Mullah Pat Robertson’s Fatwa

Re: # 50
Thanks GQ.
: o )
It`s always great to hear from you, and run into you are various events.
Thank you for the great work that YOU do. Please keep up the good work also.

Re: # 25
You`re scary, you remind me of the KKK.

Re: # 12
I went to your profile to see some good examples of writing. There`s nothing but blanks there

Re: # 11
Under every rock there is a critic?

Re: # 9
Anyone who reads Bulleh Shah, can not have a bad day. He`s the cure
: o )
Pure

Re: # 8
Thanks.
The usual suspects look very mashkook.
I tell `em:
Maashook bano, mashkook naheen!
: o )

Re: # 7
I guess you`re scarred by nudity.
: o )
The naked truth is best. Though it tastes bitter and looks ``ugly``. It`s good medicine

Re: # 4
Thanks. Taking ownership might be the most important thing an individual can do, and what a state can do. Taking responsibilities of your beliefs, thoughts, attitude, words and actions

Well, check this out. Being a bad ``mullah`` can cost you a lot of moolah, like $800,000
this is a masjid about 25 miles from me, the largest in southern California:

Fired Principal Awarded $788,000
A jury agrees there was sex discrimination in the woman`s dismissal from a Garden Grove Islamic elementary school. A cultural clash is blamed.

A Superior Court jury has ordered the Islamic Society of Orange County and two of its officials to pay the former principal of its elementary school nearly $800,000, agreeing that they discriminated against her when she was fired two years ago.

Zakiyyah Muhammad, an African American woman who converted to Islam, was fired after serving five years as principal of the Orange Crescent School in Garden Grove.

Although the jury did not have to specify what type of discrimination was involved, Ed Connor, Muhammad`s attorney, said Monday the main thrust of the case was gender bias because his client had challenged her male superiors. The jury said it found no evidence to support the separate accusation of racial bias.

``Our case was she did not fit stereotypical notions held by Muslim men of how Muslim women should act,`` he said.

Muhammad said her case showed the cultural schism that can exist between U.S.-born Islamic women who believe they are equal to men and Islamic immigrants from Asian and Middle Eastern countries, where many women are subservient.

Muhammad and Connor said they were challenging not Islam but cultural practices. Both said the religion ensures equality between the sexes.

``The revelation of the Koran is not antithetical to the Constitution of the United States,`` Muhammad said.

Barbara Fitzgerald, attorney for the defendants, said, ``The verdict is erroneous and will be corrected on appeal.`` She wouldn`t comment further.

The Superior Court jury of eight women and four men deliberated two days before reaching a verdict Friday afternoon. The jury ordered the Islamic Society, which runs the school; Dr. Fazal Mirza, president of its school board; and board treasurer Refat Abodia to pay Muhammad $788,000, which includes punitive damages of $130,000.

Shortly before bringing in their verdict, jurors sent the judge a note saying they wanted to let both sides ``know and understand that we do not consider Islam to be on trial…. We have been empowered to deliver a verdict but we are powerless to deliver peace and understanding. You must seek this elsewhere.``

In addition to discrimination, jurors found the defendants guilty of intentional infliction of emotional distress, fraud, negligence and conspiracy to defraud.

Muhammad, 60, who holds a master`s degree and doctorate from Columbia University in New York, had been involved in Islamic education most of her career. She came from Sacramento in 1998 to run Orange Crescent. The school was accredited the next year.

Muhammad charged in her suit that Mirza, the new school board president in 2003, had secretly planned to replace her with the vice principal, a Pakistani immigrant. The suit also said Mirza had reneged on an agreement giving her a new two-year contract with a raise to $65,000 a year and instead put her on probation.

Muhammad said Mirza verbally attacked her at a school board meeting and that she asked for an apology. When it never came, she asked for a hearing before the Majlis-e-Shura, the society`s governing board. Shortly afterward, on Sept. 16, 2003, she was fired.

``She did the `unthinkable,` `` Connor said. ``She questioned the authority of an elder, and she`s a woman and he`s a man. Those would never be legit reasons anywhere in the U.S. for firing her.``

A report on the firing, by the Council on Islamic Education, a group of Islamic scholars from around the country, said the decision to fire Muhammad was hasty, unethical, unprofessional and a violation of Islamic principles. The council had heard about the firing and decided to investigate, according to Muhammad`s previous attorney.

