Rahul Malviya July 11, 2006
#52 Posted by echoboom on July 13, 2006 11:50:05 pm
Qalander Baksh J`uraat:
``Kyaa baat hai , kyaa baat hai, kyaa baat hai Vallah``!
``Kyaa baat hai , kyaa baat hai, kyaa baat hai Vallah``!
#49 Posted by mannyd on July 13, 2006 12:48:47 am
Rahul:
I read this poem a long long time ago in high school Hindi class. It is a superb poem. I loved it then and loved it now. Thank you for doing the fine translation and kudos to Chowk staff for publishing it.
BJK,
Thanks for the update on the poet`s life. I did not realize that MP was a Khadi boli state or that ML Chaturvadi was born so long ago. If you have some time, can you please tell a Punjabi about various HIndi dialects and where they are or were spoken?
I read this poem a long long time ago in high school Hindi class. It is a superb poem. I loved it then and loved it now. Thank you for doing the fine translation and kudos to Chowk staff for publishing it.
BJK,
Thanks for the update on the poet`s life. I did not realize that MP was a Khadi boli state or that ML Chaturvadi was born so long ago. If you have some time, can you please tell a Punjabi about various HIndi dialects and where they are or were spoken?
#48 Posted by echoboom on July 12, 2006 6:16:35 pm
Charlie was kind enough to bring this truly great piece of literature. If ever one piece of poetry thoroughly encapsulated the state of affairs in Denmark ..errr Tattastaan, here it is:
#47 Posted by echoboom on July 12, 2006 2:33:17 pm
Inquirer:
All poetry, like cusine, has flavour entrenched the recesses of cultural-memory & gets evoked by aromas. Sometimes ithe taste needs to be cultivated & acquired in the right `company`.
``Romantic`` interludes of the Paak & Pavittar kind work wonders for the passionate kind.
It is so unfortunate that because of our learn-to-earn & matter-over-mind acculturation by the western-thuggs have robbed majority of our own of their sense of aesthetics. Much-music monkeys have hogged the scene & they are the true terrorists who are trying to make our home-grown ( how sad I`ve to use this phrase) look backward.
Hindi poetry, especially old one is awesome, but the hindi-background ones have self-loathing & self-hate and they think that the only way to look smart & modern is to embrace the new-kid-on-block power. This has been the bane of Hindus from day one & until & unless they clutch to their roots and also enjoy swaying in the breeze they always get grafted with another fruit.
Listen to the poetry here & see what a wonderful work the poet has done with the situation.
Hindi poetry is always at its best with dance--this is where they excel at.
The girl is dreaming & the rain (tears) which elude her have suddenly made her happy. She looks in the mirror & puts Kohl in the image rather than her own eyes...
If you`ve not seen the movie carefully you`ve missed much. Bhupinder has done wonders.
javascript:openWindow(`http://www.aiol.com/entertainment/cgi-bin/play.cgi?m=a&f=Lata - 10.rmj`)
All poetry, like cusine, has flavour entrenched the recesses of cultural-memory & gets evoked by aromas. Sometimes ithe taste needs to be cultivated & acquired in the right `company`.
``Romantic`` interludes of the Paak & Pavittar kind work wonders for the passionate kind.
It is so unfortunate that because of our learn-to-earn & matter-over-mind acculturation by the western-thuggs have robbed majority of our own of their sense of aesthetics. Much-music monkeys have hogged the scene & they are the true terrorists who are trying to make our home-grown ( how sad I`ve to use this phrase) look backward.
Hindi poetry, especially old one is awesome, but the hindi-background ones have self-loathing & self-hate and they think that the only way to look smart & modern is to embrace the new-kid-on-block power. This has been the bane of Hindus from day one & until & unless they clutch to their roots and also enjoy swaying in the breeze they always get grafted with another fruit.
Listen to the poetry here & see what a wonderful work the poet has done with the situation.
Hindi poetry is always at its best with dance--this is where they excel at.
The girl is dreaming & the rain (tears) which elude her have suddenly made her happy. She looks in the mirror & puts Kohl in the image rather than her own eyes...
If you`ve not seen the movie carefully you`ve missed much. Bhupinder has done wonders.
javascript:openWindow(`http://www.aiol.com/entertainment/cgi-bin/play.cgi?m=a&f=Lata - 10.rmj`)
#51 Posted by Inquirer on July 13, 2006 2:34:23 pm
Re: # 47, echoboom:
Thanks alot. I intend to find Lata`s Magic Moments in full.
Thanks alot. I intend to find Lata`s Magic Moments in full.
#45 Posted by rahulmal on July 12, 2006 10:55:24 am
Inquirer (30),
Thanks for your calming influence! I still can’t get over the fact that Delhi, Urstruly et. all find this masterful poetry …childish. Frankly speaking, I don’t care much about the translation for I don’t fancy myself as any author-shother, but to dismiss this beautiful thought as nonsensical prattle is criminal.
Shobs,
Nothing serious man, just that I checked the site after a few days. Your concern is moving, everyone is fine.
Thanks for your calming influence! I still can’t get over the fact that Delhi, Urstruly et. all find this masterful poetry …childish. Frankly speaking, I don’t care much about the translation for I don’t fancy myself as any author-shother, but to dismiss this beautiful thought as nonsensical prattle is criminal.
Shobs,
Nothing serious man, just that I checked the site after a few days. Your concern is moving, everyone is fine.
#46 Posted by Inquirer on July 12, 2006 1:57:46 pm
Re: # 45, rahulmal:
You are a bit too hard on the urdu lovers. Hindi poetry has the spontaneity of simplicity but Urdu shaayarii delights in esoteric sophistication. Both are totally enjoyable. Look at the Urdu imagery of # echoboom (#15) and urstruly (#16). Of course I never like to fail to add my own scent to the Urdu gems, see (#19) and (#20).
I was happy to read echoboom`s (#35). Some of the Hindu interactors are becoming riotous at Chowk, they seem to have lost the Hinduness of tolerance that charaterzes us, I think.
