Reaction
Fascinating perspectives.
__________________________________________________
Transcript: UPI United Press International, Sep. 26, 2001 interviews General Gul:
De Borchgrave: So who did Black Sept. 11?
Gul: Mossad and its accomplices. The U.S. spends $40 billion a year on its 11 intelligence agencies. That`s $400 billion in 10 years. Yet the Bush Administration says it was taken by surprise. I don`t believe it. Within 10 minutes of the second twin tower being hit in the World Trade Center CNN said Osama bin Laden had done it. That was a planned piece of disinformation by the real perpetrators. It created an instant mindset and put public opinion into a trance, which prevented even intelligent people from thinking for themselves.
Q: So you`re already convinced bin Laden didn`t do it?
A: I know bin Laden and his associates. I`ve been with them here, in Europe and the Middle East. They are graduates of the best universities and are highly intelligent with impressive degrees and speak impeccable English. These are people who have rediscovered fundamental Islamic values. Many come from the Gulf countries where ruling royal families have generated hatred by the way they flout divine law, wasting billions on gratifying their whims, jetting around in large private jets by themselves, and sailing the Mediterranean in big private boats for weeks on end. Osama`s best recruits come from feudal areas that are U.S. protectorates and where millions of poor people are seeking human dignity. I have even visited a Christian convent school in Murree, 60 miles from here, where my 13-year-old daughter is studying. The young girls there have told me Osama is their hero. Osama`s followers identify with Mujahideen freedom fighters wherever they are defending Islam and its values.
Q: So what makes you think Osama wasn`t behind Sept. 11?
A: From a cave inside a mountain or a peasant`s hovel? Let`s be serious. Osama inspires countless millions by standing up for Islam against American and Israeli imperialism. He doesn`t have the means for such a sophisticated operation.
Q: Why Mossad?
A: Mossad and its American associates are the obvious culprits. Who benefits from the crime? The attacks against the twin towers started at 8:45 a.m. and four flights are diverted from their assigned air space and no air traffic controller sounds the alarm. And no Air Force jets scramble until 10 a.m. That also smacks of a small scale Air Force rebellion, a coup against the Pentagon perhaps? Radars are jammed, transponders fail. No IFF -- friend or foe identification -- challenge. In Pakistan, if there is no response to IFF, jets are instantly scrambled and the aircraft is shot down with no further questions asked. This was clearly an inside job. Bush was afraid and rushed to the shelter of a nuclear bunker. He clearly feared a nuclear situation. Who could that have been? Will that also be hushed up in the investigation, like the Warren report after the Kennedy assassination?
Q: At this point, someone might be asking what you`ve been smoking. What is Israel`s interest in such a monstrous plot, which, of course, no one believes except Islamist extremists who concocted this piece of disinformation in the first place, presumably to detract from the real culprits?
A: Jews never agreed to Bush 41 (George H.W. Bush, the 41st president) or 43 (his son George W. Bush, the 43rd president). They made sure Bush senior didn`t get a second term. His land-for-peace pressure in Palestine didn`t suit Israel. They were also against the young Bush because he was considered too close to oil interests and the Gulf countries. Bush senior and Jim Baker had raised $150 million for Bush junior, much of it from Mideast sources or their American go-betweens. Bush 41 and Baker, as private citizens, had also facilitated the new strategic relationship between Saudi Arabia and Iran. I have this from sources in both countries. So clearly the prospect of a Bush 43 was a potential danger to Israel.
Jews were stunned by the way Bush stole the election in Florida. They had put big money on Al Gore. Israel has given its imperialist guardian parent opportunities to turn disaster into a pretext for imposing an all-encompassing military, political and economic agenda to further the cause of global capitalism. While Colin Powell is cautious and others are reckless and want to make up for their failure to defeat Saddam Hussein in the Gulf War 10 years ago, the global agenda is the same.
Israel knows it has a short shelf-life before it is overwhelmed by demographics. It is a state that was born in terrorism that terrorized Palestinians into the exile of refugee camps, where they have now subsisted in squalid refugee camps, and is now very much afraid of Pakistan`s nuclear capability.
Israel has now handed the Bush family the opportunity it has been waiting for to consolidate America`s imperial grip on the Gulf and acquire control of the Caspian basin by extending its military presence in Central Asia. Bush conveniently overlooks -- or is not told -- the fact that Islamic fundamentalists got their big boost in the modern age as CIA assets in the covert campaign I was also involved with to force the Soviets out of Afghanistan. Bush senior was vice president during that entire campaign. And no sooner did he become president on Jan. 20, 1989, than he summoned an inter-agency intelligence meeting and issued an order, among several others, to clip the wings of ISI (Pakistani Inter-Services Intelligence) that had been coordinating the entire operation in Afghanistan. I know this firsthand as I was DGISI at the time (director general, ISI).
Q: So how do you read U.S. strategy in Pakistan?
A: The destabilization of Pakistan is part of the U.S. plan because it is a Muslim nuclear state. The U.S. wants to isolate Pakistan from China as part of its containment policy. President Nixon`s book ``The Real War`` said China would be the superpower of the 21st Century. The U.S. is also creating hostility between Pakistan and Afghanistan, two Muslim states to reverse the perception that the Islamic world now has its own nuclear weapons. Bush 43 doesn`t realize he is being manipulated by people who understand geopolitics. He is not leading but being led. All he can do is think in terms of the wanted-dead-or-alive culture, which is how Hollywood conditions the masses to think and act.
All summer long we heard about America`s shrinking surplus and that the Pentagon would not have sufficient funds to modernize for the 21st century. And now, all of a sudden, the Pentagon can get what it wants without any Democratic Party opposition. How very convenient! Even your cherished civil liberties can now be abridged with impunity to protect the expansion of the hegemony of transnational capitalism. There is now a new excuse to crush anti-globalization protests.
Bush 43 follows Bush 41. Iraq was baited into the Kuwaiti trap when the U.S. told Saddam it was not interested in his inter-Arab squabbles. Two days later, he moved into Kuwait, which was an Iraqi province anyway before the British Empire decreed otherwise. Roosevelt baited the Pearl Harbor trap for the Japanese empire, which provided the pretext for entering World War II.
