For Cricket Lovers Only!
Zeemax June 9, 1999
#35 Posted by ferozk on June 25, 1999 3:32:50 pm
Re: Zeemax
Thanks!
The quote you posted, was actually General George ``Blood and Guts`` Patton`s and did not belong to MacArthur. Patton said that to the American invasion troops prior to the Allied landings against the forces of Vichy France in North Africa near Oran, Algiers in early 1942.
My interest in military history comes from having relatives in the Pakistani armed forces and a deep abiding interest in the political history of this century. Since the two most defining events this century were the First World War and Second World War, which would to a greater degree would influence the rest of the century, I am an avid student of military history, because of my interests in those two major wars.
Military history is a fascinating companion to political history, because in the past all great political minds, Napoleon, Frederick the Great, Caesar, Chengiz Khan and Alexander made their marks as military leaders first before turning to politics. It was only in the aftermath of the folly of World War One that our present day disdain and cynism of military mind took root in our way of thinking.
Like the old bards used to say, ``there are only two enduring themes in this world and they belong to both love and war``.
Thanks!
The quote you posted, was actually General George ``Blood and Guts`` Patton`s and did not belong to MacArthur. Patton said that to the American invasion troops prior to the Allied landings against the forces of Vichy France in North Africa near Oran, Algiers in early 1942.
My interest in military history comes from having relatives in the Pakistani armed forces and a deep abiding interest in the political history of this century. Since the two most defining events this century were the First World War and Second World War, which would to a greater degree would influence the rest of the century, I am an avid student of military history, because of my interests in those two major wars.
Military history is a fascinating companion to political history, because in the past all great political minds, Napoleon, Frederick the Great, Caesar, Chengiz Khan and Alexander made their marks as military leaders first before turning to politics. It was only in the aftermath of the folly of World War One that our present day disdain and cynism of military mind took root in our way of thinking.
Like the old bards used to say, ``there are only two enduring themes in this world and they belong to both love and war``.
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#34 Posted by zeemax on June 25, 1999 2:08:31 am
Re FerozK :
How correct Gen Douglas MacArthur was.. Though my favorite of his quotations is `` No son of a bi * * * wins a war by dying for his country .. he wins the war by making the other son of a bi * * * die for HIS country ``
Correct above if it`s not accurate.
Where do you get your knowledge of history of warfare ? Impressed !
Zeemax
How correct Gen Douglas MacArthur was.. Though my favorite of his quotations is `` No son of a bi * * * wins a war by dying for his country .. he wins the war by making the other son of a bi * * * die for HIS country ``
Correct above if it`s not accurate.
Where do you get your knowledge of history of warfare ? Impressed !
Zeemax
#33 Posted by ferozk on June 24, 1999 2:45:58 pm
Sorry about that.....
The saying is : Skills learned on the playing field, on another day on a different field, will produce victory!
The saying is : Skills learned on the playing field, on another day on a different field, will produce victory!
#32 Posted by ferozk on June 24, 1999 2:43:02 pm
Re: Zeemax
US Navy SEALs took up this ``tradition`` from the United States Marine Corps, which came up with it during the Corps` trip to Libya, in 1792, to fight the Barbary Pirates. Incidently, this is where the Marine nom d` guerre ``Leathernecks`` derives from, because the Marines wore leather coverings around their necks to prevent sabre cuts etc by the enemy.
As to recovering their dead and wounded from the battlefield, that has more to do with respect for the fallen than it has anything to do with teamwork. This is not only applicable to the American military, but to all the armed forces in the world, including Indian and Pakistani.
However, your other point is valid, because team sports do teach basic leadership and problem solving skills, which are considered crucial in a combat situation. In fact, the American military academy at West Point, New York, has a sports motto, penned by General Douglas MacArthur, which states that skills learned on a playing field produce results, which on another day and on different field will bring victory!
``The skills learned on the fields of sport
US Navy SEALs took up this ``tradition`` from the United States Marine Corps, which came up with it during the Corps` trip to Libya, in 1792, to fight the Barbary Pirates. Incidently, this is where the Marine nom d` guerre ``Leathernecks`` derives from, because the Marines wore leather coverings around their necks to prevent sabre cuts etc by the enemy.
As to recovering their dead and wounded from the battlefield, that has more to do with respect for the fallen than it has anything to do with teamwork. This is not only applicable to the American military, but to all the armed forces in the world, including Indian and Pakistani.
