Echoes

Dear Farzana:

I am having difficulty open one of my articles, Yeah Faisalabad Hai, published on January 13, 2006.

Can you please help me out in retreiving the article. I would appreciate if a copy of the article is sent at the following address:

nadeemakr@yahoo.com

Thanks.


Nadeem

I have posted my following articles for your web site but unfortunately, I got no response from chowk reason best known to editor and team. http://www.thenews.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=7765
``builgings Blocks``
http://www.sdpi.org/SDPI_in_the_press/articles_2006/articles_april_06.htm#3



Arshad H Abbasi
SDPI
abbasi@sdpi.org

145 ***And if you don`t know, , Jat = Ganwar. Now, you know what a ``ganwar`` is, don`t you? It`s you, and you have certainly proven to be one.

Mr. Godot,
Whether you meant Iraqi style of speaking ``soft G`` or Egyption with ``hard G,`` this jaat in big trouble. Egyption ``ganwar`` means stupid paindoo and Iraqi Janwar means animal for him. Looks like lose lose scenario.

Re: # 145
...obviously you could not find any proof for the charges you laid against me...as such, you remain a liar...as for me being a jaat, i never claimed to be an aalim faazil like you...once a jaat always a jaat and a proud one too...

Mohtarma ZahraJ, Kulharee Bhai, and Godot Bhai

I want to thank you for your objectivity and ability to look at both sides of this rather boring and long-lasting altercation. I want to thank Gujju for informing me about this board where my opponents were engaged in a secret trial. :)

Basically, here is what I see as a problem:

1. Both Saminasha and Scout cannot tolerate anyone who tries to excel in writing or expressing a viewpoint that is not identical to their way of thinking. This jealousy is manifested in their hatred for Farzana, Godot, Echoboom, Queen Cut_Paste, Dotty, Catchy, Delhiwalla, Ozer Khaled, and me.
2. Both Saminasha and Scout cannot engage in polite discussions without resorting to profanity and frequent use of the ``ass`` word, the ``F`` word in all its variations of misspelling, and, if trying to hurl abuse upon a male interactor, the use of ``namard,`` ``haramzaday,`` and ``ulloo ke paThay.`` Scout is considerably more profane than Saminsasha, possibly because the latter is quite illiterate in Urdu as the former is in formal English.
3. Once Saminasha and Scout initiate vulgarity, they cannot stand it when retaliatory filth is hurled in their direction. This is when they employ their ``special`` relationships and sifarish to cause harm to their enemies.
4. Scout and Saminasha hurl abuse at males, their masculinity, their feminine relatives, and various parts of the male anatomy. When similar profanity is expressed for their ``female`` anatomy, the cry ``foul.``

I would love to see an end to this rather boring, uncivlized, and unnecessary altercation. I am willing to ignore both of these monstrous entities, if they stay away from me. Frankly, I see no benefit, fun, or knowledge to be gained by indulging them in any way.

Khamkhwa,
You think that you are clever in your abuse? What you don`t realize is that most Chowkies are aware of your habit of researching and pasting just the posts you need to defame and slander your opponents. The truly descriptive remarks about you and your family that you posted were not authored by me orginally. They were uttered by Zeena, someone you have been abusing for quite some time now. Once she became disgusted with you, she gave you a taste of your own medecine, much to your surprise. Seeing the effect that her retaliation had on you, I merely collected her posts and posted them against you, hoping that you would relearn the lesson she was teaching you. Unfortunately, you chose to copy the childish fighting from Chowk UP and presented it here in the hallowed halls of FP, just to prove that you are a ``victim`` of abuse. People are a lot smarter than you give them credit for. I hope you learned your lesson, or should we summon Zeena to put you in your place?

Re: # 137

Samina Shah:

I agree with you that if one side ignores the other side then there has to be an end to any ongoing tussle. Unfortunately, it took you a long time to realize when to stop. I wished you had used your better judgment early on and saved many of us (and yourself) from the torture on different discussion boards. The outcome of all communications should not be a women`s issue.

I hope this matter is settled in favor of all concerned parties.

Hope you have a joyful, serene, and pleasant thanksgiving!

Re: # 144

Khamkhwa

You can call me anything you want, not that you`ve tried your very best to hurl insults at me and as a last resort turned to my ethnicity, the last resort of intellectually-challenged like yourself.

Btw, you should look up the meaning of ``Jat,`` whose lineage you claim. And you have proven time and again that you are a ``Jat.``

And if you don`t know, , Jat = Ganwar. Now, you know what a ``ganwar`` is, don`t you? It`s you, and you have certainly proven to be one.

Re: # 142
[Words are cheap and the intellectually-challenged use them like a fool uses his/her money.]

godot...
i agree with you entirely and you proved it by accusing me for something i never did...hence, i called you a liar......chapter closed.

Happy Thanksgiving to all Chowkies (including those whose mothers smell)

I love President Kennedy. I have tapes of his speeches and I listen to them often. President Kennedy said: ``As we express our gratitude, we must never forget that the highest appreciation is not to utter words, but to live by them.`` And the writer Thornton Wilder said: ``We can only be said to be alive in those moments when our hearts are conscious of our treasures.``

Let`s live a life filled with gratitude and be forever conscious of our treasures! Happy Thanksgiving. Please be safe!