And now the Israelis have given the U.S. the pretext for further expansion into an area that will be critical in the next 25 years - the Caspian basin.
Q: Were you a fundamentalist in the days of the war against the Soviets in Afghanistan when you worked closely with the CIA?
A: Not as much as I am today.
Q: What turned you against America?
A: Betrayals and broken promises and what was done to my army career.
Q: And what was that?
A: President Ishaq Khan, who succeeded Zia ul-Haq after his plane was blown out of the sky, wanted to appoint me chief of staff, the highest position in the Pakistani army. The U.S., which by then had clipped ISI`s wings, also blocked my promotion by informing the president I was unacceptable. So I was moved to a corps commander position. As ISI director, I held the whole Mujahideen movement in the palm of my hands. We were all pro-American. But then America left us in the lurch and everything went to pieces, including Afghanistan.
The U.S. pushed for a broad-based Afghan government of seven factions and then waved goodbye. Even in the best of democracies, a broad-based coalition does not work. So we quickly had seven jokers in Kabul interested in only one thing - jockeying for power. The gunplay quickly followed, which led to the creation of Taliban, the students of the original Mujahideen, who decided to put an end to it.
Q: What happened to the 1,000 shoulder-fired Stinger anti-aircraft missiles that were supplied by president Reagan in 1986 and 87 to the Mujahideen, and that literally grounded the Soviet air force?
A: After the Soviets pulled out, the CIA allocated $60 million to try to buy them back. This just drove the black market price up for one Stinger from $100,000 to $300,000. The Taliban still have about 250 of them for the kind of situation they face today against U.S. aircraft.
Q: Is the U.S. now your enemy?
A: Is the U.S. national interest in contradiction with the Muslim world? The U.S. needs oil, as do its European allies. You have between 6 and 8 million American Muslims and their ranks are growing. About the same number in Europe. Israel aside, we are America`s natural allies. Prof. Sam Huntington in his ``Clash of Civilizations`` puts Confucius and Judeo-Christians in one corner, and us in the other. His prescription is wrong but is being adopted by Bush 43 who has now put 60 countries on his hit list. This is the diabolical school that wants to launch an anti-Muslim ``crusade.`` Muslims understood what Bush meant when he used that word.
We need a meeting, not a clash, of civilizations. We are on the brink of disaster. It is time to pull back from the brink and reassess before we blow ourselves up. The purpose of Islam is service to humanity. The time for like-minded people to have a meeting of the minds is now.
Q: But you are against democracy, so how can there be a meeting of the minds?
A: Democracy does not work. Politicians are constantly thinking of their next election, not the public good, which means, at best, constantly shading the truth to hide it from their constituents. Their pronouncements are laced with lies and the voters are lulled or gulled into believing utter nonsense. The Koran says call a spade a spade. It is the supreme law and tells right from wrong. There is no notion of ``my country right or wrong`` under divine law. The creator`s will predominates. All if subservient to Allah`s will and adherence to a set of basic, fundamental values.
Q: So what kind of a system are you advocating?
A: The world needs a post-modern state system. Right now, the nation-state and round the clock satellite TV lead people to imitate America`s way of life. Which is mathematically impossible. You have 4 percent of the world`s population consuming 32 percent of the world`s resources. The creator through Prophet Mohammed said equal distribution. Capitalism is the negation of the creator`s will. It leads to imperialism and unilateralism.
Q: So what does this post-modern state system look like?
A: A global village under divine order, or we will have global bloodshed until good triumphs over evil. Islam encapsulates all the principal religions and what was handed down 1,400 years ago was the normal evolutionary sequel to Judaism and Christianity. The prophet`s last sermon was a universal document of human rights for everyone that surpasses everything that came since, including America`s declaration of independence and the U.N. Charter of universal rights. If you superimpose true secular values on true Islamic values, there is no difference. So surely divine law should supersede man-made law. Islam is egalitarian, tolerant and progressive. It is the wave of the future.
Q: Marxism also believed that the nation-state would eventually wither away.
A: Socialism jumped the rails when it was co-opted by the imperialist Soviet state. Islam believes in dynamism, Christianity stands for static statism. The pope in all his pronouncements has expressed a dogmatic attachment to the status quo. Why are so many black Americans converting to Islam? Because they are looking for true equality which they cannot find under capitalism. Allah has no gender, neither male nor female. Islam has no indirect taxation in an interest-free economy. Usury was a Jewish concept.
Q: Is Iran your model?
A: There isn`t a single true Islamic state in the world today. Iran has moved forward from its 1979 revolution, but I am not sure whether it`s the right direction.
Q: And Taliban?
A: They represent Islam in its purest form so far. It`s a clean sheet. And they were also moving in the right direction when this crisis was cooked up by the U.S. Until Sept. 11, they had perfect law and order with no formal police force, only traffic cops without sidearms. Now, in less than two weeks, they have mobilized some 300,000 volunteers to fight American and British invaders if they come.
Q: And your reaction to U.S. demands on Pakistan?
A: If Pakistan gives the U.S. base rights we will have a national upheaval. And if the U.S. attacks Afghanistan, there will be a call -- a fatwa -- for a general jihad. All borders will then disappear and it will be a no-holds-barred Islamic uprising against Israel and American imperialism. Pakistan will be engulfed in the firestorm. So I can only hope that cooler heads will prevail in Washington.
Q: What about the other U.S. demands?
A: Overflight rights are meaningless since the U.S. violates air space daily all over the world. As for intelligence sharing with ISI, you can`t even catch your own terrorists. And what ISI gives you will be of marginal value anyway.
Q: President (Pervez) Musharraf has made strong statements supporting the U.S.
A: He was my student in the army. He is a good man, but he doesn`t understand Islam. The army will never fight the masses. If push comes to shove, Musharraf will say no to the Americans rather than turn against the people. He is not just facing a handful of angry people. By his own admission, it`s 10 percent to 15 percent of the population, or at least 10 million people willing to fight. For openers, they would close the port of Karachi. A country cannot breathe without lungs.
