Close Encounter

I’m not into reading iLogs, but I did read Farzana’s and Omar’s...but rather than addressing them in a one-way conversation in an iLog (besides, my entries in iLog are of different nature,) I rather post my thoughts right here...

Farzana

“Godot, how can I after 334 posts on the same thing “open a can of worms”?…I do not know what transpired, but it was because the worms were wriggling their way towards me when I was not even close to the can…”

I did not say “open,” I said “stir.” There’s a difference. However, when one is allowed to speak one’s mind by writing articles, as you are at Chowk, and the readers are free to express their opinion without first going through the editing process, there will be worms wriggling your way along with honest civilized dissenters. While handling civilized disagreement is a non-issue, handling worms is not that easy. You cannot kill the worms, but cannot let them creep up on you, either. So I understand.

Farzana, you are no doubt a warrior but a very special and a civilized one. Not responding to belittling and provocations (some seem to specialize in it...I can name at least 5 of them whom I’ve personally experienced at Chowk’s FP,) is a sign of great courage. You are a model of civility, courage and dignity. Keep it up and be yourself. Some people love you for what you are.


Omar

“closing down the discussion board on an article ... why ? is it because t-bhai wrote it and the criticism was too much for him to handle, and in stepped his protectors -- i think the chowk editors will be quite hard pressed to explain their closure of the board on t-bhai`s article --”

I agree with you. Why did Chowk publicly announced that it is “closing” this board and moved it off the Front Page. This smacks of their claim of objectivity and fairness. Obviously at Chowk some are more privileged and are protected, their mediocrity notwithstanding. It is sure a fine way to earn respect! If you or I wrote this article and were taken to task for it, we will still be taking a beating mercilessly on FP.

The fact that it got moved so quickly says a lot about the author. Hide your mediocrity before too many people find out about you. I will not be surprised if this article, along with all its posts, gets completely deleted from Chowk as if it never existed.

Re: # 335

FV

One of the few who openly admits to be a bigot. Call me Balasaheb`s stoog!!!

I profusely appologise for all personal comments I made against you. There was/is no excuse. No way to express it other wise. Also meant for Tahmed123

I never liked, people who say some else (including your ``own`` govt) should do this but never ``OWN`` the problem of theirs. I believe if there is a problem I face, it is mine. I always thought you are one of those who blame others, but do nothing to sort your ``own`` issues.

But personal insults are not what should be the right (write??) way to go. I agree, therefore am contrite.

As as a parting shot(!!!) I will ask a question again.

Few hundred years ago a woman was ``Owning`` a business. She was a widow, and god had not perfected what he wanted asses like me should do. So she ``could`` hire a ``Man``. She did.

Happy with the situation, she married him. Was a good couple, if we believe in history.

Until. (hate you Hamidm 2000/3000/40000!)

Then.. (You rot in hell Hamid because you invented dots!! )

No woman can drive a camel anymore in the same place.

What happenned?

God?

Phrophet??

Cave???

Islam????

Muslims?????

I leave it to you to ponder. NO answer required. Such a foolish question does not need one.

Chowk staff

Please Cancel my nick. I have NONE other than this one. If I can do it on my own (cancellation), help me in knowing how to do it. I DO thank thee for wonderful site and perhaps the most imaginitive and foresighted way you led way above others. Particularly in cyberspace.

I am, perhaps too idiot to have stupid questions in my mind. Look at the one I asked in this interact!!! So Bye

Yogiraj Patil

Re: # 375

Hamid

If you’re wondering about the quote, it’s from the Tao.

Re: # 374

Hamid

``Like kind attract each other``

Re: # 364

godot,

...... you are a good man and from now on, as far as i am concerned, you can do no wrong........... you have at least one of the vices i admire, even though i do prefer gin - with a twist, no olives for me ...........

...... and this thread has been very educational... as yogi berra said : ``you can observe a lot by just watching ``

samina:

why is it that you must ask if pointing something out is a problem for me? just because i do not say something, or someone else doesn`t, does not mean that we are not aware of it. truth be told, i have not had a chance to read your ilogs as of yet. my reference to katrina was my own personal observation. i have not even had much of a chance to watch television, or read mainstream media because i have had several serious personal situations that have required my attention since my move, and coming here for the few moments that i have has been a respite.

i`m not sure that i really appreciate what your tone suggests when you ask me if pointing out something is a ``problem`` for me. this is not the first time this has happened. you and i approach issues differently. if i can accept that about you, but you cannot about me, i just go on. . . .

- -
godot,

i really do hope that there are more enjoyable things to take a day off for than to watch a purported emperor being paraded . . . . oh well, enjoy the martinis. have one for me if it`s not too much to ask.

my morning break has come to an end, off i go. . . . ciao!

This board is being closed. Enough has been said. Please refrain from discussing / speculating on other people`s nicks on chowk: instead send an email to help @ chowk.

We also request your cooperation in not bringing Unplugged digressions and discussions over here.

We regretfully suspend postings of both Salim_chauhan and Saminasha for two days as per new policies.