You are a bit too hard on the urdu lovers. Hindi poetry has the spontaneity of simplicity but Urdu shaayarii delights in esoteric sophistication. Both are totally enjoyable. Look at the Urdu imagery of # echoboom (#15) and urstruly (#16). Of course I never like to fail to add my own scent to the Urdu gems, see (#19) and (#20).
I was happy to read echoboom`s (#35). Some of the Hindu interactors are becoming riotous at Chowk, they seem to have lost the Hinduness of tolerance that charaterzes us, I think.
#44 Posted by rahulmal on July 12, 2006 10:17:40 am
Harish, Khadiboli, Bjk, Burps, Shobs,
Thanks for the kind words! I explained the patchy transliteration in my last interact, nevertheless, sorry for the confusion caused.
Like I mentioned, translation is not everybody’s cup of tea. It is highly unlikely for an Average Joe to do justice to the original. My rationale for submitting it here was that some people who had never heard this poem before may get pointers and be able to enjoy the original. At the same time, I’m open to suggestions which can make the translation more enjoyable.
Inquirer,
I think I had downloaded the original from some university site. In the interact above, Bjk has typed from printed text and the piece I used for translation seems to be in line with it.
Thanks for the kind words! I explained the patchy transliteration in my last interact, nevertheless, sorry for the confusion caused.
Like I mentioned, translation is not everybody’s cup of tea. It is highly unlikely for an Average Joe to do justice to the original. My rationale for submitting it here was that some people who had never heard this poem before may get pointers and be able to enjoy the original. At the same time, I’m open to suggestions which can make the translation more enjoyable.
Inquirer,
I think I had downloaded the original from some university site. In the interact above, Bjk has typed from printed text and the piece I used for translation seems to be in line with it.
#42 Posted by rahulmal on July 12, 2006 9:58:36 am
Echo,
When I tried this translation, I also used to try my hands at ITRANS. It was really enjoyable to write some text in Latin script per their prescribed format and see it turning to Devanagari. Probably, the goof-ups in the transliteration are a result of the playing around with that tool. Maybe I got so obsessed with the output that it was churning out that I didn`t put much thought into the consistency partt. The poem is written in the official Khadiboli dialect.
I fail to see the similarity between this poem and the I posted by you exceptfor the broad theme of personification. The former is a eulogy to the spirit of sacrifice for the motherland, the latter a lament by a lifeless object whose angst is exacerbated by the death shroud. I appreciate the sentiments expressed, just that I fail to make the connection. The second one is a classical religious conundrum. I recall reading somewhere a similar question posed by Martin Luther – the protestant reformer. In Christianity, Christ’s sacrifice is supposed to deliver the mankind from its sins (the caveat is that you believe in Christ as your saviour). “Then, why not can we continue with our sinful ways, our deliverance being promised by Christ’s death at the cross” asked ML :-)
Another problem is that translation is a tricky business. One needs to have a healthy understanding of both languages, appreciation of the social, cultural and historical background of the original and be able to map the writing style of the original to the closest, if not exact fit, in the language the piece is being translated to. When these criteria are not met, translations make a perfectly fine work appear crude and unfulfilling. My translation fails to do justice to the beautiful original and I suspect the same is the case with the pieces posted by you.
When I tried this translation, I also used to try my hands at ITRANS. It was really enjoyable to write some text in Latin script per their prescribed format and see it turning to Devanagari. Probably, the goof-ups in the transliteration are a result of the playing around with that tool. Maybe I got so obsessed with the output that it was churning out that I didn`t put much thought into the consistency partt. The poem is written in the official Khadiboli dialect.
I fail to see the similarity between this poem and the I posted by you exceptfor the broad theme of personification. The former is a eulogy to the spirit of sacrifice for the motherland, the latter a lament by a lifeless object whose angst is exacerbated by the death shroud. I appreciate the sentiments expressed, just that I fail to make the connection. The second one is a classical religious conundrum. I recall reading somewhere a similar question posed by Martin Luther – the protestant reformer. In Christianity, Christ’s sacrifice is supposed to deliver the mankind from its sins (the caveat is that you believe in Christ as your saviour). “Then, why not can we continue with our sinful ways, our deliverance being promised by Christ’s death at the cross” asked ML :-)
Another problem is that translation is a tricky business. One needs to have a healthy understanding of both languages, appreciation of the social, cultural and historical background of the original and be able to map the writing style of the original to the closest, if not exact fit, in the language the piece is being translated to. When these criteria are not met, translations make a perfectly fine work appear crude and unfulfilling. My translation fails to do justice to the beautiful original and I suspect the same is the case with the pieces posted by you.
#41 Posted by rahulmal on July 12, 2006 9:20:14 am
Checked my mail just now and realized that my translation has been published. This is quite surprising!
Last year, my office was quite a long distance from my home and I used to hum familiar tunes during the commute. On one of these boring and taxing commutes, I was trying to recall the old songs telecast on DoorDarshan (DD).
For those not in the know, DD is the official channel. It was the only channel broadcast during the government monopoly days. People who were introduced to the idiot box before the cable TV boom still have some fond memories of DD. The serials like ‘Hum Log’, ‘Buniyaad’ etc. had a loyal following and some stars in the contemporary mass media scene like Prannoy Roy made their start with informational programmes like The World This Week. DD being the government organ took its social obligations very seriously and beamed informational and educative programs from time to time. One of the ways of disseminating these inspirational messages was using songs. So, there was ‘Mile Sur Mera Tumhara’ (national integration), ‘Padhna Likhna Seekho’ (education), ‘Ek Chidiya, Anek Chidiya’ (unity is strength) etc. etc. ‘Chah nahin main surbaala ke’ was one of my favourites. The tune was rendered extremely well (probably some classical singer) and the video was shot very aesthetically. Jut picture a 5ish boy and girl, very innocent and cute – manifestations of God’s kindness, dressed in white pyjama kurta a nd lehenga choli respectively, walking on the path to Gandhiji’s Samadhi, their little palms holding a few petals. I always found the combination of the soothing background score and the imagery very captivating.
