Being Imrana

burpinder,

Garbage? More like context. If I go off quoting blindly from the bible or the Gita or whatever without understanding the context of the text, I`m likely to look the fool. Trust me, the Quran (which is chalk full of implicit references to historical events) is no different.

#126 by Urstruly

Ummm...Urstruly, last time I checked I was a Muslim...unless of course, Muslim is only synonymous with Pakistani. Or with someone who only looks outwards for problems and never inwards.

Re: # 127 Jawahara

And I always thought that you were ``Reformist Mohammaden``

I am quite surprised that no Muslim/Pakistani has interacted on this board. Another alarming trend is that Chowk contribution by the said people has declined to less than 50%. Are Muslims being intimdated into silence, even for the anonymous boards like this one?

My personal assumptions is that, as the time goes by, more and more Muslims are being convinced that either there is no need for dialogue or it is of no use. Battle lines for ``Third World War`` are being drawn shraper by the minute.

Re: # 126
//... Battle lines for ``Third World War`` are being drawn shraper by the minute...//

To a guy with a hammer, everything looks like a nail. To a guy with jihad in his mind, everything looks like a war :) Super-jihadis are contemplating even ``world war``.

kaal,

``You said it was clear to you that the uproar was not about the decree that a woman raped by her father-in-law should divorce her husband and marry her rapist.
Can you please explain how you reached that conclusion?``

Excuse me, no one suggested that she marry her rapist except the village idiots. Even the Deoband reject this view.

This is exactly what I mean. No one has their facts straight, yet feel they have enough ``evidence`` to talk about Muslim Personal Law and it`s right to exist (or not). And that`s what it`s all about, not that Imrana was raped and some people are suggesting that she leave her husband.

Rape is far more serious than the latter, and the fact that many rapes have gone by without so much a peep tells me that the uproar is feigned, and not about rape at all but something else.

85 by mohar11 on July 12, 2005 2:55pm PT
``Those who are ecstatic to have found the exotic beast called ``reasonable prejudice`` - always remember the wise words: ``Donot hate your enemy, lest you end up just like him``. SO never be prejudiced against your enemy, that would be the worst things that you can do to yourself.

You can see an example right here - jawahara`s prejudice against RSS has blinded her so much that she fails to see that her actions has ended up working for the RSS agenda. RSS-hate has blinded her judgements to the point that she would not support UCC whole-heatedly, just because RSS suggests the same....... ``

All this works really work in fairy-tale theories but the fact remains that all of us (and there is plenty of research to back this up) are prejudiced against someone or the other. In order to really make a positive difference, however, you have to own up to your prejudices, acknowledge they exist and work to not let your actions be influenced by the prejudices. Prejudice by itself does not harm people, it`s the actions one takes because of prejudice that does that. It`s only when people do not even acknowledge that they have prejudices and wander around being self delusionally perfect that problems occur, in my opinion.

They don`t analyze their actions, they don`t think that some of their thoughts and actions are being formed because of their prejudices, they do not examine themselves. And the cycle of destruction continues.

The more I am aware of my prejudices the less I will instinctively act on them without thought. Instead, I will take the time to think about my actions, the things I say and do things that are not drawn from my prejudices.

If I believe that Muslims should self analyze themselves (or any group for that matter) I think I should do no less as an individual. To do any less would be hypocritical.

Prejudices are a fact of life, a set of feelings. Not acting on them because you realize they exist takes more work than living inside one`s delusion of perfection while continuing to spout hatred or black/white realities.

Furthermore, like I have said before, this is not an `either` `or` situation for me. I did not say we should not work towards a UCC because of my feelings about the RSS/BJP or that my prejudice against the RSS/BJP was a good thing. These are the ground realities that we have to work up from because we don`t live in a perfect world. These are some of the obstacles that we have to overcome.

In fact if if I operated without acknowledging my feelings about the RSS/BJP I would consider myself blind. I have acknowledged them, I am working through them....that might make my vision somewhat defective but certainly not blind.

Re: # 124
//...work to not let your actions be influenced by the prejudices. ...//

Same difference. The point was that one`s actions should come out of clear thinking. It doesn`t matter if one overcomes prejudice or doesn`t have it to begin with.

+++
//...I did not say we should not work towards a UCC because of my feelings about the RSS/BJP...//

That`s what I understood from your earlier posts. Thanks for clarification - that`s what I was hoping to see in the first place. Because I see just too many muslims just hung up on the RSS or some other boogeyman [not that RSS is not full of extremist boogeymen].

