A Journey to India
Abroo Shah August 13, 2006
#49 Posted by saharanpuri on August 26, 2006 5:50:38 am
Competitive Massacre
Posted Monday, Sep. 8, 1947
While the orchestra at Lahore`s Falett`s Hotel played quietly for dancing, European guests drank cocktails on the moonlit terrace. Beyond earshot of the music, whole blocks of buildings lay gutted. Streets were bare and silent. Over the deserted railroad station the smell of corpses hung.
One-seventh of Lahore, capital of the Punjab, had been destroyed. Scores of nearby towns and villages had been razed. War—or rather, competitive massacre—between Moslems and Sikhs had reached a pitch of horror that made the Indian Mutiny of 1857 look like a mere street brawl. In two weeks, between 40,000 and 150,000 people had been killed in the Punjab. Most of the bodies were too hacked and charred to be recognized. At least a million were homeless.
``Never during two wars have I seen such sights as I have seen these last two days,`` said a middle-aged British colonel at Lahore airport. ``All those atrocity yarns we used to hear, such as Germans cutting Belgian children`s hands off and raping and then killing women, have suddenly come true in the Punjab during the last week.``
``The Joy of Fraternization.`` For months the Punjab`s communal hatred had been boiling up into slaughter. A previous climax came last spring when hundreds were killed in riots there (TIME, March 17). In mid-August the partition of the Punjab between India and Pakistan left 1.6 of the 3.8 million Sikhs in the province under Moslem rule; at least twice as many Moslems remained on the Indian side of the border in a new East Punjab state.
The Sikhs are an offshoot of the Hindu religion; they organized 300 years ago to resist militantly Moslem oppression. The British had used the warlike Sikhs extensively, giving them land and offices, especially in the fertile, predominantly Moslem West Punjab. In consequence, the Moslems hate Sikhs far more than they do Hindus.
The rest of India was relatively quiet. In once turbulent Calcutta, Mohandas K. Gandhi, still striving for Hindu-Moslem unity, was able to write of the situation there: ``One might almost say the joy of fraternization is leaping up from hour to hour.``
There was no fraternization in the Punjab. At Amritsar, on the Indian side of the border, organized gangs of Sikhs had exterminated or driven out the Moslem minority population (150,000). Moslems in Lahore and other Pakistan border regions retaliated against the Hindus and Sikhs there.
Mohamed Ali Jinnah, who had conceived Pakistan in hatred and was now its president and undisputed boss, sent to the West Punjab as governor his faithful follower, the Khan of Momdot. The bland, moonfaced Khan had served four years in the Punjab Legislative Assembly without opening his mouth. When he got to the West Punjab, he acted. With his province literally in flames, the Khan of Momdot relaxed regulations that had restricted the carrying of firearms; he also decreed that every man could wear a sword, provided it was covered.
Some of his subordinates went further. The Moslem deputy commissioner of one of the Western Punjab districts mourned a son killed on the Indian side of the border. Said he to the young Moslems: ``You have full liberty to go the limit.
Take revenge as you like, but if there is one Hindu or Sikh left alive in my district after you are through, I swear to kill them myself.``
The Canal Turned Pink. TIME Correspondent Robert Neville flew over the area last week, then talked with refugees and correspondents fleeing from the carnage. Neville cabled:
``Just flying over the Punjab today with a landing here & there gives a feeling that terrible things have happened below. The number of smoking villages that can be counted from Ambala up to Lahore must be at least 150. Here & there can be seen a big town like Sialkot and Gujranwala, where charred black districts tell the story that here the property of one entire community was wiped out.
``The panorama of West Punjab seems even worse. In hitherto peaceful districts like Montgomery and Lyallpur there is not one town which has not been a battlefield. There is no bazaar which has not been burned out. Streams of refugees can be seen approaching all bridges, and over some roads they form virtual convoys miles long. On a ten-mile stretch of road leading to the big bridge over the Sutlej River into Pakistan, there must have been 100,000 people, most of them walking beside bullock carts piled high with their sole possessions.
``At Lahore`s Central Station, Sikh and Hindu refugees from North or West Punjab were mobbed on the platform, often stabbed to death and their few belongings looted. A major incident involved a big convoy carrying perhaps 1,000 from Sialkot to Amritsar. The convoy was stopped and attacked at the Ravi River bridge. Hundreds were stabbed to death and other hundreds wounded.