However, your other point is valid, because team sports do teach basic leadership and problem solving skills, which are considered crucial in a combat situation. In fact, the American military academy at West Point, New York, has a sports motto, penned by General Douglas MacArthur, which states that skills learned on a playing field produce results, which on another day and on different field will bring victory!
``The skills learned on the fields of sport
#31 Posted by zeemax on June 24, 1999 1:37:12 am
SR ..
Your anology of a pack of dogs grudgingly accepted. You have forced me on the backfoot with an in-swinging yorker .. however, you have only commented on the corporate aspect of teamwork and not the military management, of which you have profound knowledge and interest. Are you aware that the US Navy Seals have NEVER left a single dead or wounded teammate behind during an operation,, regardless of impending peril, in their entire history ?
That kind of loyalty is inspired ONLY by teamwork. I`m sure you appreciate it`s an admirable quality.
Zeemax
Your anology of a pack of dogs grudgingly accepted. You have forced me on the backfoot with an in-swinging yorker .. however, you have only commented on the corporate aspect of teamwork and not the military management, of which you have profound knowledge and interest. Are you aware that the US Navy Seals have NEVER left a single dead or wounded teammate behind during an operation,, regardless of impending peril, in their entire history ?
That kind of loyalty is inspired ONLY by teamwork. I`m sure you appreciate it`s an admirable quality.
Zeemax
#30 Posted by SR on June 23, 1999 9:30:00 am
Yes, Super toiletbowl as well as any other World Saucer or World Plate or World Cup, its all the same rediculous nonsense. Yes, I know you corporate types really get hung up on this `team spirit` mantra. To me its the essential difference between herd mentality and individualism. Its the dog-people as opposed to the cat-people. Dogs are pack-hunters, cats are solitary. Dogs are co-dependent, hirerchial, obedient, subservient, either dependent or controlling (depending on where they fit in the pecking-order), have very little independent initiative without the need for approval. They are the model your corporate drones emulate in their lock-step march in the corporate corridors, wearing their pin-striped suits. Robotic, unimaginative and pathetic. But that is, sadly, the majority. They are the borg, and yes, I realize, resistence is futile. They will assimilate all. I for one shall die fighting on my feet instead of living in servitude on my knees.
May the devil take all the astro-turf to hell.
...SR
May the devil take all the astro-turf to hell.
...SR
#29 Posted by zeemax on June 23, 1999 2:23:35 am
SR :
Lost a little bit here .. If you have no interest in Cricket, how does that make it ``Much ado about nothing....and Good riddance!`` ? Tsk . Tsk ..
Cricket World Cup is like the Super Bowl to us Pakistanis. Is the Super Bowl too ``much ado about nothing`` ?
There was an excellent article in Fortune Magazine about ``Teams``. Taking a cue from team sporting, competetive business now has ``Teams`` instead of `` Departments``. Practically all of silicon valley follows this philosophy of management. Even Military Management is based on Teams. Reason being teams are geared towards Leadership, coordination, motivation, Loyalty, and a drive to win. All of which are key elements of success.
Cricket then, is not only a game. It`s a whole way of Life !
Zeemax
Lost a little bit here .. If you have no interest in Cricket, how does that make it ``Much ado about nothing....and Good riddance!`` ? Tsk . Tsk ..
Cricket World Cup is like the Super Bowl to us Pakistanis. Is the Super Bowl too ``much ado about nothing`` ?
There was an excellent article in Fortune Magazine about ``Teams``. Taking a cue from team sporting, competetive business now has ``Teams`` instead of `` Departments``. Practically all of silicon valley follows this philosophy of management. Even Military Management is based on Teams. Reason being teams are geared towards Leadership, coordination, motivation, Loyalty, and a drive to win. All of which are key elements of success.
Cricket then, is not only a game. It`s a whole way of Life !
Zeemax
#28 Posted by SR on June 22, 1999 12:54:41 pm
Let`s come back to our main subject.
I am so glad this stupidity is finally over and done with, at least for this time around. I`ve heard that the Pakis did make it to the finals but, all the mashallahs, subhaanallas, alhumdulillahs and inshallahs notwithstanding, they got the dog-crap beaten out of them.
Much ado about nothing....and Good riddance! Let`s get on with life.
