Lillie

a very well written, enagaging and insightful article. enjoyed reading it and hope to see more of your work on chowk.

shandana

Re:RR`s post #10

Rehan, just let me add a caveat; I would consider myself to be more of an optimist, than an idealist, with a firm belief in Murphy`s Law!

I agree with you that there is no incentive for the present ruling classes to undermine their own power base. I will also conced the argument to you that the robbers murders of Pakistan will not change their ways, but they do not have a choice in the matter. As the Chinese philosopher Confucius said, ``the reed that does not bend, will break``, so will be the case with Pakistani elites.

We have reached a stage in Pakistan where the ability of the leadership to change, and the peoples willingless to accept that change, is diminishing. The people have lost faith in the elected politicans and what is worse, they have lost faith in the institutions of the country and ipso facto, in democracy itself. The government, the elected politicans and the establishment have lost their legitimacy in the eyes of the people: the people are voicing a return to martial law, because according to them, the government has failed in its contract with them.

Governments are instituted amongst people to secure for them a right to life and a secure personal environment in which they can exist. In return for this, the people agree to be ruled by a set of laws, all designed to benefit them, which the government promises to implement. When governments, the establishment, fails and loses its right to rule, its legitimacy, when it fails to meet the basic expectations of the people; food, shelter and a sense of personal security, it ceases to be represtative of the people it seeks to govern.

In this I tend to lean towards Ask`s post. The Roman emperor Marcus Aurelius once said that the greatest danger to a political society lies not in the dissatisfaction of its people, but in the sense of what they covet. Rhetorically, how do we we covet? We covet, by our eyes, by what we see and what we want. People of Pakistan covet the basic ammenties of life and their resentment at its lack would be directed towards those, the politicans, who keep promising it to them. The establishment of Pakistan has been promising its people, for fifty years, and it has never delivered on its promises. The expectations of the people, not the willingless of the establishment to change, will determine the future of Pakistan.

Rehan, in the final analysis, it does not matter what the establishment thinks and is willing to give up, because the reality of the situation has moved beyond that point. The fate of the country is now shiting to the hands the people and how they will respond to the robber barons of Pakistan will, in the final end, determine the shape Pakistan`s polity will take in the coming years.

As to UN and other international organizational studies, I would not put too much faith in their abilities. These studies are in a sense merely road maps, but how we get to our final destinations, is only dependent on ourselves. They can point the direction and offer suggestions to solve the problems, but they are only recommendations. Let me give you an example, from Carl von Clausewitz` book ``On War``: strategy is the ability to make war upon a map and a battle is the ability to translate that strategy into reality. Wars are not won on maps, but on the ground and Pakistan`s social problems will not be solved by studies of the issue, but by people reconizing the reality; there is a problem and it needs to be solved.

The fact that a problem is insurmountable should not imply a lack of discussion on its resolution and hence, a refusal to acknowledge its reality. If we do not acknowledge there is a problem and discuss ways to solve, the problem is not going to solve itself! Pakistanis should be willing to highlight the issues problems facing them and they should talk about. I am confident that in time they will do something about it!

All in all, I agree with you. The perceptions of the present leadership and how much change and power sharing it is willing to do, will determine the outlook of Pakistani issues and not the discussions on Chowk. If the printing press could revolutionize learning and usher in the renassiance; the internet can mobilize public opinion too!

Sincerely Ferozk aka F.R. Khan aka Feroz aka Ferocious aka the Putz!

re:Ferozk

Excellent proposals. I too agree that efforts should be made in a way that the results are sustained. Amartya Sen too recently stated that he is against mass movements since they lose momentum. Moreover, as I have so often seen in India, naysayers then start questioning the objectives themselves.

On the issue of land reform I feel that should be carried out in any case to break the hold of the feudal landlords so pervasive in South Asia. But this does not mean the peasants should be told to be satisfied with just that. I agree that promoting education is better than just land distribution.

re: Rehan

I agree with your response in general. I would like to add that in addition to educating the elites about the benefits of an educated populace, it would be appropriate (and maybe more effective) to threaten them with the consequences of having an uneducated but increasingly aware population viz. increased crime directed against the ``islands of prosperity`` as can be seen in many large cities in the poorer nations. Moreover, teaching poor people to organize and demand schools is, I believe, another underemployed tool. Especially, with our politicians only sustained pressure leads to any work. And it is better if the affected people themselves do this which would probably be more successful.