``Refugees from Lyallpur in West Punjab say that so many Sikhs and Hindus were murdered and their bodies thrown into the canal that the canal actually had a pinkish color for a day after. Moslem refugees told how Sikhs stripped and paraded Moslem women through the streets, raped them and then killed them. British correspondents reported having seen dead, naked women lying about villages of the Amritsar district.``
A Look of Satisfaction. ``Although railway administrations of both Dominions have doggedly tried to keep a skeleton schedule going, they have now given up. For days on end no trains arrived in Delhi without having been attacked and looted practically all along the route.
``Near Jullundur, a band of Sikhs held up a train, methodically searched all compartments and pulled out 17 Moslems, whom they beheaded on the platform. Most amazing of all was the look of bland satisfaction on the faces of these young Sikh men, their hands dripping blood, their clothes smeared with blood, as they stood and grinned at their handiwork while the train finally pulled out. The only Moslems who escaped on this trip were two who were hidden by two British officers under their baggage.
``A British correspondent traveling in the opposite direction through this territory saw half a dozen lying stabbed on the Lahore platform, slowly dying without any help being given. Later that night, on a small siding south of Amritsar, a band of Sikhs entered his compartment and before his eyes beheaded a Moslem apparently trying to travel disguised as a Hindu. (For identification, both sides use the tried and true means of seeing whether there has been circumcision. Moslems always circumcize, the Hindus and Sikhs practically never.)
``A member of the U.S. Embassy arrived in Lahore from Delhi with another tale of horror. Reaching the small station of Okara, near Montgomery, he found the station platform utterly deserted except for several hundred dead Hindus and Sikhs lying around the platform, apparently slaughtered only a few hours before while waiting for the train to escape. All these people were workers in a textile mill which had been attacked by Moslems. Their bodies were mostly stripped and in several instances limbs had been torn from the bodies. The wife of a British textile factory manager told how a Moslem mob had attacked the Hindu and Sikh workers in another factory. When Moslems broke into the ground floor, the Sikhs slashed the throats of their own wives, and afterwards tried to fight through themselves. All were killed.``
Authorities were utterly unable to cope with the situation. In many cases both Sikh and Moslem police had participated in the riots. British soldiers, present in the Punjab, were not allowed to interfere under the arrangements now in force for Indian independence.
No Plans. For the homeless, crippled refugees, no one had anticipated relief measures. In New Delhi a penniless Hindu woman from the West Punjab clutched her two children, told of her husband`s murder by Moslems. ``Don`t ask her about her plans,`` cautioned a welfare official, ``she hasn`t any and neither have we.``
The rioting was breaking down railroad traffic between parts of India and Pakistan. Unless it was soon restored, both nations, especially Pakistan, would be economically crippled. Fearing that the Punjab rioting would spread, millions of Hindus and Moslems prepared to cross borders in a transfer of population greater than Europe had ever seen.
In his new capital, Karachi, Jinnah preached that ``restraint is necessary.`` However, the fires of communal hatred, which he had fanned for 20 years, were burning too brightly in the Punjab to be easily stifled. They might spread
From the Sep. 8, 1947 issue of TIME magazine
Posted Monday, Sep. 8, 1947
While the orchestra at Lahore`s Falett`s Hotel played quietly for dancing, European guests drank cocktails on the moonlit terrace. Beyond earshot of the music, whole blocks of buildings lay gutted. Streets were bare and silent. Over the deserted railroad station the smell of corpses hung.
One-seventh of Lahore, capital of the Punjab, had been destroyed. Scores of nearby towns and villages had been razed. War—or rather, competitive massacre—between Moslems and Sikhs had reached a pitch of horror that made the Indian Mutiny of 1857 look like a mere street brawl. In two weeks, between 40,000 and 150,000 people had been killed in the Punjab. Most of the bodies were too hacked and charred to be recognized. At least a million were homeless.
