants?`` A detailed investigation should be carried out to tell the general public as to how many air tickets in bulk were purchased by Mr Jagmohan. This figure should be easy to obtain as Indian Airlines was the only airline operating at that time and the number of Kashmiri Pandit migrants was registered at Delhi and Jammu. The figure was close to a lakh and it would be interesting to know how many flew by air. Financial help and organisational support to Pandits provided to help them leave must have cost the government a lot and hence the figures need to be made public. And since the support from abroad to Hurriyat leaders and militants has already been proved, the support to Kashmiri Pandits from abroad, of which Ms Versey talks about, also needs to be proved. It is of course a source of great consolation to read that other places of worship are also being targeted and that the militancy is largely secular in character. After the PDP came to power, compensations to victims and militant widows were being given by its government. However, if this is not being done, the Nadimarg victims’ relatives should be asked to return the compensation they got. And since not many Pandits are on the roadside, efforts should be made to bring them out so that people can talk about them as much as they talk about Yasin Malik. Malik is after all a conduit between the locals and the governments of India and Pakistan. Unfortunately, there seem to be more conduits than locals left after the militancy pioneered by the likes of Yasin Malik. And no Kashmiri Pandit organisation is in the valley to represent the Kashmiri Pandits because there are not many Kashmiri Pandits left in the valley.

Ritesh B.L. Shah, Versova, Mumbai
- - -
Having done so, those who wish to discuss the subject, kindly go to Unplugged or my old article `They shoot Kashmiri Pandits, don`t they?` and post your stuff there....this forum is not for any further discussion on this subject. Most of you are not adding any additional insight except for the old name-calling. I have been through it several times, so it serves no purpose.

Re: # 73 suhail
//...self-appointed conscience keepers of Indian secularism can be so stone hearted and insensitive when the roles are reversed , i.e. , victimised minority is hindu while the oppressive majority is muslim...//

Yeah - we kind of know that already.

Farzana`s pro-jihadi leanings are well known...before 9/11, she was the chowk apologist for the taliban..she implied that the destruction of the buddhas was ok because there were no buddhists in Afghanistan....

Cayenne , PMishra ..... Farzana-ji has always been very consistent (check out the archives of her chowk column) on her views about Kashmir Pandits being cowardly , cunning , manipulative , mischievous evil brahmanical horrible hindooos out to bring a bad name to the secular benign nature of the Kashmiri freedom movement by crying wolf and running out of the valley in droves.

It is interesting how certain self-appointed conscience keepers of Indian secularism can be so stone hearted and insensitive when the roles are reversed , i.e. , victimised minority is hindu while the oppressive majority is muslim.

Re: # 71 mishra

Well - we all know FV has a bolt or two loose in the brain department. For that - she has been getting fired all her life. She has to go somewhere - so chowk has been her pasture, her last refuge. The lady has finally found ``home``.

Chowkies have learnt to live with the crazy lady. It`s part of the ambience here, you know - we have all kinds - mullahs, closet-mullahs, cuckoos[=romair], funny guys, freaks, fools and a crazy lady :)

Just like a real life ``chowk``.

#69 SuhailQazi

Astonishing and appalling. as someone who has family who had to leave the kashmir valley due to religous persecution and threats, this is a real revelation.

One of the challenges for rational people is how to deal with irrational hatred and denial of suffering as in this ``letter``. I have to say this pushes the limits of decency. An equivalent would be arguing that muslims in gujrat murdered themselves or each other. Besharmi ki bhi hud honi chayiha!!

Re: # 69

Thank you for exposing this incidious , hateful, treacherous and vile woman.Has to be female and indian.I betcha.

Enough about Jinnah -Advani , it would be more interesting to know what Ms.Versey makes of the Kashmir imbloglio , and in particular , the plight of the Kashmiri Pandits.


I just read a letter to the editor of Asian Age by Farzana Versey dated 20-6-05 on the subject of Kashmiri Pandits. (I dont have the url for the letter , so just quoting from the hard copy. Please bear with me .)

Ms.Versey argues that

1. ``The Pandit`s plight is not only the doing of the militants. Besides the Kashmiri Pandits cannot be called refugees because they chose to leave``

2. And then she insinuates something about hindoo cunningness by pointing out that the governors of Kashmir have always been hindus and that , [``A detailed investigation should be carried out to tell the general public as to how many air tickets in bulk were purchased by Mr Jagmohan.``] , and about Kashmiri Pandits deliberately and cunningly leaving the valley so that they can bring a bad name and a communal taint to the otherwise Kashmiri freedom movement. >> [``Financial help and organisational support to Pandits provided to help them leave must have cost the government a lot and hence the figures need to be made public.``]

3. She points out that the hindus shouldn`t protest too much about their temples being destroyed because the militants destroyed the Charar-e-Sharief as well.

4. She further points out how the Pandits getting killed in Kashmir by the militants get compensation amounting to 1 lakh rupees while no such measures are provided for the muslims getting killed. (Surely another sign of hindu fascism overtaking India.)

---

A reader responds in today`s edition :

Not refugees?

Sir, While one can understand the reasons for publishing Farzana Versey’s letter Ominous signs (June 20), the root causes of the sizeable ``migration`` of Kashmiri Pandits need to be investigated carefully. Since they themselves chose to leave after a hundred or two of them were killed by militants initially, what term should be used to describe them, if not refugees?

Will Ms Versey be happy with ``migrants?``

FV : [``A detailed investigation should be carried out to tell the general public as to how many air tickets in bulk were purchased by Mr Jagmohan.``]

This figure should be easy to obtain as Indian Airlines was the only airline operating at that time and the number of Kashmiri Pandit migrants was registered at Delhi and Jammu. The figure was close to a lakh and it would be interesting to know how many flew by air.

FV : [``Financial help and organisational support to Pandits provided to help them leave must have cost the government a lot and hence the figures need to be made public.``]

And since the support from abroad to Hurriyat leaders and militants has already been proved, the support to Kashmiri Pandits from abroad, of which Ms Versey talks about, also needs to be proved.

It is of course a source of great consolation to read that other places of worship are also being targeted and that the militancy is largely secular in character. After the PDP came to power, compensations to victims and militant widows were being given by its government. However, if this is not being done, the Nadimarg victims’ relatives should be asked to return the compensation they got. And since not many Pandits are on the roadside, efforts should be made to bring them out so that people can talk about them as much as they talk about Yasin Malik.

FV : [``Malik is after all a conduit between the locals and the governments of India and Pakistan.``]

Unfortunately, there seem to be more conduits than locals left after the militancy pioneered by the likes of Yasin Malik.

FV : [``Unfortunately no Kashmiri Pandit organisation is in the valley to represent the Kashmiri Pandits This calls for self-examination rather than passing the buck.`` ]

There are no Kashmiri Pandit organisations in the valley because there are hardly any Kashmiri Pandits left alive.

Ritesh B.L. Shah, Versova, Mumbai

Actually, this Advani-Jinnah-Laloo Prasad Yadav thing is very important.

It has caused crude oil to cross 61 dollars and NBA to go on strike.

Re: # 66

And you must be the grand vazir of bullshit, of this site.The whole indian press ain`t talking about this crap.Only a few english language dailies and weeklies at the most.And, believe you me, most of the public will skip any article that continues to deal with Jinnah and Gandhi.BORING.AAH, i know now that you must be fantasizing about my behind.You have certified your nationality to all.

#64 by cayenne

Since you are the village idiot of this site, I will just say that you read this article again and figure out what this article is about and what the whole Indian press is talking and it is not about mirchi in your slimy behind!