Jihadis are Our Real Enemies!

13 by Naqshbandi

I wonder why the religion of an `ummi` (un-lettered) nabi for an ummi nation should need the so called `Ullema` to explain and interpret inspite of the folloing Hadees:

``Jo shakhs kahe kih mein aalim hoon woh jaahil he`` (one who calls himself `aalim` he is ignorant) - vide Abudawud Tirmazi barawaait Ali as quoted in Ghazali`s Ehyaaulaloom, vol. I, page 218.

dhananjay writes <<< I do not agry with your above view.Please donot mind if I say that Islamic ideology is not subject to correction and is very static. The whole idea of religion is based on the principals which are supposed to be infallable( meaning that they can not be changed by mortals like us) when one can not question (or have no option )about the correctness of a theory then one has to blildly accept it. >>>

If religious institutions were not subject to change and did not change then you wouldn`t see the variety of religious belief that we see both within and among religions. You began your post by differentiating between theory and what is and now revert to the theory based upon your understanding of religion. Regarding your understanding of Islam, it is incorrect. Islamic principles are established in the Quran based on reason, reflection and analysis of the natural world, all scientific principles, further the section of the ``infallible`` is very small, relating to the nature of God, (which has no bearing on political decisions involving man)other recommendations are more methodology given social justice in particular circumstances in which human freedom is given free reign, and they are not considered ``infallible`` or applicable to all circumstance regardless of condition, that is what makes the context so important.

Regarding the ``religion of capital`` that is not seperate from politics in the US, that is a fact. If you study religion sociologically, the civil religion that is practices as ideology by the US political establishment and pushed and embraced by the public has the same indicators of religion as any religion out there. It has its sacred and profane, it has its symbols and mythologies, its believers and renegades. (See Sociologist Robert Bellah`s work). Regarding your question on why I talk about the US is because the modern type of ``democracy`` which in fact is no democracy has reached maturity in the US which commands the world system. It is better to study the source than immitators to get to the facts.

Re: # 74
Dear friend Masadi,
why do you keep refering to America time and again? please enlighten me.

Re: # 74 Masadi writes........Institutions by definition are enduring, whether they be religious or political institutions. The ideology based on which the political establishment in the US operates is similarly immune t change as is clearly revealed by the results. On the other hand institutions though enduring are not totally static, including the religious institutions, they intereact with each other and are changed in the process.........

I do not agry with your above view.Please donot mind if I say that Islamic ideology is not subject to correction and is very static. The whole idea of religion is based on the principals which are supposed to be infallable( meaning that they can not be changed by mortals like us) when one can not question (or have no option )about the correctness of a theory then one has to blildly accept it. In fact posing doubts about any religious theories brings wrath and sufferings to those who dare to question. This very well explains fights between different opposing sects of the same religion and if it really does not annoy you, this explains fights between Sunnis and Shiyas as well. A state basing its political ideology on some principals formulated in medival times and which do not have any scope for change is unagreeable.

#71 bskhan, people can read my posts, compare them with yours and decide for themselves who provided the facts and who relies on sloganeering- they sure as hell do not need a mirasi like you to tell them anything even remotely having to do with knowledge and facts. Stay with what you are best at, being a mirasi and shouting and crying like an animal, with no sense.

#73 dhananjay writes <<< so called theology of the religion is supposed to never change meaning the theology of the religion is dogma while other political theories are always subject to better correction. >>>

Institutions by definition are enduring, whether they be religious or political institutions. The ideology based on which the political establishment in the US operates is similarly immune t change as is clearly revealed by the results. On the other hand institutions though enduring are not totally static, including the religious institutions, they intereact with each other and are changed in the process. Finally, you seem to have overlooked what my post stated regarding theology and how it has nothing to do with the functioning of the political institution, neither does the ``religion of capital``- which is just as resistant to change, and just as dogmatic in popular culture,- look at the aversion that any mention of communism produces, have anything to do with it.

