Why the American War on Terror is Failing Miserably

Re: # 247

zeemax,

.......... how much do you want to bet that geo will be back on air soon, with hamid mir and the rest of them taking a 'soft' approach towards the government in the interest of national unity and all that jazz .......

...... and don't get too excited about the abdul aziz types .......... these primitive cave dwellers are a nuisance and a pain in the butt, but they too can be bought off like the 'mainstream' politicians, or simply killed like the animals that they are ..........personally i don't believe in wasting money on them .....

#245 Posted by bulleya,

I agree with this post.

......the million dollar question is what will be the vehicle through which it is released.....

Remember Lal Masjid? That's the vehicle through which it will be released, and Abdul-Rashid Ghazi's portraits will replace those of M.A Jinnah as Quaid-e-Azam.

That's the truth. No disrespect meant to M.A Jinnah of-course.

so:

1. musharraf + mqm + pml(q) on one side
2. pml(n) + pti + anp + baluchi parties on one side
3. bb on one side
4. jui(f) on one side

three questions:
1. where will jamaat go......it could go with 2, as that is where political direction lies currently.....or it could go with 4, as that is where its ideological directions lies

2. will bb join 1, or will she join 2

3. will jui(f) join 1 or remain in 4

the best case for establishment is that bb and jui(f) join 1, or at least agree to compete against them

the best case for judges (and for pakistan) is for bb to join 2......if she does this, i think musharraf is probably screwed, and pml(q) is totally screwed (while mqm will survive, regardless of what happens).......

#243 Posted by hamidm2,

Yeah I can understand about ARY. Pity, isn't it?

Problem was Dr. Shahid Masood. ARY found him but had to fire him out of pressure, and then GEO picked him up. Now ARY has fired the rest of their main anchors as well and back on air, while GEO has been demolished. Even their webcasts have stopped.

What can I say? ARY are businessmen, not journalists, with a lot of other businesses at stake in Pakistan. GEO are journalists of the Jang Group and have support of civil society.

Re: # 243

zeemax,

....... just to show that i haven't given up ... yet, i am still hoping that nawaz sharif and bb will boycott the elections and let the chaudharys, musharraf, maulana fazloo and the rest of the jokers hang themselves with their own rope ........ this is the only way to get rid of the military-mullah-cattlethief kleptocracy ....... imran khan and asghar khan sitting out the elections is like the lions sitting out of the super bowl ........

....my opinion has been that smart money is on Urstruly....i.e. Jamaat types are going to rise within a few years.....because the current secular enlightened moderates of musharraf, mqm + maybe bb are bankrupt and will continue the downslide of society.....thereby raisng the stock of religious right.......

however, now Urstruly has dumped Jamaat etc......so smart money cannot be on Urstruly, or it cannot be on Jamaat types......

.....so what is the vehicle through which the common unheard (non-Chowk) pakistani (perhaps over 75% of the population) find its voice, if the religious right and the secular liberals are discredited...as is the army....

is it going to be the religious extreme right.......if the army's current operations in wazirstan to swat fail (which they will fail, in my opinion), then there are big reprecussions.....and if musharraf, mqm and bb end up running pakistan, with their loyalties to foreign countries, then there are even bigger problems.......

all this pressure will have to be released from somewhere......the million dollar question is what will be the vehicle through which it is released.....

#241 Posted by Urstruly,

I agree with you, but a hell of a lot of blood will be spilt in that manner. In fact, what you say appears to be the obvious and inevitable outcome of the current crisis.

Why I favour NS is because only NS offers a middle alternative, and a sturdy one.

After all, he did the nuke tests in the face of great intimidation from across the seas.

Re: # 240

zeemax,

.... to prove my point ....... have you tuned in to ary oneworld today? ......... it is back on air and sounds like ptv ..... and i just heard shahbaz sharif in a new armani suit talking about coming back to pakistan to serve the poor people on the 25th ....... i think the people of pakistan are getting set up to get screwed again by the same set of scounderals ..... why don't we act like the pederast mullahs and their madrassa boys so that we can at least enjoy it this time around ..........

shankar #: "I thought you were the eternal optimist. Thats why I'm surprised to hear you say Pakistan has had it after your last visit!....."

.......i try to be an optimist in my personal life...but, when describing an issue or place on this site, i try to be as objective as possible....i had my first real insight into pakistan about two years ago.....i was in pakistan for six months, and got to meet a lot of these, "leaders" face to face......i had never had an opportunity to discuss issues with people in such high places, previously in my life ......after these interactions, i came to the following conclusions:

- pakistan military is beyond repair and totally degenarated....i used to think it was only the generals.....now i am convinced that as an institution it is totally degenerated.....the only thing anyone above the rank of major wanted to discuss with me was plots.....

- pakistan's burecracy is so corrupt it is unbelivable......i already knew it was corrupt, but this was an eye-opener......