...SR
I am so glad this stupidity is finally over and done with, at least for this time around. I`ve heard that the Pakis did make it to the finals but, all the mashallahs, subhaanallas, alhumdulillahs and inshallahs notwithstanding, they got the dog-crap beaten out of them.
Much ado about nothing....and Good riddance! Let`s get on with life.
...SR
#27 Posted by zeemax on June 18, 1999 1:25:20 am
SR
Read (C) instead of (D)in the first para. Regret the typo. And if you choose to hide behind an allegation of ``Kaj Bahsi``, that`s being trivial !
Read (C) instead of (D)in the first para. Regret the typo. And if you choose to hide behind an allegation of ``Kaj Bahsi``, that`s being trivial !
#26 Posted by zeemax on June 18, 1999 1:25:20 am
SR :
a) Pakistan Rupee depreciated against US$ by 12 % year on year June 1998/99.
b) Pakistan Rupee appreciated against US$ by 22.5% year on year June 1998/99.
c) None of the above.
d) Both of the above.
The correct answer is (d) None of the above. Pakistan Rupee depreciated by 8.7% during the last fiscal year as I originally stated before this onslaught of ridicule(I thought Chowk had a policy against that ..) so I had to clobber you guys :-)
When I advised you to convert your money at 46 I knew the Govt. would not devalue the Rupee chasing the open market, but I did think the open rate may go to 75, hence my despondance at the time (I myself started buying $ at 53 and continued up to 60)But I have learnt a few things since then about the resilience of this economy. Foremost of this newly found wisdom is the nature of the open market in this country.
No one made a loss on their $ accounts just because of the exchange rate (most of these dollars were held by local residents and accumulated at an average rate of 36 ..), only those people lost who were obstinate and didn`t take my advice to convert :-)
As it has turned out, people who DIDN`T convert then @ 46 can convert now @ 50 and get back into 88.50 dollars at open market for every original $100; while people who DID convert then and invested in Rupee instruments can get $102 for each original $100 AFTER all taxation. This is given the interest differentials between the two currencies.
Was my advice wrong? If data doesn`t give you goosebumps ask and I shall send you detailed calculations.
Mr. Walker is barely my companion nowadays .. more interested in Siri Paya and B`BQ in Lahore!Notwithstanding the terrific Lahori Muttyars !
Zeemax
a) Pakistan Rupee depreciated against US$ by 12 % year on year June 1998/99.
b) Pakistan Rupee appreciated against US$ by 22.5% year on year June 1998/99.
c) None of the above.
d) Both of the above.
The correct answer is (d) None of the above. Pakistan Rupee depreciated by 8.7% during the last fiscal year as I originally stated before this onslaught of ridicule(I thought Chowk had a policy against that ..) so I had to clobber you guys :-)
When I advised you to convert your money at 46 I knew the Govt. would not devalue the Rupee chasing the open market, but I did think the open rate may go to 75, hence my despondance at the time (I myself started buying $ at 53 and continued up to 60)But I have learnt a few things since then about the resilience of this economy. Foremost of this newly found wisdom is the nature of the open market in this country.
No one made a loss on their $ accounts just because of the exchange rate (most of these dollars were held by local residents and accumulated at an average rate of 36 ..), only those people lost who were obstinate and didn`t take my advice to convert :-)
As it has turned out, people who DIDN`T convert then @ 46 can convert now @ 50 and get back into 88.50 dollars at open market for every original $100; while people who DID convert then and invested in Rupee instruments can get $102 for each original $100 AFTER all taxation. This is given the interest differentials between the two currencies.
Was my advice wrong? If data doesn`t give you goosebumps ask and I shall send you detailed calculations.
Mr. Walker is barely my companion nowadays .. more interested in Siri Paya and B`BQ in Lahore!Notwithstanding the terrific Lahori Muttyars !
Zeemax
#25 Posted by SR on June 17, 1999 9:40:13 pm
Zeemax
[``…No comment from SR and evasive tactics …Pakistan Rupee depreciated / appreciated against US$ (twelve months- June 1998/99) Which one is true ?…``]
I can just picture you sitting at your desk, handle in hand with your Black friend Mr. Walker. You are howling and laughing and thumping the table with your other hand after writing those lines. While poor Johhny is being drained dry you are behaving like the fisherman who just hooked a big fat bass. Well, you may think it`s a bass, but my friend what you have is really just a minnow. Its Mr. Walker`s company that has you all excited by the tug on the line. Okay, enough metaphor, I`ll answer your question. But before that I exercise my right of `tamheed` not because I want to reward your `kaj-behsi` by taking it seriously, but out of respect for the public forum where some readers may not have any clue as to the perverse humor and convoluted mind game that instigated this line of argument.