Re: # 140

Khamkhwa, my post #114 was directed to your kind:

``It’s so easy to type words sitting behind the flickering computer screen. It requires no physical effort, and for those who are incapable of thinking, no mental effort. Words are cheap and the intellectually-challenged use them like a fool uses his/her money. Hence, the emptier the vessel the louder the noise. Very few realize that in typing what they may, they are baring their souls. They are, unintentionally and voluntarily, letting us know their true nature and the material they are made of.``

Dili ka Qutab Minar Dekho

Re: # 139

godot...
i am calling you a liar...coz i never abused zeena or any other female on chowk...either prove me wrong or shut up...;)


ps: have you forgotten last summer when i showed your ugly face in a mirror...perhaps this ghazal that i wrote for you will bring back those memories when you called me names after boasting about yourself...;))

godot ke meethay ye alfaaz dekho
aalim ke roshan ye jazbaat dekho

tehzeeb e mashriq ke iqdaar dekho
halavat, sharafat ke meyaar dekho

godot ke alfaaz, bahyya ke afkaar
taleem-e-maghrib hai bekaar dekho

sikhate hain hum ko sabaq aashti ka
fun e rah ravi ke ye funkaar dekho

suna tha ki patna bahut basukhan tha
ussi shahr e ruswa ki phitkaar dekho

Re: # 138

Khamkhwa

I do not want to take this any further on this board. I have made my point, and you along with your cohorts know it. As far as what you said to Zeena on UP, I believe she is in a better position to respond to that.

PS: My SUV is running great!

Re: # 135
godot...
you are the self proclaimed noble one...why don`t you post what i said to zeena that in your opinion would be considered dirty... i humbly request you to please do that and prove me an `un-noble` liar...;)

ps: how is your suv...;)

Zahra Begum,

Are you implying that although I have refused to respond to these interactors anymore, their carte blanche should continue?

Logic, please.

Re: # 135

Godot:

Excellento!

Re: # 132

Khamkhwa

Just as those you support, I know you are a man of nobility whose thinking and attitude is clear as fresh water.

However, would you care to enlighten the Chowkies with your recent dialogue with Zeena on UP? That should tell us how noble you are.

Re: # 131

Dear Kulharee:

You are indeed a sweet and kind soul.

Take Care

Please be nice to all turkeys!

Re: # 132

Khami Yaar.. there was no need to advertise this anymore than it has already been. You are using up megabytes here. It was Chauhan Sahib’s way to showing you how much you can get under his skin. Which is not a bad, and you should be happy about it. By the way, where is Chauhan Sahib? I haven’t seen him around, and I wanted to wish him Happy Turkey. If you see him, please give him my love.

... i didn`t want to soil `echo` section but consider it necessary for distinguished persons like zahraj and godot to have a sampling of the witty salim chauhan...whose abusing quality is unchallenged...newton`s third law not withstanding...;)


[...here is some of his wit and profound behaviour culled from Unplugged...;))

#6 by Salim_Chauhan on November 22, 2005 7:18am PT

khamkhwa
anyone seen your mother bitch? your mother bitch is lost??
I think your mother the biggest bitch is licking canadians shit. You are motherphuddichud. You are harrammi kii aulad who eats canadians shit daily basis and then shit on the chowk.

khamkhwa(bharvay, hijraiy)
You are son of the biggest bharva. You are zaleel creature, who licks
canadians shit and then shit on chowk. I wish I could smash your bharva face and then flush your infected stinky body in the toilet. You are the biggest bitch , who licks and eat human shit..............harammi kii aulad.....

khamkhwa(harrammi kii aulad)
Your father is bharva, that is the main reason you are bharva. You lick canadian shit daily and then shit on chowk. Your mother bitch is lost????
Where is she??? I know, she must be licking , too...............kutaiy kii aulad , you are gandoo bitch........

khamkhwa(harramii ki aulad)
Your father`s official name is khwajasera................
Your official name is gandoo. Your licking canadians shit daily, then you shit on chowk. your father is kutaa. your father is also maha gandoo, who gave you gandoo genes, that is why you`re gandoo on chowk, eating shit.

#7 by Salim_Chauhan on November 22, 2005 7:19am PT

That fixed the goddamnedmotherfuckingcocksuckingassholesonofabitch.



#17 by Salim_Chauhan on November 22, 2005 7:28am PT

Khamkhwa,
Ulley ke paThay, haraami ki aulad,

I am upset because Queenie had to leave after John Ghattiya obtained insider information.
As for you, I will be glad to come up to Toronto next week and give you a big lund from your filthy mouth into your belly, you motha fucka.



#21 by Salim_Chauhan on November 22, 2005 7:32am PT

You bastards, Khamkhwa, John Ghattiya, and the bitches with the big cunts ganged up on Queenie.




#24 by Salim_Chauhan on November 22, 2005 7:43am PT

Khamkwha,
I am going to stick your head up so far into Scout`s anus that you will taste the nihari she had last year.

#23 by Salim_Chauhan on November 22, 2005 7:42am PT

Khammy,
Teri maan ki gaanD meN kaale ka lund. Saaley,
Abhi banaata hun tujhe ek impotent person on Chowk. Suwar ki aulaad.]

---

godot...
hope you enjoyed the witty interacts of your good friend. if you still think he is an innocent simpleton reacting to other`s hazing then that`s your opinion...;)...but then ghalib said something like...
jitne chaaho bihar se lay lo...;)

Re: # 130

ZahraJ Ji, I always give everybody a benefit of doubt. If you want some, I will give it to you too. Can you show me some instances where the involved parties have been disrespectful to one another? As I said, it must be some misunderstanding. I think members/participants who get so pissed off over some internet banter should be locked inside a room and they should never be allowed to touch a keyboard. If you think that the parties (both of them) in this conflict are at fault, I will take your word for it. As I said, I personally like both sides, and I enjoy their participation.

Happy thanksgiving to you too!

[Re: # 124

Yes Godot Sahib, I concur with you (not that it matters). Even though I am not very familiar with the background of this whole saga, but I do find Salim Chauhan Sahib very courteous and very well mannered. He is always polite and rarely (never) uses foul language. He is one of the cleanest and nicest people I have had a chance to read. He is my hero. I love his politeness, civility and courteousness and the way he addresses other people’s relatives – with utmost respect, more respect than he shows his own relatives. It is a fact.