Ashish

Re: Feroz

I am an optimist and an idealist just like you. But unfortunately, I also know the limits as to what can be done in the present status quo in Pakistan for education. With the robbers and murderers in power, parasites who thrive on people`s poverty, ignorance and lack of education, why would they want to change all that?

In 1993, still an undergrad, I read a paper on Education and Economic Development at the 3rd annaul PESACON conference on 3rd world development, in Santa Clara. My contention was and still is that we must educate the feudals and the elites first about the benefits to them of an economically developed society and an educated population. Their prosperity and power will increase several fold as has happened in Japan, Europe and the US. I`m sure you know who`s who from which family in the power structure in this country and elsewhere.

As far as child-labor is concerned, its a curse. But its a lesser of two evils. I recently read an article by the chair of the Human Rights body that`s trying to amend the charter of the UN to make it more pragmatic. He recalled that his group succeeded in shutting down a factory in Bangladesh which empolyed child laborers. A few months later, they were horrified to find out that some of the children were forced into prostitution after losing their jobs. Unless an alternative is provided to support the starving children who must work to eat, all this talk about ending child labor is nothing but feel-good idealism of first world self-serving activists who have never been to a third world country.

Rehan.

Re: Nishith

An aside.....

How do you know that the nuclear technology was stolen, borrowed or surreptitiously purchased from the rest of the world ?

There is a difference between using knowledge available in the public/private domain and developing on it and stealing or borrowing.

By the same token, would you loath to blame the western nations of stealing or borrowing the Arabic numerals or the concept of zero....

C`mon gimme a break.

Re: Futema`s post #6

You have astutely identified the problem. The problem is our own perceptions and priorities towards education. The ability to change and accord a new status to our education goals is what needs to be done. There has to be strategic foresight in formulating an education policy that will serve Pakistan well into the next century.

Here are some suggestions...

I am not advocating a ``jump-start`` approach to the problem, but a policy of gradual incremental progress.

First of all, we need to attract our best and brightest minds into this field. This is not a suggestion that every Pakistani became a teacher, but rather it should be a policy that encourages teaching. The government should encourage teaching by offering financial incentives and it should pay the tution costs of studying abroad for those who qualify based on merit. In return, that person should be obligated to teach for a minimum of five years, in their field of expertise, till they have paid off their loans to the government. A program, based on the lines of the Peace Corps, needs to be implemented in matters of education.

Secondly; the government needs to allocate more funds towards education and it needs to support a sustained approach to a specific aim. Lets say this program is implemented this year. In that case, it should be the goal of the government to ensure that all children, in Pakistan, upto the sixth grade will be functionally literate in the next five years.

Forget about high school and college levels. Instead we should start from ground-zero.

Once this aim has been reached, then the next step would be to make certain that grades 7-10 attain this level and are also literate within five years. In the mean time, there should be programs, sponsered by the government or aided by the NGOs, that offer technical training to induct these students into the work force. It should be the government`s policy to educated all children with at least a grade ten education and then place them in the work force.

Parents should be encouraged to keep their children in school and they should be offered an ``education incentive`` which should approximately equal the monetary sum that a child might make if he or she dropped out of school and started working. The parents have to be educated that the welfare of the family, forget the state at this point, lies in the child completing the required educational levels: the ability to read, write and comprehend train schedules and simple directions etc.

Those that show promise, should go on to high schools and colleges, but we have to gurantee that those who finish grade ten, will have a job upon graduation. It should be made a condidtion that if you finish grade ten, the government will find you a job for you.

This policy needs to be implemented without political posturings and a certain amount of the budget, just as in national defence, should be earmarked for this purpose. The government should be creating jobs and offering jobs, not free land to Pakistanis. Giving land is just another way of perpetually indenturing the people to the whims of the feudals.