You seem to imply that the Pakistani Rupee has in fact appreciated in value against the US Dollar. Most people when confronted with that proposition would have a tendency to not think any further and simply reject the idea. However, you have a smattering of data that can demonstrate otherwise. And that is what you are having fun with.
This reminds me of a story about an international globe trotting constantly-on-the-move corporate executive (such as your former self) who became very concerned about how he could reduce his odds of being on board an airlines that could be carrying a terrorist`s bomb. After PanAm 103 his concern turned into panic so he employed a statistician to find out how he could reduce those odds. ``Carry a bomb in your brief case,`` said the statistician, ``that will reduce your odds of being in a plane with TWO bombs``. While quite true theoritically, this obviously changed nothing. The moral of this story is that the language of numbers has skewed nuances and we must look at the total picture to make sense of what the numbers tell us. You sometimes can state facts truthfully yet obscure the reality. You can count individual trees and distort the view of the forest.
Yes, it is true that if you take a certain day in June, 1998 (I forget which date it was when the rupee fluctuated to its worst depth against the dollar) as the arbitrarily picked starting point of a twelve month period and recount the `recovery` (you chose the misleading term `appreciation`) against the US currency, you will find a great propaganda one-liner, which while absolutely true, does not tell us anything about the over all picture. It makes a partical recovery (or adjustment) look like appreciation.
I remember in the late-mid seventies the bank exchange rate of the US dollar against the Soviet Rubble was zero point seven five rubbles (that is, seventy-five kopeck) equal to one American dollar. The black market rate, however, was five rubbles to a dollar. The Soviet propagandists used to correctly state, in private, that the black market amounts to a very low percentage of the total and does not really make any difference (you make the same argument). Officially, they even denied that the black market existed. But, of course, we are not complaining about the communist slavery of the Soviets. We are discussing the free land of the pure, where the local currency is on the a meteoric rise. Twenty two percent in a twelve month period. Maashaallah...chasham-e-bud-dour.
If you keep up this pace, in less than five years the rupee should double in value. Maybe it is on its way back to the end of the nineteen eighties rate of around thirty rupees to the dollar, or perhaps it won`t just stop there, it will keep appreciating to the late seventies rate of between fifteen and twenty to the dollar. Perhaps it will reach the rate of Rs. 9.90 against the dollar which the Quaid-e-Awam himself decreed when he became chief martial law administrator. But why stop there, why not take the rate of four rupees and eighty paisa per dollar of the pre-1969 crisis? (For those reader who were still in heaven at the time, or were too young to remember, The 1969 crisis was the one that led to the 1970 crisis that further led to the 1971 crisis - also called Bengal crisis --, which is sometimes talked about but not discussed.)
This is the kind of sales-promotion gimmick talk that stock market `advisory services` use while touting their `high rate of return` on investment. This is a view from the rear view mirror and it is distorted. Looking backwards one can find many such statistical `artifacts`. Its called `fishing` and sometimes you do hook a bass.
...SR
[``…No comment from SR and evasive tactics …Pakistan Rupee depreciated / appreciated against US$ (twelve months- June 1998/99) Which one is true ?…``]
I can just picture you sitting at your desk, handle in hand with your Black friend Mr. Walker. You are howling and laughing and thumping the table with your other hand after writing those lines. While poor Johhny is being drained dry you are behaving like the fisherman who just hooked a big fat bass. Well, you may think it`s a bass, but my friend what you have is really just a minnow. Its Mr. Walker`s company that has you all excited by the tug on the line. Okay, enough metaphor, I`ll answer your question. But before that I exercise my right of `tamheed` not because I want to reward your `kaj-behsi` by taking it seriously, but out of respect for the public forum where some readers may not have any clue as to the perverse humor and convoluted mind game that instigated this line of argument.
You seem to imply that the Pakistani Rupee has in fact appreciated in value against the US Dollar. Most people when confronted with that proposition would have a tendency to not think any further and simply reject the idea. However, you have a smattering of data that can demonstrate otherwise. And that is what you are having fun with.
