Protestant Introspection Is Destiny

americanFOB, i agree with you 100%

It is causing steretypes to be created towards African-American ppl too. which is sad.

I`m talkin bout rap today, what it has evolved to, these are the names that blare on top 20 lists, BET, and MTV: 50 Cent, Young Buck, Lloyd Banks, R Kelly (his full of sh*t), Cassidy, Fat Joe, Jay-Z, Snoop Dog, Ludacris, Missy Elliot, and the list goes on. I think these are the artists that are at the top of the game nowadays. Their message to the youth it very disturbing to me.

MeShell N`Dege Ocello, Spearhead, The Roots, The Pharcyde, Chuck D, Lauryn Hill, Nas, Tupac...just some of the brightest minds and artists in America today...and they are all hiphop artists...

asadm -- dude thats what i was saying --

athat (arthur?) jee -- the yawn was because i was sleepy

kaurasuch jee -- chill -- i made no reference to religion in my post about introspection either --

asadm -- dude thats what i was saying --

athar (arthur?) jee -- the yawn was because i was sleepy

kaurasuch jee -- chill -- i made no reference to religion in my post about introspection either --

``Ninety percent of Pakistanis are not educated. Islam to the best of my knowledge is not anti education. Most of the greatest artists, mathmaticians, writers and architects were muslims. So I dont see how religion holds us back. If anything its the lack of education. The way African American`s dress and talk is not holding them back either again its the lack of education. The way they dress and the music they listen to is just a way of creating their own identity. By the way Mr Shiraz the secularist supports the most religious rightwing US President in history. ``

No education along with ideas of what a black man or woman should be cause a distructive cycle. I think rap is to blame for the failures of this and coming generations of blacks (And some desis along with others too)...Now the way they talk, if that holds them back seems kind of blurry to me. However, there is no doubt about the fact that NOW rap is about enforcing a negative identity on to many youths (Which nowadays aren`t even black anymore.) The way they dress is fueled from the music videos with Lil Kim, Eve, etc. I`ve noticed that today the black culture is spreading rapidly. You see white people acting ``black`` or ``ghetto``, you see desis at Eid in there ``thug gear``, you even see oriental asians in the same attire and manner (Mr. Chinn, asian rapper). The rap game is becoming much more multicultural, still predominantly black though. Rap has trangressed over racial boundaries a bit and now it`s more about spreading it`s ideas of money, power, wealth, and hoes to the general youth (black, white, brown, etc.)

#30 by dost-mittar on July 7, 2004 4:18pm PT

Wow thanks Mr. Mittar,

That is very kind of you to share all that interesting history of Bill Cosby!

#20 by omar_r_quraishi on July 7, 2004 7:31am PT

Thanks. Have you made up your mind yet if its a ``yawn`` or if its ``A good article with rational and honest content.``?

#23 by kaurasach on July 7, 2004 8:29am PT

Join the club ! (populated by Socrates, Aristotle, Plato, Cicero, Ibn Sina, Ibn Rushd, Copernicus, Galileo, Leonardo Da Vinci, Voltaire, Michalangelo, Fredrich Neitzche (sp?), Ben Franklin, Queen Elizabeth...) the list is endless. The greatest men in history were exiled and excommunicated and hunted and persecuted for they dared to criticize and they dared to look deep inside and declare the truth unto their own people (not everyone else but first they tried to set their own house in order). So congrats and welcome to a long hard road ahead if you can dare to tread it be certain of immortality. If you feel lonely while treading the path less travelled reach out through the surrounding brush and you are bound to touch someone human who is walking just cornstalk of a thickness away from you.