I also think that the other parties are also very polite and courteous and friendly. There must be some misunderstanding. I think it is the Tamashabaz people who are trying to make a mole out of a mountain.]

Kulharee:

Do you know the involved parties personally? If not then how can you vouch for anyone with so much confidence? Just because your nick says Kulharee does not mean that you should be reckless with your humor :)

Hey, Ii did not even know this section existed. Well, congratulations to Farzana for her new position and a heartfelt thanks to the outgoing team. I have been on Chowk for a few years know and it has been a constant pleasure. I second Raw Dust`s comments.

As far as suggestions are concerned, I really don`t have any. I actually happen to like the ``garish colors``...prolly coz it blends well with my ``garish Puppy Punju`` personality. I also like to drive around Dfance Clony market in my Mruti listening to Tootak Tootak Tootian.

This seems to be a mini ipod version of the unplugged.

Re: # 124

Ditto to Godot`s post.

Samina: The nonstop nonsense on the discussion boards is not one sided. You and other women on Chowk(in fact, on this board) are equally responsible for inciting others and disturbing Chowk`s momentum. Please do take some responsibility for your own acts.

Agree with Godot. Saminasha has every right to hate Salim or ignore him. But none to gag him. Whatever the problems she has with Salim are personal and should not be made the concern of the eminently respectable Madam Editor. Has Salim been abusive , crude with Saminasha , Scout and Co. ? Maybe. But as Godot said , fact is , Saminasha , Scout and Co. have been equally abusive and crude towards Salim.

This is a personal fight between the Saminsha camp and Salim. I sure dont think its a good idea for Madam Editor to get involved.

Re: # 124

Yes Godot Sahib, I concur with you (not that it matters). Even though I am not very familiar with the background of this whole saga, but I do find Salim Chauhan Sahib very courteous and very well mannered. He is always polite and rarely (never) uses foul language. He is one of the cleanest and nicest people I have had a chance to read. He is my hero. I love his politeness, civility and courteousness and the way he addresses other people’s relatives – with utmost respect, more respect than he shows his own relatives. It is a fact.

I also think that the other parties are also very polite and courteous and friendly. There must be some misunderstanding. I think it is the Tamashabaz people who are trying to make a mole out of a mountain.

It’s not that bad. Really.

Respectfully,

Kulharee

p.s. Happy Turkey to you all.

Editors, I think this place (echoes) has served its purpose. Now it is getting ridiculous. It will be nice to see some of the ideas and suggestions considered by you.

Re: # 123

Chowk Editor:

This attack on Salim is utterly one-sided. I think it would benefit the Chowkies to look at both sides before they pass a judgement as to who has been wronged.

Saaminasha:

Can you ask your friend who helped you extract all of Salim`s responses in one place to do the same for what you had to say at UP about Salim. And oh yes, how about directing Chowkies to the lovely pictures scout had recently posted on UP claiming it was Salim`s?

Do you know what the phrase ``looking in the mirror`` means?

Bina, Scout, Zahra, Zeena,

Thanks!

---

If anyone has the time and the stomach, read what the interactor known as ``salim_chuhan`` has posted for the last month. Notice that despite the fact that Khamkhwa and I entirely ignore him and Scout and JG rarely respond to him and that Temporal has NOT set foot on chowk.com, he continues to write the obscene posts he claims are ``humorous.``

As the current editor in chief made clear in a position that was posted on chowk.com, the editorial staff will not intercede on up. Here are the results of that stance: when interactors like salim_chuhan, queen cut and paste, etc. are being ignored, they either 1. disappear (as queen cut and paste did when I publically announced that I would not be responding to his/her posts) or, 2. they bring their abuse to the front page, even though they are not responded to here by their targets.

Why is my and my family`s name being bandied around? Why are completely untrue and unsubstantiated claims about me and other interactors found to be credible enough to remain on several fp and up pages? Why is Khamkhwa`s female relatives being obscenely written about-even though Khamkhwa has shown great restraint in responding to this interactor?

By completely ignoring this interactor, how are WE encouraging these abusive posts?





http://www.chowk.com/show_forum_topic_user_post_list.cgi?uid=Salim_Chauhan

I have to add my voice to the women protesting the abusive, vitriolic, and utterly unnecessary attacks going on on the discussion boards. I`ve read through some of them and they are utterly disgusting. Please don`t let Chowk become associated with this kind of behavior. I would like to see at least one South Asian institutione untouched by the kind of misogyny and chauvinism that our region is so famous for.

chowk staff,

Are you going to let the psychopath named Salim_Chauhan take over your website and turn it into an obscene free-for-all.

This psychopath has abused every single female on Chowk and the males who disagree with him.

And now he is bringing his baseless garbage agenda to the Front Page when neither Samina, John Galt nor me have even interacted with him there

Chowk staff
With all respect, I believe majority of interactors are sick and tired of abuse, personal attacks and especially women abuse. Please, show your responsibility and try to resolve the matters in time.

I also, believe multiple nicks should be banned. Only, interactors with one nick should be allowed.

Thanks

Re: # 116

I second Samina`s post without taking sides with anyone. Chowk`s admin should step in and get this matter resolved. This back and forth abuse on different discussion boards is extremely annoying and distasteful. There has to be an end to this menace. Even when babies fight their parents try to soothe and comfort them and serve as mediators. The administration needs to act like the concerned parents in this scenario. In my view, only then we will see some positive results.

{{{{Do restrict your comments to what you think about the site, the editorial and the overall look. Interactions on specific articles should be submitted to their designated slots. Dialogue between interactors will not be carried in this section. }}}
Thanks
Please, interactors follow above guidelines. If some of you will make this board, just like another discussion boards, it will loose it`s attraction and it`s main cause.
I appeal all of the interactors Not to interact with each other on this board. Thanks

Re: # 107

HP,

With all due respect, chowk readership has the right to now why the ONLY womanist/feminist writer on chowk.com is not a featured columnist as she was before under the new editorship.

