Behind the Iron Purdah

Now THATS an EXCELLENT example of comparision and contrast!

Getting back to the issue of people who want to see Pakistan emulate the Taliban


Yup..The taliban the Paki government created...the taliban that was supported by a majority of the pakis....

Strategic depth has left Pakiland in Deep shit...

...... it is not fair to kafirs....the believers can and do oggle kafir women.....and hide their behind purdah....that is not fair.....OFF with the Purdah.....

Purdah is worse than Sati....the women die everyday....wearing that black chadors in 100F + heat....

it is not the purdah itself but all the restrictions and subjugations that come with it.....it is a symbol of subjugation.....


Modesty is stupid excuse.....why don`t muslas make their hearts modest?

lesser beings ........

the other day i was talking to a friend who moved back to pakistan about twelve years ago because of his old parents ........... now he is thinking of moving back to the us because of his young daughter ....... he says, ``i don`t want my daughter to be treated as a lesser being`` ......

but there is hope .....

Gaddafi on women: ``Women should be trained for combat, so that they do not become easy prey for their enemies.`` In the West, ``the situation for women is hardly enviable: she has left home but only to confront a difficult fate, driving trucks & trains.``

........... and he has an amazonian guard ! .... sign up, ladies !

kaka seriously wants to know how old Bina Shah is.. Just the age bracket will suffice. Are you acting `bewildered, raised-too-pure` observer when you ask dumb question? Or are you being dumb asking bewildering questions?

`On the one hand, we are mothers, daughters, and sisters, the most respected beings according to our religion; on the other hand, with honor killings, forced marriages, and domestic violence, you’d think we were animals that need to be kept in cages, bred according to the whims of our owners, and culled when we have outlived our usefulness. On the one hand Pakistani women are becoming Air Force pilots; on the other, sold as sex slaves. We are constantly told of all the rights we have in Islam but apparently this doesn’t include the right to vote, as women are being disenfranchised in the NWFP as we speak. Pakistani women earn their PhDs in universities both at home and abroad, but every day in Pakistani villages there are girls who are taunted by their relatives and neighbors when they want to go to school.`

If you haven`t been able to resolve the `contradiction` above, then its time to stop writing further articles and submitting them to chowk.. and getting to know an atleast one intelligent person who will explain stuff to you.. After acquiring sufficient skills to parse and peruse the problem, you can come back and pontificate further.

``.......precious rights and liberties we stand to lose if we become complacent about our country. Ridiculous as the Iron Purdah seems...............``

Excellent article.........I have always maintained that we would pay a heavy price if we `tolerate` the mullahism in our own houses and backyards and not expect the mullahs to enslave us...................Pakistani society has tried hard to appear `purer` than the rest of the world and in the outcome of this pretext is the fact that the mullahs are now a formidable force in their society.........................I can see the Hasba Bill coming to other provinces as well despite whatever SC may say...............

The Hasba Bill, Zina ordinance and Honour Killing are inhuman and Un-Islamic as well. But at the same time, I think, the drawbacks of a nation is the responsibility of every citizen of that nation and no-one can shun it or disclaim responsibility. I think, it`s not only the responsibility of the citizens but of the entire world to nip these ideas in the bud.

I think what Islam teaches fundamentally is that men and women are different, not un-equal. Different biologically, physiologically, psychologically and genetically. It teaches us to acknowledge these differences and conduct ourselves accordingly.

- The Foolish Shaikh

The author makes the legitimate point that “separate but equal” never really is so in real life – the underdogs (the women in this case) always end up with the short end of the stick. However, the separation itself is wrong (irrespective of how adequate or otherwise the facilities) – and that needs to be emphasized.

It is difficult to figure out why half of the population – consisting of the women – puts up with this treatment – I doubt it has anything to do with the level of education (the author’s first example is striking) – probably more a result of familial indoctrination – which also explains why there is such diversity (in terms of the levels of accomplishment) among women – so that’s where the effort needs to be focused – and eventually will be!

#5 Dear Hamidm bhai
Please stop quoting outdated dictators who share the first part of their name with a very docile animal (gadha) – in order to not hurt the feelings of the (docile) animal! Also, women are not really looking for an “enviable” position – just to be treated as an equal – which means they would (and should) end up with the same challenges and opportunities as anybody else. (I have a feeling that all that hashish you were drooling over on the other board has already done some serious damage. (You didn’t think I was going to let you get away with that “adrak” remark, did you?))

Re: # 7

As Mush says........we clean up our house you clean yours..............that implies that we do that together without waiting for the the other to do his act......

........................and surprisingly Mush doesn`t realize that we can all see his government`s double speak when they act contrary and also say-

`` NO Trade, No Indian FDI before KAshmir``.......................

Re: # 9

beejay,

... i put gaddafi in the same category as michael jackson (with those silly uniforms and all) but he is the best the muslim world has to offer ..........

