The Long Road to Talibanization

I have reposted the ilog referred to in #48

The miserable Chowk staff had banned me and removed through deception this ilog. Further, they censored this article by not publishing it on FP. It is my guess that YLH has a role in all of this. It is not me they harm by such censorship, it is you, the members that are being treated as children by these thugs that follow an agenda

TNITC masadi

Pakistanis deserve every thing that is happening to them. Nowhere in the world people chose corrupt leaders after free and fair elections except Pakistan. Kudos to the people who write big words but do nothing...

riaz thats exactly what iam saying, popply cultivation is thriving now because the taliban are not in power.
so this is a question which should be put to the us backed govt of afghanistan that why cant it control this problem...
you muddle facts please dont take your personal anger against a group and start to see faults in them which dont even exsist. you must give credit where credit is due.

Like Hizbullah in Lebanon, it seems to me that the Taliban play their own game by their own rules. They are very nimble and highly adaptive, and they know how to raise money, as well as any Silicon Valley startup. And they appear to have the upper hand at the moment.

And the Americans are conceding Taliban's momentum and they are looking for scapegoats to blame...Karazai, ISI, Kiyani, Pakistan etc. The short-term objectives for U.S. forces in Afghanistan have narrowed under Obama's new strategy, Defense Secretary Robert Gates has told "FOX News Sunday."

Gates is responding by the usual talk (it was dubbed Vietnamization when US was losing in 1960s) by saying the U.S. needs to focus its efforts on making headway and reversing the Taliban's momentum, and strengthening the Afghan army and police -- while really going after Al Qaeda.

While you may think Taliban as medieval, their tactics are more modern than Uncle Sam's, who is repeating the errors of Vietnam war.

In his recent book "Age of Unthinkable", author Joshua Cooper Ramo wonders out loud if the established order in the US can take on these new insurgents. He says, "When I thought of these rebels I knew in the context of other friends of mine, such as the suits working in the National Security Council or the U.S. Army or Time Warner, I realized that there was no chance those conservative places could compete. They were locked in a vision of the world that was out of date. As a perplexed Alan Greenspan confessed to Congress about his own thinking in 2008: “I have found a flaw. I don’t know how significant or permanent it is. But I have been very distressed by the fact.� The congressman questioning him asked, “In other words, you found that your view of the world, your ideology, was not right. It was not working?� Greenspan replied, “Absolutely. Precisely. You know that’s precisely the reason I was shocked. Because I have been going for 40 years or more with very considerable evidence that it was working exceptionally well.�
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

Re: # 41

If you saw National Geographis and History channel yesterday you will see films showing that poppy cultivation is doing just fine in Afghanistan today. So please don't put out outdated information.

Re: # 42

Riaz

On the subject of poppy cultivation and its curtailment by Taliban:

(1) Pressure from donor agencies
(2) Falling price of poppy in the international markets forced the Taliban and the poppy growers to cut back on production, it was a purely economic decision. When oil prices fall, OPEC reduces production to support falling prices, supply and demand.

Re: # 41

I agree that the Taliban eradicated poppy when they ruled Afghanistan. But times have changed and so have their tactics (poppy being lesser evil than accepting foreign occupation). It's not cheap to run an organized insurgency. It takes equipment, training, recruits etc. that all translates into need for funds, most of which come from "taxes" levied on all economic activity...most of which is poppy cultivation in Afghanistan. In fact, the underground drug economy is far bigger than the formal economy in Afghanistan.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

riaz haq please investigate before you write; your intelligence is not your best weapon in factual matters
taliban do not rely on poppy money. infact poppy cultivation is one evil which was totally destroyed during taliban rule... ppl were so terrified of the punishment issued against consumption and cultivation of drugs by taliban that eye witnesses testify that when the orders were issued fields were levelled by owners themselves in a matter of hours.
rumour has it that the latest afghan govt with help of usa started this cultivation again to fund the war on terror!

lookie here prophet tahmed(pbuhsrr)...more pandit hate..


http://tinyurl.com/camvsu

Pakistan: the epicentre of Islamist terror
In the lush, green valleys of the Punjab, young men are being schooled in the principles of mass murder.