Schools,and universities should be informed that they will get tax breaks and other financial assitence if they subsidise the education of children from poor families. There should be an affirmative action program that offers the disadvantaged children, who have finished grade ten, either the opportunity to pursure higher education (academic) or learn a technical skill (electric, TV repairs etc).

Furthermore, the government has to accept this fact and reinforce it in the minds of the public that the nation`s salvation lies through education. A massive long term investment has to be made in education. We, as Pakistanis, can make a commitment to afford an armed forces, why can`t we same the same promise towards education? At the present exchange rates, we can educate more people for the price of a fighter, a submarine and tank and we would be buying a better form of defence. The success of Pakistan and the prosperity of its democracy lies not in the lethality of its weaponary, but in the enlightenment and education of its populace: The pen is mighter than the sword!

Food for thought ...!

Nishith:

Thanks for sharing your experience with us. This definitely is a subject worthy of our attention. I think Lillie was one of the lucky ones; she ended up in a kind household and was afforded the opportunity to continue her education.

I agree with some of the other respondents on the importance of education--who wouldn`t? While making education a fundamental imperative in our infrastructure should be the ultimate goal, we MUST have some standards of conduct in place before (or while) that wonderful end is achieved. As far as I know, our society is, by and large, indifferent to the predicament of its domestic workers, be it children or adults. It`s really sad and even shocking to see how servants/helpers are treated sometimes in Pakistan.

For now, any change in the existing system will have to come on a voluntary basis. As private citizens, we can at least set a good example for our kids. On a higher level, our media--TV plays, public service campaigns, etc.--can take the initiative to create awareness.

I think we can start by giving fellow human beings a little respect. We can strive to be fair employers by limiting working hours to a sane maximum and allow for off days on a regular basis. And it would be great if we can take a step further and actually help our workers get an education!

--AS

Nishith...wonderful article about an issue which most of us have confronted when returning to Pakistan/India. I personally have seen the sense of pride felt by children such as Lillie in working. Rather than our sympathy, these children deserve a feeling of respect and dignity from us. I agree with your mother-in-law`s philosophy. She is merely creating a source of better employment for this child allowing avenues such as education to open.

Re: Ferozk (#5)

We can talk about the importance of children`s education and the ills of child labor till we are blue in the face. However, the reality of the matter is that countries such as Pakistan lack the proper infrastructure and seriousness in education policy to provide a ``good`` education to the masses. I cannot speak for India, but the literacy rate in parts of the country show that greater attention is given to education.

From my experience, I have seen that even education has become a business in Pakistan. True teaching is found not in schools but in tuition centers and private tutors. Does that mean that a good education boils down to money? And what does that mean for children such as Lillie who cannot afford private instruction?

Of course these are generalizations and do not speak for all educators in Pakistan. Despite my criticism, I agree that the solution to not only child labor but economic ills as well lies in education. Now the only question that remains is how to change our approach to education in Pakistan. Maybe the key to economic prosperity lies in that mystery.

All the best.

Re: Nishith Vasavada

Your article, reading it, was a profound experience. Child-labor laws, either in India or Pakstan, are not the solution to the problem. The long term and only realistic solution to this problem lies in educating our children and instilling in them a sense of self-respect. The greatest threat to our children is not the exploitive employers, but their own sense of believe that their lot in life will not get better. Before we try to answer the remedy to child-labor problems, let us ask what promotes child-labor and how it can be erdicated.

Child-labor is a reflection of a societal problem; of poverty, inadequate welfare programs and a socio-economic class structure that favors one group over another. In the sub-continent, if child-labor is to be banished, we have to understand the basic fundlemental reason why children work under abysmal conditions and so early in life; to support their familes by earning a meager wage to sustain their existence.

Instead of whining about and wringing our hands at the intractibility of the issue, we should have the moral courage to ask why; why are we wasting monies in a futile arms race and for whose benefit are we investing in nuclear weapons? We are not doing this in the name and for our children, because we are robbing them of their rightful future. This present policy of nuclear showmanship is, in the long run, self-defeating. India and Pakistan will have no future to defend!