Q: Back to Osama`s terrorist network. Who was behind the bombing of the U.S. Embassies in Tanzania and Kenya?
A: Mossad is strong in both countries. Remember the Israeli operation to free hostages in Entebbe (Uganda)? Both Kenya and Tanzania were part of the logistical tail. A so-called associate of Osama was framed at Karachi airport. The incidents took place on Aug. 8, 1999, and on the 10th a short, clean-shaven man disembarks at Karachi airport and presents the passport of a bearded man. Not your passport, he was told. He then tries to bribe the clerk with 200 rupees. A ludicrously small sum given the circumstances. The clerk says no and turns him in and he starts singing right away. Not plausible. Osama has sworn to me on the Koran it was not him and he is truthful to a fault. Pious Muslims do not kill innocent civilians who included many Muslim victims. The passport must have been switched while the man was asleep on the plane in what has all the earmarks of a Mossad operation. For 10 years, the Mujahideen fought the Soviets in Afghanistan and not a single Soviet embassy was touched anywhere in the world. So this could not have been Osama`s followers.
Q: What if bin Laden has been lying to you and is guilty. Is that inconceivable?
A: If Taliban are given irrefutable evidence of his guilt, I am in favor of a fair trial. In America, one is entitled to a jury of peers. But he has no American peers. The Taliban would not object, in the event of a prima face case, to an international Islamic court meeting in The Hague. They would turn extradite Osama to the Netherlands.
End of transcript: UPI United Press International, Sep. 26, 2001, Interview with General Gul
__________________________________________________
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 24, 2001 03:57 pm
INTERVIEW---GENERAL HAMID GUL---26 sept 2001Fascinating perspectives.
__________________________________________________
Transcript: UPI United Press International, Sep. 26, 2001 interviews General Gul:
De Borchgrave: So who did Black Sept. 11?
Gul: Mossad and its accomplices. The U.S. spends $40 billion a year on its 11 intelligence agencies. That`s $400 billion in 10 years. Yet the Bush Administration says it was taken by surprise. I don`t believe it. Within 10 minutes of the second twin tower being hit in the World Trade Center CNN said Osama bin Laden had done it. That was a planned piece of disinformation by the real perpetrators. It created an instant mindset and put public opinion into a trance, which prevented even intelligent people from thinking for themselves.
Q: So you`re already convinced bin Laden didn`t do it?
A: I know bin Laden and his associates. I`ve been with them here, in Europe and the Middle East. They are graduates of the best universities and are highly intelligent with impressive degrees and speak impeccable English. These are people who have rediscovered fundamental Islamic values. Many come from the Gulf countries where ruling royal families have generated hatred by the way they flout divine law, wasting billions on gratifying their whims, jetting around in large private jets by themselves, and sailing the Mediterranean in big private boats for weeks on end. Osama`s best recruits come from feudal areas that are U.S. protectorates and where millions of poor people are seeking human dignity. I have even visited a Christian convent school in Murree, 60 miles from here, where my 13-year-old daughter is studying. The young girls there have told me Osama is their hero. Osama`s followers identify with Mujahideen freedom fighters wherever they are defending Islam and its values.
Q: So what makes you think Osama wasn`t behind Sept. 11?
A: From a cave inside a mountain or a peasant`s hovel? Let`s be serious. Osama inspires countless millions by standing up for Islam against American and Israeli imperialism. He doesn`t have the means for such a sophisticated operation.
Q: Why Mossad?
A: Mossad and its American associates are the obvious culprits. Who benefits from the crime? The attacks against the twin towers started at 8:45 a.m. and four flights are diverted from their assigned air space and no air traffic controller sounds the alarm. And no Air Force jets scramble until 10 a.m. That also smacks of a small scale Air Force rebellion, a coup against the Pentagon perhaps? Radars are jammed, transponders fail. No IFF -- friend or foe identification -- challenge. In Pakistan, if there is no response to IFF, jets are instantly scrambled and the aircraft is shot down with no further questions asked. This was clearly an inside job. Bush was afraid and rushed to the shelter of a nuclear bunker. He clearly feared a nuclear situation. Who could that have been? Will that also be hushed up in the investigation, like the Warren report after the Kennedy assassination?
Q: At this point, someone might be asking what you`ve been smoking. What is Israel`s interest in such a monstrous plot, which, of course, no one believes except Islamist extremists who concocted this piece of disinformation in the first place, presumably to detract from the real culprits?
A: Jews never agreed to Bush 41 (George H.W. Bush, the 41st president) or 43 (his son George W. Bush, the 43rd president). They made sure Bush senior didn`t get a second term. His land-for-peace pressure in Palestine didn`t suit Israel. They were also against the young Bush because he was considered too close to oil interests and the Gulf countries. Bush senior and Jim Baker had raised $150 million for Bush junior, much of it from Mideast sources or their American go-betweens. Bush 41 and Baker, as private citizens, had also facilitated the new strategic relationship between Saudi Arabia and Iran. I have this from sources in both countries. So clearly the prospect of a Bush 43 was a potential danger to Israel.
Jews were stunned by the way Bush stole the election in Florida. They had put big money on Al Gore. Israel has given its imperialist guardian parent opportunities to turn disaster into a pretext for imposing an all-encompassing military, political and economic agenda to further the cause of global capitalism. While Colin Powell is cautious and others are reckless and want to make up for their failure to defeat Saddam Hussein in the Gulf War 10 years ago, the global agenda is the same.
Israel knows it has a short shelf-life before it is overwhelmed by demographics. It is a state that was born in terrorism that terrorized Palestinians into the exile of refugee camps, where they have now subsisted in squalid refugee camps, and is now very much afraid of Pakistan`s nuclear capability.