Re: # 358

....aik shayr suno...

apne hathon mein uTahay huay bhari patthar
maarnay aaye haiN Eissa ko havaari patthar

Re: # 366

ana

Vodka. I took the day off just to watch the emperor getting paraded in public with his talent hanging in balance!

godot,

is it a gin martini or a vodka martini? and is this one of those long martini lunches?! i mean how fortunate are you to be drinking a martini at a little after noon east coast time.

it is too early to treat myself to a vodka martini. *sigh*

to illustrate the point that hamid beat me to. . . an affect as a noun is something you develop or put on, like putting on a superficial emotional affect. it is used in a verb as in how karina is affecting the people of louisiana in devastating ways and some of our problems don`t amount to a hill of beans really next to that.

effect is used as a noun and a verb as well.

This is getting too good! I’m on my third martini (shaken not stirred) already watching the show!

Salim is very bright, but he may need some coaching. No, Salim, don’t look at me. I’ve said my peace (unless addressed and attacked.)

Re: # 360

salim,

......... ``affect`` is a noun, so the phrase ``superficial emotional affect`` could be right if affect is used as a noun and ``superficial emotional`` as an adj .........

...... i hope this revelation does not harm your case against samina ......

lo ji!

when the writer titled this piece ``close encounter``, i`m sure these interactions are not what he had in mind. (we won`t get into what was or rather was not in his mind) and chowk-staff`s appearance more than once -- ek dum jhikaas! i guess it`s better late than never that he or she would appear, and that too on a volunteer`s board.

chalo, perhaps some differences are being ironed out. and then again some are sticking with their differences, and leaving the deep wrinkles, the crumpled fabric as is. life goes on. in a real-life chowk, in lahore at least, there are harassers there, which the police will not always do anything about. so the harassed one might get a few of her/his thagRay brothers, cousins, friends together and beat the focker up. and then that focker will return, even more ``Dheet``, belligerent, and offensive than ever. no, wait, perhaps that doesn`t happen in a real-life chowk afterall. . . . it does happen somewhere though, not over the rainbow.

and yes chowk-staff you may delete my post for using the word focker. and i have three nicks other than this one. . . . i haven`t used them for a long while since you enabled ``ana`` again, which is what i began my bizarre journey with here. so perhaps you will rid this chowk of those as well. :) it is only fair to delete all multiple nics, not just those of a harassing nature. aur haaN, that is taking on much too work upon yourself since there are those here (even the one nic walley) who simply choose to ignore ``decency`` and ``responsibility``. kya kiya jai?

now where are the good reads to be found here. . . ? and did someone mention the word toffee? *slurp*

Re: # 346

temp,


...... it seems you forgot to, ``never hold discussions with the monkey when the organ grinder is in the room`` .......... even though, in this case it is hard to separate the monkeys from the organ grinders (sometimes i too feel like having a banana) .....

............and he also said, ``he has all the virtues i dislike and none of the vices i admire`` - that might explain my aversion to urstruly

Chowk Staff regarding Farzana;

Who is going to apologize to us Chowkies? She has insulted our intelligence by writing lies time and again without conscience. Please step in to moderate her lies too. Thank you.

i also had a dream

hamidm bro:

am singling you out…you were one of the few who tried in vain to steer this in the right direction…also feel should lend you a shoulder...for it is not often we get stood up… more so when the respondent is not a … nah…let me not hit you there;)

may i share a dream which in my way i can also use to hint at a closure to this brouhaha?

you and begum hamidm were at this event of the year thrown by the grande dame scion of a world known family…a plain looking woman in her early sixties…(zoare plain per hay dost m`ray – ah! all this political correctness)

during the course of the evening she made a couple of passes at you…and you desisted…at the third blatant pass you were irked sufficiently to decline saying, ``M`am tomorrow morning I will be sober but you will still be …`` at this point in my dream i saw mrs. hamidm step in gingerly and steered you away…

(disclaimer: some of you may recognise that this dream was based on a literary anecdote)

rgds

t

Farzana –

You had to come here and stir the worms in the can!

My dear friend, you cannot take cheap shots at people, belittle them, or are Ms. Sanctimonious. That’s an art form and, frankly, you are not the type who can master it. Most importantly, to your detriment, you are not cut out to respond to a rock hurled your way with a brick.

So, grab a spicy bloody mary (or virgin mary, if you wish), sit back, put your feet on the ottoman, relax, read the posts on this board (the article is not worth wasting time), and enjoy. You maybe looking for trouble by participating, as if your hands aren’t full already!!!

salim #261:

Your ability to balance between your partisan emotions during the
frequent altercations and your objective enforcement of Chowk
guidelines as Chowk ``volunteer,`` is admirable.

…you must have misunderstood…will give you the benefit of doubt…

khair…this is what i said publicly here last year… and reiterated
yesterday … that i volunteer for chowk…i refrained from mentioning in
what area…

but suffice it to say it is not enforcement area…more where my
interests lie….and where over the years it has been my pleasure to
have helped more people than have interacted on this board so
far…barring a few exceptions….anonymously

re: women i will disagree

this is what I wrote in #331: ...respecting another person
...specially a women is different and more of challenge...in a sense
we can also bring in an individual`s self-worth …if they are … secure
or insecure…after all in the desi mind-set women occupy the lowest
rung of the totem pole…

having quoted this…i also feel obligated to state that civility and
tolerance should be incumbent upon all who visit here (thank you and
godbless- n)

rgds

t

chowk staff .....

zindabad !