After I was able to recall a few lines from the aforementioned song, I set out to search the poem. The poem was too appealing to not try my hands at translation, so I did, and submitted the same to Chowk last year. I recall getting a response to the effect that they needed some more meat about the poet, writing style etc. The matters of bread kept me busy and I could never get a chance to read up more on the poet. So it is pleasant surprise to see it here …
Last year, my office was quite a long distance from my home and I used to hum familiar tunes during the commute. On one of these boring and taxing commutes, I was trying to recall the old songs telecast on DoorDarshan (DD).
For those not in the know, DD is the official channel. It was the only channel broadcast during the government monopoly days. People who were introduced to the idiot box before the cable TV boom still have some fond memories of DD. The serials like ‘Hum Log’, ‘Buniyaad’ etc. had a loyal following and some stars in the contemporary mass media scene like Prannoy Roy made their start with informational programmes like The World This Week. DD being the government organ took its social obligations very seriously and beamed informational and educative programs from time to time. One of the ways of disseminating these inspirational messages was using songs. So, there was ‘Mile Sur Mera Tumhara’ (national integration), ‘Padhna Likhna Seekho’ (education), ‘Ek Chidiya, Anek Chidiya’ (unity is strength) etc. etc. ‘Chah nahin main surbaala ke’ was one of my favourites. The tune was rendered extremely well (probably some classical singer) and the video was shot very aesthetically. Jut picture a 5ish boy and girl, very innocent and cute – manifestations of God’s kindness, dressed in white pyjama kurta a nd lehenga choli respectively, walking on the path to Gandhiji’s Samadhi, their little palms holding a few petals. I always found the combination of the soothing background score and the imagery very captivating.
After I was able to recall a few lines from the aforementioned song, I set out to search the poem. The poem was too appealing to not try my hands at translation, so I did, and submitted the same to Chowk last year. I recall getting a response to the effect that they needed some more meat about the poet, writing style etc. The matters of bread kept me busy and I could never get a chance to read up more on the poet. So it is pleasant surprise to see it here …
#40 Posted by shobig_sifar on July 12, 2006 7:16:26 am
Hope Rahul and all his loved ones are doing fine, he hasn`t interacted or responded to any query on this board yet. From what I know he is based in Bangalore, which is quite distant from Mumbai...but you never know...
AmaN Maulvi sahib, sab khairiat tau hai na? jald ittela`a bheijo
AmaN Maulvi sahib, sab khairiat tau hai na? jald ittela`a bheijo
#36 Posted by hush on July 11, 2006 10:05:26 pm
Here is the Jhansi Wali Rani in Audio.
http://www.historytalking.com/hindi.htm
http://www.historytalking.com/hindi.htm
#35 Posted by echoboom on July 11, 2006 8:25:49 pm
#2:
Being deeply interested in poetry from all sources I couldn`t resist looking for it..and I found it!
I admire Jhansi Kee Rani tremendously. She is part of our glorious & true freedom struggle. Not the kind obtained by moving paper or lip or performing weird-antics.
USA walks tall because it FOUGHT the colonisers. [ America was a British colony]. Most of others got APPOINTED as loyal servants of the DOMINION; Hence a rot there to this day.
Chinese too kicked them out.
Wealth & prosperity will never ever cleanse the minds & muscles. The Rajas were no less opulent & the public not as poor then--just like the Saudis & Everyone knows the real story as to who is the ``king`` & who is the ``king-on-a-string``.
I respect people from ALL faiths. Anyone true to his/her own faith/community/culture/cuisine/clothing WILL never ever be a traitor. The other kind are far far worse than even ``terrorists``. They are zilch--simply JOBBERS.
With LOVE to true Independance loving hindus: Here it is
Bundeley Harbolon key munh hamney suni kahani thi,
Khoob ladi mardani woh to Jhansi wali Rani thi.
Lakshmi thi ya Durga thi woh swayan veerta ki avatar,
dekh Marathey pulkit hotey uski talwaron key vaar,
nakli yudh-vyuh ki rachna aur khelna khub shikar,
sainya gherna, durg todna yeh they uskey preeya khilwad.
Maharashtra-kul-devi uski bhi aaradhya Bhavani thi,
Bundeley ...
.
.
.
Kutiya mein bhi visham vedna, mahalon mein aahat apmaan,
veer sainikon key man mein tha apney purkhon ka abhimaan,
Nana Ghunghupant Peshwa joota raha tha sab saamaan,
bahen chhaveeli ney Ran-Chandi ka kar diya prakat aahvaan.
Hua yagna prarambh unhey to soyee jyoti jagani thi,
Bundeley ..
Mahalon ney di aag, jhonpdi ney jwala sulgayee thi,
yeh swatantrata ki chingari antratam sey aayee thi,
Jhansi cheti, Dilli cheti, Lucknow laptey chhayi thi,
Merat, Kanpur, Patna ney bhari dhoom machayi thi,
Jabalpur, Kolhapur, mein bhi kuchh hulchul uksani thi,
Bundeley ...
.
.
Jao Rani yaad Rakhengey yeh krutagna Bharatwasi,
yeh tera balidaan jagayega Swatantrata avinasi,
hovey chup itihaas, lagey sachchai ko chahey phansi,
ho madmaati vijay, mitaa dey golon sey chahey Jhansi.
Tera Smarak tu hi hogi, tu khud amit nishaani thi,
Bundeley ...
Being deeply interested in poetry from all sources I couldn`t resist looking for it..and I found it!
I admire Jhansi Kee Rani tremendously. She is part of our glorious & true freedom struggle. Not the kind obtained by moving paper or lip or performing weird-antics.
USA walks tall because it FOUGHT the colonisers. [ America was a British colony]. Most of others got APPOINTED as loyal servants of the DOMINION; Hence a rot there to this day.
Chinese too kicked them out.
Wealth & prosperity will never ever cleanse the minds & muscles. The Rajas were no less opulent & the public not as poor then--just like the Saudis & Everyone knows the real story as to who is the ``king`` & who is the ``king-on-a-string``.
