Songs of Dissonance

Why does an Islamist insist upon telling everyone that Islam has pre-empted all the important scientific theories?

Simple, Islamist wants to spread the propaganda that world does not need scientists because everything is already revealed..............so this propaganda to `prove` that all the important and established theories of sciences are already pre-empted in Islam............it would only lesd to more muslims getting weaned to Islamist ideology. I am sure the chowk must have realized that in their midst only how Mr. Naqshabandi has been reading the Islamist stuff so much that he had almost decided to throw away his phd thesis in chemistry ...............

Whom does the propoganda target?

It is targetted at moderate muslims who would unwittingly become party to the fascistic intents of these Islamists and would provide intellectual and moral support. It is not targetted for publication in acclaimed forums of science or even philosophy of science. It is a propoganda ploy to obtain support from various moderate muslims and to keep the Islamists afloat on their violent course towards fascistic submission of all the other educated and moderate muslims as well as non-muslims alike.

This is what the charlatan Mr. Masadi states:


``THE WATERY ORIGIN OF LIFE


The Koran mentions that all life ``originated`` from water (Koran 21:30)and that man himself is ``created`` of water and so are all the animals on earth (Koran 25:54, and 24:45).

These statements to an Arab would have sounded atrocious in that day and age. Even today such statements in the Koran might cause you to wonder. The fact that all life originated in water is well established by the scientific community, today. We have evidence to support the fact that the first living beings were cyanobacteria also called bluegreen algae, and they existed in water. The fact that human beings and animals are created of water is also well established since cytoplasm the basic component of ``life`` in any animal cell is over 80% water.``



The fact remains that this view was probably a modification of the well know thesis propounded by Thales of Miletus (Born: about 624 BC Died: about 547 BC in Miletus, Asia Minor ,now Turkey) `all things are water`..................so the original claim for pre-emption should go to Thales............

Anyway, this is a patently false thesis because `life` is characterized by the DNA sequence............and the helical DNA sequence was not even understood before the 20th century.....no religious text could have pre-empted the DNA sequence........it only comes from religious loonies who make this claim for propaganda of their form of religious cult..........

Re: # 72
Madani Sahib
After reading your replies I have completly lost trail of the subject matter. BRAVO!!! Absoluetly brilliant. If some people do not get the gist of your writings, then they surely are at a loss.

My first, 17year old daughter has started to impress her viewpoint causing me much consternations. Can you advise course of action cause like u I too feel threatened by her independence.

JJ made his name and fame being a pop singer which he now considers to be un-Islamic yet has no qualms in useing that same fame to propagate his born again Islam. Making others feel good about themselves through music was JJ best possible contribution to this world, his latest monologue will only endear him to his coterie of Tablighees/fundos searching for the ultimate conspiracy theories. I for one would support JJ need to have his bouts of verbal diorrehea.

This is what happens when moderate `educated` muslims submit themselves to the Islamist propaganda. They prescribe faster backward movement to the glorious past.............i.e. more Islamization...............it is these `educated` persons like JJ and Dr Farrukh Saleem who embolden the Islamist even more:-

http://www.jang.com.pk/thenews/nov2005-daily/08-11-2005/oped/o6.htm

`` Muslims of the world are among the poorest of the poor.

Fifty-seven Muslim majority countries have an average of ten universities each for a total of less than 600 universities for 1.4 billion people; India has 8,407 universities, the U.S. has 5,758. From within 1.4 billion Muslims Abdus Salam and Ahmed Zewail are the only two Muslim men who won a Nobel Prize in physics and chemistry (Salam pursued his scientific work in Italy and the UK, Zewail at California Institute of Technology). Dr Salam in his home country is not even considered a Muslim.

Over the past 105 years, 1.4 billion Muslims have produced eight Nobel Laureates while a mere 14 million Jews have produced 167 Nobel Laureates. Of the 1.4 billion Muslims less than 300,000 qualify as `scientists`, and that converts to a ratio of 230 scientists per one million Muslims. The United States of America has 1.1 million scientists (4,099 per million); Japan has 700,000 (5,095 per million).

Fact: Of the 1.4 billion Muslims 800 million are illiterate (6 out of 10 Muslims cannot read). In Christendom, adult literacy rate stands at 78 percent.

Consider, for instance, that Muslims constitute 22 percent of world population with a 1 percent share of Nobel Prizes. Jews constitute 0.23 percent of world population with a 22 percent share of Nobel Prizes.

What really went wrong? Muslims are poor, illiterate and weak. What went wrong? Arriving at the right diagnosis is extremely critical because the prescription depends on it. Consider this:

Diagnosis 1: Muslims are poor, illiterate and weak because they have `abandoned the divine heritage of Islam`.
Prescription: We must return to our real or imagined past.

Diagnosis 2: Muslims are poor, illiterate and weak because we have refused to change with time.

Keep pace with time -- al Quran``

#84 by ballukhan

[...............it is these `educated` persons like JJ and Dr Farrukh Saleem who embolden the Islamist even more]

Ballu Bhai,

I think you got it all wrong. You are grossly mistaken about Dr. Farrukh Saleem. For years, he has been advocating modern education for Pakis as the only solution to Pakistan`s ills. I have read many of his articles on The Friday Times, and he comes across as a real modernist, not a turncoat ;-) like Jamshed Junaid and Saeed Anwar.

Note the last paragraph:

``Diagnosis 2: Muslims are poor, illiterate and weak because we have refused to change with time.

Keep pace with time -- al Quran``

Re: # 85

It is time Dr Farrukh Saleem said that unambigously that Diagnosis 2 is the correct diagnosis than clubbing the two together and leaving the readers to decide................his silence on the issue makes him appear to be a fence sitter.......................