...... but you could have avoided all this unpleasentness if you had taken my suggestion and barred everyone who is under 17 years of age (except romair, who should be barred for life)

........ does this mean that i cannot hound urstruly, romair and ntsyed (echoboom seems to be on an extended vacation in the caribbean or somalia or afghanistan ) ? ....... if that is the case, then i am afraid i will have to find another vocation ..............

fv,

..... i was relieved when urstruly didn`t show up - i don`t think i could have continued to abuse him once i looked the devil in the eye ............

Re: # 339 she is the bg cheez or is naa-cheez around these parts!

oh how sweet -- chowk staff is apologizing to farzana versey -- btw chowk-staff, what brought about this change of heart and this realization of so many things done wrong in the past ???

farzana, i wonder whether your visiting card actually says `chowk columnist` ? you dont really have to answer that by the way

Why Temporal is posting with multiple nick? He is writing as Chowk staff now. What a joke.

# 336 continued ...

This is to clarify that ``soulat`` was indeed a pseudonym (user id/nick) used by an existing member of Chowk and has therefore been removed. But none of the ids in question have anything to do with Farzana Versey.

Re #314 by tddysam on August 31, 2005 12:45pm PT
[On the subject of multi-nicks, methinks Soulat is none other than Farzana Versey]

tddysam,

If you want to volunteer information please do so about yourself. There is no need to imply false and baseless speculation about others.

Farzana Versey is columnist and regular participant on Chowk and as she states below she has never used covers of pseudonyms to write here.
--

To Farzana,

Please accept my public apologies for this and several other personal attacks you have suffered on Chowk. There were occasions where chowk-staff could have and probably should have (debatable) stepped in to moderate.

Sincerely

(Sorry about this digression -- indeed!)

Chowk Staff:

I thought I would desist, but I am afraid silence will be misconstrued in a context that has to do with my identity on Chowk.

Since you decided to jump into the fray and monitor this board, and are even accepting offers for Baskin Robbins, you ought to display some respect for writers who choose to maintain their distance from this sort of slugfest. By giving me a column and publishing me on a regular basis, you are certainly not to be held responsible for my opinions (which in all probability are not in consonance with yours), but you DO have to stand up for unprovoked slurs, especially since you know the truth.

I am referring to the post #314 by tddysam on August 31, 2005 12:45pm PT

[Re: # 313
On the subject of multi-nicks, methinks Soulat is none other than Farzana Versey.]

You know this is not true, and you let a person whose credentials are suspect get away with it.

tddysam
Registered Dec 6 2004

And yet her/his first post appears on April 7, 2005. Do you realise this could be someone with a multiple nick?

If the person Soulat seems to have made me into an example, then 1)it is not my problem; 2)why does it bother people so when they are openly getting cute on their Bhais/bhabhis/behens here?

For you this may appear to be a minor problem, but I do not take kindly to this at all as it would have been very convenient (and even prudent) for me to get a nice nick for myself to defend myself, which I know I have to do pretty much on my own and do so the way I know best -- without resorting to the abuses similar to the ones hurled at me.

However, in the recent past, there have been people who have made a huge noise about my `fans`, `admirers` who, invariably, according to them are of `dubious character`. I deal with people on the basis of what they say about my writing, and not whether they are going to stand by me in my moment of crisis.

And I anyway do not understand how and why you permit this consistent use of a person`s name on boards when she does not even make an appearance. It may give people a kick to become a metaphor, but I`d much rather be what I am. You seem to have this great maternal/paternal concern for all that goes on in UP, but the stalking on FP is far worse because some of us want to engage in a dialogue on a subject that may have to do with an important issue. Surely you are aware it takes more effort to write about these than post on boards that talk about catfights?

I am also surprised that you permitted this board to take the shape it did -- the digressions are not in the same league as Jinnah revived or Kashmir revisited. This constant battle among certain individuals has always been simmering, but of late it has been exported to these boards. Whenever there has been even a feeble attempt on any of my boards, I have stalled it. It is the job of the writer to do so, even at the risk of losing a few enemies which everyone around seems to love so dearly. This pathetic thing happened on the Zafar Anjum board; those of us who did have things to say had to refrain. I certainly do not wish to be made a part of such empty wars or partake of their spoils.

And while we are on the subject of multiple nicks, the ones that create a `havoc` are easily recognisable. I wish to draw your attention (oh, but you already know that!) to the use of more than one nick by the nice folks. Ask your volunteers; they might know who these people are. They may not have nuisance value (debatable point), but I hope you apply the standards you are striving to apply across the board.

I try to give you feedback, more often at times when I am not the `aggrieved party` (have never asked for anyone to be banned and, to the chagrin of several folks here, never threatened to leave!) because of only one reason -- I need to respect the space I occupy. I expect some reciprocation for that. There are several other points which I shall put up in my personal space later...

If you do read this, I can only hope it did not take too much time and your ice-cream has not melted.

Regards,
Farzana
- - -

Hamidm:

I would like to remind you that it was I who had suggested quite some time ago that it was my dream for a double date with you and urstruly; he had accepted it. You maintained silence. Now it seems clear where your preferences lie:) It is a pity I cannot use the term `green with envy` lest I be deported to S.Arabia...