I respect people from ALL faiths. Anyone true to his/her own faith/community/culture/cuisine/clothing WILL never ever be a traitor. The other kind are far far worse than even ``terrorists``. They are zilch--simply JOBBERS.
With LOVE to true Independance loving hindus: Here it is
Bundeley Harbolon key munh hamney suni kahani thi,
Khoob ladi mardani woh to Jhansi wali Rani thi.
Lakshmi thi ya Durga thi woh swayan veerta ki avatar,
dekh Marathey pulkit hotey uski talwaron key vaar,
nakli yudh-vyuh ki rachna aur khelna khub shikar,
sainya gherna, durg todna yeh they uskey preeya khilwad.
Maharashtra-kul-devi uski bhi aaradhya Bhavani thi,
Bundeley ...
.
.
.
Kutiya mein bhi visham vedna, mahalon mein aahat apmaan,
veer sainikon key man mein tha apney purkhon ka abhimaan,
Nana Ghunghupant Peshwa joota raha tha sab saamaan,
bahen chhaveeli ney Ran-Chandi ka kar diya prakat aahvaan.
Hua yagna prarambh unhey to soyee jyoti jagani thi,
Bundeley ..
Mahalon ney di aag, jhonpdi ney jwala sulgayee thi,
yeh swatantrata ki chingari antratam sey aayee thi,
Jhansi cheti, Dilli cheti, Lucknow laptey chhayi thi,
Merat, Kanpur, Patna ney bhari dhoom machayi thi,
Jabalpur, Kolhapur, mein bhi kuchh hulchul uksani thi,
Bundeley ...
.
.
Jao Rani yaad Rakhengey yeh krutagna Bharatwasi,
yeh tera balidaan jagayega Swatantrata avinasi,
hovey chup itihaas, lagey sachchai ko chahey phansi,
ho madmaati vijay, mitaa dey golon sey chahey Jhansi.
Tera Smarak tu hi hogi, tu khud amit nishaani thi,
Bundeley ...
#37 Posted by Inquirer on July 12, 2006 5:06:13 am
Re: # 35,echoboom:
I KNOW you did not mean that way but this is an indeed fitting reply to bjk #18.
I KNOW you did not mean that way but this is an indeed fitting reply to bjk #18.
#34 Posted by arstoo on July 11, 2006 7:34:38 pm
ref#[#2 by khadiboli on July 11, 2006 1:16am PT
Good attempt ,Rahul.
Can you also narrate Subhadra Kumari Chauhan`s ``Khoob ladi mardani woh tau Jhansi wali Rani thi``.]
Here are some stanzas from memory
Bundelay har bolon ke muhn, hamne suni kahani thi
khoob ladi mardaani, voh to Jhansi wali Rani thi
I will try to dig some more stanzas
Good attempt ,Rahul.
Can you also narrate Subhadra Kumari Chauhan`s ``Khoob ladi mardani woh tau Jhansi wali Rani thi``.]
Here are some stanzas from memory
Bundelay har bolon ke muhn, hamne suni kahani thi
khoob ladi mardaani, voh to Jhansi wali Rani thi
I will try to dig some more stanzas
#32 Posted by bjk on July 11, 2006 2:26:06 pm
=== Interact Filtered ===
view this users filtered interacts
view this users filtered interacts
#31 Posted by bjk on July 11, 2006 2:09:06 pm
#29 Dilli-waale
Ama dilli-waale jara dil-waale bun-ne ki koshish karo!
The point is that just because a poem`s message was simple enough that even sixth-graders could understand it - it should not be discounted. If anything, that makes it more potent and its effect longer-lasting!
What do you want here - Shake-spear?!
And if you have known the poem all along why didn`t you translate it yourself?
Kyun kee Dilli utnee nazdeek nahin hai jitnee nazar aati hai!
#33 Posted by delhiwala on July 11, 2006 2:46:24 pm
Re: # 31
BeejWa:
Tumhaar kyon Nookta-cheene KArat ho babuwa?
Hamar Ko E Kavita bahut Pasand kiye the...Hamar Matra bhasha ki AdhyapakWa ne danday maar-maar ke Ratta lagwaya tha e Kavita ka.
SamLaingik Sambhog ke baarey mai Aap Ka kiya Veechaar hai...
BeejWa:
Tumhaar kyon Nookta-cheene KArat ho babuwa?
Hamar Ko E Kavita bahut Pasand kiye the...Hamar Matra bhasha ki AdhyapakWa ne danday maar-maar ke Ratta lagwaya tha e Kavita ka.
SamLaingik Sambhog ke baarey mai Aap Ka kiya Veechaar hai...
#29 Posted by delhiwala on July 11, 2006 1:53:52 pm
This was the poem for 6th grade hindi Poostak mala in AISSE.
#28 Posted by DrDr on July 11, 2006 1:50:06 pm
b..o..r..i..n..g!
isnt there enough chest thumping already!
isnt there enough chest thumping already!
#27 Posted by bjk on July 11, 2006 1:49:19 pm
=== Interact Filtered ===
view this users filtered interacts
view this users filtered interacts
#26 Posted by bjk on July 11, 2006 1:35:20 pm
=== Interact Filtered ===
view this users filtered interacts
view this users filtered interacts
#25 Posted by bjk on July 11, 2006 1:23:54 pm
#21 by Inquirer
[…I am an ardent Hindu but your comment in this context is unjustified, uncalled for and indeed in poor taste.]
Well, you can call yourself an ardent whatever – but I will speak my mind. I think simple words can carry a lot of punch – like this simple poem does! And it is highly fake to mouth big words and not follow up in deed.
And K.A.R.G.I.L. is a fact of life – the gutlessness of the Pakistani crowds in failing to acknowledge its soldiers killed there is highly relevant to this poem`s theme!
So you can call yourself an ardent whatever , but when it suits my fancy, I will never have any hesitation in calling you – using simple words – to go screw yourself!
Therefore, here you go!
Go SCREW yourself!
#30 Posted by Inquirer on July 11, 2006 2:01:04 pm
Re: # 25, bjk:
You belied your maturity expressed through your #10. Leayglade Inn is a literary section and we do not have to convert everything into Hindu-Muslim riot!