The council warned that the matter could widen a rift between immigrant and U.S.-born Muslims and ``invariably be seen as proof that immigrant Muslim communities look at African American Muslims as their inferiors.``

Re: # 50
Thanks a lot bro
: o )
Great to know you are here GQ. Thanks for your encouragement. And PLEASE keep up the good work you do as well. Thanks

Salams Fazeel,

Nice work there bro. I recently joined this forum and you`re the first person I`m interacting with. Keep up the good work!

peAce,
GQ

Re: # 39
Qawali,
You are right about the period of Hazrat Moinuddin Chishti and Maharaja Prithviraj Chauhan - late 12th and early 13th centuries. Yes, many Chauhans may have converted at that time.
Mine held on for much longer, till the late 17th century. Then, as I am told, they converted to show their loyalty, admiration, and love for that great Rajput Maharaja - Aurangjeb Alamgir. :) I still have Hindu Rajput relatives in Ajmer and Jaipur - we call it braderi. :)

Salim

Re: # 32
Name dropping? Perhaps you misunderstood all of them? Not possible, right?
~~~
The Lyric Poets?
The Beats?
The Black Mountain Poets?
The Nuyoricans?
The Black Arts Movement?
The Imagists?

``There`s no such thing as an enlightened mullah, that`s an oxymoron`` a friend said yesterday. I thought about it and said, yea, I can`t remember meeting a mullah who was enlightened
: o )
If you like Mullah`s, I`ll just say, Mullah get your act together, stop hiding behind a mask by writing on your forehead ``religious``. We know that a ``holy`` facade cannot cover-up bad behavior. I`m not putting a ``fatwa`` on any mullah, because there is hope yet for anyone

Putting a judgemental label on someone by simply saying it`s ``bad``, without rhyme or reason, is pretty much like issueing a fatwa, no?

Re: # 32
A good cure for jealousy: Instead of having evil intention about someone else`s good, create your own good. Or if you prefer, as Gandhi said:
Be the Change you want to see in the (poetry) world.
Me, I want to see this kind of poetry. You go and write your own type of poetry. Or are you not in favor of the idea of ``live and let live``?
You can follow the writers you choose, it`s fine with me, you have my ``permission``. But don`t expect others to clone you. And when you can`t control others, don`t tell them they are wrong simply because their views or styles are ``different`` from what you perceive. What you find ``unacceptable``, is caused by your ``judgemental`` nature. For example, if I were to use your ``style``, I`d say, you have ``bad behavior``, and definitely a very ``bad attitude`` and are also a ``bad mouth``, and a ``Bad influence``, and possibly ``Bad medicine``, and a ``Bad critic``, and a eventually you will say I`m a bad human. But you know how African Americans use the word ``bad`` and ``fat``
: o )

Re: # 33
Very Funny, made me laugh, Mr. Revolution
: o )

Re: # 32
Okay, let`s take that walk. But I don`t go for walks with someone who wants to attack me as an enemy. So if you want to go for a friendly stroll which will not be a scold, then let`s go. Also, don`t expect that you will be able to have a monologue to ``lecture`` me, instead be ready for a dialogue, and be open to the possibility that you may learn something from me also. Otherwise, go back to your own corner and write your own poem

Re: # 31
From the Qawali by Nusrat, titled ``Piala``, what happened to me
: o )
``Hun Piala Rakh Day Ik Paasay
Aj Nazraan Naal Pila Saqi
Saada Roz Da Peena Muk Jaaway
Aj Aisa Nasha ChaRRha Saqi``

Re: # 30
what`s Raki?
: o )
Is that good medicine for some and bad medicine for others?

Re: # 27
Salim Saheb, very funny
: o )
My brother in law is Sheikh, and when he met a man for the first time, the man said enthusiastically, happily, ``Sir I am Sheikh also``. And my brother-in-law jokingly said ``Nobody`s Perfect``
: o )
Would you happen to know when the Chauhans began to convert to Islam? I`m guessing that Prithvi Raj Chauhan was around in the same era as Hazrat Mueen-ud-Deen Chisti. I think my ancestors became Muslim because of the teachings of Sufi`s like him, because that legacy is still evident in my family

Re: # 29
Wow!
Wonderful.
Salim Saheb, you are very talented.
Very impressive writing
: o )

Re: # 25