Re: # 298

[Here is how we plan to enforce these guidelines:

1. Multiple ids of registered interactors will be removed
2. Posts containing crude language will be filtered and removed in extreme cases
3. Interactors posting abuse, attacks, and hate etc. against other members will have their interacting privileges suspended for a short period and the specific comments will be filtered or removed ]

Chowk-Administration (I do not like to write ``Staff``)

I recommend that you allow at least 24 hours for substantive feedback from your subscribers before approving a new legislation in the rowdy and chaotic halls of Chowk Assembly. Some of us have long working hour plus commute plus workout activities therefore we are not aware of the latest and greatest happenings here. We need some time to go over the current affairs on Chowk :)

I would like to add to the (3) item on the list:
I agree with you that interactors inciting members against other members should have their interacting privileges revisited. On the other hand, those who are easily influenced by the hate-mongers need to be treated in-kind for their gullibility.

Re: # 267 & 259

Godot: Very well put!

Re#331

T,
I smell the coffee!
(i.e., you are right!)

Sincerely,
BeeJay.

BeeJay:

I agree that in a sense they are related...especially when we view them from the personal vista...whatever goes in to making the desi genes...

but whereas religion was a broader subject...respecting another person ...specially a women is different and more of challenge...in a sense we can also bring in an individual’s self-worth …if they are themselves secure or insecure…ingredients not as important in that other debate…after all in the desi mind-set women occupy the lowest rung of the totem pole… khair...have a good evening

rgds

t

#323 chowk-staff

Dear Chowk-staff,

[…and why not bj…]
With all due respect (I must NEVER be disrespectful to people who can cut me off!) I must decline your kind invitation. It is perhaps worth pointing out that generally speaking, going out for dinner with a lion is not recommended because of differing dietary preferences (while you may be eyeing the printed menu, he may be eyeing you!)

And while I am in a forgiveness-seeking mood, let me apologize to you for comparing you to Kumbh-karan on numerous occasions. No physical similarity (or similarity of lineage) to that legendary individual was implied!

As I have said only a FEW times before – “SORRY!”

Sincerely,
BeeJay

Dear T-Bhai,

I am impressed by your memory (talk about a remembering elephant!) and the fact that you can recall the “old” context. I did feel though, that the shoe fitted these feet too (I am not really sold that the underlying current of discrimination based on sex is much different from that based on religious labels), at least close enough by my standards!

I also would like to quote the following from some earlier comments on a closely-related issue.

“Who are we kidding? Anything one says or does on this site does not mean diddly-squat! Great civilizations have always risen and fallen based on their inherent strengths and weaknesses and will continue to do so. All that a site like this can accomplish is to let some people vent themselves for a moment. When they do that, like people breathing, sometimes they smell good, sometimes they stink (except to themselves). This is not going to change.

Let us not take ourselves too seriously. If we do that, we end up looking even more foolish than many interactors here. It is all temporary anyway!”

Sincerely,
BeeJay.

Sunlight #254

good post

am

wish i could say guilty as charged…most of this was a spill over from UP


tddysam #314

On the subject of multi-nicks, methinks Soulat is none other than Farzana Versey.

no he isn’t…you will be surprised to find his other nicks here… he conned me too…will refrain from replying to him unless he shows up under his original nick…or surrenders other nicks and retains this one:)

rgds

t

Re: # 326

Salim

This love-feast will not last long. It`s against human nature. People gravitate to who they are from inside.

drlokraj #244:

this has been festering since before you showed up and it is possible you did not get a handle on the whole mess...

dost-mittar #246:

let`s wait and see... this new awareness where chowk asked for shared responsibilitiy from its member plus the implementation of new policies may work to improve the atmosphere

rgds

t

Re: # 319

salim_chauhan it is. and baskin robbins sounds good. i`ll be in your town next month. perhaps hamidm and urstruly can join as well. and why not bj, dalit, arjun_m and gujjubania too. we may have a more interesting and less volatile chowk in the making.

On a serious note. I request others using mutliple identities to volunteer your duplicate nicks as well. You can send feedback message with details.

BeeJay #221:

i enjoyed it the first time around... the context was different there

#311 was good too

rgds

t

Zahra,

re: your question

How?

Re: # 319

I always knew you had a sense of humour. But this list...you do have an extremely good sense of humour. (Please note the up grade).

Chowk Staff:
Not that you need any help, but I am ready to confess to the following multiple nics. Please delete them, because I plan on using just Salim_Chauhan from now on:

Barachota
KKKandK
Salim
PakShaer
Rsaxena
Deadrajput
JagdeeshGodbole
sidhibaat
Finland
Premwalla
Khamkhwa
googenschlaugen
Mannu404
Atif2
Shizenstrucker
Rsaxema
Rsribhar
NathuramBhonsle
JohnGalt
Vicsubramanyam

These are the ones I remember. Being part Rajput, who are almost sardars, I might have misspelled some and forgotten some of the others. :)

I plan to run a test on UP soon, just to make sure that the diligent Chaprasi who deletes all my threads and erases all my messages has been properly laid off. :)

I will also cancel the contract I placed on him/her. :)


Thanks

Dear Honroable Chowk Staff:
I am using this nic from now on. Please adjust my interact rating so my posts are not filtered. I plan to ignore incming profanity and avoid outgoing profanity altogether.
Wish me luck. :)

Chowk Staff,
Could I interest you in some Baskins/Robbins ice cream?

Thanks,

Respectfully your humble servant,

Salim

``#314 by tddysam on August 31, 2005 12:45pm PT
Re: # 313

On the subject of multi-nicks, methinks Soulat is none other than Farzana Versey.``


Just loved it...tddysam is none other than temporal...hahah!