It is as simple as that.

An Open Letter to Ginni, Safwan and Chowk.com,

From the time the new editorship has been announced, I have not responded to the interactor named ``salim chuhan`` not have I interacted with his multi nicks or associates.
My post record is on chowk.com for all to see.

And yet, ALTHOUGH I have NOT interacted on unplugged, the cyber harrassment by the interactor whom the current chief editor finds a negligible nuisance continues to write about me on UP and FP.

IS CHOWK GOING TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS?


``#163 by Salim_Chauhan on November 22, 2005 7:01am PT
Dear Farzana, Chowk Staff, and Chowkies, this is a serious alert ...

for an insidious assault on Chowkies` privacy. I believe that the previous administration, including member(s) of Chowk Staff have helped John Galt (aka JG or JagdeeshGodbole) in obtaining confidential information, such as e-mail and IP addresses, about certain Chowkies. This information has been shared with Saminasha and Scout and involves Temporal and a few other insiders. Not very long ago, a post was intercepted and it was clear that the intended victim was Dalit. Recently other victims have been myself, Queenie, and a couple of others seen as ``enemies`` by this gang of insiders. This information is discussed and exchanged in media outside of Chowk, such as e-mails and other websites and chatrooms.

While this is a breach of confidentiality and certainly against all norms of ethical conduct and possibly US laws, it is very difficult to prove in a court of law. You have to prove that the act was intentional, malicious, and resulted in tangible harm to the victims. Emotional distress is no longer a guarantee for conviction.

I have been using Anonymous IP software for a very long time to preclude my IP address from being divulged. Not that I care, but it is fun to have them think that I am in UK one minute, and then in Poland the next, while appearing in US, Canada, and even Germany during the day. Almost all my life is an open book and I really don`t care about people knowing more about me than they already do. But, I do not appreciate covert actions, behind my back, to use insider information and break a trust that was ostensibly established between Chowk and Chowkies. The identities and locations of Chowk Management are well known as are the ones for some of the criminal perptetrators. I hope they realize this.

If, however, any actual harm comes to me or my family as a result of John Galt, Temporal, Scout, or Saminasha`s despicable and immoral behavior, I will come looking for them. We can always start with Ms. McDonald and go from there.

So, here is my sincere request:
1. Chowk Management need to investigate and correct this obvious breach of confidentiality.
2. The pernicious activity by JohnGalt (JagdeeshGodbole), Temporal, Scout, and Saminasha needs to stop RIGHT NOW.
3. A simple apology from the perpertrators will suffice once this silly game is stopped.

Thanks,


[Reply to interact #163] ``

Dear chowk staff
Look at the following interactors, they are interacting on this board. Why don`t you remind them.

Let me remind them to respect chowk`s guideline for this board(echoes) which is not for interaction with each other and they are the ones talking about other interactors misbehaviour. Yes, they are setting a good example of not following the rules.

{{{{Do restrict your comments to what you think about the site, the editorial and the overall look. Interactions on specific articles should be submitted to their designated slots. Dialogue between interactors will not be carried in this section. }}}
Thanks

Re: # 112

Zahra

It’s so easy to type words sitting behind the flickering computer screen. It requires no physical effort, and for those who are incapable of thinking, no mental effort. Words are cheap and the intellectually-challenged use them like a fool uses his/her money. Hence, the emptier the vessel the louder the noise. Very few realize that in typing what they may, they are baring their souls. They are, unintentionally and voluntarily, letting us know their true nature and the material they are made of.

- knock knock

who is there?

- Suggestion

Suggestion who?

- The one you asked for

Oh.

- Can I come in?

No you cant

- But didn`t you call me?

Yeah, but I changed my mind. And you look nasty. Go away!

- I wana be taken by you.

Get lost or else I will unleash ShahSisters on you.

- Now that’s scary.

You bet ya.

- ShahSisters are my favorite, all 18 of them.

Ours too. Which one is your most favorite.

- If I have to name just one, it will have to be TamaShah

Shahtup you missy! Take you Shahjestion someplace else.

- Now that`s very Shahtupid, don`t shah think?

Re: # 108

Whether one visits Chowk after a month or a year, the same interactors are stabbing each other with constant verbal nonsense. Then if a khizr tries to route the cyber warriors on a different path, they resort to lies, cheap shots, deceit and hyperventilation. Way back, you had put forth a brief analysis and I disagreed with you. I am realizing that I was wrong. You were right, in your assessment. Just thought of acknowledging your interpretation.

Zeena! I couldn`t have said it better!!

I am surprised to see some of the interactors here have delusions that they are contributing a lot for chowk. And, every other man or wpman is rambling, except them.
For those interactors, I have a message........
1:- show me , where are your contributions for chowk???
2:-prove, that you are not rambling.
3:-everyone, regardless of who, where, what has the right to participate or to take over as many discussion boards as they can. We are not here to judge, based on our own choices or prejudices seeing only through our own lil glasses of biasedness, that we have all the right to participate on all discussion boards. Calling people moron with out any specific reason is itself abusive towards other interactors , which shows, interactors who utter such abuse are clearly angry and mad for their own personal reasons. Chow.com is for all to participate, not for specific group of people...........Thanks

Re: # 106

``The most amusing factor is that those who have little to contribute are taking over...with their ramblings.``

Empty vessel makes more noise!

#105 by Saminasha

“Does the Editor in Chief believe it is in her duties to deign to explain to readers why:”

I don’t think Editors owe anything to you or others to explain why Bina is here or not. That is a decision between Bina and the chowk management. She was good but people move on.