This reminds me of a story about an international globe trotting constantly-on-the-move corporate executive (such as your former self) who became very concerned about how he could reduce his odds of being on board an airlines that could be carrying a terrorist`s bomb. After PanAm 103 his concern turned into panic so he employed a statistician to find out how he could reduce those odds. ``Carry a bomb in your brief case,`` said the statistician, ``that will reduce your odds of being in a plane with TWO bombs``. While quite true theoritically, this obviously changed nothing. The moral of this story is that the language of numbers has skewed nuances and we must look at the total picture to make sense of what the numbers tell us. You sometimes can state facts truthfully yet obscure the reality. You can count individual trees and distort the view of the forest.
Yes, it is true that if you take a certain day in June, 1998 (I forget which date it was when the rupee fluctuated to its worst depth against the dollar) as the arbitrarily picked starting point of a twelve month period and recount the `recovery` (you chose the misleading term `appreciation`) against the US currency, you will find a great propaganda one-liner, which while absolutely true, does not tell us anything about the over all picture. It makes a partical recovery (or adjustment) look like appreciation.
I remember in the late-mid seventies the bank exchange rate of the US dollar against the Soviet Rubble was zero point seven five rubbles (that is, seventy-five kopeck) equal to one American dollar. The black market rate, however, was five rubbles to a dollar. The Soviet propagandists used to correctly state, in private, that the black market amounts to a very low percentage of the total and does not really make any difference (you make the same argument). Officially, they even denied that the black market existed. But, of course, we are not complaining about the communist slavery of the Soviets. We are discussing the free land of the pure, where the local currency is on the a meteoric rise. Twenty two percent in a twelve month period. Maashaallah...chasham-e-bud-dour.
If you keep up this pace, in less than five years the rupee should double in value. Maybe it is on its way back to the end of the nineteen eighties rate of around thirty rupees to the dollar, or perhaps it won`t just stop there, it will keep appreciating to the late seventies rate of between fifteen and twenty to the dollar. Perhaps it will reach the rate of Rs. 9.90 against the dollar which the Quaid-e-Awam himself decreed when he became chief martial law administrator. But why stop there, why not take the rate of four rupees and eighty paisa per dollar of the pre-1969 crisis? (For those reader who were still in heaven at the time, or were too young to remember, The 1969 crisis was the one that led to the 1970 crisis that further led to the 1971 crisis - also called Bengal crisis --, which is sometimes talked about but not discussed.)
This is the kind of sales-promotion gimmick talk that stock market `advisory services` use while touting their `high rate of return` on investment. This is a view from the rear view mirror and it is distorted. Looking backwards one can find many such statistical `artifacts`. Its called `fishing` and sometimes you do hook a bass.
...SR
#24 Posted by zeemax on June 17, 1999 11:27:11 am
SR/Amin Saleh :
No comment from SR and evasive tactics from you. Let me put the question in a multiple choice format which may be easier ..
a) Pakistan Rupee depreciated against US$ by 12 % year on year June 1998/99.
b) Pakistan Rupee appreciated against US$ by 22.5% year on year June 1998/99.
c) None of the above.
d) Both of the above.
Which one is true ? Your answer please.
Zeemax
No comment from SR and evasive tactics from you. Let me put the question in a multiple choice format which may be easier ..
a) Pakistan Rupee depreciated against US$ by 12 % year on year June 1998/99.
b) Pakistan Rupee appreciated against US$ by 22.5% year on year June 1998/99.
c) None of the above.
d) Both of the above.
Which one is true ? Your answer please.
Zeemax
#23 Posted by Amin Saleh on June 17, 1999 10:27:28 am
Zeemax:
1)That is why they call the numbers games
Lies, damn lies and statistics.
2) I don`t think you invest in capital markets abroad because if dividends drive share prices I am sure you would not invest in the likes of Intel and Microsoft or for that matter any other high tech company.
What is classified as undistributable, is undistributable only as far as dividends are concerned. Look at Golden Arrow Mutual Fund that reduced its paid up capital from Rs.10 to Rs. 5. Which is why in companies ordinance they have a term (And Reduced).
So if the company can not make proper use of its funds it will find a way to return it back to its owners, either as return of capital, buybacks or dividends. These are just various forms of distribution. I think you should look to the spirit of the distribution rather than the form. I understand the accounting conventions of which you are speaking but the world has evolved further than the constraints of the accounting dictates. The key focus of finance is engineering.