Chaturvedi did not write the poem only for Hindu soldiers dying for their motherland. As a matter of fact you could completely globalize the idea and even include all soldiers of Russia, France and Germany. What is the central idea of Chaturvedi? It is to express the value of a sacrifice of any soldier for the cause of the protection of the motherland. The soldier does that by implicitly following the nation`s policy without question. Even though we know that he is either forced or fooled by the cunning leaders of his own nation. The country can be any.
In Leafyglade Inn we need to enjoy the literary aspects without political bickering and backbiting. You can do that to your heart`s content in Civic Center. Here we have to savor positive literary moods.
Nevertheless your poetic reply, though not appropriate here, could be used poetical arguments in the Civic Center. You see we need to raise the level of our interactions. We should show desire for appreciation to the extent possible rather than sting our interactors at every opportunity that we get.
I do not mind your crude words to me but I hope you will try to savor all moods as they are meant to be savored.
``Bari mushkil hai dil waale – tujh mein pyaar naheen``
****Koi bahot badri mushkil nahiin, pyaar kar ke to dekho.****
You belied your maturity expressed through your #10. Leayglade Inn is a literary section and we do not have to convert everything into Hindu-Muslim riot!
Chaturvedi did not write the poem only for Hindu soldiers dying for their motherland. As a matter of fact you could completely globalize the idea and even include all soldiers of Russia, France and Germany. What is the central idea of Chaturvedi? It is to express the value of a sacrifice of any soldier for the cause of the protection of the motherland. The soldier does that by implicitly following the nation`s policy without question. Even though we know that he is either forced or fooled by the cunning leaders of his own nation. The country can be any.
In Leafyglade Inn we need to enjoy the literary aspects without political bickering and backbiting. You can do that to your heart`s content in Civic Center. Here we have to savor positive literary moods.
Nevertheless your poetic reply, though not appropriate here, could be used poetical arguments in the Civic Center. You see we need to raise the level of our interactions. We should show desire for appreciation to the extent possible rather than sting our interactors at every opportunity that we get.
I do not mind your crude words to me but I hope you will try to savor all moods as they are meant to be savored.
``Bari mushkil hai dil waale – tujh mein pyaar naheen``
****Koi bahot badri mushkil nahiin, pyaar kar ke to dekho.****
#23 Posted by Urstruly on July 11, 2006 12:41:39 pm
bjk
here is one for you:
kissi ko hiqarat ki nazar se mat daikh
keh har chehra kissi ka mehboob hota hay.
I read this couplet about two decades ago, written behind a truck, but I still think it is so profound that we can weigh it against the whole poetry by Ghalib.
#38 Posted by Inquirer on July 12, 2006 6:24:16 am
Re: # 23, urstruly:
Aap to truck kii yaad me zyaadaa hii lag gaye. Sher achchhaa hai par hai ``Ghalib kaa bayaan aur.``
Aap to truck kii yaad me zyaadaa hii lag gaye. Sher achchhaa hai par hai ``Ghalib kaa bayaan aur.``
#43 Posted by Inquirer on July 12, 2006 10:14:41 am
Re: # 39:
Aap sahi haiN, Janaab.
Par meraa iraadaa harf ba harf quote karne kaa nahiin thaa.
Sirf urstruly ko dhartii par ley aanaa chaahtaa thaa.
Chaliye aapkii dua maulvi saahab ko ley to aaii! Ab wo do ghuunt pii len to pataa chale!!
Aap sahi haiN, Janaab.
Par meraa iraadaa harf ba harf quote karne kaa nahiin thaa.
Sirf urstruly ko dhartii par ley aanaa chaahtaa thaa.
Chaliye aapkii dua maulvi saahab ko ley to aaii! Ab wo do ghuunt pii len to pataa chale!!
#22 Posted by Urstruly on July 11, 2006 12:31:50 pm
Inquirer
Now that I recall, the correct version was actually this:
nahiN nahiN, nahiN kar
nahiN, yeh waqt nahiN nahiN ka nahiN
here is another one for you and echo:
daagh! daagh! matt kaho, keh sab daaghdaar haiN
bay-dagh to bas aik hay jo Uski zaat hay
#18 Posted by bjk on July 11, 2006 12:09:28 pm
Yes, Boomer and 2-Lee, everybody knows that the Pakistanis are good at poetry. In fact, a legitimate argument can be made that they are especially good at it – perhaps the only thing that they are good at.
You guys are extremely good at words – also called hot air!
The point is – to some of us, those words mean more than hot air and the people follow through on them.
Open your eyes! Do you see what I see?!
Knowledge that those young men fight for their country!
Army that serves its civilians!
Reassurance that the population is behind it!
Guts – to fight to the bitter end!
India – the country that they fight for!
Legacy – that is full of honor!
And if all that appears too long – just spell it K.A.R.G.I.L.!
#21 Posted by Inquirer on July 11, 2006 12:28:40 pm
Re: # 18, bjk:
I am an ardent Hindu but your comment in this context is unjustified, uncalled for and indeed in poor taste.
I am an ardent Hindu but your comment in this context is unjustified, uncalled for and indeed in poor taste.
#17 Posted by echoboom on July 11, 2006 11:40:53 am
Urstruly:
`` MuuddatoaN booaya vafa aae-gee buut khaanoaN sey
Ood bUn bUn kay jala hai dil-e sozaaN meraa``
Haaey Haaey voh zamaana-e ``jahiliyyat``--Tarbiyat kaa iss sey behtar tareequaa koi naheeN. JavaaN maulvee aur booRRhaa shaaer hUmeshaa odd hotay haiN. Allah mian kee hidayaaat aur doosraa azeem ``literature`` bhhee chalees saal kay baad hee samajhh aata
hai.
Issi liyay jo loag chalees saal kay baad Allah mian kay inkaaree hotay haiN, voh daryaa kay mukhhaalif simt chaltai hain. Bhallaa hormones aur neurons sey bhee koee sahee-udd-Dimaagh lUrr saktaa hai?