Or may be samina... or both... thinking...tddy....sam

Re: # 313, {``BTW, I being a sardar and all, have forgotten passwords to all of em except one. So let those legends (nicks) sleep in the lap of CHOWK history.``}

Kauray,
That was very funny. I loved it.

Chowk Staff,
Please allow Mr. Kaura`s other nics such as Atif2 and Khamkhwa to continue to exist.
Thanks,

#300, Chowk-Staff {``We would have preferred to send this message in email but there are way too many email addresses to know what you check.``}

Chowk-Staff,
You DO have a sense of humor. That was the funniest thing you have said in my one year at Chowk. I am still laughing. Good for you. You see, I can appreciate good humor - even at my expense.


{``Salim and gujjubania: From this point onwards use only mannu404 and ranjit respectively. Your other ids like salim_chauhan, premwalla, ranger etc will be removed.``}

Could you please let me have Salim_Chauhan instead. I prefer my own name. Mannu404 was there because you had given Salim_Chauhan a low interact rating and were filtering all the posts from tha tnic. Please restore Salim_Chauhan to a more positive rating. :)

Also, I know that you had already banned Premwalla. I am just trying to help out in this new spirit of friendship and fairness. I do know my nics. :)

While you are in such a cordial mood, can you please restore all of Mr. Barachota`s and Mr. Mannu404`s ilog entries under Slaim_Chauhan?

I appreciate the help.

Thanks,

Salim

Re: # 313

On the subject of multi-nicks, methinks Soulat is none other than Farzana Versey.

Chowk Staff;

Like the USA, CHOWK may have faults, but it is still the best place. I commend your efforts to improve it.

However, Please note that Kaurasach`s other nicks are part and parcel of CHOWK`s raunak and legend and lore. How can you remove them? It will be Blasphemy!!

BTW, I being a sardar and all, have forgotten passwords to all of em except one. So let those legends (nicks) sleep in the lap of CHOWK history.

Re: # 311

beejay,

..... that was simply wonderful ....... loved your elephant tale .... you do have a nice way with words ........

just for the record, i was willing to look urstruly in the eye and see if he truly deserved my derision - he didn`t show up so i will continue to (de) ride him

In view of all these interesting exchanges, I thought it worthwhile to resurrect an old i-log (originally posted on April 24, 2005, since deleted) and make it a PERMANENT part of these proceedings!

The Secret Adversary

A few years ago, I developed an inexplicable interest in listening to Gospel music and since then, have owned a few cassettes of the same. It is most enjoyable when it gets your full attention, so I listen during long drives alone. The other day, I got one such opportunity. The following lines were playing:

“This world is not my home, I`m just a-passing through.
My treasures are laid up - somewhere beyond the blue…”

As usual, a special calm appeared to descend and a sense of safety, comfort, and peace wrapped all around. Later, as first the song and then the drive ended, I lingered in the parking lot a little while more, thinking and rethinking those lines. Much later, I remembered some earlier Chowk interacts, and marveled at the irony.

It is quite surprising - the amount of vitriol that can pass these web pages. This is not news to discriminating readers of these spaces (there must be some, for I did not pile up hundreds of hits by myself!) I sometimes wonder if individuals who carry on with bitter exchanges were to physically confront each other, would those words remain the same? I seriously doubt it. For one thing, most of them are likely products of a certain economic class and hopefully brought up with a modicum of training on how to empathize with fellow humans. They would at least pause and reflect just a moment longer before letting go of those words – words which can not be recalled (unlike these ilogs, which can always be deleted at the pleasure of the contributor!)

Words are special gifts to humans and no other specie has quite that ability. Sure, they facilitate basic communication, they describe the physical around us, but they also open a window to their creator’s soul and penetrate into ours - reaching depths and recesses of which we may not be aware ourselves. Merely a few weak vibrations in the air media or a bunch of tiny pixels on a fluorescent screen, they carry the wisdom of ages, the wrath of gods, the fear of the unthinkable, the marvel of creation, and the magic to give light, life, and hope!

And also, the power of death!

The anonymity conferred through the internet (in reality a myth) and the physical separation from the objects of derision can provide a false sense of invincibility like no other! How much easier it is to run somebody down, to shoot one into smithereens, to run a spear or dagger to cut one to pieces, just as long as you don’t have to look one into the eye while you accomplish that heroic feat! Yes, hack them all, a whole class of humans, the men, the women, the children, one and all till not a single sample of the offending group is left to invite your ire! Day in and day out, this macabre ritual of deadly dancing occurs right here in our faces and the crowd of jackals gathers all around and applauds. The duelists have studied and mastered every little move of the opponent and are so intimately familiar with them that they will never be taken by shock or surprise, no matter what ensues! This adversary is fully known, except in real time! One can never loose a battle to him!

Yet, there is another adversary which always defeats us! This adversary is always secret. He ensures that the fruits of victory will always elude us. He contaminates the wells that we drink our success from. He sours the pitch, making sure that no matter how accurately we hit our targets, we still lose the game because the ball we throw is a dud! He always wins because he, and only he, understands the falsity of our moves!

We rarely see our secret adversary for he is truly invisible, except in the mirror!

That Gospel singer went on to his real home many years ago, but the clarity of his message has not lost any resonance!