Re: # 68P.....politics can never be seperated from values and ideology, it can certainly be seperted from ritual and theology and fulfill its function as a state institution fulfilling and serving the needs of the people.........

your argument , my friend seems very impressive at the face of it. But what you have overlooked is that the so called theology of the religion is supposed to never change meaning the theology of the religion is dogma while other political theories are always subject to better correction. for example let us consider the issue of the caste system in India. Now in modern India it is banned to practise caste system in the public which means equality of all citizens. Religion is something very personal and we should not be carried away with what we believe because by chance we are born in particular religious society

<<>>

your argument , my friend seems very impressive at the face of it. But what you have overlooked is that the so called theology of the religion is supposed to never change meaning the theology of the religion is dogma while other political theories are always subject to better correction. for example let us consider the issue of the caste system in India. Now in modern India it is banned to practise caste system in the public which means equality of all citizens. Religion is something very personal and we should not be carried away with what we believe because by chance we are born in particular religious society

Re: # 70

``........like a pathetic chicken with its head cut off, or like a baboon high on something.``

``...........dimwits like your pathetic self, ......................``

``.....you are a dimwit mirasi who has no sense of reasoning and no access to facts, it also shows your extremely low (gutter) morality.............``

More abuses from a choutya like yourself when you fail to provide evidence to support the propaganda that you are mouthing ...................... ofcourse Islamists like you do not need evidence when you can derive anything using your convoluted logic from the Holy Quran.................

bskhan writes <<< Asadi, you are a lier and a fake. When I ask you to provide evidence for the propaganda that you are spreading you only throw abuses at me. >>>

If that were the case you would have had no problem in refuting what I write. Contrary to that you are jumping around all over the place hurling labels of Islamist etc, like a pathetic chicken with its head cut off, or like a baboon high on something. Regarding the textile industry, that was the major British industry in the 18th century, and India at the time of colonization was much ahead of the British in that sector, which was then methodically destroyed by the British. As usual you have no access to any knowledge except for BS. The only reason I reply to dimwits like your pathetic self, is because there are people on here genuinely interested in the truth and your baseless ranting, asking for documentation when it is either provided or not required or labelling might mislead them. Such tactics on your part, not only reveal that you are a dimwit mirasi who has no sense of reasoning and no access to facts, it also shows your extremely low (gutter) morality.

Re: # 68

``a political institutions inspired by the Quran`s principles of equity that makes people`s needs foremost ``

Asadi, you are a lier and a fake. When I ask you to provide evidence for the propaganda that you are spreading you only throw abuses at me.

Show some honesty and please provide details and evidence for the existence of such a successful equitable order inspired by the Holy Quran (unless it only does in your dreams)

Also provide evidence about the existence of the ``vibrant economy`` you talked about in the ``Textile Trade`` .................that was the most pathetic system embodying child labour and exploitation of bonded labourers and slaves through the system of cultural and religious exploitation perfected by the mullahs and pandits..................it still exists in Pakistan and India ..........only mullahs find it ``vibrant`` in their fantasies......

If you cannot then you should seriously consider seeing a shrink before it is too late!!!

#67 dhananjay writes <<< In my opinion the view the author holds about seperating religion from polity is very correct and scientific as well >>>

Politics can never be seperated from values and ideology, it can certainly be seperted from ritual and theology and fulfill its function as a state institution fulfilling and serving the needs of the people.

What exists today in so-called democracies like the US, is a state institutions heavily influenced by the relgion of capital accumulation and exclusion, a religion that puts to shame even the hierarchy of the Hindu caste system. This by the way is no conspiracy, data like the distribution of wealth in this society where 1% owns greater wealth than the rest of the 99% combined, a gini index that shows near total inequality (0.84) etc reveals that very clearly.

Just because an ideology is not termed ``religion`` does not mean that there is seperation of church (or in this case corporation) and state. On the other hand, a political institutions inspired by the Quran`s principles of equity that makes people`s needs foremost and not theological argumentation or ritual would be much preferred to the bs that exists in the US. That said, the mullahs are not inspired by those principles of equity, to them ritual and formulation and and forcing their own laws is more important, therefore they should be kept out of politics unless they understand the basic principle behind that institution which is not prosletyzation to your narrow theology but the fulfilment of the basic needs of a society.

