Last Kiss

this is realy nice!

but has made u so ...well...acerbic?

i so wish it were written for me.

temporal:#49

The name is FARANGI_KUSH.Please notice the under-score as well;)Nothing is trivial here:)

Munni Bai Hijab made lillupitans out of many a literary giants including Daagh Dehlavi.It is understandable because the bait was the `mauzoo-e-sukhan` of sha-e-ri itself.

The ``Aagahee`` was very apt(brilliant!) but the other shai`r somehow could not elicit the context for me-----maybe it was an `insider`.

There seems to be a stampede,these days, of those trying to tread the avenues which the `malaikaas` find slippery.Only on CHOWK? you say.

__________________________________________________

``Hum sey khul jaao bu-vaqt e mai purustee aik din

Vurnaa hum chharain gey rukh kur uzr-e mustee aik din``

Yes Yes I do!at the right clime & time and in the right company & class.

I once went bankrupt keeping up my tribute-payments to virtue.

__________________________________________________

wassalaam.

temporal:#49

The name is FARANGI_KUSH.Please notice the under-score as well;)Nothing is trivial here:)

Munni Bai Hijab made lillupitans out of many a literary giants including Daagh Dehlavi.It is understandable because the bait was the `mauzoo-e-sukhan` of sha-e-ri itself.

The ``Aagahee`` was very apt(brilliant!) but the other shai`r somehow could not elicit the context for me-----maybe it was an `insider`.

There seems to be a stampede,these days, of those trying to tread the avenues which the `malaikaas` find slippery.Only on CHOWK? you say.

__________________________________________________

``Hum sey khul jaao bu-vaqt e mai purustee aik din

Vurnaa hum chharain gey rukh kur uzr-e mustee aik din``

Yes Yes I do!at the right clime & time and in the right company & class.

I once went bankrupt keeping up my tribute-payments to virtue.

__________________________________________________

wassalaam.

SameerJB #47:

Thank you:)


FARANGI #48:

Thank you;)

Epihany, indeed.

[e·piph·a·ny -n

a: A sudden manifestation of the essence or meaning of something.

b: A comprehension or perception of reality by means of a sudden intuitive realization.]


aagahee daam-e-shunaidan jis qadd`r ....

or

aata hay daagh-e-husrat-e-dil ka shoomar yad
moojh say meray gunah ka hisab ayekhuda na mang

rgds,

t

temporal:#43

I watched with baited anticipation your sting operation.Alhamdullilah,I was rewarded.Verily,He works in mysterious ways.

Despite my misgivings and benefit-of-doubts you pulled it.

Please do not ruin it by further `explanations`.I`ll savour this for a long time.Needless to remind you that your mischievousness is almost an epiphany.(How do you rate this use of the word?Shabaash.Shukrya!)

__________________________________________________

``Khulta kissi pay kyoon miray dil ka muamlaa

Shairon kay intikhab nay,rusvaa kiyaa mujhay``

__________________________________________________

wassalam.

P.S:I think we`ll get along fine;).

temporal # 43: (For temporal only) The poet is obviously morning the loss of something very dear or he/ she is concerned about the deteriorating situation but unable to come to understand the causes of effects. The last line, ``bunyad kuch to ho`` is very important. It clearly suggest an analytical approach based on reason and logic for understanding of the disappearance of stars in the morning-and extrapolate it to look for reason behind pain and suffering. From this standpoint, you can relate Buddha meditiating under a bo tree thinking about the meaning of life, pain and sorrow, Muhammad contemplating in Hira cave, or Jinnah formulating a plan or ideology as a basis for Pakistan. You may also think of Mansour Hallaj accepting death sentence with a smile because he thought he knew the truth/ reason (oneness with God). The story of Al-Rushd (Averros) and his trail about his philosophy (reason with God at the center) or Al-Rawandi, the great mutzalli (Sp?) and his philosophy (reason with no God).

Also include in this list, Gallileo and what must be going through his mind after being house arrsted by the Church and had to retrieve and criticize his own work. He knew exactly why stars disappear in the daylight. But the best I have kept for the last. It is Socrates and his last speech and thoughts before drinking hammock from the bowl. He did not want to live without thinking/ reason.

The story of Buddha, Gallileo and Socrates could be related to those two stanza you posted in # 43.