Lekin:
``Kaa`bay sey inn buutoaN ko bhhee nisbat hai dooooor kee``--Kaash mulihad hazraat yeh samajhh sakaiN. YahaaN buutoaN sey muraad laat O mnaat naheeN haiN.
Uuss kee maslihat meiN kiss ko dakhl hai--jo huaa khoob huaa.
``Voh buutoaN ney daalaiN haiN vsvsay, ke diloaN sey khauf-i khudaa gayaa``--Yeh Bush aur Musharraf kee taraf ishara hai.
Khair..
`` MuuddatoaN booaya vafa aae-gee buut khaanoaN sey
Ood bUn bUn kay jala hai dil-e sozaaN meraa``
Haaey Haaey voh zamaana-e ``jahiliyyat``--Tarbiyat kaa iss sey behtar tareequaa koi naheeN. JavaaN maulvee aur booRRhaa shaaer hUmeshaa odd hotay haiN. Allah mian kee hidayaaat aur doosraa azeem ``literature`` bhhee chalees saal kay baad hee samajhh aata
hai.
Issi liyay jo loag chalees saal kay baad Allah mian kay inkaaree hotay haiN, voh daryaa kay mukhhaalif simt chaltai hain. Bhallaa hormones aur neurons sey bhee koee sahee-udd-Dimaagh lUrr saktaa hai?
Lekin:
``Kaa`bay sey inn buutoaN ko bhhee nisbat hai dooooor kee``--Kaash mulihad hazraat yeh samajhh sakaiN. YahaaN buutoaN sey muraad laat O mnaat naheeN haiN.
Uuss kee maslihat meiN kiss ko dakhl hai--jo huaa khoob huaa.
``Voh buutoaN ney daalaiN haiN vsvsay, ke diloaN sey khauf-i khudaa gayaa``--Yeh Bush aur Musharraf kee taraf ishara hai.
Khair..
#15 Posted by echoboom on July 11, 2006 10:55:54 am
Urstruly:
eh phool yeh phool mere phool ko daina
kehna yeh phool tumhare phool ne diya hay.
Haa Haa! Good commentary on the adolescent poetry here. But then you must remember that poetry is not their forte.
my attempt:
Aye phool tuum khushee sey kaheeN phool na naheeN
tuum ko galay lagaa kay voh gar phoolaiN lUGaiN.
eh phool yeh phool mere phool ko daina
kehna yeh phool tumhare phool ne diya hay.
Haa Haa! Good commentary on the adolescent poetry here. But then you must remember that poetry is not their forte.
my attempt:
Aye phool tuum khushee sey kaheeN phool na naheeN
tuum ko galay lagaa kay voh gar phoolaiN lUGaiN.
#19 Posted by Inquirer on July 11, 2006 12:15:31 pm
Re: # 15,echoboom:
Some corrections to romanization:
``Aye phool tuum khushee sey kaheeN phool na naheeN
tuum ko galay lagaa kay voh gar phoolaiN lUGaiN. ``
should be written as:
****Aye phool tum khushee sey kaheeN phool na jaanaa
tum ko galay lagaa kay voh gar phoolney laGeiN. ****
Some corrections to romanization:
``Aye phool tuum khushee sey kaheeN phool na naheeN
tuum ko galay lagaa kay voh gar phoolaiN lUGaiN. ``
should be written as:
****Aye phool tum khushee sey kaheeN phool na jaanaa
tum ko galay lagaa kay voh gar phoolney laGeiN. ****
#16 Posted by Urstruly on July 11, 2006 11:18:50 am
Re: # 15
wah wah wah
But I must advice you not to underestimate the power of adolescent poetry. You have no idea what have I accomplished with sort of following in my zaman-e-jahiliat;
nahiN nahiN, nahiN kar
yeh waqt nahiN nahiN ka nahiN
wah wah wah
But I must advice you not to underestimate the power of adolescent poetry. You have no idea what have I accomplished with sort of following in my zaman-e-jahiliat;
nahiN nahiN, nahiN kar
yeh waqt nahiN nahiN ka nahiN
#20 Posted by Inquirer on July 11, 2006 12:22:33 pm
Re: # 16, urstruly:
Walla, Jawaab khayal kaa nahiin!!!
Par haan ki ummeed key liye kam sey kam nahiinyoN ko zaraa ghataa deiN:
****nahiN nahiN, nahiN kar
ab yeh waqt nahiN ka nahiN.****
Walla, Jawaab khayal kaa nahiin!!!
Par haan ki ummeed key liye kam sey kam nahiinyoN ko zaraa ghataa deiN:
****nahiN nahiN, nahiN kar
ab yeh waqt nahiN ka nahiN.****
#14 Posted by delhiwala on July 11, 2006 10:40:51 am
Chehvi Class ki Hindi PustakMala se cut/paste kar di aur Chowk walo ne Publish bhee kar di.
Kiya Zamamna aa gya hai.
Chowk Ed: Where are your so called high standards now? You are publishing a Sixth Grade Hindi Poem that every kid in AISSE board reads......
No offence to the poet, it was my favorite till 8th class, then it was Robert Frost..
Kiya Zamamna aa gya hai.
Chowk Ed: Where are your so called high standards now? You are publishing a Sixth Grade Hindi Poem that every kid in AISSE board reads......
No offence to the poet, it was my favorite till 8th class, then it was Robert Frost..
#13 Posted by Inquirer on July 11, 2006 10:34:37 am
#10,bjk:
``But where the heck is your sense of charity, I ask you! ``
There are few people who can take critical scrutiny as you did! Congartualations!! I hated to see your wonderful quote with the flaw, so I dared!!!
Particularly, as I do remember the last two lines by heart!!!!
#12 Posted by Urstruly on July 11, 2006 9:02:57 am
eh phool yeh phool mere phool ko daina
kehna yeh phool tumhare phool ne diya hay.
#10 Posted by bjk on July 11, 2006 5:58:33 am
#8 Inquie
O man, Inquie! Just when I thought I had the whole gang fooled, too!