By Sean Rayment, Security Correspondent

Some 70 miles north of Lahore, in a 200-acre camp that also houses a large mosque, swimming pool and fish farm, volunteers are taught how to assemble bombs, fire weapons, create terrorist networks and communicate covertly using the internet and mobile phones.

They are also instructed in resistance to interrogation techniques and how to create cover stories in the event of being captured.

This is the headquarters of the Pakistani militant group Lashkar-e-Toiba (LeT) – which in Urdu translates as "army of the pure" – the organisation widely believed to be responsible for the Mumbai massacre in November which left 172 people dead.

LeT, which professes to be a peaceful organisation, is known to have close links with al-Qaeda and is understood to train around 40,000 young men every year at its madrassas (religious schools) and military bases.

Some of the trainees at its base in the Punjab are British.

Many of those who graduate from the camps are sent to the front line in Kashmir to wage war against the Indian army, others venture north to Afghanistan to fight against Nato forces, while many of the British return to the UK and begin plotting.

Mohammed Siddique Khan and Shehzad Tanweer are both thought to have visited the camp several times before carrying out the 7/7 suicides attacks on the London Tube network.

Mohammed Ajmal Khan, who was sentenced to nine years in March 2006 for fundraising for terrorist groups operating in Pakistan and Afghanistan, also admitted visiting one of the organisation’s camps.

Virtually all of the al-Qaeda terrorists convicted in Britain since 2001, including the 7/7 bombers and Dhiren Barot – the so-called "Dirty Bomber" – received training in Pakistan.

Gordon Brown recently stated that three quarters of all British terror plots originate from within the state.

However, monitoring everyone visiting or returning from Pakistan is an impossible task for Britain’s police and MI5.

Up to 400,000 British Pakistanis visit the country every year, the vast majority for completely legitimate reasons. Up to 10,000 young Pakistanis enter the UK every year on student visas.

It is also believed that some of the 12 terrorist suspects arrested in Wednesday’s Operation Pathway may have been trained to form a covert cell in Pakistan before entering Britain.

LeT is a hardcore terrorist organisation committed to using extreme violence to achieve its aim of forcing India to leave the disputed area of Kashmir.

But in the 18 years since its creation, the movement has forged links with other terror groups, most notably al-Qaeda, and has become a major threat to many western countries.

After the Mumbai attacks, it emerged that the group had compiled a worldwide hit list of 320 targets. Yet despite being banned by most western countries, the Pakistani authorities stand accused of effectively having turned a blind eye to its operations.

And the organisation is not alone. Another militant group, Lashkar-e-Janghvi is believed to have been behind the attack on the Sri Lankan cricket team in Lahore last month, also operates openly, while other groups such as Jaish-e-Mohammed and Harkat-ul-Mujahideen are understood to be expanding their influence in Punjab, an area with strong British connections.

In one area of Kashmir roughly the size of the West Midlands, 25 militant groups are known to operate with impunity.

Many of their volunteers sign up here for jihad – or ‘holy war’ – before taking the next step of joining other organisations committed to attacking the West.

It is against this backdrop that Pakistan has now acquired the dubious distinction of being epicentre for Islamist terrorism in the world.

At the same time, MI5 and the CIA are becoming increasingly worried by the country’s inability to clamp down on militants.

Pakistan is now a very dangerous country for Westerners to live and work. The Foreign and Commonwealth Office only allows its diplomats to work in the country unaccompanied, meaning partners, wives and children must remain behind in the UK.

As far as the FCO is concerned, Pakistan is as dangerous as Afghanistan, which is currently in the grips of a full-blown insurgency.

The rise of militant Islamist groups in Pakistan began in the early 1980s under the country’s then leader General Muhammad Zia-ul-Huq, largely in response to the growth of Shia fundamentalism in Iran and in a bid to support the Mujahideen who were fighting the Soviets in neighbouring Afghanistan.

Over the last 30 years, the country’s leaders have been content for various Islamist groups to train and recruit in Pakistan, and to wage a proxy war with India over the disputed Kashmir region. During the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan, the Inter-Services Agency (ISI), the intelligence wing of the Pakistan army, funded the Mujahideen and, later, the Taliban in the mid-Nineties.

Although Pakistan is fighting its own counter-insurgency war against militants, the ISI is believed to have firm links with groups like the Taliban and even al-Qaeda, much to the consternation of Britain and the US.