If you consider yourself a ``good writer`` or a ``good reader``, why be a ``bad boy``? Perhaps, have some standards, and have some respect toward WORDS. Someone who appreciates writing, appreciates words and doesn`t throw them around carelessly. For example, you`re talking about ``lynching`` in a very irresponsible way. Do you know any history related to this word, do you even know what the word means? Do you care about this word? And throwing around ``lightly`` a subject like ``book burning``, well the Barbarians and Bush, who burned down Baghdad`s libraries and museums, will love you. Are you willing to own your words? All a man has is his word

Re: # 24
Salim Saheb,
Thank you, very kind of you
: o )
I don`t know why is it that when something ``looks different``, it evokes the fear of the unknown in some people. Fear is the enemy of thinking. In psychology, making the unknown, into the known, as it relates to one`s own behavior, requires courage

Re: # 12
Perhaps you`d like to be more specific, or are you just a ``bad reader``, but that would be a judgement, no? Define ``Bad Poetry``. Better yet, define ``Poetry``. The poets in America I`m familiar with, don`t quite have definition. Ever heard of Basquiat? A lot of people wouldn`t call that art

Re: # 11
Define ``Bad Poetry``. Better yet, define ``Poetry``. The poets in America I`ve heard, don`t quite have definition. Ever heard of Basquiat? A lot of people wouldn`t call that art

Oye Fazool!

Dehk! Dont let these Pinky come latelys tell you how to shair! As a bijniz owner in Amrika, I know it is my right to badmouth my country and its poetic institutionals! You and I see eyeball to eyeball, hain? Here is my jawaab to these socialism society pinky types:


Watch dog bark on a hot summer night,
Kill my landlord, kill my landlord,
watch dog bark, though he bite,
kill my landlord, kill my landlord,
slip in his window, break his neck,
then his house I start to wreck,
got no reason, what the heck!
kill my landlord, kill my landlord,
C-I-L-L my landlord.




Is not revolutionary, hain???

``writer``,

re:

``But perhaps you`re not ``used to`` unusual styles, which could be due to indoctrination?``

I beg your pardon? To which ``indoctrination`` do you refer?

The Lyric Poets?
The Beats?
The Black Mountain Poets?
The Nuyoricans?
The Black Arts Movement?
The Imagists?

And...when did a fresh metaphor or the aesthetics of defamilliarization become a poem`s enemy? If you want, we could take a walk through your poem-the textual equivalent of Chucky Cheez...

#30, Hamid Sahib, {``salim,
..... you deserve this secret recipe for lion`s milk :
ingredients
1 oz. raki
1 oz. water``}

Now you tell me, Sir. I just finished tying my only raki on Tempy`s tender wrist. :)

Actually, in Turkey we use raki to clean the tables, then we consume delicious Efes beer. :)

Did you know that raki is probably short for araki or arak - juice?

Salim

salim,


..... you deserve this secret recipe for lion`s milk :

ingredients
1 oz. raki
1 oz. water

mixing instruction
serve at room temp in lowball

sagligina !

Hamidm Sahib,
Inqilaab Zindabad.


Salim ko isliye mara ke jeena jaanta tha woh
Apne dushmanoN ka khun pina janta tha woh

Yeh basti, uff! yeh basti jisko Chowkistan kehte heN
JahaN ban ban ke hakim ``liberal`` haiwaan rehte heN

JahaN ka jailkhaana mujahidoN se bharta jata he
JahaN par parchame jhoot-o-faraib sansanata he

Yeh basti, uff yeh basti jisko Chowkistan kehte heN

Re: # 26

salim mian,

...... see my post on your favourite poet`s article .thread ....

``If Assadullah had given up in Lucknow, where would civilization be today? `` ....... what civilization ???? ...... thou dost jest with me ?

Hamidm Sahib,
Haven`t you noticed that the poet is a Chauhan. Now, I always say ``blood is thicker than ink.`` :)
Salim

#25, Hamidm Sahib,
If Assadullah had given up in Lucknow, where would civilization be today?
If Clint Eastwood had listened to Hollywood pundits, we wouldn`t know where Italy was.
Speaking of poet lynching, I have my own favorites ...:)
Salim

Re: # 24

salim mian,

... this is a very bad poem , any way you look at it ....... it is the kind of thing that justifies poet lynching and book burning ........

#18, Qawali,
Very fitting, measured, and appropriate response to unwarranted criticism bordering on malicious jealousy. Good job.
Salim

Re: # 12