Israel has now handed the Bush family the opportunity it has been waiting for to consolidate America`s imperial grip on the Gulf and acquire control of the Caspian basin by extending its military presence in Central Asia. Bush conveniently overlooks -- or is not told -- the fact that Islamic fundamentalists got their big boost in the modern age as CIA assets in the covert campaign I was also involved with to force the Soviets out of Afghanistan. Bush senior was vice president during that entire campaign. And no sooner did he become president on Jan. 20, 1989, than he summoned an inter-agency intelligence meeting and issued an order, among several others, to clip the wings of ISI (Pakistani Inter-Services Intelligence) that had been coordinating the entire operation in Afghanistan. I know this firsthand as I was DGISI at the time (director general, ISI).
Q: So how do you read U.S. strategy in Pakistan?
A: The destabilization of Pakistan is part of the U.S. plan because it is a Muslim nuclear state. The U.S. wants to isolate Pakistan from China as part of its containment policy. President Nixon`s book ``The Real War`` said China would be the superpower of the 21st Century. The U.S. is also creating hostility between Pakistan and Afghanistan, two Muslim states to reverse the perception that the Islamic world now has its own nuclear weapons. Bush 43 doesn`t realize he is being manipulated by people who understand geopolitics. He is not leading but being led. All he can do is think in terms of the wanted-dead-or-alive culture, which is how Hollywood conditions the masses to think and act.
All summer long we heard about America`s shrinking surplus and that the Pentagon would not have sufficient funds to modernize for the 21st century. And now, all of a sudden, the Pentagon can get what it wants without any Democratic Party opposition. How very convenient! Even your cherished civil liberties can now be abridged with impunity to protect the expansion of the hegemony of transnational capitalism. There is now a new excuse to crush anti-globalization protests.
Bush 43 follows Bush 41. Iraq was baited into the Kuwaiti trap when the U.S. told Saddam it was not interested in his inter-Arab squabbles. Two days later, he moved into Kuwait, which was an Iraqi province anyway before the British Empire decreed otherwise. Roosevelt baited the Pearl Harbor trap for the Japanese empire, which provided the pretext for entering World War II.
And now the Israelis have given the U.S. the pretext for further expansion into an area that will be critical in the next 25 years - the Caspian basin.
Q: Were you a fundamentalist in the days of the war against the Soviets in Afghanistan when you worked closely with the CIA?
A: Not as much as I am today.
Q: What turned you against America?
A: Betrayals and broken promises and what was done to my army career.
Q: And what was that?
A: President Ishaq Khan, who succeeded Zia ul-Haq after his plane was blown out of the sky, wanted to appoint me chief of staff, the highest position in the Pakistani army. The U.S., which by then had clipped ISI`s wings, also blocked my promotion by informing the president I was unacceptable. So I was moved to a corps commander position. As ISI director, I held the whole Mujahideen movement in the palm of my hands. We were all pro-American. But then America left us in the lurch and everything went to pieces, including Afghanistan.
The U.S. pushed for a broad-based Afghan government of seven factions and then waved goodbye. Even in the best of democracies, a broad-based coalition does not work. So we quickly had seven jokers in Kabul interested in only one thing - jockeying for power. The gunplay quickly followed, which led to the creation of Taliban, the students of the original Mujahideen, who decided to put an end to it.
Q: What happened to the 1,000 shoulder-fired Stinger anti-aircraft missiles that were supplied by president Reagan in 1986 and 87 to the Mujahideen, and that literally grounded the Soviet air force?
A: After the Soviets pulled out, the CIA allocated $60 million to try to buy them back. This just drove the black market price up for one Stinger from $100,000 to $300,000. The Taliban still have about 250 of them for the kind of situation they face today against U.S. aircraft.
Q: Is the U.S. now your enemy?
A: Is the U.S. national interest in contradiction with the Muslim world? The U.S. needs oil, as do its European allies. You have between 6 and 8 million American Muslims and their ranks are growing. About the same number in Europe. Israel aside, we are America`s natural allies. Prof. Sam Huntington in his ``Clash of Civilizations`` puts Confucius and Judeo-Christians in one corner, and us in the other. His prescription is wrong but is being adopted by Bush 43 who has now put 60 countries on his hit list. This is the diabolical school that wants to launch an anti-Muslim ``crusade.`` Muslims understood what Bush meant when he used that word.
We need a meeting, not a clash, of civilizations. We are on the brink of disaster. It is time to pull back from the brink and reassess before we blow ourselves up. The purpose of Islam is service to humanity. The time for like-minded people to have a meeting of the minds is now.
Q: But you are against democracy, so how can there be a meeting of the minds?
A: Democracy does not work. Politicians are constantly thinking of their next election, not the public good, which means, at best, constantly shading the truth to hide it from their constituents. Their pronouncements are laced with lies and the voters are lulled or gulled into believing utter nonsense. The Koran says call a spade a spade. It is the supreme law and tells right from wrong. There is no notion of ``my country right or wrong`` under divine law. The creator`s will predominates. All if subservient to Allah`s will and adherence to a set of basic, fundamental values.
Q: So what kind of a system are you advocating?
A: The world needs a post-modern state system. Right now, the nation-state and round the clock satellite TV lead people to imitate America`s way of life. Which is mathematically impossible. You have 4 percent of the world`s population consuming 32 percent of the world`s resources. The creator through Prophet Mohammed said equal distribution. Capitalism is the negation of the creator`s will. It leads to imperialism and unilateralism.
Q: So what does this post-modern state system look like?
A: A global village under divine order, or we will have global bloodshed until good triumphs over evil. Islam encapsulates all the principal religions and what was handed down 1,400 years ago was the normal evolutionary sequel to Judaism and Christianity. The prophet`s last sermon was a universal document of human rights for everyone that surpasses everything that came since, including America`s declaration of independence and the U.N. Charter of universal rights. If you superimpose true secular values on true Islamic values, there is no difference. So surely divine law should supersede man-made law. Islam is egalitarian, tolerant and progressive. It is the wave of the future.
Q: Marxism also believed that the nation-state would eventually wither away.