If you don`t like Hamzaad, please don`t read him but it is still Chowk`s decision. Don`t you think?

On Chowk.com

Change is necessary. In that respect, the layout change is a pleasant move. In fact, the layout should be updated at least once a year. Change is also a sign of constant improvement. It shows that someone is thinking behind the scenes. That`s a positive indicator.

What I am unable to understand is the nastiness and distraction that is becoming part and parcel of several discussion boards on Chowk. The most amusing factor is that those who have little to contribute are taking over many discussion boards with their ramblings. This includes both men and women on Chowk. It`s a shame to see adults behaving like morons. Probably many of these morons need to be sent to a Chowk shrink.

Does the Editor in Chief believe it is in her duties to deign to explain to readers why:

1. Bina Shah, author of two published and well received books, several fairly intelligent and coherent articles, and explorer of the endangered species ``women`s issues`` and ``feminism`` no longer has a column on chowk.com?

Is her no nonsense and clearly focused viewpoint too lip and not enough lipstick for the editorial staff?

2. Why, the ``cunting`` and ``bitching`` interactor Hamzaad`s pieces are now regular front page material?

Chowk.com: Catapulting to hell in a handbag.

=== Interact Filtered ===
view this users filtered interacts

=== Interact Removed ===

Re: # 17
I second godot`s suggestion; but with just one amendment. Only interactors with rating 4 should be allowed to post realtime. Everyone else`s posts should be made to go through the editor`s filters.

Is Bina Shah no longer a columnist at Chowk.com?

Please explain.

=== Interact Filtered ===
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Ok Chowk editors - Here is a feedback for you

Chowk survey

Friends

Chowk editors write that "We value your voice as much as ours". It is feedback time. Some of you joined me creating this feedback. Thanks for doing that. Following feedback is based on people who responded and does not represent a scientific study. Results may be skewed because few respondents (I think only one) may have had fun with survey site. Presented data is from survey. Comments are mine. Enjoy (or complain if you want- I don`t care)

1. Is Farzana Versey proper choice for Chowk editor?

I do not think that is a million dollar question for most of us. Outcome does not affect us in real life. Number of active participants of Chowk appear to have gone down in last 5 years and now it only gets few loyal visitors. Farzana got 35% yes vote and that is quite impressive.

Yes	11
No	20
Total	31

2. How successful Chowk has been in meeting its stated objectives? (1- not at all, 5 - most successful)

Chowk states

Chowk is a platform to publish, discuss and debate writings on a variety of issues that are important to the people of India, Pakistan, and other South Asian countries. It is a place to:

express and exchange ideas
discover eclectic thoughts
get useful information
meet new people
engage in social change
enjoy and educate yourself

In general there appears to be almost 40% clear-cut "no" votes. "Engage in social change" score shows very clearly that Chowk is not contributing toward any social change. My personal feeling is that interaction on Chowk has converted many moderates to hard-core fanatics. Still, an above 50% should be quite satisfactory for editors.

	No	May be	Yes	Score
express and exchange ideas	14	8	9	53%
discover eclectic thoughts	14	7	10	55.40%
get useful information	15	6	10	54.80%
meet new people	16	2	13	56.20%
engage in social change	20	2	9	46.40%
enjoy and educate yourself	13	8	10	54.80%

3. Rate following interactors on the basis of whether you will like to have them as friend in real life

This is fun part. Almost all chowkies hate other chowkies ;-). Dost-Mitter is a clear winner of popularity contest. You can make your own conclusions about people at the bottom of the list.

	No	May be	Yes	Score
Atif	14	6	10	52.60%
Saleem	15	2	18	66.60%
TAhmed	20	6	3	37.20%
Scout	15	6	10	53.60%
Farzana	21	4	6	42.00%
Yaseer	17	3	10	50.60%
Behram	21	5	4	36.60%
Urstruly	13	11	6	50.60%
Dost-mitter	9	10	11	62.60%
Temporal	14	4	11	53.00%
Zeena	16	9	6	49.60%
FerozK	12	7	11	55.40%
Sadna	12	8	10	54.00%
Godot	19	6	6	45.20%
Faisaluno	19	5	6	45.40%
Khamakhwa	14	5	11	53.40%

I was never ever mean or rude or abusive to Farzana Versey. I know her, since 2002 on chowk. I never liked her articles. I never liked her ideas. I have always criticised her in the past , but, with respect. I never ever disrespected Farzana versey. I have the right to criticise writters in a healthy way, not in an abusive way. I have all the right to my opinion, so, do you.

Any one can criticise any time ,but, the only thing I hated and I was extremely mad at is/ was , when someone abuses Honourable and respectable people in a an extremely derogatory way.

I do not have any personal issues with Farzana Versey. Infact, I do not know her personally. I do not wish to know her either in person. But, this is all virtual world and all of us have equal right to show our dislike or criticism over someone , who will be chief editor of a web site, where we spent our precious time . Our time is also very important , I have to see who is running the show. This is important for me.
Chowk staff
Please, look at the post , where did I show my mean behaviour towards farzana Versey?? I am critical, I will be critical , I was critical. Look at the following words......................
{{{Farzana Versey
Don`t you know the international rules and regulations of internet????
If, you do, you also have to set strict rules here or else, resign from your chief editor ship. I believe, Saminasha will be much much better CHIEF EDITOR. She has all the sense to run a web site. or Temporal was the best for running this web site......
As for as Farzana Versey is, yes I never liked her articles. But, choosing her as chief editor of chowk and then her response that she will not be responsible for Un Plugged , she will not appreciate COMPLAINTS, she will not take care of any abuse or porno pictures here, makes me nuseated, this is sick, absolutely sick...................
Being chief editor is a very sensitive job. It is samething, if some President of country after being elected announces that he will not be responsible for any CRIME in the country. All criminals are wellcome to committ crimes in this country iunder my rule.
Sorry, I can`t be part of this new version of crime chowk.com .................... }}}}}}}}}}}}}}

Now, where did I abuse her??? Yes, I can`t be part of a web site where chief editor encourages abuse by showing indifference or by discouraging complaints...................
I believe
Healthy criticism is the most CONSTRUCTIVE thing to do for the improvement of any web site . If, all I do praise, praise and praise ................
Well, that won`t work. I am not here to form groups. If, you dislike some ionteractors here on this web site. I don`t care, that is your own personal choice. Unless you abuse any female, I won`t say a word. You have all the right to dislike or to be critical about anyone here.