Re: # 299

Dear Samina:

Aren`t you kind of contradicting yourself ?

I don` think the Chowk scheme, being suggested below, will work. Though I wish you the best of luck.

Here is my suggestion:

1. Charge anyone who wants a nic, $20 (or some amount) to set one up. Consider it a one time fee, covering the lifetime of the nic. Considering the fact that I have had mine for five years, it is $4/year. Anyone can afford it........

This will give you some revenue for your hard work. Chowk Staff can use that money for a weekly trip to Baskins & Robbins, to relax. Or if you want to be good samaritins, you can donate it to charity. I can point you to the one I work with, if you want......

2. After a person has a new nic, make it a rule that every nic will have to wait one week to start posting.

If someone is going to be on this site for years, one week wait isn`t much. However, if someone is coming here to abuse others, then a one week wait will be hell for them (not to mention the extra $20).......

3. Make a rule that you can kick out any nic you want, anytime you want, and they lose their $20. They can come back, pay another $20 and wait a week.

If you are going to swing the, ``danda,`` then you may want to swing it with some passion and gusto. The mild half-swings you have been trying so far, obviously, haven`t worked. So just ban the person, when you want to. After all, it`s your site......If you don`t want to swing the danda, then don`t try swinging it half-way. It will create partiality.......

4. Do not set up a police of any sorts, and don`t be partial. As someone who has seen quite a bit of abuse, I can say with certainity and impartiality, all the holier-than-thous here, have spent time swimming in the gutter and disrobing in the hammamm.....I have interacted with them, for far too long, to know this........

5. If even after all of this, someone is still willing to wait a week, repeatedly, and pay $20 repeatedly and abuse repeatedly. Well then let them do it. You will be making money........

But, under no circumstance should you censor anything anyone writes.........nor play favorites........

#306
``The offended interact should be removed``

Should read... ``the offending interact or post should be removed``

Thanks.

Chowk Staff:

Let me get this straight:

So if I quote somewhere ``A`oozubilla he mina-Shaiytan-Nirajeem`` (tr: main panah mangta hoon Allah ki Shaytan mardood say), will it be considered abusing hamidm?

Chowk Staff-

I would like to recommend the following:

There is no use of filter. The offended interact should be removed and that’s it. Why even give someone with bad attitude any space at all?

A new user must wait 24 hours before posting. This is common on many discussion boards.

Chowk staff needs to apply the guidelines and NOT just talk about the crude language. It is subjective and would again bring in lax moderating.

There should be a three member committee of respectable interactors to monitor the chowk staff performance or there will be problems again as chowk staff record is NOT impeccable.

chowk needs ombudsman

Re: # 302

Now please stick to this user id - ``ranger``.

Chowk Staff,

Post 302 is worth considering for several reasons:

1. The implied statement that a. your staff is not as ``intelligent`` as the multi nic harrassers in question
2. That these multi nics will continue to disregard your instructions-for their own notions of ``justice`` and kicks
3. They have no intention of cooperating with any of the guidelines by which Chowk operates.

Hope its worth it to you. Good luck.

this thread is somewhere between lol-funny and you-gotta-be-kidding-moron-disgusting. or rather most of the interactors fall between these two.

got to hand it to you, t - when you kick off psychotic episodes in others you do it impartially, across the board....
:)
am.

Dear Chowk-Staff ,

Gosh you are stupid aren`t you ? If I owned an interactive website of my own , I would most definitely learn the methods of identifying and blocking IP addresses - a concept which seems to have escaped you. For had you known that , you would know that `Gujjubania` aka `Killer` aka `Ranger` , was never `Ranjit`.

As I said , you are a fool.

Re: # 298
Chowk-staff you got to be kidding right. Seriously, this whole is is a result of people not using their faculties - you have ignore lists ets. People have never ever used these. In fact I know of one person who started this whole thing and has never used it.
Then filters.

You are asking some people to be grown up. But really I question whether they can be grown up or are grown up. Indeed, they need their daily fill of abusing and being abused.

There is very little that you can do - you will have peace for a few hours before normal service resumes. I said this when you introduced ignore features and the filters.

Let us see how long this will last. I am sure the Grand dame of Chowk will start the ball rolling with her first abuse soon - even before you can say hello. I am looking forward to being disabused of this notion though, and it will be a welcome thing.

Salim and gujjubania: From this point onwards use only mannu404 and ranjit respectively. Your other ids like salim_chauhan, premwalla, ranger etc will be removed. We would have preferred to send this message in email but there are way too many email addresses to know what you check.

On a general note chowk has provided features like filters and personal ignore lists to solve squabbles amongst interactors. We recommend you use these features to avoid confrontations which lead to direct attacks.

Also anyone who uses interaction space of an article for settling quarrels will be suspended to avoid digressions.

Lastly, if you want to bring someone’s comments to our attention for action then send feedback using the feedback form only. Posting it in interact space will not necessitate immediate action and will only result in your comments being removed.

Excellent! Thank you Chowk for all your ongoing efforts!

This post is to acknowledge all the comments and remarks for improving the interact space on Chowk. We believe the combination of following two recommendations will be most effective and have clearly stated how these will be enforced. Please be informed.