``Never during two wars have I seen such sights as I have seen these last two days,`` said a middle-aged British colonel at Lahore airport. ``All those atrocity yarns we used to hear, such as Germans cutting Belgian children`s hands off and raping and then killing women, have suddenly come true in the Punjab during the last week.``
``The Joy of Fraternization.`` For months the Punjab`s communal hatred had been boiling up into slaughter. A previous climax came last spring when hundreds were killed in riots there (TIME, March 17). In mid-August the partition of the Punjab between India and Pakistan left 1.6 of the 3.8 million Sikhs in the province under Moslem rule; at least twice as many Moslems remained on the Indian side of the border in a new East Punjab state.
The Sikhs are an offshoot of the Hindu religion; they organized 300 years ago to resist militantly Moslem oppression. The British had used the warlike Sikhs extensively, giving them land and offices, especially in the fertile, predominantly Moslem West Punjab. In consequence, the Moslems hate Sikhs far more than they do Hindus.
The rest of India was relatively quiet. In once turbulent Calcutta, Mohandas K. Gandhi, still striving for Hindu-Moslem unity, was able to write of the situation there: ``One might almost say the joy of fraternization is leaping up from hour to hour.``
There was no fraternization in the Punjab. At Amritsar, on the Indian side of the border, organized gangs of Sikhs had exterminated or driven out the Moslem minority population (150,000). Moslems in Lahore and other Pakistan border regions retaliated against the Hindus and Sikhs there.
Mohamed Ali Jinnah, who had conceived Pakistan in hatred and was now its president and undisputed boss, sent to the West Punjab as governor his faithful follower, the Khan of Momdot. The bland, moonfaced Khan had served four years in the Punjab Legislative Assembly without opening his mouth. When he got to the West Punjab, he acted. With his province literally in flames, the Khan of Momdot relaxed regulations that had restricted the carrying of firearms; he also decreed that every man could wear a sword, provided it was covered.
Some of his subordinates went further. The Moslem deputy commissioner of one of the Western Punjab districts mourned a son killed on the Indian side of the border. Said he to the young Moslems: ``You have full liberty to go the limit.
Take revenge as you like, but if there is one Hindu or Sikh left alive in my district after you are through, I swear to kill them myself.``
The Canal Turned Pink. TIME Correspondent Robert Neville flew over the area last week, then talked with refugees and correspondents fleeing from the carnage. Neville cabled:
``Just flying over the Punjab today with a landing here & there gives a feeling that terrible things have happened below. The number of smoking villages that can be counted from Ambala up to Lahore must be at least 150. Here & there can be seen a big town like Sialkot and Gujranwala, where charred black districts tell the story that here the property of one entire community was wiped out.
``The panorama of West Punjab seems even worse. In hitherto peaceful districts like Montgomery and Lyallpur there is not one town which has not been a battlefield. There is no bazaar which has not been burned out. Streams of refugees can be seen approaching all bridges, and over some roads they form virtual convoys miles long. On a ten-mile stretch of road leading to the big bridge over the Sutlej River into Pakistan, there must have been 100,000 people, most of them walking beside bullock carts piled high with their sole possessions.
``At Lahore`s Central Station, Sikh and Hindu refugees from North or West Punjab were mobbed on the platform, often stabbed to death and their few belongings looted. A major incident involved a big convoy carrying perhaps 1,000 from Sialkot to Amritsar. The convoy was stopped and attacked at the Ravi River bridge. Hundreds were stabbed to death and other hundreds wounded.
``Refugees from Lyallpur in West Punjab say that so many Sikhs and Hindus were murdered and their bodies thrown into the canal that the canal actually had a pinkish color for a day after. Moslem refugees told how Sikhs stripped and paraded Moslem women through the streets, raped them and then killed them. British correspondents reported having seen dead, naked women lying about villages of the Amritsar district.``
A Look of Satisfaction. ``Although railway administrations of both Dominions have doggedly tried to keep a skeleton schedule going, they have now given up. For days on end no trains arrived in Delhi without having been attacked and looted practically all along the route.
``Near Jullundur, a band of Sikhs held up a train, methodically searched all compartments and pulled out 17 Moslems, whom they beheaded on the platform. Most amazing of all was the look of bland satisfaction on the faces of these young Sikh men, their hands dripping blood, their clothes smeared with blood, as they stood and grinned at their handiwork while the train finally pulled out. The only Moslems who escaped on this trip were two who were hidden by two British officers under their baggage.