Sorry to say but this article is ridiculous. I understand the author is trying to make a point by illustrating extreme conditions in a society that allowed fundamentally un-Islamic ``fundamentals`` to take over; however, the point being made, is a poor one and poorly made also.

As the author herself has pointed out, we can find women in all parts of society and all over the spectrum with respect to their level of education, basic freedoms, career development, and general empowerment. Kind of like where I`ve grown up, the U.S. of A. I find it really strange that the author singles out Pakistan as an extraordinarily inhumane place for women -- the reality is that women have it hard all over the world, and all throughout history.

Women as powerful leaders, objects of desire, victims of abuse, tools of utility exist today and always have...and probably always will. The world may view the US as veritable heaven on earth for women but the sad truth is women here suffer in tremendous ways. Imagine a society where men, for the most part, will bed the women but refuse to marry them. Where women have struggled for years for the right to equal pay but it has led only to the right to support themselves and the children men have left behind for them to care for. As an attorney I work with so many other single female attorneys who are so desparate for a man to marry (so few will committ in this society) that they usually lie about their profession so men aren`t intimidated to even date them. This is a society where women are abused sexually, mentally, physically, by relatives and scores of boyfriends in a vicious cycle they often can`t escape. Drugs, alcohol, promiscuity do not a liberating society make....

And, by the way, there are religious extremist Christian elements in the US too. Ever heard of Utah? Or the Bible-belt? There are plenty of Christian polygamists who are way beyond the Islamic limit of four wives...in fact they create entire colonies with their wives and breeding factories as they hunker down and wait for the second coming of Christ. Popular news shows have done reports on these men and their penchant for pre-teen wives, even marrying a series of sisters and yes, even sometimes their own daughters. I promise you, women are considered chattel in different ways all over the world....

I`m a Pakistani-American Muslim women who does the unthinkable and wears hijab because she wants to. I feel sorry for my non-Muslim American female counterparts because they have to worry about growing old without companionship and wondering if they will ever have children. I feel secure knowing my rights and knowing there are good Muslim men out there who also know my rights. The muhala-mullahs in Pakistan are a product of the culture and don`t reflect Islamic values, they just use the religion as a means of control.

Anyhow, my basic point was women are and always have been on the short end of the stick. Pakistan is no different than the rest of the world.

Rabia

Women in Pakistan have problems, but women EVERYWHERE have problems.

rabia,

``I`m a Pakistani-American Muslim women who does the unthinkable and wears hijab because she wants to``

......... i feel sorry for you ........

#12 Rabia

Please answer the following simple questions to enlighten this ignorant person.

(1) Are the author’s intentions good or not? (Yes/No)

(2) Do you even believe that women in Pakistan are worse off compared to U.S., or not? (Yes/No)

(3) If the answer to (2) is “Yes” – should something be done about it or not? (Yes/No)

(4) If the answer to (3) is “Yes” – what is YOUR solution?

Taking apart a well-intentioned article is easy – let’s see you come up with some suggestions of your own, for starters!

Notes
[Imagine a society where men, for the most part, will bed the women but refuse to marry them.]
Excuse me Ms. Rabia, the way my rudimentary understanding is – it takes TWO to bed – or does the woman not even count from your perspective?

[This is a society where women are abused sexually, mentally, physically, by relatives and scores of boyfriends in a vicious cycle they often can`t escape.]
Are you sure you are talking about U.S. and not Pakistan? The point. my sweet lady, is that in U.S., the woman can walk away from a bad relationship – unless she has been mentally conditioned to remain a “pair kee jootee”!

[Drugs, alcohol, promiscuity do not a liberating society make....]
ANYWHERE!

[Ever heard of Utah? Or the Bible-belt? There are plenty of Christian polygamists who are way beyond the Islamic limit of four wives...in fact they create entire colonies with their wives and breeding factories as they hunker down and wait for the second coming of Christ.]
This is incredible! Are you okay being a quarter wife?

Re: # 14

beejay,

..... don`t waste your time - you are talking past a muslima who has bought the party line hook, line and sinker ......... that`s why, when my daughter went to college last year, i told her to stay away from the msa and any creature in a headjob who calls her ``sister`` ........ alhamdollilah, she is doing fine ..........

........... anyone who compares the state of women in the us to the chattel in pakistan needs help .........

bina:

great article. keep writing.

Our nation can be aptly described as a lunatic asylum masquerading as a country….

yup, that about sums it up.

beej (post #9) brings up an important point when he alludes to women putting up with this treatment. i think as long as even a handful of women give their tacit (in some cases not so tacit) approval the situation for women is unlikely to improve anywhere but especially so in pakistan. i don’t know about other desi women at chowk but i’ve met plenty of these complicit women over the years.

rgds
miriam