- pakisatni politicians are sell-outs....i already knew this, but it was interesting hearing it from their own mouths.....having said that, my opinion of politicians has improved, from very bad to bad.......

- interestingly, there were two institutions and two specific individauls that i ranked quite highly (and mentioned it on chowk also)....one was the media, the other were lawyers and to some extent judiciary......that has proven to be true.....

similarly, there were two politicians that all the politicians spoke highly of.....one very senior guy from ppp actually said, that these were the only two decent politicians in pakistan.......imran khan and aitezaz ahsan.......that has proven correct.......

......if the judiciary wins out against the establishment, pakistan will have made a quantum leap towards stability.......much like it has earlier made due to its fast economic progress, in comparison to other south asian countries, since 47.......if the establishment wins, then the next rise will be of the religious right........and then eventually anarchy......

"Also, I hear you visited India. Havent heard your impressions""

yes, i am spending nearly all my professional time with indian companies......and am in india regularly now......at least once every four to six months or so......more on this later.......india is doing quite well.......it has got its marbles straight, and will continue moving ahead.....not at the pace, everyone keeps saying, but it will keep going ahead.......

at the moment, i found the infrastructure in paksitan actually better.....so one cannot really tell the difference.......but pakistan is pointed downwards, and india moving upwards.......

Re: # 238

I agree with hamidm here about NS (and political class in general). See the criterion is simple. The most pressing issue in this country today is the absolute failure of state apparatus and military; the civil war; and the freedom struggle in Afghanistan that has now reached Islamabad. Just as neocolonialists in Afghanistan think that the source of all their troubles lies in Pakistan, so do the freedom fighters over there are of the opinion that unless they crush the head of this snake (Pakistan)fdirst they cannot harm the mother of all serpents (US). No political leader in Pakistan dares address these issues.

The senseless and extrajusicial murder of Pakistani citizens using the full force and fury of state appratus is on no politician's agenda.

The re-enactment of judiciary has taken back seat.

So this is the bottomline:

- Any election under this harami is invalid.
- Any government formed under this harami or any other harami in uniform is invalid.

- Any politician who takes part in any election under this harami is a part of harami brigade.

Even a second grader would understand that this harami is allowing NS to comeback to lend some credibility to the political system he intends to establish. NS will discredit himself just like Bezamir did if he takes part in this farce.

But I do not need to tell these things to anyone. It is written on the wall that anyone who is going to take part in protecting the status quo in any shape or form should have nine lives. It is not going to be bed of rose anymore. Pakistani citizenary has picked up weapons against this corrupt and deadly system and would not let the corrupt ruling elite has its way anymore. A time of reckonning is upon us all.

#239 Posted by hamidm2,

That's defeatist. Have Faith in people.

(Oh but I forgot, you reject all kinds of 'faith')

Re: # 234

zeemax,

.... you and tahmed are hopeless optimists in your own way .... in the end one of you will end up drinking the milk and other will have to eat the goat droppings like the rest of us .......... nothing, my friend is going to change and as much as i like my namesake, hamid mir, i don't think he is any different from the rest of the crowd ....... in a crowd of pygmies a man who stands at four feet looks like a giant .........

Just a reminder ...

The problem is, and has always been the army top brass.

ZAB confronted the army top brass and got hanged. Nawaz Sharif confronted the army top brass too and almost got hanged.

But he is smarter than ZAB. He called on favours done to powerful people and bided his time in exile and saved his life. But hasn't stopped confronting the top brass.

A dead man is no good. Better to live and fight.

#236 Posted by tahmed32,

So you didn't listen to that speech. That's alright.

Then of-course you wouldn't have a clue how that speech is embedded in publics mind, and rightfully so.

zeemax #32 a picture is worth a thousand words. i dont need to listen to NS speeches. his actions - e.g. storming of the Supreme Court, the 18th amendment - show his mindset is the same as that of musharraf. as is benazir. and the maulvis are not even worth mentioning, since they are only dumber versions of musharraf/ns/bb types.

That is why I keep saying - it is the system that is important. not the individuals.

#231 hamidm: There was no democracy in germany or japan either until after WWII. There was no democracy in India until after 1947. There was no democracy in South Korea either until Park (or whatever his name was) was overthrown. There is no democracy in Russia either, with Putin going the extra mile to have the opposition jailed or murdered. There was no democracy in Estonia, Latvia, Poland, Hungary, East Germany, and the rest East Europe and no democracy in Argentina, Chile, Brazil and a good deal of the rest of Latin America until the Cold War ended. There was no democracy in Turkey - until recently. Indonesia after Suharto has a much stronger rule of law than before and is well on its way to becoming a democracy. Same thing in Malaysia.

With the growth of the middle classes, it is a question of time before people figure out that the Big Man is merely a scoundrel lording it over them on the pretext of being a savior. Whether the scoundrel is wearing a uniform, a beard or merely a "national dress" of one kind of another - it doesnt matter.