But, I will stand for women rights, if, you will abuse women here .

I respect all as a fellow interactor. I request all NOT TO PATRONIZE me . I will NOT PATRONIZE you, either.

If, Farzana Versey will show us an improved , unbiased, decent and NON abusive web site. I will definitely admire her. But, if, she will not care whats going on. She doesn`t deserve my admiration.
PS:-Even, though I did not like her indifference for UP abuse for women, still as a courtsey, I congratulated her and sent her virtual roses on her appointment as cheif editor. I still do. But, I reserve my right of admiration for her. Thanks

Ana! Ana!! you too brutus!! Harassing a poor creature like me...
My survey feedback is ready. Will post as soon as Chowk allows it.

1) Name one boradcast, print, or web where the editor is selected based on popularity contest?

Answer: All the main stream media from Fox news to The New Republic.

friend,

why don`t you (and perhaps some of the others) just walk away without the whining. go wine yourself instead! obviously, not everyone is being heard here. there is ``being heard`` and then there is ``noise.`` deal with what category you fall into and move on.

and ask yourself this. . . have godot`s posts been filtered often enough for his thinking that some of us get what`s coming to us. if you can`t think hard enough, the answer is no. so why cry like a baby, chin up dude, move on.

``speak wisely -- you will be heard!`` LOL

and i`m addressing this to you risking being removed, because this is just noise as well. just like ninetysomething percent of the posts have been. contribute wisely, man. that is what really matters. ye rona dhona drama spamming nahiN chalega! hargiz nahiN!

i am the weakest link. goodbye!

There is too much whining in this section from farigh people. For your
benefit and ours, put a limit of 100 words max. Most sensible people
are able to formulate a suggestion in that space.

Dear Ms. Editor, after reading your editorial (another brick in your head) I, a relatively new member at Chowk, appreciate all that you are set to do. Good luck with running this place. Here are two more suggestions.

(I am not a computer technical person, so #1 may not be technically doable).

#1. The homepage real estate is too dense, it should be less crowded. Many a times, quality stuff gets buried under so much mish-mash. If there can be a scrolling banner type mechanism to display some of the stuff which is mostly archival, can be accessed by clicking “More”. Similarly, I-Logs – no need to display all the recent I-Loggies, just display “Today’s I-Logs” – and if someone is interested in reading, can click on “More”. The saved-up real estate can be used for other more important announcements, features, etc.

#2. One of the things that attracted me to this place was an active Indian participation. Keeping that in mind, I think there can be some mechanism to have collaboration (or combative collaboration). Chowk should have a weekly bi-Column (not as in homosexuals) but a regular feature presenting two different perspectives (an Indian, and a Pakistani) on current affairs – e.g., Earthquake, Scooter Libby, Bush in Asia, etc. In this bi-Column, two guest writers will write brief (there should be word limit of say 150 max) standpoints.. (((Obviously more thought needs to go into it))). The name of this feature column can be “Line of Control”. Unlike the regular contributions, this Column will only discuss current happenings, pretty much like “Week In Review” of the Sunday NYTimes, or like the featured articles in the World Press Review or similar to the now defunct CNN’s Cross-Fire, Hannity and Colms, Thelma and Louise, you get the idea. This bi-Column will be pretty much like WPR but limited only to Indian and Pakistani PsOV.

Here’s a little sample:

---

Atal B. Hindu – Reporting from Vesakhapatnam

The recent bombings in Amman Jordan clearly indicate that the chickens have come home to roost. Jordan has for too long stayed on the sidelines (despite having cordial relations with Israel) and have done nothing to address the religious fanaticism in the Arab world. If anything, Jordanian Secret Police has been complacent in silencing the voices of change, both within its borders, and within Middle East at large. Jordan has the highest rate of Honor Killing per capita in the world… Down with the King…… blah blah blah……


Aulad K. Khan – Reporting from Peshawar

The bombs in Jordan only prove that the struggle to liberate Iraq has now moved beyond its borders. The female freedom fighter who is arrested by Jordanians lost 4 of her brothers to the bullets of the occupying Zionists. Ina Lilaha Waina Alahe Rajioon… It is incumbent upon the Islamic world to stand together with our brothers and sisters in Iraq. Death to America…. Blah blah blah….

Chowk editors,
Look look, Godot is stalking me ;-) She is not doing anything meaningful, no feedback, no suggestions. Only thing she is doing is ``criticism`` and that too of me.

Do I have your kind permission to draw her attention to your rule ``Dialogue between interactors will not be carried in this section. ``. You may also tell her that ``survey`` will finally help you what I/we ``think about the site, the editorial and the overall look``. Also tell her that ``dangal`` ki zagah unplugged per hai.

Re: # 90

``friend``

Getting too hot for you in the kitchen? Running for cover, eh?

Where are your answers? Why don`t you tell the Editor what to do with your posts on this board?

Chowk editor
I am requesting you one more time to stop Godot. She is stalking and harassing me. She has no right to indulge in private interactions on this board.

Re: # 87

``harrassing me``

Well, there`s an irony if I ever saw one!

what is the editors nic while interacting on chowk....

Chowk editor
Godot is harrassing me.. Ban her nick.

