Ajnabi November 13, 1998
#12 Posted by ferozk on November 23, 1998 4:01:48 pm
Re: Rishi
Yes ! I would say the same for the Indians who had to leave their homes, in what is now Pakistan, to go to India. Intolerance, blind hate and racial ethnic bigotary does not have any geographic boundaries.
Yes ! I would say the same for the Indians who had to leave their homes, in what is now Pakistan, to go to India. Intolerance, blind hate and racial ethnic bigotary does not have any geographic boundaries.
#11 Posted by rishi on November 23, 1998 7:40:11 am
Re: Ferozk
Partition was a double edged sword. Indians too bore the brunt and as most Historians would agree, much more than Pakistanis. Atleast, the government of India was not aiding or abetting the marauding mobs as was done in Pakistan. Do remember that a majority of Muslims stayed back in India unlike in Pakistan and were not affected by partition at all ? Pakistan could never claim to this mantle.... the sikhs and Hindus not butchered in Pakistan are today converted.
And you do state that your parents escaped to freedom. Would you say the same for hindu parents such as mine who went through the same fire to get into India..?
life s-u-c-k-s..................
Partition was a double edged sword. Indians too bore the brunt and as most Historians would agree, much more than Pakistanis. Atleast, the government of India was not aiding or abetting the marauding mobs as was done in Pakistan. Do remember that a majority of Muslims stayed back in India unlike in Pakistan and were not affected by partition at all ? Pakistan could never claim to this mantle.... the sikhs and Hindus not butchered in Pakistan are today converted.
And you do state that your parents escaped to freedom. Would you say the same for hindu parents such as mine who went through the same fire to get into India..?
life s-u-c-k-s..................
#10 Posted by ajnabi on November 23, 1998 7:40:11 am
Dear fellow chowk wale,
I have followed with interest the comments to this article. Especially those by Waheed and Afrasiyab. Allow me to add a few final thoughts.
The article was meant to be a bemused look at a country we love. I regret the offence it has caused in some and do apologise if you feel I was callous.
I agree with most observors that the `literary` merit of the piece is negligible. It is an early exerpt from a work that is still not fully realised or executed. It was intended as a tidbit among the more weighty and serious pieces on the site.
My final comment: regardless of the literary merit of this or any other piece of literature, art, humour, satire, wagera wagera it is perhaps essential that our `comfort zones` be challenged.(Though as stated before, that was not my intention at all when I posted this piece). Hazrat Ali himself in one of the gravest challenges to humanity has been quoted as saying (and I paraphrase): until we examine all of our deepest, and dearest beliefs and convictions and can be sure of why we believe what we claim to believe and until we can be assured that our faith is not just an accumulation of cultural and social hand-me-downs, our faith cannot be considered real.
See you at the chowk again sometime.
I have followed with interest the comments to this article. Especially those by Waheed and Afrasiyab. Allow me to add a few final thoughts.
The article was meant to be a bemused look at a country we love. I regret the offence it has caused in some and do apologise if you feel I was callous.
I agree with most observors that the `literary` merit of the piece is negligible. It is an early exerpt from a work that is still not fully realised or executed. It was intended as a tidbit among the more weighty and serious pieces on the site.
My final comment: regardless of the literary merit of this or any other piece of literature, art, humour, satire, wagera wagera it is perhaps essential that our `comfort zones` be challenged.(Though as stated before, that was not my intention at all when I posted this piece). Hazrat Ali himself in one of the gravest challenges to humanity has been quoted as saying (and I paraphrase): until we examine all of our deepest, and dearest beliefs and convictions and can be sure of why we believe what we claim to believe and until we can be assured that our faith is not just an accumulation of cultural and social hand-me-downs, our faith cannot be considered real.
See you at the chowk again sometime.
#9 Posted by ajnabi on November 23, 1998 7:40:11 am
Dear fellow chowk wale,
I have followed with interest the comments to this article. Especially those by Waheed and Afrasiyab. Allow me to add a few final thoughts.
The article was meant to be a bemused look at a country we love. I regret the offence it has caused in some and do apologise if you feel I was callous.
I agree with most observors that the `literary` merit of the piece is negligible. It is an early exerpt from a work that is still not fully realised or executed. It was intended as a tidbit among the more weighty and serious pieces on the site.