3) Foreign Exchange Act still exists and as you mention they were only amendments done. The act was not done away with.
4) Strong arm tactics are still abound. No remitting over $10K without getting big brothers permission. Try to buy $1K and you will get ``Sorry we have run out of US Dollars`` come back tomorrow. Price is a medium that put supply and demand into equilibrium.
God why I am saying all this as according to SK you are just yanking my chain.
This is the end no more conversation on this topic from my side.
Have a hearty laugh on my account.
Best wishes.
1)That is why they call the numbers games
Lies, damn lies and statistics.
2) I don`t think you invest in capital markets abroad because if dividends drive share prices I am sure you would not invest in the likes of Intel and Microsoft or for that matter any other high tech company.
What is classified as undistributable, is undistributable only as far as dividends are concerned. Look at Golden Arrow Mutual Fund that reduced its paid up capital from Rs.10 to Rs. 5. Which is why in companies ordinance they have a term (And Reduced).
So if the company can not make proper use of its funds it will find a way to return it back to its owners, either as return of capital, buybacks or dividends. These are just various forms of distribution. I think you should look to the spirit of the distribution rather than the form. I understand the accounting conventions of which you are speaking but the world has evolved further than the constraints of the accounting dictates. The key focus of finance is engineering.
3) Foreign Exchange Act still exists and as you mention they were only amendments done. The act was not done away with.
4) Strong arm tactics are still abound. No remitting over $10K without getting big brothers permission. Try to buy $1K and you will get ``Sorry we have run out of US Dollars`` come back tomorrow. Price is a medium that put supply and demand into equilibrium.
God why I am saying all this as according to SK you are just yanking my chain.
This is the end no more conversation on this topic from my side.
Have a hearty laugh on my account.
Best wishes.
#22 Posted by zeemax on June 16, 1999 4:59:22 pm
On second thought let me re-phrase that question :
Q : Has the Pakistan Rupee depreciated by 12 % or appreciated by 22.5% year on year June 1998/99?
This is fun .. maybe I can turn this into an Inami Scheme ..
Q : Has the Pakistan Rupee depreciated by 12 % or appreciated by 22.5% year on year June 1998/99?
This is fun .. maybe I can turn this into an Inami Scheme ..
#21 Posted by zeemax on June 16, 1999 4:59:22 pm
Amin Saleh / SR:
Quote:``
I am sorry but that is the most absurd thing that I have read. I would persume that you do not have any financial back ground for such a statement. ``Share premiums or capital reserves``. Pray tell me where do they come from and what difference would it make if buybacks are made from current or accumulated income. all money belongs to shareholders and I do not see the distinction between one accounting category versus another.``
Unquote
Well SR has commented upon my background in rather charitable terms so I`ll ``Cease and Desist`` as Lord SR wishes. However by way of education, I`ll only clarify a couple of points :
1) The difference between share premium/capital reserves versus accumulated income is the former are Non-Distributable reserves i.e. these cannot be distributed as dividends while Accumulated Income is meant for distribution as dividend. If treasury stock is allowed out of accumulated income then listed companies will get a further excuse not to pay dividends. Any premium on issue of shares can ONLY be used by law to float further capital, bonus shares, rights issues and so forth but NOT as cash didvidend. You may be confusing non-listed public companies/private companies with Listed public companies which are very tightly regulated by the SEC.
2)The Foreign Exchange act was amended by legislation titled ``Liberalization of Foreign Exchange Act`` during the first tenure of Nawaz Sharif.
3)The Interbank Floating Rate on date of unification was 50/50.50 and has been used for reference. Later fluctuations have not been taken into account as Rupee is now fully floating WITHIN the economy and fluctuations are normal. Even if your indicated rate of 51.90 is taken, the percentage loss of value of Pak Rs will be what .. 12 % ? Even that`s okay considering only half a year was spent in fire-fighting here and the economy only functioned for six months in 1998/1999.
Conversely, $ was at 65 in the open market as you say in June 1998 and now is around 53.
So has the Rupee appreciated by 22.50 % ?
Appreciate an answer to the last para by either you or SR, whoever figures it out first.