Mr.Zafar Anjum has still not responded to my query as to whether he`s from Bangladesh??.(shudder)

Re: # 122

Google please!

Re: # 123
Zafar Anjum

I did.Well as a paysan, i find it hard that you come down heavily on the state for what is essentially a family squabble that got out of hand.God only knows how many daughters-in-law are being raped by their father-in-laws in hindu, christian, animist and other sect households that never see the light of day.The state cannot do everything.People and society have to stand up and be counted.As a person of indian origin, i have actually come to admire the state apparatus and how it copes , inspite of an illiterate, slothful, backward, religious(ritualistic) and irresponsible population.

I find it hard to believe that the intelligentia of India, instead of educating the public, find it easier to harangue the state and claim cheap popular points with the masses.It is almost as if they are in competition with the corrupt politician class.I expect better from you and your kind, having been gifted with education and resources to pursue your dreams to do good by your society and country. Yet many of you migrate to the developed world, and from your lofty ivory towers harangue a state that struggles against improbable odds to emerge as one of the leading nations of this world.Shame on you!!.

ajeya:

what the heck? what do the intolerant hindus have to do with my growing up christian in pakistan? where did i even mention intolerant hindus. and i wasn`t referring to your hatred per se. . . so get off it already.

some of the muslims i grew up around treated me with intolerance. i choose not to tar them all with one brush. baat aayi samajh maiN?

and my vision in seeing beyond religion is not wrong. but that`s my opinion. and you have yours. and in case you haven`t heard: opinions are like assholes. everybody`s got one.

``Being Imrana``

I just realised the utter irony of the title of the piece. It`s quite obvious the author has NO CLUE what is like to ``be Imrana``. Otherwise he wouldn`t have offered this tame apology of a piece. ``Indian state``, bah!

Re: #118 by burpinder

[Ajeya/Mike/ranjit,

This is NOT about ``My religion is better than your religion``, guys. ]


As I have mentioned before, I don`t care at all what religion or any other kind of nonsense ANYBODY believes in. And neither should anybody.

The problem only arises when a religion is dangerous to you. As Islam is. To everybody.

Recently the Chief Justice of the Bihar high court had to request a transfer because he spoke up against the Imam of a Mosque across the street broadcasting their prayers five times a day through the loudspeakers, in defiance of existing Court orders. At a mosque in Kolkata, across from the Statesman Newspaper`s Headquarters, same scenario. Today Hindus in Kashmir are getting kicked out from their homeland. Tomorrow, it will be another state. Then another.

And pseudo-pacifist lefty types will be holding hands, and wearing garlands made from dainty little flowers, and singing beautiful songs with other similar noble souls in open-minded peace/brotherhood/love demonstrations.

It`s things like these. Otherwise I would be doing something far more productive right now.

Ajeya/Mike/ranjit,

This is NOT about ``My religion is better than your religion``, guys. It`s about how religion has a specific place in modern life and how, unlike most other religions, Islam has allowed itself to be hijacked by its most extreme fringes into a place that is not really where a majority of its adherents want to be in.

Going ballistic over Quranic quotes is not the solution. I think all of us, whatever our religion, realise there is a lot of ``garbage`` in our respective texts that most of choose to ignore in our daily lives. Taunting the likes of Jawahara, Ana et al about that is like preaching to the converted. And you boys really need to grow up.

Re: #107 by ana

[vaisay. . . i will tell you what in part prompts me to speak out against hatred.]


Hatred? So if I say something bad about Islam then that`s hatred? And therefore wrong?


[this is a complete digression from this board, but i was persecuted as a christian child/young girl growing up in lahore.]


What kind of persecution?


[i know from things that were said to me that a large part of it had to do with my being christian. the other parts may have to do with my being disabled, and my attitude at the time.]

Ah! The intolerant Hindus. They`ve never changed through the ages. The only good ones converted voluntarily to Islam or Christianity. Under the gentle guidance of the Muslim do-gooders and the Christian Missionaries.



[i think at some point i made a conscious choice that i would never treat anyone, no matter who they were or where they came from with the same intolerance with which i was treated.]


Who is treating whom with intolerance? I`m not sure I follow.



[perhaps if i had been neither christian, nor disabled, i still would have made that choice. but that certainly did have much to do with my developing a broader vision.]


Your vision in THIS case is not broader. It`s just plain wrong.