Re: # 85

friend

If you feel you have a right to conduct a survey on this board, I`ve a right to question its authencity.

Now answer the 2 questions:

1) Name one boradcast, print, or web where the editor is selected based on popularity contest?

2) How many times an individual can submit your survey?

If you cannot come up with answers then tell the Editor what to do with your posts and your userid.

chowk editors
Can you please remove Godot`s interacts on this page? He is ignoring your guidelines ;-) Ban her for few days

Re: # 82

My dear ``friend``

How many times can an individual submit your survey (just provide a number between 1 and infinity)? How authentic does that make your survey?

Re: # 81

friend

``Create an online survey to find out how many Chowkies think that FV is a good choice for chowk editor.``

Can you name any boradcast, print, or web where the editor is selected based on popularity contest?

``find out if Chowk is serving its purpose and need.``

And what do you think Chowk`s ``purpose`` is and which ``need`` it`s suppose to be serving?

People


Click here to take an Online Survey on Chowk

Chowk staff,
One more suggestion (though it is quite clear that you know all and will not read it)..

Create an online survey to find out how many Chowkies think that FV is a good choice for chowk editor. Also find out if Chowk is serving its purpose and need.

Chowk staff
{{speak wisely, you will be herad>}}}
When, we will be heard??After one century???
Why you do not respond to us immediately and stop this women abuse on Un Plugged??
Or, else I believe it is chowk staff and Farzana Versey who are harrassing women under different nicks.

Farzana Versey
Stop playing with words. Sometimes it is good to play with words, but, there are times when you have to be practical. Being chief ediotr, IT IS YOUR JOB TO POLICE THE CHOWK,ESPECIALLY UNPLUGGED. If, you will not police, and let men abuse women the way it is going on with no rules and regulations, Which direction will you take chowk to???
Obviously, you are encouraging chowk to become an abusive criminal web site with NO respect left for each other and for women. I condemn your policy...........

chowk staff
Since, Farzana Versey has joined the office, this chowk web site has become fish market. It was very interesting when Saima Shah was the chief editor. She cared for chowk`s interact guidelines. She was a decent woman of principles. Farzana versey is just the opposite of Saima Shah. Chowk has become a TAMASHA where khamkhwa and catchy are harrassing me and stalking me. They have NO life left. I feel sorry for these two persons who are stalking a stranger woman 24 hours/7 days.

Chowk has become just an insult to interact for fair people. Good for Saminasha and others who left. I am also leaving this web site. But, I think, khamkhwa and catchy just feel pleasure to stalk me. and I can not please them any more. Good for khamkhwa and catchy.
Now, they will stalk someone else.
used to enjoy chowk when it was just benign site with some standards, now, this web site is nothing more than a gutter....................I mean it. This gutter stinks.

Farzana Versey
Don`t you know the international rules and regulations of internet????
If, you do, you also have to set strict rules here or else, resign from your chief editor ship. I believe, Saminasha will be much much better CHIEF EDITOR. She has all the sense to run a web site. or Temporal was the best for running this web site......
As for as Farzana Versey is, yes I never liked her articles. But, choosing her as chief editor of chowk and then her response that she will not be responsible for Un Plugged , she will not appreciate COMPLAINTS, she will not take care of any abuse or porno pictures here, makes me nuseated, this is sick, absolutely sick...................
Being chief editor is a very sensitive job. It is samething, if some President of country after being elected announces that he will not be responsible for any CRIME in the country. All criminals are wellcome to committ crimes in this country under my rule.
Sorry, I can`t be part of this new version of crime chowk.com ....................

some words from Farzana`s editorial and my response to them:

``“Who is Chowk staff?” was the question asked several times until just the other day, appended with adjectives about cowardice, invisibility and waywardness. Now, when I am here to take responsibility, the comment being made is about how you miss the ‘enigma’ that was Chowk!``

and then later..

``Chowk has not done that. It has given you the power to be yourself – together with that power comes responsibility. Clearly, not everyone is equipped for that. ``



Clearly, you can do better to use that `power` in a responsible way.

Actions speak louder than words Farzana. It`s easy to claim responsibility but to exercise it is another matter. You have not exercised it yet. Interactors and their families pictures are being posted along with copyright infringements, I emailed chowk staff to remove them.
But there is silence. So don`t talk about `responsibility` until you can really take it.

It`s all loose talk and loose talk is easy.

copyright infringement and publication of interactor`s pictures without their permission:


is this allowed on chowk?

someone on unplugged posted a picture from a copyrighted site, a picture of an interactor and her family

i emailed chowk staff with the request to remove the interactor, and there was silence


Farzana,

Do you allow women and their families to be subjected to this kind of illegal `exposure` on this website?

dear sir,
i was told that my article, `mullah, mosque & state` has been published in Chowk but i did not found the same, please let me know about the fate of my article.
thanks
aftab alam advocate

... father raymond was RIGHT... i am going blind coz i swear i saw a news item `karachi blasted` on the front page a while ago, which i can`t see no more...i should have listened to the old padre and not used my palms...

after all the good suggestions for the format of the front page, the front page remains the same.... a colorful, clownish, verbal vomitus


and they ask us for suggestions...... what a farce

Re: # 61

We don`t expect - we demand a revolution! Please provide!!!

I think # 210 is a brilliant idea

I realize it`s a personal thing but i find sites that are not cluttered nor complicated to look at very inviting. Interestingly, I find that the color stripes on the front page a turn off - i have to make a special effort to go to those articles. I also note that they have had a lot fewer clicks.
I also realize that you`re trying to make this look more like a magazine than a blog site. Therefore it`s hard to know how complicated in appearance this can be while keeping the visual appeal.
Also, articles that invite a lot of interest could be pushed to the margin before they are pushed off the front page. This way their transition into oblivion will be more gradual.