Darn! And here I was just ready about to escape – and out of nowhere comes this “gotcha”! Man, O man!
It is “lenaa” not “denaa”!
Taking – not giving! Like the great Dolly Parton of devastatingly drastic proportions immortalized:
...it`s all taking, and no giving!
Oh well, there IS a difference, between taking and giving.
But where the heck is your sense of charity, I ask you!
Don’t tell me you are the type who will never give, when he can take!
You got me! I am trapped and can not escape! Caught in your clutches like a rodent!
Therefore, have it your own way. Here is the original Hindi again – typed with two of my own fingers!
माखनलाल चतुर्वेदी
चाह नहीं मैं सुरबाला के – गहनों में गूँथा जाऊँ,
चाह नहीं, प्रेमी माला में – बिंध प्यारी को ललचाऊँ,
चाह नहीं, सम्राटों के – शव पर हे हरि, डाला जाऊँ,
चाह नहीं, देवों के सिर पर – चढ़ूँ, भाग्य पर इठलाऊँ।
मुझे तोड़ लेना वनमाली – उस पथ पर देना तुम फेंक,
मातृभूमि पर शीश चढ़ाने – जिस पथ जावें वीर अनेक
#11 Posted by shobig_sifar on July 11, 2006 6:08:31 am
Re: # 10 Oh drop it beejay sahib, bet you used only one there...
#6 Posted by burpinder on July 11, 2006 4:54:19 am
Not bad, rahulmal....
reg echoboom`s question ``Is the first part Sanskrit?``, why have you used that strange notation (M for N for example)?
reg echoboom`s question ``Is the first part Sanskrit?``, why have you used that strange notation (M for N for example)?
#9 Posted by bjk on July 11, 2006 5:30:43 am
Some tid-bits on the poet (from “Shayeri.net” and other sources).
Makhanlal Chaturvedi was born on April 4, 1889 in Babai village in Hishangabad district (Madhya Pardsh). He started his career as a teacher in 1906 but resigned in 1910. He took a leading part in the Non-cooperation Movement and the Quit India Movement. Makhanlal Chaturvedi was one of the most distinguished writers in Hindi literature. He was a sensitive poet, story writer, essayist and playwright. He also edited the Hindi weekly “Karmaveer”. Makhanlal’s political activities greatly influenced his writings. A forceful and persuasive writer, he aroused great patriotic fervor among the masses by his writings. He was President of All India Hindi Sahitya Sammelan held at Hardwar in 1943. Makhanlal Chaturvedi made notable contributions to the enrichment of various branches of Hindi literature. Some of his great works are “Him Kirtini”, “Him Tarangini”, “Yug Charan”, and “Sahitya Devta’. In 1954 Makhanlal won the Sahitya Akademy Award for his work ‘Him Tarangini’ – becoming the first recipient of the Award in Hindi literature. He was conferred the honorary degree of D.Litt. by Saugar University in 1959. Makhanlal Chaturvedi passed away on January 30, 1968.
To commemorate his birth centenary, the Makhanlal Chaturvedi Rashtriya Patrakarita Vishwavidyalaya, Bhopal was set up through an Act of the Madhya Pradesh state in 1990. The University was formally inaugurated by the then Vice-President of India Dr. Shankar Dayal Sharma on 16th January 1991.
#7 Posted by shobig_sifar on July 11, 2006 5:17:19 am
Re: # 6 That`s what i`ve been wondering about. By the look of it, the M should have the same effect in pronounciation as the commonly used N or .n ( for noon-ghunna in Urdu). Rahul chooses M in the first four verses while `.n` in the last verses of both the stanzas. Is there any particular reason for this juxtaposition?
Splendid poetry nonetheless, and a laudable attempt at translation.
Splendid poetry nonetheless, and a laudable attempt at translation.
#5 Posted by bjk on July 11, 2006 4:53:00 am
And here is the original Hindi.
पुष्प की अभिलाषा
माखनलाल चतुर्वेदी
चाह नहीं मैं सुरबाला के – गहनों में गूँथा जाऊँ,
चाह नहीं, प्रेमी माला में – बिंध प्यारी को ललचाऊँ,
चाह नहीं, सम्राटों के – शव पर हे हरि, डाला जाऊँ,
चाह नहीं, देवों के सिर पर – चढ़ूँ, भाग्य पर इठलाऊँ।
मुझे तोड़ देना वनमाली – उस पथ पर देना तुम फेंक,
मातृभूमि पर शीश चढ़ाने – जिस पथ जावें वीर अनेक
माखनलाल चतुर्वेदी
चाह नहीं मैं सुरबाला के – गहनों में गूँथा जाऊँ,
चाह नहीं, प्रेमी माला में – बिंध प्यारी को ललचाऊँ,
चाह नहीं, सम्राटों के – शव पर हे हरि, डाला जाऊँ,
चाह नहीं, देवों के सिर पर – चढ़ूँ, भाग्य पर इठलाऊँ।
मुझे तोड़ देना वनमाली – उस पथ पर देना तुम फेंक,
मातृभूमि पर शीश चढ़ाने – जिस पथ जावें वीर अनेक
#8 Posted by Inquirer on July 11, 2006 5:30:43 am
Re: # 5, bjk:
There seems to be a mistake in the presentation of the Hindi original. I remember only the last two lines by heart.
I think Chaturvedi wrote ``lenaa`` not ``denaa.``
Please verify from a printed text, not computer files which are generally replete with mistranslations and errors.
There seems to be a mistake in the presentation of the Hindi original. I remember only the last two lines by heart.
I think Chaturvedi wrote ``lenaa`` not ``denaa.``
Please verify from a printed text, not computer files which are generally replete with mistranslations and errors.
#4 Posted by bjk on July 11, 2006 4:42:21 am
Beautiful!
The use of the term ``patriots`` in place of ``braves`` could be questioned.
#3 Posted by harish_hyd on July 11, 2006 1:51:32 am
Rahul,
What a beautiful and patriotic poem. Brought back memories of my Hindi teacher who explained the poem so beautifully that it still continues to ring in my ears. Great work, keep it up!