I envy the Indians for secularism has made more Indians into introspective self critical people than Pakistanis. There are many Pakistanis who are introspective and those who are , are beautiful and vulnerable and confident and glorious and stand miles above their contemporaries.

shiraz:
Bill Cosby is a true hero of the blacks. Many people criticised his Bill Cosby Show for being too unrealistic. It revolved around a black couple where the husband was a successful doctor and the wife a successful lawyer. Back then, such a black couple probably didn`t exist anywhere in America. But they missed the point. What the black kids lacked, and still do to a large extent, were good role models. This is what the Cosby show provided. I would like to see some study showing how mancy blacks were inspired by the Cosby show to achieve higher education and avail themselves of the opportunities available to them. Very few people know that he was a tireless spokesperson for the blacks in the early days. Back in the 1970s, there was almost no black person in commercials. Cosby would come on the TV interviews and complain about it, saying that blacks too bought cars, shampoos and tvs and should be on the TV shown purchasing these products.
We need more Cosbys in every community.

very true, my knowledge of early rap is limited. but i think rap was much more empowering and ``clean`` back when it came about in the 80`s.

Rock music is a totally different genre. I think a lot of rock music is still very distructive (Linkin Park, Good Charlotte). But rap gets the prize for being the most negative and hateful.

It seems as if all the songs are moving away drugs and money and lingering more towards sex. All the one hit wonders that come off these famous cd`s usually are sexual in nature (Naughty Girl, Slow Motion, etc).

Ninety percent of Pakistanis are not educated. Islam to the best of my knowledge is not anti education. Most of the greatest artists, mathmaticians, writers and architects were muslims. So I dont see how religion holds us back. If anything its the lack of education. The way African American`s dress and talk is not holding them back either again its the lack of education. The way they dress and the music they listen to is just a way of creating their own identity. By the way Mr Shiraz the secularist supports the most religious rightwing US President in history.

I have emails from this fellow sent through a Pakistani Organization where his name is arthur shiraz.

vertex #24

``Don`t blame the rapist feudal, ambitions generals, or the corrupt judge...blame Islam. How nice and vague.``

Please distinguish between the impact of ideologies and the actions of people who take advantage of societal opportunities opened by those ideologies.

Rapist feudals, ambitious generals, and corrupt judges do a lot of bad things but in themselves not are sufficient to prepare the religio-ideological ground for discrimination against minorities, anti-women laws, religious fanaticism, and wides-spread anti-science attitude.

Look at non Islamic countries. There are very many of them. It is quite absurd to claim that many of their feudals are not rapists, their generals are not ambitious, and their judges are not corrupt. Yet, if you carry out any objective study you will find a range of non flattering differences between countries whose people follow Islam and those that don`t.

Ralph,

``...then IT WOULD NOT BE RIDICULOUS to correct the enviromental problems by `reforming` buddhism first.``

It would not be ridiculous only if the environmental problems were directly related to the ``buddification`` process. And that`s just the point...environmental problems are ``real-world`` and not ideological. It is ridiculous to go on and on about ideology when the real problem is, say, factories dumping toxic waste. I think I previously described this kind of behavior as ``disruptive``...opposition to an ideology is one thing, however being so immersed in this anti-ideology makes you no more rational.

``It is blamed for much worse - for the suppression and dehumanization of minorities, for its barbaric laws against women, for its inability to create an enlightened education system, for its anti-science regressive character, and for the fanaticism and influence of its mullahs.``

Exactly. Don`t blame the rapist feudal, ambitions generals, or the corrupt judge...blame Islam. How nice and vague.

americanFOB,

During the late eighties and early `90`s Rap was very good. Primary themes were about self-empowerment and communal responsibilities. Then the mass media execs took rap into the mainstream, and made it the new hair-band rock`n roll - i.e. pornographic.

If you notice, it`s the rock bands that are now being socially conscious now days (since most claim to be punkish). Rap is only about materialism, and is espousing a very destructive mindset of ``if it pays, it`s good``.

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#2 by kaurasach on July 6, 2004 12:10pm PT
Shiraz,

A good article with rational and honest content. Other communities, religions, nations can learn a lot from this. Instead of ranting and blaming others and begging of favors, they should do a lot of introspection and correct themselves. Most problems arise within.


yes kaurasach -- hopefully u will tell your fellow paki haters to begin instrospecting pronto