Re: # 209 Keeping up appearances, is what seperates Democracy from
other other forms of govt.

I read write-ups at Chowk with interest, but sometimes I cant help say to myself: Fuk it (I say that while I clinch my fists real tight). The journalistic component on this website is pretty edgy, but some of the subsequent discussions end up in fist-fights among Chowkies. E.g., Indians blaming everything on Pakistanis, and half of Pakistanis blaming Pakistanis, and the remaining are divided between India haters and Jew haters. Once in a while, you find an Indian hating other Indians. One cannot but notice that this tension, if you will, is what makes this place tick. This tension also brings Pakistanis closer to other Pakistanis and Indians and Jews. Therefore, it might not be a bad idea to have a new tab labeled “Gleason’s Gym” – a Boxing gym in Brooklyn where over a 100 Boxing Champions trained (including heavy weights like Mohammad Ali, Mike Tyson, George Foreman). Most recently, Hilary Swank, the “Million Dollar Baby” trained there for her role.

The purpose of “Gleason’s Gym” will be to have a purely dedicated section for Indo-Pak (and Pak-Pak) rivalry, because as it is, every discussion gets corrupted by the useless bare-knuckle fights between the various groups, and very rarely is there is a knockout. In this section, there will always be a knockout. You be the referee.

While I am not it… Since Chowk is tabbed into various sub-sections named inappropriately without any significance to what is being discussed there (I never heard the name Leafyglade until I came here – I still don’t have a clue what it means – I am clinching my fists again), I think some of the other tabs should also be re-named. “Gymkhana” sends very upper crusty vibes for a section’s name. I avoid going there caz the name intimidates me. I think you shouldn’t be so abstract, and should choose more user-friendly (and lower middle class) names for various sections. Not everyone lives in Gulberg. My German colleague once was very surprised to know that we have places in Pakistan named in Duetche;;; I told him, Gulberg is not on the Neckar, and is prettier than Heidelberg.

WHAT HAPPENED TO THE USUAL LOOK???????????????????????????

Updating without warning is like eating pizza for breakfast.................................

#210


Correction: It should read as “There shouldn’t be a need for “Ignored By”….

I think the peer rating system in one’s profile should be done away with. What purpose does it actually serve? I mean, ain’t everyone equal, a few more equal than others. Similarly, there’s should be a need for “ignored by”. One can always be “manually” ignored. These were suggestions for cosmetic appearance. Now for the content:

There should be a place to list articles submitted (pretty much like monitors at the airport arrival halls). Like this:

- Dogs and Military – by Romair – Submitted on 11/6/98 – To be reviewed
- MukhtaraN Mai and Starbucks – by Urstruly – Under Review
- India Pakistan and US in a threesum – by Dulla Bhatti – Rejected due to adult language
- Waterhose and Hydraulics – by Mr. Gill – to be published on 11/12/05

Such a status of submissions will give the Chowkies an idea of what exciting stuff to look forward to, and also to make vacation plans accordingly.

Re: # 207

...personally i recommend removal of this good for nothing `letters to editor` section...it does not serve any purpose except to put the editors under unnecessary pressure and a chance to losers to get closer to the power base through the tried and tested mantra of flattery and apple polishing...neither are you going to implement any of the recommendations that may not fit in with your world-view, so why this painful excercise in pretence and `democracy`...be honest...thank you.

It has been 48 hours and I am still awaiting a reply from chowk staff in the feedback section.

I ask chowk staff (yet again) to make public the list of chowk interactors who are empowered to ban posters and censor posts.

Dear Chowk Edtior:

My post #77 was not about a suggestion how to improve this site and should be removed, not “filtered,” just as all other posts on this board that have nothing to do with the editorial content of this site and ideas as to how to improve Chowk.

A philistine with too much time on his hand seems bent on destroying this site, or at least make it as unpleasant for the visitors as possible. This is a filthy virus and, like all other viruses, must be put to rest.

Again, I suggest you take away the ability for the users to post in real time on this board and edit the posts before you publish it, or this board will become just another thread of the unruly Unplugged of the morally and intellectually corrupt and experts in abuse.

Sincerely,
Godot

Re: # 67 Wah bai, tu te bari aqal di gallaN karda aieN...tenu kenay
andar aan ditta ?. :)

Good job man. Keep the faith.

Re: # 55 Um...............YEAH!. Like, totally.

SaimaShah,

Thank YOU :)

To the current Chowk staff,

Thank YOU too for filtering out Beej.

To the Editor in Chief,

Make us believe that you are what is best for this beloved website. Good luck.

Dear Chowk Editor:

I thought it was a great idea to provide space for the Chowkies to write directly to the Editor suggesting ideas as to how we the writers, the readers and the interactors can contribute in making this site our home where we come to learn, discuss and enjoy.

Noble idea as it is, there are some elements who know nothing other than abuse. I suggest that you should take the ability from the interactors to post in real time, at least on this Letter to Editor board. If a post has nothing to do with an idea or a suggestion re improvement of Chowk, the post should simply not be posted. This should also make “filter” unnecessary on this board.

Sincerely,
Godot

#61
``This space should, however, be treated as a `Letter to the Ed` with suggestions/comments and not to get into a dialogue with one another as has been clearly stated.``

Let us give it a try.. At least now editor has a face and not a god like creature hidden somehwere on seventh level.

Dead editor sahiba,
Here are some suggestions. Will wait for your response.
0. Avoid trying to solve Indo-Pak issues on this forum. Chowk has become a playground of arm chair experts who have not been able to achieve anything in their life other than writing 5000+ posts on chowk. For one year, DO NOT publish anything on contemporary Indo-pak relations. Chowkies are not mature enough to participate in such discussion.
1. Publish lots of short stories and literature - if you do not get good stu