This is the downside of the poetry. Too many seemingly different interpretations of the same piece of art. The chaotic mumbo jumbo actually provides an excuse for reason and logic to enter into the picture and settle the interpretation to few more likely ones by looking at each at a time and accepting or rejecting them. For example the Buddha and Muhammad would be rejected because they were not famous at the time of their meditattions. ``kis sheh`r na shuhra huva.........`` is not applicable to them. Similarly, ``hum par tumhari chah ka ilzam hi to hey`` fits with Mansour for his love of God, for Socrates for his love of Athens and for Gallileo for his love of science. But Mansour did not worry about reason for stars disappearing in the morning and he is thus also rejected.

After rejecting all except Gallileo and Socrates, I will go with Socrates.

No more assignments please!!! It takes too much time.

Sameer #40
Its sad that when it comes to interpreting ancient religious texts, we go all literal and rigorous, and are often unwilling to yield on any point even to save a life.

But when it comes to getting to the root of the matter after horrifying ethnic violence or any difficult sad issue affecting the lives of many, where an uncompromising untiring rigorous tenacity IS called for, to get at facts/causes/effects/solutions, we easily lapse into the ambiguity of poetry and philosophy.

Maybe fear of venturing into the unknown is the motivation in both cases.

Pankaj #45
``But hey even chemistry is not the sum of parts. Infact ``the whole`` in science is rarely a mere sum of parts.``

Yes, and the real wonder is that maybe the first single-cell organism was born when some lightning struck some pea-soup :).

Sameer #31

You say

``Prose is better when it comes to acquire detailed knowledge or skills because of its continuous pattern whereas poetry is better for memorizing because of its pulsed or quantized pattern with rythmic quality. Human mind is programmed to focus deeply on rythms and this has led to its use in meditation/ religion``

Superb! Now I know why your posts are so enlightening to read. You always attempt to look at mundane things from a fresh perspective instead of toeing the beaten line. BTW, I never thought it this way. Somehow I got convinced long back that poetry is not my cup of tea. I always find it hard to understand symbolisms embedded in the poetry, and multiplicity of meanings make my task of interpreting arduous.

Sadhana

``poetry is like a human being, more than the sum of its parts viz sundry organic compounds + 70% water. And like humans, a lot of poetry I find hard to understand :-).``

Me too(I mean about the poetry). But hey even chemistry is not the sum of parts. Infact ``the whole`` in science is raraely a mere sum of parts. Sodium atom combines with Chlorine atom to produce Sodium Chloride, or common salt, the properties of which are different from any possible linear combination of the properties of its constituent parts. See you are pitted against two people here: a chemist and a chemical engineer:-). Just nitpicking.

Sincerely

PPS:

.... the second line should be...

Qumri ka tauq halqa-e-bairoon-e-dar....

SameerJB #40

[...The prose is flexible in structure but rigid in meaning. A prose writer will get mad if you find a different meaning in his/ her writing than what the writer intended....] and [...The jihadis/ deobandis/ wahabis seem to be reading Quran as prose and would like it to mean exactly what it meant for the bedoinns of 7th century Arabia. Now if you think it as a poetry, like Veda, the changing of meaning/ interpretation is actually a credit to the beauty of Quranic poetry and the appreciation of the Poet...]

Not necessarily so...The Supreme Court of USA is given the task of continuously re-interpreting the 8000 worded document according to changing needs and times. It can be done; is shown to be done. And sadly, some still don’t learn.


Fully agree that good poetry is multi-layered and lends to changing interpretations that seem to survive changing times.

When Ghalib wrote:

Gulshan maiN bandobast ba’rang-e-deegar hay aaj
Qumri ka halqa-e-tauq bairoon-e-dur hay aaj

he was only lamenting the hijack of India by the English. Today some can interpret it as the stranglehold of the third world, the disparity between North and South, the tyranny of the First world, even the strangle hold of the mis-named talibans in that country to the north.

Oh, without realising I slipped into discussing the ever lasting nature of immortal poetry. There is more to it than choice words, expression, metre, rhythm, thought. This is an intangible element that makes it timeless and universal. There have been thousands of good poets in the past two hundred years. Other than serious scholars of the language, how many of the rest of us know their names. How many of them are still relevant?

Back to your post. The three interpretations you provided are relevant and interpretable from the original submission. But it is more you ingenuity than the poet’s!


Let me give you this light assignment. Consider these short poems and tell me how your imagination would unravel the shades of meaning..