MI5 treats any intelligence passed to it by the ISI with caution, given that much of it is politicised, although the relationship between the two organisations remains strong.

But the US, which over the last few years has funded the Pakistan military and therefore the ISI to the tune of £7 billion, is said to be increasingly frustrated with rogue, Islamist-supporting elements within the ISI.

Washington wants the Pakistani government to clamp down on the militant groups operating within the country and to cleanse the ISI of Taliban and Islamist sympathisers.

Admiral Michael Mullen, the US Chairman of the Joint Chief of Staffs and America’s most senior officer, recently called for the ISI to make "fundamental" changes in its relationship with militants.

But despite the frustrations, there have been some major advances.

The bilateral agreement between Pakistan and Washington, which had been a secret until recently and allowed America’s heavily armed unmanned aircraft, known as Reapers, to attack al-Qaeda and Taliban targets inside Pakistan, have produced enormous dividends.

Security sources said the various strikes over the past 12 months have severely disrupted al-Qaeda operations in Pakistan and their lines of communication back to the UK.

MI5 are convinced that the current lack of so-called "late-stage plots" – in which "cells" of terrorists are close to launching attacks – is partly down to the Reaper strikes in the Pakistan/Afghanistan border regions.

Pakistan, however, remains a country on the brink of catastrophe.

The ‘Talibanisation’ of the Swat Valley in the tribal areas of the northwest frontier province serves to illustrate how the central government is beginning to lose control in certain areas.

It is in this region that more than 75,000 soldiers of its Frontier Corps are waging a bitter counter-insurgency war against the Taliban and al-Qaeda.

The war has reached a stalemate and is causing deep divides within the Pakistani Army. While the officer class support the war, the rank and file see little honour in killing fellow Muslims. The potential for revolt within the Army is very real.

The economy is also in freefall, with some estimates suggesting that Pakistan will be bankrupt within six months, a position which will play further into the hands of the militants, who already recruit the majority of their foot soldiers from the poorest areas.

Pakistan is a country of 150 million people, many of whom are trapped in poverty. It is in desperate need of help, probably more so than neighbouring Afghanistan.

If the economy implodes, the Army revolts and the Islamists gain power – a sequence of events that is entirely possible – the problems for the West will dwarf anything seen in Iraq or Afghanistan and will take international terrorism to a new infinitely more dangerous level.

For the first time since the Cold War, the West would have an enemy with a nuclear capability.

Re: # 27
Loop...
you are correct...every musla should believe in Korun and try to attack non-muslas....but then situation changed, when the Korun was written and current state....if you follow islam ( ditto written in Korun), it will be highly likely that US/NATO/USSR will send you people to arabic moon god's whore house (aka heaven described in Korun) by pressing a button from Pentagon...

Re: # 29
Kamath....
London bomber did not lack opportunity in respect to education and job....you know the source of the problem
:-)...The Holy Book....

Re: # 36
SPY: "Where from is the Taliban getting so much of money to pay better than the govt. "

The best guess is the highly lucrative poppy production and drugs smuggling...something that has proliferated since the US invasion of Afghanistan. Afghanistan is essentially a narco state...a la Columbia or Mexico where the drug cartels have extraordinary power. Many Afghan warlords and govt officials benefit greatly from such trade and so do the Taliban who fund their growing insurgency with it.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

Re: # 9 Riaz: "Taliban pay about $150 a month to each fighter, much higher than the $100 a month paid by the governments in the region".

- Where from is the Taliban getting so much of money to pay better than the govt. The Taliban are not having mechanical industries to generate this money. Is it Saudi / Gulf money. The Pak govt than should cut off the source of such money supply to strangle the Taliban. But than it would be abandoning the Talibans as strategic assets for use against India and Afghanistan. Aaahhh.....Catch 22.

- On second thoughts the Pak govt is also dependent on the American aid to survive.

- Is there a basic problem with the people/govt of this region, to live on aids.

Re: # 29

Oye Kamathe Dhimmi,

Sat Sri Akal Jai Shri Ram ya Namaskar kar.

Sanatani

Re: # 22

Spoken like a true NRPRiI (Non Resident Paki Resident in India).

Develop Pak economically so that it can attack India again.

Good very good.

Sanatani