``A British correspondent traveling in the opposite direction through this territory saw half a dozen lying stabbed on the Lahore platform, slowly dying without any help being given. Later that night, on a small siding south of Amritsar, a band of Sikhs entered his compartment and before his eyes beheaded a Moslem apparently trying to travel disguised as a Hindu. (For identification, both sides use the tried and true means of seeing whether there has been circumcision. Moslems always circumcize, the Hindus and Sikhs practically never.)
``A member of the U.S. Embassy arrived in Lahore from Delhi with another tale of horror. Reaching the small station of Okara, near Montgomery, he found the station platform utterly deserted except for several hundred dead Hindus and Sikhs lying around the platform, apparently slaughtered only a few hours before while waiting for the train to escape. All these people were workers in a textile mill which had been attacked by Moslems. Their bodies were mostly stripped and in several instances limbs had been torn from the bodies. The wife of a British textile factory manager told how a Moslem mob had attacked the Hindu and Sikh workers in another factory. When Moslems broke into the ground floor, the Sikhs slashed the throats of their own wives, and afterwards tried to fight through themselves. All were killed.``
Authorities were utterly unable to cope with the situation. In many cases both Sikh and Moslem police had participated in the riots. British soldiers, present in the Punjab, were not allowed to interfere under the arrangements now in force for Indian independence.
No Plans. For the homeless, crippled refugees, no one had anticipated relief measures. In New Delhi a penniless Hindu woman from the West Punjab clutched her two children, told of her husband`s murder by Moslems. ``Don`t ask her about her plans,`` cautioned a welfare official, ``she hasn`t any and neither have we.``
The rioting was breaking down railroad traffic between parts of India and Pakistan. Unless it was soon restored, both nations, especially Pakistan, would be economically crippled. Fearing that the Punjab rioting would spread, millions of Hindus and Moslems prepared to cross borders in a transfer of population greater than Europe had ever seen.
In his new capital, Karachi, Jinnah preached that ``restraint is necessary.`` However, the fires of communal hatred, which he had fanned for 20 years, were burning too brightly in the Punjab to be easily stifled. They might spread
From the Sep. 8, 1947 issue of TIME magazine
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#48 Posted by Sanatani on August 26, 2006 4:22:02 am
Re: # 47
sach karva hai appne sach kaha.
Har Har Mahadeva
sach karva hai appne sach kaha.
Har Har Mahadeva
#47 Posted by wiseguyin on August 22, 2006 3:32:08 pm
Re: # 46
> so between you and santana you should be able to put some material here....
And I always thought everyone knew of a certain ch*tiya chauhan with a first name of
PrithviRaj. Brave, but a ch*tiya nevertheless.
> so between you and santana you should be able to put some material here....
And I always thought everyone knew of a certain ch*tiya chauhan with a first name of
PrithviRaj. Brave, but a ch*tiya nevertheless.
#46 Posted by jang on August 21, 2006 10:01:33 am
# 44 by krishna
``but Hindu kings practiced their warfare with lot more ethics and dignity that the Muslim rulers ``
this is an assertion. how about some names, and how so? remember, satyameva jayate. if this FACT is so obvious, there would be no dearth of material on this topic. some comparisons of the contemperory wars etc will make the case.
so between you and santana you should be able to put some material here. i am not contesting that the invaders from the fargana or kabul were not nasty. you should read about the treatment fargananinas meted out to mr ibrahim lodhi or lodhi-gardens fame.
so panditji, post somethign in support of your above assertion.
thanks and jai ganesh vighnaharta and milk-lover.
``but Hindu kings practiced their warfare with lot more ethics and dignity that the Muslim rulers ``
this is an assertion. how about some names, and how so? remember, satyameva jayate. if this FACT is so obvious, there would be no dearth of material on this topic. some comparisons of the contemperory wars etc will make the case.
so between you and santana you should be able to put some material here. i am not contesting that the invaders from the fargana or kabul were not nasty. you should read about the treatment fargananinas meted out to mr ibrahim lodhi or lodhi-gardens fame.
so panditji, post somethign in support of your above assertion.
thanks and jai ganesh vighnaharta and milk-lover.