I
Jis roz qaza aa’aye gi
meray dar’d ko jo zubaaN milay
chalo phir say mooskuraiN
yeh mausam-e-gul
hameeN say apni nava hum kalaam hoti rahi
yeh kis khalish nay phir is dil main aashiyana kiya
kis sheh’r na shohra hua na’dani-e-dil ka

II
Sit’m ki rasmaiN buhat theN
baat bus say nikal chali hay...
Hum pur tumhari chah ka ilzaam hee tou hay
fikr-e-sood-o-ziyaan
subha phootin tou aasmaaN pay t’ray
boonyaad kooch tou ho


Will be back to shed some light on this.

regards,

t

PS: PM and fairdinkum: Hum aap kay liyay dua-e-khair karaiN gay. Ab dawa say aap ka eelaaj hona mumkin nahiN nazar aata hay.

Please read poetry instead of history in the first line of my last post.

I suspect an alliance in the making against chemistry. Allah kher kare.....

sadna #38, ``As for me, poetry is like a human being, more than the sum of its parts viz sundry organic compounds + 70% water. And like humans, a lot of poetry I find hard to understand :-).``

i agree with you...that`s the beauty of it

Sadhana: I agree with temporal definition of history as a creative art. I just looked at it from a diffent angle. My chemistry does not interfere at all when it comes to enjoying the beauty of inner and outer world.

Poetry had the faster rate of diffusion than prose in a papreless and media-free environment. Its rythmic qualities also made it resilient to corrption. At the same time, though rigid in form due to the fear of break in the rythm, poetry is more flexible when it comes to extracting the emaning from it. The meanings can easily change with the changing environment with no negative bearing on poetry and poets. Actually it is a credit to poets when people see different meanings than the poet because of the extensive use of symbolism in poetry.

The prose is flexible in structure but rigid in meaning. A prose writer will get mad if you find a different meaning in his/ her writing than what the writer intended.

The jihadis/ deobandis/ wahabis seem to be reading Quran as prose and would like it to mean exactly what it meant for the bedoinns of 7th century Arabia. Now if you think it as a poetry, like Veda, the changing of meaning/ interpretation is actually a credit to the beauty of Quranic poetry and the appreciation of the Poet.

I have no doubt in my mind that Hussain Burhani`s meant his poem to be about a boy-girl love. But consider the following three interpretations and see how they credit him for using easy and common symbolism.

1) He was passionate about his religion but the bitter experiences have turned that passion into anger, to hurt and he finally closes the chapter by swallowing the keys-Abandoning religion.

2) He was passionate about Pakistan but recent history has turned his passion into anger, hurt and he finally swallows the keys-getting green card and not wishing to go back.

3) he was madly in love with his beloved city Karachi. He kissed the ground last time when he boarded a flight to New York. The events taken place in Karachi during last several years has turned his passion into anger, hurt and he has closed the box and swallowed the keys-becoming passionate about Atlanta.

None of these was the aim of the poet. Yet he is not being ridiculed by different interpretations.

PM: Are bhai yeh chowk hey. Yahan baat se baat nikalti hey. Aur kabhi kabhi baat chemistry ki taraf bhi chali jati hey. Here is how interaction at chowk find direction.

BUTT SAHIB se butt-tameez......waisey butt kashmiri hotey hain......aur kashmir india-pakistan ke beech dushmani ke jarh hey......jarh kharboozey ke pukki hoti hey.......aur kharbooza kharboozey ko dekh je rang pakarta hey.......aur rang jaman ka pukka hota hey......aur jaman pakistan ke kuch logoN ko buhut pasand haiN.......pakistan jinnah sahib ne banaya.......aur wolpert aur ayesha jalal ne jinnah per kitabaiN likheeN........aur ayesha jalal minto ke gharaney se haiN.....aur minto ki mashhoor kahani toba tek singh hey........ab toba tek singh aik district hey.........aur ab her district maiN nazim hoa kareN gay......jamat-e-islami apne district ke head ko pehle hi se nazim kehti hey......aur JI ke lahore ke nazim haiN BUTT SAHIB.

Baat se jo baat nikalti hey asar rakhti hey

per naheeN taqat-e-parwaz magar rakhti hey

PM #32,

kya karun, baron kay agay sar jhukta hai aksar...

Sameer #31
``Because poetry is less corruptible because of rhythmic qualities, memorizable..`` ``.. Human mind is programmed to focus deeply on rhythms..``

Hey never thought of it that way, thanks!

But for even rhythmic words/sounds to evoke a sense of beauty, there needs to be overall harmony or integrity. That may be partly what temporal means.

As for me, poetry is like a human being, more than the sum of its parts viz sundry organic compounds + 70% water. And like humans, a lot of poetry I find hard to understand :-).

Sadhana