A: Socialism jumped the rails when it was co-opted by the imperialist Soviet state. Islam believes in dynamism, Christianity stands for static statism. The pope in all his pronouncements has expressed a dogmatic attachment to the status quo. Why are so many black Americans converting to Islam? Because they are looking for true equality which they cannot find under capitalism. Allah has no gender, neither male nor female. Islam has no indirect taxation in an interest-free economy. Usury was a Jewish concept.
Q: Is Iran your model?
A: There isn`t a single true Islamic state in the world today. Iran has moved forward from its 1979 revolution, but I am not sure whether it`s the right direction.
Q: And Taliban?
A: They represent Islam in its purest form so far. It`s a clean sheet. And they were also moving in the right direction when this crisis was cooked up by the U.S. Until Sept. 11, they had perfect law and order with no formal police force, only traffic cops without sidearms. Now, in less than two weeks, they have mobilized some 300,000 volunteers to fight American and British invaders if they come.
Q: And your reaction to U.S. demands on Pakistan?
A: If Pakistan gives the U.S. base rights we will have a national upheaval. And if the U.S. attacks Afghanistan, there will be a call -- a fatwa -- for a general jihad. All borders will then disappear and it will be a no-holds-barred Islamic uprising against Israel and American imperialism. Pakistan will be engulfed in the firestorm. So I can only hope that cooler heads will prevail in Washington.
Q: What about the other U.S. demands?
A: Overflight rights are meaningless since the U.S. violates air space daily all over the world. As for intelligence sharing with ISI, you can`t even catch your own terrorists. And what ISI gives you will be of marginal value anyway.
Q: President (Pervez) Musharraf has made strong statements supporting the U.S.
A: He was my student in the army. He is a good man, but he doesn`t understand Islam. The army will never fight the masses. If push comes to shove, Musharraf will say no to the Americans rather than turn against the people. He is not just facing a handful of angry people. By his own admission, it`s 10 percent to 15 percent of the population, or at least 10 million people willing to fight. For openers, they would close the port of Karachi. A country cannot breathe without lungs.
Q: Back to Osama`s terrorist network. Who was behind the bombing of the U.S. Embassies in Tanzania and Kenya?
A: Mossad is strong in both countries. Remember the Israeli operation to free hostages in Entebbe (Uganda)? Both Kenya and Tanzania were part of the logistical tail. A so-called associate of Osama was framed at Karachi airport. The incidents took place on Aug. 8, 1999, and on the 10th a short, clean-shaven man disembarks at Karachi airport and presents the passport of a bearded man. Not your passport, he was told. He then tries to bribe the clerk with 200 rupees. A ludicrously small sum given the circumstances. The clerk says no and turns him in and he starts singing right away. Not plausible. Osama has sworn to me on the Koran it was not him and he is truthful to a fault. Pious Muslims do not kill innocent civilians who included many Muslim victims. The passport must have been switched while the man was asleep on the plane in what has all the earmarks of a Mossad operation. For 10 years, the Mujahideen fought the Soviets in Afghanistan and not a single Soviet embassy was touched anywhere in the world. So this could not have been Osama`s followers.
Q: What if bin Laden has been lying to you and is guilty. Is that inconceivable?
A: If Taliban are given irrefutable evidence of his guilt, I am in favor of a fair trial. In America, one is entitled to a jury of peers. But he has no American peers. The Taliban would not object, in the event of a prima face case, to an international Islamic court meeting in The Hague. They would turn extradite Osama to the Netherlands.
End of transcript: UPI United Press International, Sep. 26, 2001, Interview with General Gul
__________________________________________________
Reaction
[My gut feeling is soon there will be a sharp move of Pakistani immigrants from the USA to Canada (specially if there is one more terrorist attack in the US, or if the US attacks one more country). This is actually a good thing. Within fifteen to twenty years, I think the country of choice for Pakistani immigrants and students will be China. Due to this, I think Pakistan should completely throw in its lot with China, right now. Pakistan needs to become China`s Canada (or Mexico). And just ensure that relations with the US never get bad (which now they will not).]
Spoken like a true Shaheen of Iqbal!
I think it is a very opportune time for Muslims in US to shed their racist attitude towards the blacks and learn to become better muslims.It is such kind of amassing of the worse aspects of any culture which has reduced muslims to their present status.I also notice,here at chowk,a conspicous absence of some pride(gloating?)of ones Chinese,black,and arab associations & friendships.
An extra diligent effort must be made to broad-base & reinforce our Ummah ties.The masjids are a good place to start.Inviting these groups, especially the chinese & the blacks,to our homes is very very important.
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 24, 2001 02:41 am
Romair----13[My gut feeling is soon there will be a sharp move of Pakistani immigrants from the USA to Canada (specially if there is one more terrorist attack in the US, or if the US attacks one more country). This is actually a good thing. Within fifteen to twenty years, I think the country of choice for Pakistani immigrants and students will be China. Due to this, I think Pakistan should completely throw in its lot with China, right now. Pakistan needs to become China`s Canada (or Mexico). And just ensure that relations with the US never get bad (which now they will not).]
Spoken like a true Shaheen of Iqbal!
I think it is a very opportune time for Muslims in US to shed their racist attitude towards the blacks and learn to become better muslims.It is such kind of amassing of the worse aspects of any culture which has reduced muslims to their present status.I also notice,here at chowk,a conspicous absence of some pride(gloating?)of ones Chinese,black,and arab associations & friendships.
An extra diligent effort must be made to broad-base & reinforce our Ummah ties.The masjids are a good place to start.Inviting these groups, especially the chinese & the blacks,to our homes is very very important.
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 24, 2001 02:41 am
rsridhar--232you said:
[As to the massacre of Navy Seals, that is pure bull.]
Yes & it is the bull--s! which is the issue here.The fight is between the bulls.Whose bull is more fragrant is the contest.Which bull is more blood-soaked is the trophy.
It is not about ``you`re either with us or them``.It is that the sane people of the world are with neither....especially when a nod is solicited at gunpoint.
But then there is some redemption in rooting for the underdog.Only the truly independent can afford to do that ;)
PS:In case you are seeking an Indian connection let me clarify that bull/ is short for bulletin.Hence bulletins by the Pope was called the papal bull--to denigrate it & give it a double-meaning in english(& by the english).