If we, in India and Pakistan, want to defend our future generations, we should start educating them. As my mother used to say, ``the army is largest gathering of idiots in one place``, we should not be wasting our money on a group of idiots. I have nothing against national defence, but I will not tolerate a national defence which hurts the ones it is supposed to protect.

Ask yourself the question how you ended up living in the United States and what enabled your stay here?

Why am I living in the United States and not earning a livihood in Pakistan in some Nike sweatshop: education. My family is middle class by Pakistani standards and my parents sacrificed their comforts and their lifestyles so that my brother and I could have decent education.[He got his degree in finance from McGill in Montreal, Canada and a masters in economics from Cambridge, England. Now he is getting his Ph.D., on a full scholarship, from McGill and when he returns to Pakistan, he will be a full professor of business mangement at LUMS in Lahore. He would be teaching the youth of Pakistan!] They invested in our futures and they did not buy cars or any other status symbols of Pakistani materialistic lifestyles.

I remember my dad being angry at our driver, becuse he took his kid out of school for a lack of money. My dad gave him a raise on the spot so that he could afford his kid`s education. He would help kids, regardless of their parents financial status, gain admission to schools. Why was he doing this? He was investing in Pakistan`s future the best way he knew how, because he loved Pakistan`s children- its future!

I can never repay my parents for what they gave me and my brother. My dad told me the importance of education in these words: The only thing which I will trully ever own in this world and the only thing I will take to my grave will be the knowledge I learn. The world can take away all my worldly possessions, but it can never take away my education and with that, no matter how many times it cuts me down, I will survive because of my wits. (sorry for this emotional diatribe)

Education, education and nothing but education will save our children`s future and end the evil of child-labor in India and Pakistan.

Nishith:

What is the difference between Lille and an American or Canadian kid of the same age delivering papers, or cutting lawn or doing small chores? I don`t think they qualify as child labour.

Sweatshops, indentured labour, ``begar`` camps-- that`s a different issue.

As long a child is afforded opportunity to continue working and school at the same time then in the subcontinental context I will be loathe to brand it child labour.

regards

Mr. Vasavada,

Thank you for writing about your experiences. We do tend to molly-coddle our children so.

What I `love` about the logic of employing a child laborer on purpose because ``otherwise, he/she will be laboring at a much worse place, we are actually doing them a favor`` is the apparent absence of the realization, that one could have helped the child more by sending him/her to school, and helping the family keep the child in school by supporting them in other ways, such as better wages for the parents. The real reason many people hire kids is because they can get the same amount of work, for much less money than they would pay an adult.

Re: Zain
You are right that early industrial England depended massively on low-paid child labor for economic growth. However, there are other ways to achieve the same goals today. We know that investing in children by educating them would be much better for long-term economic growth, than the short-term gain achieved by low-wage employment in their most critical years of life.
Also, if one is to believe Caldwell, once parents realize that they can no longer depend on their children for bringing in some extra cash, since by law, they have to be in school, they may voluntarily reduce their birth rates.

Anita

Well documented facts. Unfortunately these are the economics of the Sub-continent as they stand. The opputunities provided to children in West definitely differ from those provided in Sub. We also have to take into consideration that early days of industrialization in West which encountered the similar challenges, i.e. the child labor and exploitation of labor by industrialists. Since industrialization in sub is still in its infancy compared to Western to even Asian counterparts such hurdles need to be tackled in along the way. I like the idea of free education for girls in Gujarat. This idea should be encouraged and adopted in Pakistan as well. I`ve seen a barage of young kids mostly Afghan refugee kids sifting through garbage for recyclables. It is sad. There was a recent news about industrial colonies in Pakistan where parents of the poor kids were encouraged to send their kids to schools rather then workshops and instead provide their parents the opportunity to earn in the setup and live close by in the labor colonies. These projects though minimal provide a glimpse of hope for the million of minds being wasted.

I feel more sorry for you and your oh-so-superior-raised-in-America children than I feel for Lillie. She has more dignity than you will ever know.