What a beautiful and patriotic poem. Brought back memories of my Hindi teacher who explained the poem so beautifully that it still continues to ring in my ears. Great work, keep it up!
#2 Posted by khadiboli on July 11, 2006 1:16:37 am
Good attempt ,Rahul.
Can you also narrate Subhadra Kumari Chauhan`s ``Khoob ladi mardani woh tau Jhansi wali Rani thi``.
Can you also narrate Subhadra Kumari Chauhan`s ``Khoob ladi mardani woh tau Jhansi wali Rani thi``.
#1 Posted by echoboom on July 11, 2006 12:58:31 am
Thank you Rahul.
First part seems seems to be in Sanskrit second hindi. Is it?
Funny, that I shared in my i-log, just today, two Bangladeshi poems on a similar theme.
Here I rewrite them:
July 10, 2006
TWO POEMS: from BANGLADESH
I.
Mask
Shower me with petals,
heap bouquets around me,
I won`t complain. Unable to move,
I won`t ask you to stop
nor, if butterflies or swarms of flies
settle on my nose, can I brush them away.
Indifferent to the scent of jasmine and benjamin,
to rose-water and loud lament,
I lie supine with sightless eyes
while the man who will wash me
scratches his ample behind.
The youthfulness of the lissome maiden,
her firm breasts untouched by grief,
no longer inspires me to chant
nonsense rhymes in praise of life.
You can cover me head to foot with flowers,
my finger won`t rise in admonishment.
I will shortly board a truck
for a visit to Banani.[1]
A light breeze will touch my lifeless bones.
I am the broken nest of a weaver-bird,
dreamless and terribly lonely on the long verandah.
If you wish to deck me up like a bridegroom
go ahead, I won`t say no
Do as you please, only don`t
alter my face too much with collyrium
or any enbalming cosmetic. Just see that I am
just as I am; don`t let another face
emerge through the lineaments of mine.
Look! The old mask
under whose pressure
I passed my whole life,
a wearisome handmaiden of anxiety,
has peeled off at last.
For God`s sake don`t
fix on me another oppressive mask.
[Banani - An affluent suburb of Dhaka. It has a well known cemetery.]
From: Selected Poems of Shamsur Rahman.
Translated and Edited by Kaiser Haq.
II.
Allah please don`t judge me
Kazi Nazrul Islam
Translation: Abu Rushd
Courtesy: Mohammad Nurul Huda (ed.) Poetry of Kazi Nazrul Islam in English Translation
[Dhaka: Nazrul Institute, June 2000], p. 593
Allah please don`t judge me on the doomsday.
Your justice I don`t seek, this sinner craves for your mercy.
I have knowingly throughout my life erred wherever I was
I therefore daren`t hope I will survive your scrutiny.
If you will judge why should you be known as the Merciful
Your name is a guarantee of redemption - why give me this knowledge.
I am a beggar and so when I beg my lord
Don`t send me back with an empty hand.
First part seems seems to be in Sanskrit second hindi. Is it?
Funny, that I shared in my i-log, just today, two Bangladeshi poems on a similar theme.
Here I rewrite them:
July 10, 2006
TWO POEMS: from BANGLADESH
I.
Mask
Shower me with petals,
heap bouquets around me,
I won`t complain. Unable to move,
I won`t ask you to stop
nor, if butterflies or swarms of flies
settle on my nose, can I brush them away.
Indifferent to the scent of jasmine and benjamin,
to rose-water and loud lament,
I lie supine with sightless eyes
while the man who will wash me
scratches his ample behind.
The youthfulness of the lissome maiden,
her firm breasts untouched by grief,
no longer inspires me to chant
nonsense rhymes in praise of life.
You can cover me head to foot with flowers,
my finger won`t rise in admonishment.
I will shortly board a truck
for a visit to Banani.[1]
A light breeze will touch my lifeless bones.
I am the broken nest of a weaver-bird,
dreamless and terribly lonely on the long verandah.
If you wish to deck me up like a bridegroom
go ahead, I won`t say no
Do as you please, only don`t
alter my face too much with collyrium
or any enbalming cosmetic. Just see that I am
just as I am; don`t let another face
emerge through the lineaments of mine.
Look! The old mask
under whose pressure
I passed my whole life,
a wearisome handmaiden of anxiety,
has peeled off at last.
For God`s sake don`t
fix on me another oppressive mask.
[Banani - An affluent suburb of Dhaka. It has a well known cemetery.]
From: Selected Poems of Shamsur Rahman.
Translated and Edited by Kaiser Haq.
II.
Allah please don`t judge me
Kazi Nazrul Islam
Translation: Abu Rushd
Courtesy: Mohammad Nurul Huda (ed.) Poetry of Kazi Nazrul Islam in English Translation
[Dhaka: Nazrul Institute, June 2000], p. 593
Allah please don`t judge me on the doomsday.
Your justice I don`t seek, this sinner craves for your mercy.
I have knowingly throughout my life erred wherever I was
I therefore daren`t hope I will survive your scrutiny.
If you will judge why should you be known as the Merciful
Your name is a guarantee of redemption - why give me this knowledge.
I am a beggar and so when I beg my lord
Don`t send me back with an empty hand.
Interact Index
Latest Interacts
- Goldfinger: Re: # 700 tahmed...that... Mumbai Attacks: Shocking
- nkg: Re: # 89 bluffer32... yeh dawood... India-Pakistan: Empathy, grief in
- Goldfinger: Re: # 698 ngk...says:... Mumbai Attacks: Shocking
- mohar11: Re: # 98 Right on...... India-Pakistan: Empathy, grief in
- Dash_Dot: Re: # 84 sabji... India-Pakistan: Empathy, grief in
- mohar11: I mean - zardari... India-Pakistan: Empathy, grief in
- Dash_Dot: Tahmed32 sabji LOL at... India-Pakistan: Empathy, grief in
- AlephNull: There's nothing particularly mysterious... India-Pakistan: Empathy, grief in








reply to this interact
write a new interact
add to favorites
flag objectionable content