Caste, Technology and Religious Conversions in India
When will we learn to trust our 95% people who are more intelligent & smarter than us---the english-knowers?
__________________________________________________
Published on Monday, December 17, 2001 in the Toronto Sun
Is the Gun Smoking?
`Experts` Disagree on bin Laden Home Video
by Eric Margolis
WASHINGTON -- In our media age, it was inevitable we`d finally see terrorist home videos. How long, one wonders, before they come out in DVD format?
The Osama bin Laden home video released by the U.S. last Thursday gave a fascinating look at the head of a fanatical Muslim cult receiving a visiting Saudi sheik. According to the accompanying translation from Arabic to English - made by the U.S. government and checked by two U.S.-based Arabic experts - bin Laden clearly appears to voice his culpability for the suicide attacks on New York and Washington, D.C.
In the most damning admissions, a gleeful-looking bin Laden says, ``We calculated in advance the number of casualties from (sic) the enemy who would be killed based on the position of the tower.`` And, ``We had notification since the previous Thursday that the event would take place that day.``
The U.S. government is delighted by the smoking gun tape, which was mysteriously ``found`` in Afghanistan a few days ago. The White House says the tape should dispel any lingering doubts bin Laden was behind the Sept. 11 mass killings.
But two other Arabic experts say the tape`s audio quality is so poor that almost nothing bin Laden says on it can be verified. To my ears, well accustomed to Arabic, half of bin Laden`s words were inaudible. The translation was sometimes out of sync with the action on screen. Bin Laden`s statements looked cut up and edited.
Cynics suggest the tape was a forgery made by Russian intelligence or the U.S. government, with incriminating statements spliced into an otherwise boring exchange of pleasantries between bin Laden and a visiting admirer. This is possible. In 1990, the U.S. used retouched satellite photos to convince the Saudis that Iraq was about to invade - which it was not.
A KGB PLANT?
The old Soviet KGB was extremely fond of planting fake documents to embarrass the West. Russia wants to keep George Bush`s crusade going because it takes heat off Moscow`s own brutal war in Chechnya, distracts the U.S., and earns cash IOUs from Americans.
But regardless of whether the tape is real or a fake, there remains little doubt that al-Qaida was behind the attacks on the U.S. But, as Prince Nayef, head of Saudi security observed last week, Osama bin Laden is largely a figurehead. Its real leaders, said the prince, echoing this column`s view, remain as yet unknown and are likely outside Afghanistan.
Two of al-Qaida`s leaders are in Afghanistan: its Egyptian CEO Ayman al-Zawahiri - known to all as ``the doctor`` - and his No. 2, Abu Zubaydah. They are still believed alive and in hiding with bin Laden. The late Mohammed Atef, a former Egyptian policeman, was considered the military leader of al-Qaida until he was killed by a U.S. bomb.
The roots of al-Qaida and other loosely linked anti-American organizations remain where they originated: in Egypt. Even though 15 of 19 of the hijackers on Sept. 11 were Saudis, it`s likely the operation was planned in Egypt by members of two militant groups, Egyptian Jihad and Gamma al-Islamia, with Osama bin Laden serving as a symbolic spiritual guide.
In this sense, bin Laden was re-enacting the role of the dreaded medieval head of the cult of the Hashishins, Hassan al-Sabbah, known as Sheik al-Jebel, or Old Man of the Mountain. From his lair in the Syrian mountains, the sheik`s suicide assassins, crazed on hashish and armed with poisoned daggers, terrorized much of the Muslim world and the Crusader states of the Levant. The Mongols finally stormed the sheik`s aerie, Alamut, and put a bloody end to the Hashishins, from whom we get the term ``assassin.``
Americans need no more convincing that bin Laden was behind the 9/11 attacks. Washington released the self-serving tapes to convince the many doubting Abduls of the Muslim world of bin Laden`s guilt.
Some Muslims will certainly accept the tape at face value and turn with disgust against bin Laden as a fanatical mass murderer. Few Muslims accepted his wild claims or calls for jihad against the West. But one suspects many Muslims and other Third Worlders will still believe bin Laden and his henchmen gave the United States what it deserved, payback for decades of bloody meddling in their affairs - revenge, as the tape mentioned, for the ``martyrs`` of Palestine.
Third Worlders do not always accept our western view that when states kill huge numbers of innocent civilians, c`est la vie, but when private enterprise killers strike, that`s unacceptable terrorism.
To many, the fanatical Osama bin Laden will still represent the hand of retribution against the arrogant western powers and their local satraps. New avengers will follow in his footsteps. Suicide bombers are the poor man`s version of cruise missiles, helicopter gunships, B-52s, fuel-air explosives and 15,000-lb. bombs.
Copyright © 2001, Canoe Limited Partnership
###
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 23, 2001 03:35 pm
Specially for anNy---others also welcome.When will we learn to trust our 95% people who are more intelligent & smarter than us---the english-knowers?
__________________________________________________
Published on Monday, December 17, 2001 in the Toronto Sun
Is the Gun Smoking?
`Experts` Disagree on bin Laden Home Video
by Eric Margolis
WASHINGTON -- In our media age, it was inevitable we`d finally see terrorist home videos. How long, one wonders, before they come out in DVD format?
The Osama bin Laden home video released by the U.S. last Thursday gave a fascinating look at the head of a fanatical Muslim cult receiving a visiting Saudi sheik. According to the accompanying translation from Arabic to English - made by the U.S. government and checked by two U.S.-based Arabic experts - bin Laden clearly appears to voice his culpability for the suicide attacks on New York and Washington, D.C.
In the most damning admissions, a gleeful-looking bin Laden says, ``We calculated in advance the number of casualties from (sic) the enemy who would be killed based on the position of the tower.`` And, ``We had notification since the previous Thursday that the event would take place that day.``
The U.S. government is delighted by the smoking gun tape, which was mysteriously ``found`` in Afghanistan a few days ago. The White House says the tape should dispel any lingering doubts bin Laden was behind the Sept. 11 mass killings.