#45 Posted by althaf51 on August 20, 2006 2:37:15 am
30 by althaf51 on August 16, 2006 8:43am PT
Interesting reading, a Very vivid description of every thing that Abroo sha saw on his first visit, he seem to have observed lot more in such a short visit. Opinions are unbiased and dispassionate. But there is something I tell my Pakistani friends when they keep harping about common culture and shared lifestyle. India is much more than Hindi movies and Hindustani tongue. Such striking similarities are confined only to some parts of northern India., and as you know majority of Indians are not north Indians. A typical Malayali or tamilian or Telungu or Assemese , or a Naga has very little to share with his Pakistani counter part. Iam a malyali muslim and I have more in common with fellow Christians and Hindus or nigoubering tamilian, or srilanakan or a malasian than with a Pakistani except my faith. We don’t speak Urdu, and is never proud of mugul past. And do not share the same history of invasion and conquest. our food habits and recipes are not the same. i am not saying this because I am offended by such close comparisons or iam apologetic about our shared past. I would like the two countries to come much closer and I wish Mr. abroo sha to get a visa on arrival on his next visit to India. It is just my observation that India has a cultural diversity that an average Pakistanis can never comprehend.
Interesting reading, a Very vivid description of every thing that Abroo sha saw on his first visit, he seem to have observed lot more in such a short visit. Opinions are unbiased and dispassionate. But there is something I tell my Pakistani friends when they keep harping about common culture and shared lifestyle. India is much more than Hindi movies and Hindustani tongue. Such striking similarities are confined only to some parts of northern India., and as you know majority of Indians are not north Indians. A typical Malayali or tamilian or Telungu or Assemese , or a Naga has very little to share with his Pakistani counter part. Iam a malyali muslim and I have more in common with fellow Christians and Hindus or nigoubering tamilian, or srilanakan or a malasian than with a Pakistani except my faith. We don’t speak Urdu, and is never proud of mugul past. And do not share the same history of invasion and conquest. our food habits and recipes are not the same. i am not saying this because I am offended by such close comparisons or iam apologetic about our shared past. I would like the two countries to come much closer and I wish Mr. abroo sha to get a visa on arrival on his next visit to India. It is just my observation that India has a cultural diversity that an average Pakistanis can never comprehend.
#44 Posted by krishna_abcd on August 18, 2006 12:48:57 pm
#40 by jang
[it would be great if you do a presentation here (links or from your memory) of how medieval hindu kings (like the rajputs, solankis etc) performed state-craft and waged wars. the last vikramditya was banya king hemu of dilli..defeated by young akbars army. scortched earth policy was e.g. also used by mahadji scindia during the last battle or wadgaon that marhattas won against bombay company british.
so i invite you to present some evidence and not resort to whining about behavior of medieval central-asian invaders. ]
It may be difficult for you to accept, but Hindu kings practiced their warfare with lot more ethics and dignity that the Muslim rulers (who you hope are your ancestors - which is natural for you to do, because all half-breeds hope that maybe they are full-blooded :) ).
I think maybe unethical conduct in warfare was first started by the inventor of your peaceful religion mohammed who always ambushed his enemies when they were resting/sleeping etc.(LALOPBUH-SAW-POM-KS-GG) (LALOPBUH = Lots and Lots of Peace Be Upon Him, POM = Pride of Medina, KS = Kind Soul , GG=Grrrrreat Guy), because before him, the Arabs used to conduct their warfare with much more honor and dignity.
[it would be great if you do a presentation here (links or from your memory) of how medieval hindu kings (like the rajputs, solankis etc) performed state-craft and waged wars. the last vikramditya was banya king hemu of dilli..defeated by young akbars army. scortched earth policy was e.g. also used by mahadji scindia during the last battle or wadgaon that marhattas won against bombay company british.
so i invite you to present some evidence and not resort to whining about behavior of medieval central-asian invaders. ]
It may be difficult for you to accept, but Hindu kings practiced their warfare with lot more ethics and dignity that the Muslim rulers (who you hope are your ancestors - which is natural for you to do, because all half-breeds hope that maybe they are full-blooded :) ).