Re: # 60``Perhaps you have limited your understanding of the Quran, hence Islam, to just veils around your women. Or perhaps you refer to the people who think they know Islam but really dont, and some how force you into being ``

It might be true that Islam in its purest form may be a complete way of life. However this unfoutunately is in theory.And what do you see in practise? We at our Madarsas are teaching how to practise terrorism and how to surrender yourself as a human bomb.Religion, my friend, should never allow oneself to disturb another humanbeing`s life.This can not be accepted at any level that if someone is not holding your views then that somebody should be forced to accept it even if it amounts to using force. In my opinion the view the author holds about seperating religion from polity is very correct and scientific as well

#65 by Sri <<< For the first 25 years of my life, living in the third world, I somehow failed to notice the mythical wealth you are talking about. >>>

That is why I said that you don`t even possess half a brain, tabulate the cotracts from the Third World going to Western firms, billions in military hardware alone, tabulate all these countries have paid in debt servicing, and the unfair terms of trade they face regarding their primary products, and you will come up with figures that are dozens of times the Marshall Aid given to Europe for rebuilding after WW2, many have done this and it is well documented. If the extent of your knowledge is based upon only what you ``see``, then you confirm my assertion that you are a pathetic illiterate.

#56 by masadi

`` Dimwits like yourself cannot think beyond the pathetic circle of your narrow life. You can work you a$$ off but it wont take you out of poverty if the economy is not producing wealth and generating jobs. ``

And constantly whining on ``exploitation`` while sitting on your lazy behind somehow produces wealth and generates jobs ? Oh wait a minute.. that`s right... you were going to use your welfare checks

`` If all the wealth from the third world is flowing out towards the West, no amount of personal endeavour will remove the vast majority from poverty. ``

``Wealth from the THIRD WORLD`` that`s an oxymoron you idiot.

For the first 25 years of my life, living in the third world, I somehow failed to notice the mythical wealth you are talking about. Sure there were huge mansions of Hyderabadi Nawabs and their descendants but right next to the mansions I remember slums. All of that can barely qualify as wealth of people ( unless you consider only Nawabs as people ).

And there were these elders of community ( lazy bums ) who got together every morning and smoked hukkah as a congregation. Their wealth generation activity was badmouthing Amreeka and west all day. Oh what a sense of deja vu I get whenever I stumble across your moronic posts.

`` My suggestion to you, get a damn education or you`ll stay in the gutter of a colonized mind where you write your tcp/ip BS. ``

thanks for the suggestion. Anyway, I have no intention of becoming a NamakHaram unlike people of certain community who bite the very hand that feeds them. Not very different from the behavior of Snakes.

bs khan writes <<< All this talk about ``vibrant`` economies of third world is BS...............Slave Trading was part of the these indeginous economies and its political order had already consolidated slave trade through religons. ...........It was very normal for the marauding kings to make wars and capture the other states and take a considerable number of people from that as their slaves >>>

This person has a brain of a baboon every time he posts he reveals the limits of his ability to reason. There is nothing in his post except for labels, Marxist, Mullah and what not, and bits of unrelated stuff. It is a fact that the Economy of India, as well as Africa were quite vibrant before colonization. In fact the textile industy in India was way ahead of that of England, slavery was never so ingrained in the Economy as the Atlantic Slave trade achieved, and never did any invading king achieve a favorable population to resource ratio as these white settlers/colonizers did by getting rid of the indigeneous populations.

He (as well as tahmed) want you to believe in the biggest conspiracy tale of all, that the Europeans through hard work, though a small percent of the world population, came to occupy and exploit the vast majority of its resources, and the rest of the non-white creation are genetically inferior that is why they suffer regardless of culture or religion (because they come in all brands and varieties, including Christianity). The facts are quite clear, there are numerous studies on them, on the economies and the exit of capital from the Third World, the economies of the third world today compared to the middle ages etc, and they cannot all be neatly classified as ``marxist`` as this baboon is doing