But two other Arabic experts say the tape`s audio quality is so poor that almost nothing bin Laden says on it can be verified. To my ears, well accustomed to Arabic, half of bin Laden`s words were inaudible. The translation was sometimes out of sync with the action on screen. Bin Laden`s statements looked cut up and edited.
Cynics suggest the tape was a forgery made by Russian intelligence or the U.S. government, with incriminating statements spliced into an otherwise boring exchange of pleasantries between bin Laden and a visiting admirer. This is possible. In 1990, the U.S. used retouched satellite photos to convince the Saudis that Iraq was about to invade - which it was not.
A KGB PLANT?
The old Soviet KGB was extremely fond of planting fake documents to embarrass the West. Russia wants to keep George Bush`s crusade going because it takes heat off Moscow`s own brutal war in Chechnya, distracts the U.S., and earns cash IOUs from Americans.
But regardless of whether the tape is real or a fake, there remains little doubt that al-Qaida was behind the attacks on the U.S. But, as Prince Nayef, head of Saudi security observed last week, Osama bin Laden is largely a figurehead. Its real leaders, said the prince, echoing this column`s view, remain as yet unknown and are likely outside Afghanistan.
Two of al-Qaida`s leaders are in Afghanistan: its Egyptian CEO Ayman al-Zawahiri - known to all as ``the doctor`` - and his No. 2, Abu Zubaydah. They are still believed alive and in hiding with bin Laden. The late Mohammed Atef, a former Egyptian policeman, was considered the military leader of al-Qaida until he was killed by a U.S. bomb.
The roots of al-Qaida and other loosely linked anti-American organizations remain where they originated: in Egypt. Even though 15 of 19 of the hijackers on Sept. 11 were Saudis, it`s likely the operation was planned in Egypt by members of two militant groups, Egyptian Jihad and Gamma al-Islamia, with Osama bin Laden serving as a symbolic spiritual guide.
In this sense, bin Laden was re-enacting the role of the dreaded medieval head of the cult of the Hashishins, Hassan al-Sabbah, known as Sheik al-Jebel, or Old Man of the Mountain. From his lair in the Syrian mountains, the sheik`s suicide assassins, crazed on hashish and armed with poisoned daggers, terrorized much of the Muslim world and the Crusader states of the Levant. The Mongols finally stormed the sheik`s aerie, Alamut, and put a bloody end to the Hashishins, from whom we get the term ``assassin.``
Americans need no more convincing that bin Laden was behind the 9/11 attacks. Washington released the self-serving tapes to convince the many doubting Abduls of the Muslim world of bin Laden`s guilt.
Some Muslims will certainly accept the tape at face value and turn with disgust against bin Laden as a fanatical mass murderer. Few Muslims accepted his wild claims or calls for jihad against the West. But one suspects many Muslims and other Third Worlders will still believe bin Laden and his henchmen gave the United States what it deserved, payback for decades of bloody meddling in their affairs - revenge, as the tape mentioned, for the ``martyrs`` of Palestine.
Third Worlders do not always accept our western view that when states kill huge numbers of innocent civilians, c`est la vie, but when private enterprise killers strike, that`s unacceptable terrorism.
To many, the fanatical Osama bin Laden will still represent the hand of retribution against the arrogant western powers and their local satraps. New avengers will follow in his footsteps. Suicide bombers are the poor man`s version of cruise missiles, helicopter gunships, B-52s, fuel-air explosives and 15,000-lb. bombs.
Copyright © 2001, Canoe Limited Partnership
###
Caste, Technology and Religious Conversions in India
__________________________________________________
ON THE SUBJECT OF ``HATE SPEECH`` AND ``ANTI-SEMITISM``.
(Is Amr bil maaroof & Nihi unl Munkir becoming the order of the day---rejoice muslims,you`ve friends everywhere)
__________________________________________________
In the wake of the revelation of yet another spy scandal involving the Mossad, involving the arrests of the largest spy ring ever uncovered inside the United States, and the existence of a huge system that allowed Israel to track telephone calls by media, politicians, law enforcement, indeed all Americans, as well as the means to eavesdrop on actual calls by using the wiretapping system built into the telephone system by an Israeli owned company, any and all reports of this scandal have been met with the charges of ``hate speech`` and ``anti-Semite``.
These phrases, ``hate speech`` and ``anti-Semite``, are well-worn devices to shut up a critic of Israel without having to answer the criticisms. Indeed they have been used so much that they have become red warning flags that the person using those phrases has something to hide and needs to shut down the discussion by any means possible. By screaming ``hate speech`` or ``anti-Semite``, the debate is over without actually examining the issues involved.
I`ve run this web site for over 8 years. You can check through the pre 9/11 version of What Really Happened for yourself to see if I have had any excessive preoccupation with Israel during that time. Only in recent weeks have I even mentioned Israel, and that solely because the ACTIONS of the government of Israel have called attention to Israel. In the wake of the spy arrests this is a story that people do need to know about, to know who else may be listening when that phone is picked up, if the phone tapping system was actually paid for with the money we send Israel every year, to know what intelligence service may be blackmailing our government and media, and to what purpose.
So, I`ve been getting a lot of email from people who ask ``Why do you hate the Jews``? The answer is that I don`t hate the Jews. I know a lot of Jews and count as my friends the ones who are as respectful of me as I am of them. My first wife was Jewish, which should erase once and for all that I came with any built in bias regarding the Jewish people.
What I hate are the actions of INDIVIDUALS. I hate the idea of someone spying on our nation`s citizens. I don`t like our own government to do it; why should I be any less opposed to a foreign government doing it? Why is it not reasonable to hate those who pry into our government, then use the information to coerce that government into actions contrary to the good of our own people? I hate that sort of behavior. All civilized people should. I would hate the perperators of the spy ring and the phone taping scandal if they were Russian, British, Lithuanian, Brazilian, whatever. That`s a perfectly normal response to this crime.