I think maybe unethical conduct in warfare was first started by the inventor of your peaceful religion mohammed who always ambushed his enemies when they were resting/sleeping etc.(LALOPBUH-SAW-POM-KS-GG) (LALOPBUH = Lots and Lots of Peace Be Upon Him, POM = Pride of Medina, KS = Kind Soul , GG=Grrrrreat Guy), because before him, the Arabs used to conduct their warfare with much more honor and dignity.
#43 Posted by Inquirer on August 17, 2006 10:56:54 am
Abroo has not come back to respond to the comments. That is acceptable, but can`t you negativistic antagonists leave this board as a positive one as it was started?
What is preventing you from opening your own battle grounds and letting this remain a board of goodwill?
What is preventing you from opening your own battle grounds and letting this remain a board of goodwill?
#40 Posted by jang on August 17, 2006 7:44:02 am
santy, i mean no offense with uncapitalized script..you see in devnagri or brahmi, there is no concept of capitalization, its a firangi concept, and that is why i dont capitalize.
i thnk using ramayana or smirits is not right comparison...too old and with does not have enough corroboration.
it would be great if you do a presentation here (links or from your memory) of how medieval hindu kings (like the rajputs, solankis etc) performed state-craft and waged wars. the last vikramditya was banya king hemu of dilli..defeated by young akbars army. scortched earth policy was e.g. also used by mahadji scindia during the last battle or wadgaon that marhattas won against bombay company british.
so i invite you to present some evidence and not resort to whining about behavior of medieval central-asian invaders.
i thnk using ramayana or smirits is not right comparison...too old and with does not have enough corroboration.
it would be great if you do a presentation here (links or from your memory) of how medieval hindu kings (like the rajputs, solankis etc) performed state-craft and waged wars. the last vikramditya was banya king hemu of dilli..defeated by young akbars army. scortched earth policy was e.g. also used by mahadji scindia during the last battle or wadgaon that marhattas won against bombay company british.
so i invite you to present some evidence and not resort to whining about behavior of medieval central-asian invaders.
#39 Posted by VRV on August 17, 2006 7:10:04 am
>>>>Press Trust of India:
Islamabad, August 17: Pakistan, which continues to ban Indian television channels, has permitted local private channels to air six per cent Indian content in their programmes during daily transmissions.
The local channels were allowed to air six per cent Indian content and four per cent English content, Minister in charge of the Cabinet Division, Major (Retd) Zulfiqar Ali Gondal, told the National Assembly, the Lower House of Parliament, on Wednesday.<<<<<<<
Is Pakistan becoming a Stalinist state?
What about the minister changing his 1/3 Indian name Gondal to some Pakistani name? (Gondal is in Kathiawar).
India and Pakistan must allow each other`s channels for free flow of ideas and info.
Islamabad, August 17: Pakistan, which continues to ban Indian television channels, has permitted local private channels to air six per cent Indian content in their programmes during daily transmissions.
The local channels were allowed to air six per cent Indian content and four per cent English content, Minister in charge of the Cabinet Division, Major (Retd) Zulfiqar Ali Gondal, told the National Assembly, the Lower House of Parliament, on Wednesday.<<<<<<<
Is Pakistan becoming a Stalinist state?
What about the minister changing his 1/3 Indian name Gondal to some Pakistani name? (Gondal is in Kathiawar).
India and Pakistan must allow each other`s channels for free flow of ideas and info.
#38 Posted by Sanatani on August 17, 2006 1:30:49 am
Re: # 36
Jai Bhawani, Jai Mahakali Jangji,
First Hanuman, Krishna and Shivaji should be in capitals not small.
Ashwamedh ko Gardhabmedh kyon banate ho? Yagy ko Yajnya bhi kyun? Is this the sum total of your education attempting to lampoon your religion and culture. Or should I take it you are the ``fashionable Macaulayite kind``. Your previous posts suggest not?
The Ashwamedh was last done by Chandragupt Vikramaditya in (I think after which the Vikrami Samvat was posssibly formulated).
As to your question ``can you please discribe how the medival hindu kings ruled their lands and waged wars (in contrast)?`` Read the Smritis all33 of them (and yes the much maligned Manusmriti) for the classical and treatisical conduct as well as the Arthshatr. For a historical account read the Muslim chroniclers, the Maratha Archives at Pune and Satara as well as Col William Todds fabled ``Annals and Antiquity`s of Rajputana`` both volumes. You could also look up Bharatvani.org for a more detailed account.