My final comment: regardless of the literary merit of this or any other piece of literature, art, humour, satire, wagera wagera it is perhaps essential that our `comfort zones` be challenged.(Though as stated before, that was not my intention at all when I posted this piece). Hazrat Ali himself in one of the gravest challenges to humanity has been quoted as saying (and I paraphrase): until we examine all of our deepest, and dearest beliefs and convictions and can be sure of why we believe what we claim to believe and until we can be assured that our faith is not just an accumulation of cultural and social hand-me-downs, our faith cannot be considered real.
See you at the chowk again sometime.
I have followed with interest the comments to this article. Especially those by Waheed and Afrasiyab. Allow me to add a few final thoughts.
The article was meant to be a bemused look at a country we love. I regret the offence it has caused in some and do apologise if you feel I was callous.
I agree with most observors that the `literary` merit of the piece is negligible. It is an early exerpt from a work that is still not fully realised or executed. It was intended as a tidbit among the more weighty and serious pieces on the site.
My final comment: regardless of the literary merit of this or any other piece of literature, art, humour, satire, wagera wagera it is perhaps essential that our `comfort zones` be challenged.(Though as stated before, that was not my intention at all when I posted this piece). Hazrat Ali himself in one of the gravest challenges to humanity has been quoted as saying (and I paraphrase): until we examine all of our deepest, and dearest beliefs and convictions and can be sure of why we believe what we claim to believe and until we can be assured that our faith is not just an accumulation of cultural and social hand-me-downs, our faith cannot be considered real.
See you at the chowk again sometime.
#8 Posted by ferozk on November 19, 1998 8:44:08 pm
Re: Waheed
Just a few additional comments...
Though I agree with your assessment of the article as poorly articulated, I still think that does not lessen its perceptions of the situation, as viewed, by the author. Perception is a question of differing viewpoints and like, different tastes, is a subjective and not an objective based opinion.
It is, thus, really hard to objectivily critise a sujective opinion. You and I may have disagreed with the author`s intent, based on our own perceptions, but that does and should not minimize his perceptions of a given situation be it in poor taste or not.
Just a few additional comments...
Though I agree with your assessment of the article as poorly articulated, I still think that does not lessen its perceptions of the situation, as viewed, by the author. Perception is a question of differing viewpoints and like, different tastes, is a subjective and not an objective based opinion.
It is, thus, really hard to objectivily critise a sujective opinion. You and I may have disagreed with the author`s intent, based on our own perceptions, but that does and should not minimize his perceptions of a given situation be it in poor taste or not.
#7 Posted by ferozk on November 17, 1998 9:40:21 pm
Re: Waheed
With all due respects sir, it is the cost of freedom that we should allow such materials, as the article, to be published to maintain that freedom. As Voltaire once said, ``I will fight to death to protect your right to say that you hate me``, so must we must protect the rights of those we do not agree with. In the end, we may have different interpretations of the same right, but it is still our right to disagree if we so desire to do so.
Those of us whose parents came to Pakistan during the nightmare that was the partition and told us about it, their deeds will be forever enshirned in our gratitude and nothing will diminish, for us, the sacrifrice of their commitments to our freedom.
Sincerely
With all due respects sir, it is the cost of freedom that we should allow such materials, as the article, to be published to maintain that freedom. As Voltaire once said, ``I will fight to death to protect your right to say that you hate me``, so must we must protect the rights of those we do not agree with. In the end, we may have different interpretations of the same right, but it is still our right to disagree if we so desire to do so.
Those of us whose parents came to Pakistan during the nightmare that was the partition and told us about it, their deeds will be forever enshirned in our gratitude and nothing will diminish, for us, the sacrifrice of their commitments to our freedom.
Sincerely
#6 Posted by Osama Ahmed on November 16, 1998 12:35:09 pm
Re: Afrasiyab. I was not referring to your response, but to ``Waheed`s`` response as ``emotionally charged``.
#5 Posted by afrasiyab on November 15, 1998 12:13:03 pm
Osama:
I don`t know why you seem to think that this response was emotionally charged. I am trying to help the author by criticizing the work specifically and objectively. Where do you read emotions, which normally are in the form of name calling and leg pulling. If I was sarcastic at some point and you did not understand that embeded sarcasm then Sir I humbly suggest that you should go read some critiques of some other works and then come back and discuss this further.
Hope this helps.