Mullah Robertson is a buddy of born again bush, like the Grahams. Many scholars have commented that Robertson was told to say this, to see the response, as a market test, like sending a test balloon out to see people`s reactions. It would be great to have a dialogue about the people mentioned in this piece

Re: # 11
Well, pushing ``personal agendas`` usually take a higher priority, instead of talking about an issue bigger than oneself. So who`s steering us away from the topic at hand? I agree the the readers who want to talk about their own personal selves instead, are trying to be a distraction and become an exhibition. The topic is fundamentalism, and there are at least three kinds: Religious Fundamentalism, Corporate fundamentalism and Government or Political fundamentalism. They are all very nasty for the public`s health

Re: # 9
I thought this was cheeeerful
: o )
lol
: o )
Bullah versus the Mullah
people would pay to watch that on wrestlemania, que no?
: o )

Re: # 8
Thank you jee, you are VERY VERY KIND
: o )
It gets lonelier as you hike further up on the ``Road Less Traveled``, eh?
: o )

Re: # 7
You got something against nudity?
: o )
I guess you`ll put the men in burqa too, along with the women? To prevent nudity around trees?
: o )

Re: # 5
I don`t know why you think I need to learn writing from you. I`ve had really good teachers in college. But perhaps you`re not ``used to`` unusual styles, which could be due to indoctrination? You will be happy to know about this poem which was NOT published here. But will answer the questions which one day you will ask:

I Suppose I Could Call Myself a Poet, but...

I`m not the type of poet who makes bad guys feel good
I`m not the type of poet who is a drunk
I`m not the type of poet who`s always struggling to pay the bills
I`m not the type of poet who`s into fantasy and strays from reality
I`m not the type of poet who is a “hopeless” romantic (naakaam aashiq)
I`m not the type of poet who gives lip service instead of action
I`m not the type of poet who is feminized
I`m not the type of poet who holds back on inspiring others
I`m not the type of poet who`s threatened by the talent of fellow artists
I`m not the type of poet who is not seeking the truth
I`m not the type of poet who`s very technical about form but lacks content
I`m not the type of poet who lives in a make-believe world to escape his responsibilities
I`m not the type of poet who has sold out to materialism
I`m not the type of poet who is an Uncle Tom mouth piece for Uncle Sam
I`m not the type of poet who takes orders from any non-grassroots establishment
I`m not the type of poet who is lost in his own world of ego
I`m not the type of poet who`s an elitist
I`m not the type of poet who`s in it for the money
I`m not the type of poet who preaches non-violence only to anesthetize people
I`m not the type of poet who lacks a sense of humor
I`m not the type of poet who disseminates romantic intoxication
I`m not the type of poet who`s still under the influence of colonization
I`m not the type of poet who does propaganda on behalf of a fundamentalist corporations
I`m not the type of poet who writes like a people-pleasing salesman
I`m not the type of poet who promotes racisms and schisms
I`m not the type of poet who`s world view is narrow
I`m not the type of poet who has no time for mentoring
I`m not the type of poet who is a player chasing women
I`m not the type of poet who seeks to boost his ego to get admiration in the spotlight
I`m not the type of poet who`s a slick, pretending, performer
I`m not the type of poet who`s in it to get political power
I`m not the type of poet who does art for art`s sake
I`m not the type of poet as Iqbal says:
``Hind kay Shair o` soorat gar o` afsana navees
Aah! baychaaron kay aasaab pay aurat hay sawaar``

Re: # 4
About Israel, you might want to see some documentaries related to Jenin. And do a search on Sharon, and the war crimes by him like the Sabra and Shatila massacre. Isn`t he the one who also called for the assasination of Arafat? Perhaps look at what Edward Said says, because he was Christian, and thus more fair than me?

Re: # 3
I have no idea what are that means?

Re: # 2