Zeemax
Quote:``
I am sorry but that is the most absurd thing that I have read. I would persume that you do not have any financial back ground for such a statement. ``Share premiums or capital reserves``. Pray tell me where do they come from and what difference would it make if buybacks are made from current or accumulated income. all money belongs to shareholders and I do not see the distinction between one accounting category versus another.``
Unquote
Well SR has commented upon my background in rather charitable terms so I`ll ``Cease and Desist`` as Lord SR wishes. However by way of education, I`ll only clarify a couple of points :
1) The difference between share premium/capital reserves versus accumulated income is the former are Non-Distributable reserves i.e. these cannot be distributed as dividends while Accumulated Income is meant for distribution as dividend. If treasury stock is allowed out of accumulated income then listed companies will get a further excuse not to pay dividends. Any premium on issue of shares can ONLY be used by law to float further capital, bonus shares, rights issues and so forth but NOT as cash didvidend. You may be confusing non-listed public companies/private companies with Listed public companies which are very tightly regulated by the SEC.
2)The Foreign Exchange act was amended by legislation titled ``Liberalization of Foreign Exchange Act`` during the first tenure of Nawaz Sharif.
3)The Interbank Floating Rate on date of unification was 50/50.50 and has been used for reference. Later fluctuations have not been taken into account as Rupee is now fully floating WITHIN the economy and fluctuations are normal. Even if your indicated rate of 51.90 is taken, the percentage loss of value of Pak Rs will be what .. 12 % ? Even that`s okay considering only half a year was spent in fire-fighting here and the economy only functioned for six months in 1998/1999.
Conversely, $ was at 65 in the open market as you say in June 1998 and now is around 53.
So has the Rupee appreciated by 22.50 % ?
Appreciate an answer to the last para by either you or SR, whoever figures it out first.
Zeemax
#20 Posted by SR on June 16, 1999 11:18:05 am
Zeemax:
[``…It must be kept in mind that the local open market rates on which many analysts base their opinions (including Bloomberg) are highly mis-leading and must not be used for serious analysis. … It would actually make no difference at all if all open market forex dealers were shut down. …open market rate is irrelevant in the overall economic set-up of the country being only 2-3% of the total forex turnover. It does have a psychological aspect though…``]
I cannot believe my eyes. I have even pinched myself to see if I was actually awake. You, of all people, Zeemax the former international banker, financier, inter-bank forex trader, stockmarket analyst, how can you possibly write any of this? These are the kinds of arguments which you used to tear to shreds. Last summer in Karachi when I sought your advice you agreed that I should close my account, take the loss, and withdraw the funds at Rs. 46 because you had no confidence left. What has changed? I`m sorry, but I happen to know you too well and refuse to believe that you are serious about any of this nonsense. Unless, of course, you`ve had a stroke or are getting senile in your golden years. :) I think you are just bored stiff and are inventing these kock-and-bull arguments to amuse yourself at the expense of the chowk readership. What`s going on? Why this ``kaj-behsi?``
…SR
(Sorry for exposing your background, but I thought it can be done safely without compromising your identity. I just couldn`t stand people thinking that you were an ignorant `jahil`. An image you seem hell bent on projecting. I suggest you start taking Ginsing and vitamin E.)
[``…It must be kept in mind that the local open market rates on which many analysts base their opinions (including Bloomberg) are highly mis-leading and must not be used for serious analysis. … It would actually make no difference at all if all open market forex dealers were shut down. …open market rate is irrelevant in the overall economic set-up of the country being only 2-3% of the total forex turnover. It does have a psychological aspect though…``]
I cannot believe my eyes. I have even pinched myself to see if I was actually awake. You, of all people, Zeemax the former international banker, financier, inter-bank forex trader, stockmarket analyst, how can you possibly write any of this? These are the kinds of arguments which you used to tear to shreds. Last summer in Karachi when I sought your advice you agreed that I should close my account, take the loss, and withdraw the funds at Rs. 46 because you had no confidence left. What has changed? I`m sorry, but I happen to know you too well and refuse to believe that you are serious about any of this nonsense. Unless, of course, you`ve had a stroke or are getting senile in your golden years. :) I think you are just bored stiff and are inventing these kock-and-bull arguments to amuse yourself at the expense of the chowk readership. What`s going on? Why this ``kaj-behsi?``
…SR
(Sorry for exposing your background, but I thought it can be done safely without compromising your identity. I just couldn`t stand people thinking that you were an ignorant `jahil`. An image you seem hell bent on projecting. I suggest you start taking Ginsing and vitamin E.)
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