Save Me From Charismatic Leaders! Sanatani,

Well said and welcome back, sir!. We would need a similar epitaph for the G-man as well. Any suggestions?

Regards

Save Me From Charismatic Leaders! DM sahib,

After ruling over India as an unchallenged democratic dictator for seventeen years, Nehru left India in shambles when he died

A better epitaph for JLN could not have been written. A well written piece, sir!

Regards

Free to Breed Whatever that is happening in the name of Islam, is not your/our/Muslim's fault. It is the fault of Americans/Indians/Zionists.

There is a possibility that it may be all true. As it is many of the groups claiming to be Talibs are suspected of being on the rolls of Afghan, US and Indian agencies.

Regards

How real is your politik? Tahmed sahib

("conversions" is a big issue in the minds of hindus)

Yup. Maybe the missionaries should select softer targets for conversions. They can proselytise outside Kaaba, Karbala or Lal Masjid.

(because yours is the about the most primitive and dysfunctional culture there is)

And a very pernicious and infectious one, too. They continue to influence Pakistanis with their legacy- casteismm, racism and suicide bombing- 60 years after being booted out.

Regards

How real is your politik? Masadi sahib,

The SU was a state capitalist system

That is the real problem. Any state run by a totalitarian agenda like the Commies will degenerate into something like what the USSR became.

market is the "motivation"

Money is not the only motivating factor eg Gandhi, Mother Teresa, Talibs but you cannot run away from the fact that it is a major motivator and has been demonstrated statistically too. Not true just for me but for much of humanity. Now if saying this makes me a monkey, so be it. In any case being called a monkey is no big deal for me, 'cos I am descended from them and as you wud be aware I worship one, too.

Regards

How real is your politik? Cheema sahib,

Re: 127

Correct. Further for a socialist system to start spending on public welfare someone has to create that wealth in the first place. USSR had an advantage of having huge amount of natural resurces which could have funded the state.

Regards

How real is your politik? Masadi sahib,

(taking care of subsistence so that it does not interfere in the creative ability of the worker is what socialism does.....in a socialist society people lives to work
because beyond subsistence there would be no disconnect between "work" and "life")

Experience of USSR shows that once subsistence is met, folk dont indulge in creative work, rather they drown themselves in vodka.

Regards

How real is your politik? Romair,

You have to make do with what you have. I am not sure that AAZ is any worse than the average Third World democratic leader or even leaders in some so-called developed nation. The important thing is to stick to the course and let institutions develop which will take care of bad apples. At any rate the worst disasters that have happened in Pakistan (Bdesh, Jihad and NWFP-FATA meltdown) have all happened under army watch.

Coming to the courts, although the non-restoration of Ifti is a setback there is a fair possibility that even the current courts may develop a spine and stand up to dictatorships and wannabes in the coming times.

(and then martial law......which will be celebrated)

Very doubtful that a future military coup will be celebrated. As it is support for military coups was purely a Punjabi phenomenon and in future even this is a remote possibility. The folks there have seen thru the Army charade.

Regards

Regards

How real is your politik? Nkg moshai,

France and Scandinavia amassed a great wealth through capitalists route, work of great entrepeneurs working in relatively free trade environment (like Alfred Nobel, Pierre Renault and many others) of course ably supported by Govt investment in infrastcruture and in good governance. Then when wealth was created, they were able to a more socialist environment. In short first create wealth then distribute it. Else you will end up like North Korea or India or Pakistan in the ZAB era.

Regards

How real is your politik? Nkg moshai,

If capitalistic economy is ideal, why US and Europe is not ready to abolish farm subsidy?

They should. The long term subsidy given to farmers in West has result in unfair and unfree trade and has been responsbile for crippling Third World agriculture especially in Africa. And contributed to serious ecological imbalances and global warming.

Subsidies given to farmers in rich countries are contrary to capitalist principles and have seriously distorted trade relations

Regards

How real is your politik? Masadi sahib,

These people milling around will get paid and will want to buy something with what they are paid

Yes, but if all factories produce nothing but socialism like this Mongolian plant, what will you buy. That was the basic problem with socialist states esp East Europe. They were producing lots, their per capita income looked great, they had great tech, missiles et al but getting good quality stuff that consumers really needed was difficult. There were long lines outside stores.

You should have been in India in the socialist age. (ie upto mid 80s) You cud not get paneer and khoya in summer in Delhi (in mid 80s when I was a school kid) becuase govt diktat forbade use of milk for any other purpose than liquid milk. You had to wait in a three long queue to get a Bajaj scooter, even getting something like a shoddy HMT wristwatch required a waiting list.

Regards

How real is your politik? Masadi sahib,

I hope you can appreciate a joke.

Unlike a socialist setup where jobs are created not for profit but for the sake of creating jobs for the people.

There was this huge factory in Mongolia and a foreigner was visiting it. He saw lots of employees milling around here and there but could not see any output. When he asked the supervisor what the factory produces the supervisor replied "We produce socialism"

Regards

How real is your politik? Harishbhai,

(But seriously, can you reproduce that survey for us here?)

http://www.altmuslim.com/a/a/a/2583/

The CNN-IBN Pakistan and India polls are out.. (State of the nation polls)

In this context Jinnah got an approval rating of 97% in Pakistan and 43% in India.

Gandhi got an approval rating 29% in Pakistan and 85% in India.

Posted by Yasser Latif Hamdani on August 19, 2007 at 11:06 AM

I will request Yasser mian to mail me the original links.

Regards

How real is your politik? Harishbhai,

Glad to know that I bring some smile to your face.

Regards

How real is your politik? Socialism, yes, communism no. Socialism has never been strict on atheism, communism very much so. Communism was never the rage in the Islamic world, it was imposed upon by force in Islamic world. Eg Soviet Central Asia, Afghanistan.

Regards

How real is your politik? Cheema sahib,

Muslims have not taken kindly to either secularism or communism.

Harishbhai,

Remember that survey quoted by YLH. Only 20 odd % Pakistanis approved of MKG.

Regards