I don`t know why you seem to think that this response was emotionally charged. I am trying to help the author by criticizing the work specifically and objectively. Where do you read emotions, which normally are in the form of name calling and leg pulling. If I was sarcastic at some point and you did not understand that embeded sarcasm then Sir I humbly suggest that you should go read some critiques of some other works and then come back and discuss this further.
Hope this helps.
#4 Posted by afrasiyab on November 15, 1998 12:13:03 pm
To Osama:
Sir, frankly speaking I have no Idea what you are talking about. I have never had anything posted on the chowk as an aricle. I sent them a poem but they have not posted it yet.
This must be another afrasiyab.
However, this is strange, I tried to search for the name ``afrasiyab`` on the chowk so as to make sure that nobody else is using it. Apparently there was someone who used to spell it differently where he/she would capitalize the A in afrasiyab so his/her name was Afrasiyab. But I could not find anything posted by him/her either.
Could u refer to the article more specifically so I could figure out who had the nerve to plagiarze (sp) Munto who happens to be one of my favourite writers.
BTW, if you feel like discussing this specific article by Ajnabi, I am willing to take the discussion further.
Sir, frankly speaking I have no Idea what you are talking about. I have never had anything posted on the chowk as an aricle. I sent them a poem but they have not posted it yet.
This must be another afrasiyab.
However, this is strange, I tried to search for the name ``afrasiyab`` on the chowk so as to make sure that nobody else is using it. Apparently there was someone who used to spell it differently where he/she would capitalize the A in afrasiyab so his/her name was Afrasiyab. But I could not find anything posted by him/her either.
Could u refer to the article more specifically so I could figure out who had the nerve to plagiarze (sp) Munto who happens to be one of my favourite writers.
BTW, if you feel like discussing this specific article by Ajnabi, I am willing to take the discussion further.
#3 Posted by Osama Ahmed on November 15, 1998 3:41:23 am
I thought this was really well written satire. I am not sure what the ``emotionally charged response was all about.
Re: Afrasiyab
Are you the same ``afrasiyab`` who plagiarized the article on Manto?
Re: Afrasiyab
Are you the same ``afrasiyab`` who plagiarized the article on Manto?
#2 Posted by afrasiyab on November 14, 1998 3:36:27 pm
I would like to be polite and say that this was nice but I would be unfair to you as the author if I did that therefore here is what I think:
No purpose, No idea, Apparently no source of inspiration depicted. There is nothing that can save this work from going down into the long list of aricles as just another one, at chowk, that do not mean anything.
If you have the undying urge for depicting what is going on back home you might want to try and be a little more original in your approach than this otherwise I could go read Naseem Hijazi and in the process also improve my Urdu vocabulary.
Nothing personal, but your treatment of events is also pathetic. It is not only unreal but has no soul in it for the reader`s pleasure. One should feel transported to the events of a story. You actually took the easier road by depicting what IS going on and just changing the names, but it still did not work.
No purpose, No idea, Apparently no source of inspiration depicted. There is nothing that can save this work from going down into the long list of aricles as just another one, at chowk, that do not mean anything.
If you have the undying urge for depicting what is going on back home you might want to try and be a little more original in your approach than this otherwise I could go read Naseem Hijazi and in the process also improve my Urdu vocabulary.
Nothing personal, but your treatment of events is also pathetic. It is not only unreal but has no soul in it for the reader`s pleasure. One should feel transported to the events of a story. You actually took the easier road by depicting what IS going on and just changing the names, but it still did not work.
#1 Posted by temporal on November 14, 1998 2:20:17 am
Ajnabi:
Great tongue in cheek affairs--two days in a row.
Am referring to yours and Monis` piece.
``Kapadia`` even presided over the Constituent Assembly`s session on Aug 10 because Karim was not in Waziria then.
The ``VC`` was a crowning touch. Hope you continue this to bring it up to Amir-ul-ChorDaku`s reign not forgetting Emperor Sipah III`s mid air disintegration.
regards
Great tongue in cheek affairs--two days in a row.
Am referring to yours and Monis` piece.
``Kapadia`` even presided over the Constituent Assembly`s session on Aug 10 because Karim was not in Waziria then.
The ``VC`` was a crowning touch. Hope you continue this to bring it up to Amir-ul-ChorDaku`s reign not forgetting Emperor Sipah III`s mid air disintegration.
regards
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