One of our common omens is being judgemental. Putting other people down makes us feel better, by springing us up? The trouble with pop culture is, the audience does not like to see a supply of originality, content or realism. Instead, fantasy, entertainment, and ``form`` (FORMula), are demanded. To me, the same old FORMula, reminds me of Mula, and it`s boring, yar. In contemporary American poetry, as in hard rock type of lyrics, there is immense amounts of originality, breaking of ``rules``, and unpredictability. That`s what I like. Because simple form may have a limited number or layers. And like when musicians ``break the rules`` of harmony, it creates a deeper work. In western art, originality is stressed, uniqueness is rewarded. In Indian pop music`s beginnings, in the previous generation, there were two female singers, and 3 male singers. AND THAT WAS ALL. They had the monopoly, which stifled the creativity in other singers. Do you want to eat the burger from a fast food chain, and say that`s cool? That was an early phase. To me, what`s cool is the mom and pop shop. They don`t have the fancy arches, and can`t afford TV commercials, but they have authenticity. They don`t need to present their kabab as a burger, specially if they are not in it for money or popularity

Re: # 1
Regarding the religion of our forefathers:
What I include as a footnote for those siblings who may not know Bulleh Shah: He was a sufi poet who passed away in 1758, his Islamic teachings emphasized spirituality, love, and self-examination, instead of dogma and ritualism. Like in buddhism, he teaches: good thoughts, good words, good actions

Re: # 1

Thanks brother Chauhan
: o )

t,

``this was allegedly supposed to be a dumping party for ayatollah pat son-of-robert``

......... i guess , ike chavez, nobody cares what pat has to say ........ besides, bad poetry relly ticks off people even if the message has some merit ........... to be honest, this was so bad that i didn`t read past the first three lines ....... i can see why someone like saminasha would be really upset by this abomination ......... the only thing worse than poetry is bad poetry ................

what is happening here?

this was allegedly supposed to be a dumping party for ayatollah pat son-of-robert

for abul hasan bani sadr`s sake if not ayatollah sadr`s sake...can bw stop judging bad poetry worse and get on with the business at hand?

tbhai,

Dont even try that humility sumility stuff here....

Haven`t come across a hilarious rantorama like this for ages.

Bulleh Shah, save me from the Mullah, LOL, Good Lord! You must be having a bad day. Cheer up!

Kudos Mr. Fazeel...well put!

Don`t worry about the usual suspects getting their thongs in knots and throwing up sarcastic tantrums in their blissful ignorance. They`re on medication, thus unable to make sense of the reality.

The usual suspects...and you know who you are, please refrain from mooning. I just drop in to keep an eye y`all and currently don`t have time to engage in your diatribes. You`re welcome to keep chewing on your knuckles though...hehehe

:-)~~

Re: # 1

fazeel mian,

c`mon ........ cut the fool robertson some slack - he has already apologized and we need people like him to keep our mullahs in check ........

............... the problem with the bleeding heart liberals is that they are against everything and for nothing - unless it is for hugging trees and organic gardening in the nude ............

sam:

easy:)

a certain hack called t;)

for specimens check his ilog

Well....the message is worthy of our consideration...I just can`t approve of the methodology of delivering it. Writer: please contact me on unplugged if you are interested in reading (and goddess help us) learning how to write political poems. Again, as much as I agree with the progressivism of the piece, it kills me to read it.

Tbhai,

well, in the spirit of poetry, feel free to nominate your candidates for the worst poem ever posted on chowk...there is some terrible pleasure in reallllly bad poetry....

sammi!

cut some slack yaar...comment on the message:)

fazeel:

the assassination of a political or religious leader or opponent as a state policy is to be condemned....there is only one country that owns up to it publicly -- israel

but other countries like the US, Pakistan and India have unofficially engaged in such practices in the past and should be universally condemned for such practices

rgds

t

(sorry, writer)

This is possibly the worst poem Chowk has ever posted.

Fazeel Chauhan,

Very well written with an even spary of blame.
Almost makes sense to revert to the religion of our forefathers. :)

Salim Chauhan