1. Each interactor should use a single identity on Chowk
2. Chowk guidelines should be enforced more rigorously

Here is how we plan to enforce these guidelines:

1. Multiple ids of registered interactors will be removed
2. Posts containing crude language will be filtered and removed in extreme cases
3. Interactors posting abuse, attacks, and hate etc. against other members will have their interacting privileges suspended for a short period and the specific comments will be filtered or removed

We invite and welcome you to share this responsibility and enable us to apply these guidelines by informing us (using the feedback form) of specific instances with references of user ids, article names, and interact numbers.

The feedback link to send can be found in the footer of each page as well as on top of the interact box.

Now, let us move forward from here.

Re: # 294
Gujju,
As we all know, your noble act in taking accountability for the pictures was the point of reversal. Thanks to Godot, Romair, and especially Mr. Soulat who persisted with the specific questions. We need to give credit to Temporal Bhai for his guarded candor in admitting the ``volunteer`` aspect of his dual nature on Chowk.
Thanks for your consistent support. Let`s hope for a better environment where you can dazzle us with all those stats. :)
Salim

Re: # 293
Dotty,
It is purely congratulatory in nature conditioned by a plea for balance despite the admiration. :)
I think he is an OK guy - just became too partisan. Obviously there is significant amity among some Chowkies, especially this bunch. Friendship is great, but I think that it should never be at the expense of others. :)
Thanks,

Things will never be the same for Mr.Tempral again...he will never be even half the man he was .....(not that he was much of a man before...)....

Salim ,

this is impressive. Temporal tried to discredit you , humiliate you , mock you , but ended up getting himself castrated in full public view (metaphorically of course) .....

Re: # 292 salim do I detect a note of admiration or is it a note of self-congratulation when you say

`` I hope the almost triple century in feedback doesn`t go to his head. ``

Re: # 291 {``It could be turned into an Indian movie titled, ``Shiasta, magar Aahista.`` However, as they say, the sequel is never as good as the original. So I am not sure, how good it will be........ ``}

Romair, my friend
That was a kiss of death if anything. :) So much for Temporal Bhai`s aspirations at replacing Dickens. Perhaps we can suggest ways of spicing up his disastrous debut.
Sticking with his passion for credibility and knowledge of geography, I suggest the following makeover for Shaista:

How about casting her as a Calcutta-born Chinawomen of Jewish religious orientation? After migrating to Pakistan, she graduates from Islamia University located on Zaibun Nisa Street (formerly called Drigh Road) in Lalukhet. She learns French while serving in the Foreign Legion in the French colony of Tandoo Adam. While serving as the chauffeur cum fung shuei consultant for the Tahmed family, she picks up fluency in Poorbhi. She applies for an asylum visa to the US based on her persecuted religious category. Arriving in the States, she meets our hero Jamil in a PSA gathering in Edison, NC and the two fall madly in love. Following her conversion and marriage, Shaista dons the Hijab only to have the events of 9/11 turn her happy life upside down.

Temporal Bhai can take it from there. I hope he is dutifully attending his writing classes in Houston, Ontario. We expect a much better product this time. :) I hope the almost triple century in feedback doesn`t go to his head.

Salim

mannu404: ``Romair dost,......Does that mean that you don`t support the idea of finding out what happened to Jamil?.....How do you feel about Shaista`s fate? Should Jack be explained in more detail?``

First of all, Jamil deserves everything that is happening to him. The guy doesn`t even know, in which city he went to college. Obviously, the feds are going to go after him. I am as opposed as anyone, to the ridiculous self-righteous double-standards the USA has on terrorism. But, if the Mexican US immigration officer, in his broken Spanish-English accent, ever asks me the city where my university was located, and I cannot reply, then he has every right to lock me up, strip me naked and beat the crap out of me till i yell, ``Hamidm is my Uncle.``

Secondly, what kind of desi student studies atmospheric engineering. That is almost as useless, for a desi, as studying English literature. If for no other reason, Jamil deserves to be in jail, for his choice of major alone.........

Jack, being an gora American, will get a trial, despite his long beard, much like the gora American Taliban who was caught in Afghanistan got a trial. Jamil, not being a gora, will be sent to Guantanomo, without a trial; which is where he belongs.....

I think part II should concentrate solely on Shaista......She seems to have potential......It could be turned into an Indian movie titled, ``Shiasta, magar Aahista.`` However, as they say, the sequel is never as good as the original. So I am not sure, how good it will be........

Re: # 289 {``salim did the right thing there by taking the high road. ``}

Thank you miriam behen,

Encouragement like yours will remind me that taking the high road is more rewarding :)

It`s not easy, but I am learning. Being an American, I was taught to always give back tenfold. It`s not necessarily a good policy.

Thanks,

Salim

hamidm:
#284

there’s a difference between using an “f” word or the “d” word to string a sentence together and interacts like #263 which lead to escalations of the bottomless pit kind.

as much as we`d like everyone to develop a thick skin, there are sensibilities to consider.

salim did the right thing there by taking the high road.

m

Re: # 287

Hamid Sahib,
George Carlin is hilarious, especially on TV. But Izzard is my favorite. I love his version of history. :)
Salim

Re: # 286

salim,

here is what george carlin (ra) has to say about words :

dirty words

Re: # 284
Hamid Sahib,
Just as you are a proponent of the ``f`` word, there are some who cannot utter a five words without using the ``a`` word. Then the ``b`` word is a favorite of some, while I respond with the ``c`` word. Everyone uses the ``d`` word and I can`t remember the ``e`` one. The ``s`` and ``t`` words are a real turn-off and frankly stink too much. Where will it end? Every letter of the soup has some word that is not permissible in polite environments. ``h, l, m, n, p, r, ...``and so on.