MantoLives:
i am not making any point here. i couldnt find the info on the web about the divine status of Ali and Allah in Ismaili faith. And since, you suggested somewhere here about reading up on Ismaili faith, i am assuming you would know about it. So could you elaborate on Ali?


Thanks.

PS: or for that matter anyone who knows about it.

#76, you got the ``financial transaction`` claim from the site (http://women.rationalreality.com) I told you about and then dishonestly presented it in a half-baked fashion without the answer given on the site, how do I know that, well when the testimony claim is presented most have no clue that it is limited to ``financial transactions`` and then you repeat the slight error in that article because it is not about testimony but about bearing witness to a written document involving DEBTS. Regardless, the FACT is that in certain cases women`s testimony holds greater weight than a man`s according to the Quran, which disproves the allegation that the Quran considers women inferior because in certain instances it wants two women to witness instead of one- which has good reasons in that case by the way. So you cannot generalize based on testimony laws that one is greater than the other- not possible because in some cases the Quran gives GREATER weight to the testimony of women.

#74 most speakers of English in the world understand Quran as Koran that is my reason for spelling it such- the purpose being that the book I am talking about is easily identified- in this regard Koran is a much more expedient rendition than Qur`an- which may confuse many readers.

I`ll get back to you ... or have Rozaiba, a fellow Ismaili, get back to you.

Re: # 83

JJ is fine. He has opinion so what is problem . Some people feel still moon landing was fake. It does not matter ?

You take good care of your daughter. I always think its more responsibility than boys as we care more for them. Its kind of watering the neighbors garden as they just go away to have their family. We need to do good job and stand by and be ready to help. Like in garden we can take out weeds it would have been nice we can take out and whip lafanga boys , but lufangas are too many.

Do not get distressed as your daughter may say you can not understand her and you are kind of backward retard. They do not mean it really. Its really hard as both side do not understand each others language. Fortunately time goes and again we start understanding each other. They start doing ``nakhara``, lipstick,looking in mirror all times,getting too many clothes, combing hair excessively it is sign of time and take it in stride. Nothing much can be done , just tighten belt and ready for rough ride. Do stand by but please donnt stand in way it will not be appreciated.

It worry time for fathers but when you retrospect at later years you can enjoy mentally the metamorphism of larve in Butterfly ready to fly like eagle without reference in sky, free at last and ready to rise. Just like many books epilogues are far better all daughter ( most cases) appear to have done fine when you look back.

Good luck.


Sincerely
Ahmed Madani

Re: # 77

Ms Sandhu... I really enjoyed the picture. Hope one day we can have such things wide spread in feudal areas of my country. I am quite old fashioned but move with time or dragged by time, I moan but move with. I got message when my daughter told me what she thinks , and acquiesced , gave my consent quitely without protest but without enthusiasm. I have travelled to India few times for work related to travel, lodging and entertainment related possibilities. If you get chance once I wrote a letter to my family of my trip to India. ( would like to get copy of that and see what I felt at that time, is there way to locate) I have deep empathy for Indian democracy and largest , complex drama , with thousand subplots . When I study the calculus of indian democracy can say such complex drama was never played and will never be played in world history ( with time many complexities will be factored out, its unbeatean paths will become well travelled and it will not be as complex or as intrigueing say after 50 years). With only about 3.5% of land mass and 16% world population its not easy by any standard. Still people survive and flourish with culture and reasonable life standard. The Indian companies are getting little freedom and they are showing class at world level, 12 Indian companies are traded in US exchanges and some with very high P/E ratios. I have no jalousy or envy in such matters.

Pakistan and muslim societies very much like the sexual content of Indian or western societies and we desire same in our lives but we do not want in our society. When we travel to India or west( I have not visited real foreign country like usa, uk,canada, Germany- real white countries) we are delighted streets full of women and women going with good dresses, satisfacion and happiness nochalantly and nobody taking notice of them. Women not afraid to travel in big cities and need no protection and general decency of males compared to say city like karachi in busses. All males like sexual content in society and we are afraid and muslims men specially are so terrified to such extent that we are paranoid , want to supress that. I have met many pakistanies who went and lived in Holy Cities and holy nations but they do not want to live there as they they say what is life for foreigner in such dry faceless societies. Due to lack of expression of these things a normal sublimatiom the men and women undergoes with passage of time is nonexistant in more repressed societies. I agree in sense I and many others live in muddied pond ,or in wells (as you said)as frogs and we have no easy way to come out of it.

I just does not like attitude of Mr.Arjun as he always sees negative and is messenger of doom.

That picture is Bhangara on motorcycles to welcome James Bond 007 ?

with best wishes for happy 2006.

# 91
Pakistan and muslim societies very much like the sexual content of Indian or western societies and we desire same in our lives but we do not want in our society
What a pervert you are.

``That picture is Bhangara on motorcycles to welcome James Bond 007 ?`` Madani saab that was hilarious.

Re: # 91

Madani saheb...............OBL is still around alive and kicking.......and shopping around for dirty bombs....and we have the great intellectuals around us providing their implicit support to whatever nonsense they spout on al-jazeera.......................and we all praise the almighty for letting OBL strike terror in the hearts of the un believer........................to think that the fascist only use terror to strike terror in un believers would be to display an IQ of a donkey.............madani saheb you would be next on the list...............how can you be an imbecile to ignore what is going on in Bangladesh where the ISI inspired Islamists are running their mafia to take control of that country?............if asking you to wake up is being a prophet of doom...so be it........because doom is already foretold by your mullahs..............

Re: # 94

does it matter if you tolerate the mullahs in your backyards?

Yes......the silent conspirators are all around us...........

Re: # 90
Madani Sahib,
Many thanks for your kind advice and words of support, I will try to appreciate my garden and hope its not attacked by the scourge of this earth.

Sincerely
Arif