And in case all this effort is beyond you then why not have a look at VCD`s/DVD`s of Ramayan and Mahabharat. You shall get the general idea.
Regards
Sanatani
Jai Bhawani, Jai Mahakali Jangji,
First Hanuman, Krishna and Shivaji should be in capitals not small.
Ashwamedh ko Gardhabmedh kyon banate ho? Yagy ko Yajnya bhi kyun? Is this the sum total of your education attempting to lampoon your religion and culture. Or should I take it you are the ``fashionable Macaulayite kind``. Your previous posts suggest not?
The Ashwamedh was last done by Chandragupt Vikramaditya in (I think after which the Vikrami Samvat was posssibly formulated).
As to your question ``can you please discribe how the medival hindu kings ruled their lands and waged wars (in contrast)?`` Read the Smritis all33 of them (and yes the much maligned Manusmriti) for the classical and treatisical conduct as well as the Arthshatr. For a historical account read the Muslim chroniclers, the Maratha Archives at Pune and Satara as well as Col William Todds fabled ``Annals and Antiquity`s of Rajputana`` both volumes. You could also look up Bharatvani.org for a more detailed account.
And in case all this effort is beyond you then why not have a look at VCD`s/DVD`s of Ramayan and Mahabharat. You shall get the general idea.
Regards
Sanatani
#37 Posted by VRV on August 16, 2006 5:50:11 pm
Re: # 23
Dear Sanatani,
I have gone thru` the booklink you gave. I found some new things which I need to cros-check from other sources, without which I can not make a final comment on your points on Tipu. The contents of the book and the language and presentation denote a pattern of a version contrary to a normal historical book. So, I am a bit sceptical but I would read the book and follow it up with further reading (of other books on Tipu).
As for Jinnah, he underwent a transformation from an unalloyed nationalist to a crude communal beast. Why he underwent or what caused such transformation is still under my study. I found 3-4 specific phases in his life. I dont like to go in-detail becoz I am still studying him.
Pl enjoy in Heaven and enjoy your time with Rambha, Urvasi, Menaka and Tilottama.. till then I will rot in hell.
By the bye, please buy some Viagra to enjoy the girls in heaven (T-I-C:))
Dear Sanatani,
I have gone thru` the booklink you gave. I found some new things which I need to cros-check from other sources, without which I can not make a final comment on your points on Tipu. The contents of the book and the language and presentation denote a pattern of a version contrary to a normal historical book. So, I am a bit sceptical but I would read the book and follow it up with further reading (of other books on Tipu).
As for Jinnah, he underwent a transformation from an unalloyed nationalist to a crude communal beast. Why he underwent or what caused such transformation is still under my study. I found 3-4 specific phases in his life. I dont like to go in-detail becoz I am still studying him.
Pl enjoy in Heaven and enjoy your time with Rambha, Urvasi, Menaka and Tilottama.. till then I will rot in hell.
By the bye, please buy some Viagra to enjoy the girls in heaven (T-I-C:))
#36 Posted by jang on August 16, 2006 1:37:30 pm
jai hanuman!
sanatani, can you please discribe how the medival hindu kings ruled their lands and waged wars (in contrast)? did they do a gardhabamedha yajnya? there is little available about this topic, so your input is apreciated.
jai shivaji and hare krishna.
sanatani, can you please discribe how the medival hindu kings ruled their lands and waged wars (in contrast)? did they do a gardhabamedha yajnya? there is little available about this topic, so your input is apreciated.
jai shivaji and hare krishna.
#35 Posted by zuni on August 16, 2006 12:00:35 pm
Hey, read ur article. Its nice u have tried to narate ur entire trip to Banglor and even noticed certain imp. things . But i would like u to see more of India, so that next time u write in , the Indian beauty bcomes visible in ur writing. Indian is so much diversed with diff cultures that one needs a lot of time to discover it. Hope u get to see more of India. For this its very imp. that both Indian and Pak govt. bcome liberal.
#34 Posted by mohar11 on August 16, 2006 11:01:38 am
Re: # 33
sure - where do you want to go?... if you live around DC, let me know...
sure - where do you want to go?... if you live around DC, let me know...
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