From Patna to Detroit (A true lifelong migration)

Re: # 45

Scout,

Thanks! You too!

How do I find your work?

Romair,

Why dont women who do work in Partition and gender contribute to chowk? There is a great deal of scholarship out there-but none of it seems to be reviewed or discussed here (Scout`s and the work of other women) work notwithstanding. Why do you think that is?

Re: # 42

excellent post

Re: # 41

and what was your experience with it? what`s your experience with anything? sitting pretty in the west with patronizing airs and righteous and apologist attitudes?

what would you know about women`s struggles

Scout,

You are absolutely right-we all need to speak to our parents and grandparents and record their narratives.

Ana`s doing an excellent job here-thanks Ana!

This is not about ``female suffering`` per se. Could the coiner of the phrase unpack it and tell us what even means? And why this is the only avenue open to women survivors of male violence?

If you looked at that piece by Sonali Jain, you`ll notice the statement in which she points out that at least one million women were raped and assaulted during the span of Partition. That particular fact bears repeating because its not one that is ever in any real way engaged-what gets bse`d about is India-Pakistan-Kashmir. The body of the land, but never the bodies of women who belong to that land. Hindus and Muslims but never women of ALL faiths who have been assaulted as part of these ``nationalistic`` civil wars. There are people on this board who have spent the last five years posting the SAME debate about India-Muslim-Pakistan-Hindu-Kashmir-Kashmir-Kashmir-Kashmir quoting ad infinitum falana maulvi and dimka historian, but who has bothered himself with reading the words of the women who lived in these times? Its a widespread form of denial and you know it.

Urstuly,

I have spent several years talking to the women in my fam about their experiences of Partition and this is one reason why this complete silence and denial of their realities is so unbelievable. One day, given the will and grace of the universe, I will write something. But as a granddaughter and daughter and as someone who will not steal the meanings and self worth of these womens` lives.

Why dont you write a piece about being an enslaved African American circa Thomas Jefferson`s presidency? Off the top of your head. I`ll be the first one to read it.

scout

I am not patronizing anyone. I just want to preserve history. I vividly remember your naration of personal experiences of Jalianwala Baagh incident. It really helped me understand the phenomenon of partition.

Urstruly,

trying to patronize ana and saminasha just makes you look very dated and chauvanistic, i suggest you avoid such behavior

i don`t think they`ll respond to you anyway

Re: # 32

i guess i can understand where u`re coming from, maybe women reading this will be inspired to write an article from the woman`s perspective

kachchi dhool:

i was referring to historical accounts not literature when i said that. i did not have those authors in mind when i wrote that, or taraqqi pasand writers :) i realize that my post was muddled in terms of those distinctions.

and thank you very much for referring to me as a new-age jargon-heavy ``scholar``. i have no clue what that means, but i`ll be sure to ask all my former english literature professors. :))

as for you, urstruly, your questions don`t deserve a response.

had gandhi not been so obdurate, we would not have to suffer accusation of not allowing women to write about partition.

Saminashah #: In Pakistan, or from Pakistan, there should be far more female writers than males writers. On this site, also, there should be more female interactors than male; at leat of the Pakistani variety. To some extent, on the English publishing side that is the case, in Pakistan. But on the whole, there are far more male writers. And even on this site, there are far more male interactors and writers, than females.

Why is that?

The demographic that Chowk (and Publishing in general) caters to in Pakistan - the 5% of Pakistanis who can speak English and the .05% who have Internet access - is manned (or wommaned) by men and women who are equally literate. None of the male interactors on this site, would have uneducated sisters. In addition, men in our society are forced to take on subjects and fields, through which they can earn good money, like engineering and medicine etc. even if they don`t want to.

I would much rather have majored in Sufi poetry than Comp. Sci, but I have no option. However, my wife can study whatever she wants to, because, within the Pakistani social set-up, she is not expected to support the family, financially. This gives her the independence to write, read, study etc. anything - poetry, literature, anthropology, sociology, art etc. An advantage I do not have. She also has a lot more free time than me, assuming she is not working. In addition, within Pakistan, well-off girls rarely have too many household chores to take care of, due to the availability of servants etc. (which nearly the whole Chowk crowd have).

Based on this, why aren`t there more girls (at least from the well-off demographics of the Chowk crowd) and women in Pakistan writing? Why aren`t more of them interacting on Chowk? Why aren`t more of them writing articles here? Why aren`t more doing research in the liberal arts area, including history?

Granted, one cannot expect even well-off Pakistani woman to become the world champion 100 meter hurdler, since there are too many social restrictions. But what is stopping her from sitting comfortably in her room, utlizing the liberal arts education she received at Kinnaird and Karachi University (not to mention Vassar and the local community college), and using her free time (once Munnu, Guddu and Annie are in school and she has ordered Fazloo - the khansama - to cook Sahib`s dinner), to write something..........

Why can most men on Chowk, with barely any liberal arts education, write more replies and articles, during their lunch break, than most Pakistani women do in a week? One cannot, always, and in every arena, blame everything on males; specifically Pakistani males. It`s a given that they are the guilty party in gang-rapes and in sexual harrassment in the workplace. But certainly not in literature.

In fact, come to think of it, instead of complaining about men not understanding the sensitivities of women and not describing their ordeals correctly, why don`t you, yourself, write something about it, on this site. Come to think of it, why haven`t you written anything on this site, when even ignoromouses like myself, who for 10 years thoought that Homer was nothing more than the dad on the Simpsons, have written stuff...........It may just be nothing more than, ``stuff,`` but it`s better than nothing........

Why not be a doer, instead of a critic?

``it is not that women have not been written about, it is that women have been written about as objects, as non-actors in an incredibly tumultuous time in history where men have been the actors.``

ana:
can you please, point out any writers you had in mind while saying what you did. you are not counting taraqqi pasand writers in this objectifying category, i hope.
krishan chandar, rajinder, singh bedi wrote powerful short-stories and it would be really sad to hear new-age jargon-heavy ``scholars`` discounting their work.

desperately submitted :-)

ana

do you have any memories of first world war?

Since Saminashah has seen and experienced partition in person I think it will be a great loss if she doesn`t document her experiences.

scout:

in my case, i hope that my response to dulla is helpful. the point for me is not so much who writes it, as it is about voice not being lost. i don`t know that i can explain it any better than that right at this moment.