Re: # 273 {``Personally speaking, I can tolerate anything, except bad poetry and prose. One can only suffer through that for so long. ``}

Romair dost,
Does that mean that you don`t support the idea of finding out what happened to Jamil?
How do you feel about Shaista`s fate? Should Jack be explained in more detail?

I just wanted to have one kosher post in this forum. :)

Salim

in praise of the f word ................

.......... having spent many many years in industry, i am convinced that you cannot manufacture anything - from paper clip to automobile - without using the f word ........... everyone, including women who work on the line and plant managers, whose sole mission in life is to ``get`` the union chairman, use the f word to get the job done ........ it is an integral part of the process - just like material, labor and overhead .........

....... similarly, it is not possible to have a meaningful discourse on the chowk without the use of some profanity and abuse ........ given the choice between a site that starts every post with ``bismillah er rehman ur rahim``, and a site that allows the irreverent posters to chew each other out like the honorable men and women who live in the shadow of the badshahi masjid, i will take the later ............ i think chowk staff should think twice before trying to police the use of colorful language ............ the plebeians have rights too .....

Re: # 275
did you or did you not say that?

Re: # 272 {``I hope posters would agree that the site admin has failed in their job and NOW we need to monitor them for their impartial and strict compliance of Chowk’s guideline. ``}

Soulat Sahib,
Very good suggestion. I think that objectivity, fairness, and accountability will be increased once we do this diligently.
I appreciate your persistence in getting the ``truth`` out yesterday. I have been trying for over a year now and you don`t know how grateful I am to reach closure on this nagging issue.

Thanks,

Salim

Re: # 272
soulat sahab...

did you find any incriminating evidence against me...or still looking for them...?

Ghalib ka aik shayr hai...

junooN tohmat kash-e-taskiN na ho gar shadmaani ki
namak paash-e-kharaash-e-dil hai lazzat zindgaani ki

cheers!!

romair,
#273

i agree that no one should be pointing fingers here. i’ve seen quite a few people lose it in my brief stint here. we all live in glass houses.

but one of the things i hope most of us also learn as youngsters is common courtesy and respect for our fellow human beings.

one doesn’t fling insults or abuse at co-workers or random passers by. it shouldn’t be any different here. this isn’t about moral high ground. this is about fostering an environment for discussion.

i have seen important discussions being derailed by abuse, whether provoked or not. that is extremely counter productive and enervating for every one.

miriam

Re: # 276
Soulat,
You bet!
I agree with your advice and will try to follow it too.
Thanks,
Salim

Re: # 270

Hamidm2 Sahib,
I get so incensed when people use lies and alter facts to cause insult and slander for others. But all three of you - Urstruly, you, and the King Tahmed version of the Holy Book are right about ignoring those with evil intentions and falsehood as weapons.
Thanks,
Salim

Re: # 269

Khamkhwa,
It is obvious who calls whom what. I see that you are supportive of Faisal in his usual profanity and vulgar abuse. Now, unprovoked, you are insulting Mr. Godot. I remember when you, on UP, were bragging about your own impending sex-change and how you humiliated women as a result. Being an insider of Chowk does not necessarily make you right. Your kind has been throughly exposed - thanks to the efforts of Mr. Godot and Mr. Soulat.

Salim

Salim,

I think you should not respond to them at all.

Thanks.

Re: # 271

Khamkhwa,
You excel at using lies and quotes out of context to slander and offend people. Are you sure that you are not a journalist of a paler orientation?
While we are talking about you, why does your nic sound as if someone is clearing their throat? Is it becaue of the odor that permeates the air when you arrive, or just your nic?

Salim

Re: # 244
Dr Lokraj

I am a fan of Salim but you can not include Sadna in that list of women he never abused.

There are social rules that people need to understand:

1. If someone wants to be an idiot, he/she has every right to be an idiot. There is no way to control that in any open forum. At least, no technical way that I know of. So it is pointless to try to address such issues. Either Chowk can have memberships. Or Chowk can remain open, and should forget about who says what........

2. Secondly, why in the world do people get so offended by abuse. There is another rule that most of us learnt in the second grade. If someone is trying to pick on you, they will bother you even more, if you reply to them. Let them say whatever they want. Ignore it. And sooner or later, they will get tired and leave. Or they will make a fool of themselves.......

3. People should not put themselves on a moral or intellectual highground. There are far too many people here, who feel they are, ``better`` than others. Hence they critique others` conduct and behavior. I am not quite sure how they have reached the conclusion that they are more civilised. That is quite a bit of arrogance. As I said earlier, ``Iss hammam mein sabb nangay hein.``

Personally speaking, I can tolerate anything, except bad poetry and prose. One can only suffer through that for so long.

Chowk Staff is probably, already, busy, as it is. The last thing they need to start doing is chasing after people and policing their IP Addresses and nicks. It`s a no-win scenario. There are too many ways around it. They need to make a decision and make this an exclusive site, if they want, with payments of a certain amount to get a nic. And then kick out anyone whom they want.

Or they need to keep it open and live with anything that anyone wants to say.........

I would suggest the later. And some people need to develop a thick skin and follow the adage: ``St