Hate gets a bum rap. In our politically correct society we are taught that it`s bad to hate at all, but I disagree. Hate can be a good thing. There are lots of things I hate and I am not ashamed to admit it. I hate liars. I hate thieves. I hate drug dealers. I hate corrupt politicians. I hate child molesters. These are hates that are good for the people to have. Maybe if more people allowed themselves to hate liars, thieves, druggies, and the corrupt, our nation wouldn`t be in the mess it`s in. Think about that for a while. Hate could actually save our country.
I hate those who presume to decide for us what we can and cannot see, hear, or read. I am firmly opposed to and have openly defied efforts by our own government to withhold from the people information the people need to make good decisions with. When the Israeli lobby coerces Fox News to erase the story about Israel`s spy ring, should I be less outraged at the concealment simply because the concealers are Israeli? To NOT speak out about a crime because the perpetrators are Israeli would be racist. Because this is EXACTLY what we are dealing with. Crimes. Espionage. Illegal wiretaps. Interference with investigations. Under the definitions in the USA Patriot bill, the coercion of Fox News to drop the espionage story is itself (technically) an act of terror.
Speaking of racism, the ideal held forth in the Constitution and Declaration of Independence is that no one race is superior to others; that no one race should rule by virtue of being a specific race. We even fought a civil war partly on that principle, and while the United States has not always lived up to that ideal, we have never surrendered it as our goal. So, when Arial Sharon openly bragged on October 3rd that, ``We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it``, why should I not find this statement objectionable, and anti-American? Why should I not feel something less than affection for the man who made that statement? Why should a reasonable citizen of this nation not wonder to what extent Sharon was speaking the truth, especially in light of the manner in which Fox News was forced to erase the Carl Cameron stories?
As seen in the subtitle above, the truth is ``hate speech`` only to those with something to hide. In the wake of the exposure of this latest spy scandal, the government of Israel might have expressed some public regret or shame over treating its purported friend, from whom it gets more foreign aid than is given to the entire continent of Africa, in such a shameful manner. Instead what we have seen is censorship of the American news by a foreign power, apparently with the permission of a compromised or complicit US Government, and the shrill cries of ``hate speech`` and ``anti-Semite`` hurled at anyone who dared presume to notice or comment on what Israel has been caught doing.
If you want to know why Israel is so much in the news it isn`t because of ``hate`` and it isn`t because of ``anti-Semitism``, it`s because foreign owned companies were caught bugging the phone system (including that of the White House) and foreign citizens have been arrested as part of the largest spy ring ever found in the United States. That is NEWS, no matter what nationality is involved. In the course of that reporting, it was revealed by a US official that evidence exists linking 9/11 to persons other than Muslim Arabs, but that this evidence is CLASSIFIED. That too is NEWS. Deal with it.
The good side to the Fox News incident is that for the first time, Americans got a good look at just how much power and influence over what we see and hear is being exercised. It doesn`t even matter who did it; that it was done at all is the lesson for our time.
And it is not ``hate`` to point that fact out.
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 23, 2001 03:35 pm
WORTH READING& SPREADING.__________________________________________________
ON THE SUBJECT OF ``HATE SPEECH`` AND ``ANTI-SEMITISM``.
(Is Amr bil maaroof & Nihi unl Munkir becoming the order of the day---rejoice muslims,you`ve friends everywhere)
__________________________________________________
In the wake of the revelation of yet another spy scandal involving the Mossad, involving the arrests of the largest spy ring ever uncovered inside the United States, and the existence of a huge system that allowed Israel to track telephone calls by media, politicians, law enforcement, indeed all Americans, as well as the means to eavesdrop on actual calls by using the wiretapping system built into the telephone system by an Israeli owned company, any and all reports of this scandal have been met with the charges of ``hate speech`` and ``anti-Semite``.
These phrases, ``hate speech`` and ``anti-Semite``, are well-worn devices to shut up a critic of Israel without having to answer the criticisms. Indeed they have been used so much that they have become red warning flags that the person using those phrases has something to hide and needs to shut down the discussion by any means possible. By screaming ``hate speech`` or ``anti-Semite``, the debate is over without actually examining the issues involved.
I`ve run this web site for over 8 years. You can check through the pre 9/11 version of What Really Happened for yourself to see if I have had any excessive preoccupation with Israel during that time. Only in recent weeks have I even mentioned Israel, and that solely because the ACTIONS of the government of Israel have called attention to Israel. In the wake of the spy arrests this is a story that people do need to know about, to know who else may be listening when that phone is picked up, if the phone tapping system was actually paid for with the money we send Israel every year, to know what intelligence service may be blackmailing our government and media, and to what purpose.
So, I`ve been getting a lot of email from people who ask ``Why do you hate the Jews``? The answer is that I don`t hate the Jews. I know a lot of Jews and count as my friends the ones who are as respectful of me as I am of them. My first wife was Jewish, which should erase once and for all that I came with any built in bias regarding the Jewish people.
What I hate are the actions of INDIVIDUALS. I hate the idea of someone spying on our nation`s citizens. I don`t like our own government to do it; why should I be any less opposed to a foreign government doing it? Why is it not reasonable to hate those who pry into our government, then use the information to coerce that government into actions contrary to the good of our own people? I hate that sort of behavior. All civilized people should. I would hate the perperators of the spy ring and the phone taping scandal if they were Russian, British, Lithuanian, Brazilian, whatever. That`s a perfectly normal response to this crime.
Hate gets a bum rap. In our politically correct society we are taught that it`s bad to hate at all, but I disagree. Hate can be a good thing. There are lots of things I hate and I am not ashamed to admit it. I hate liars. I hate thieves. I hate drug dealers. I hate corrupt politicians. I hate child molesters. These are hates that are good for the people to have. Maybe if more people allowed themselves to hate liars, thieves, druggies, and the corrupt, our nation wouldn`t be in the mess it`s in. Think about that for a while. Hate could actually save our country.
I hate those who presume to decide for us what we can and cannot see, hear, or read. I am firmly opposed to and have openly defied efforts by our own government to withhold from the people information the people need to make good decisions with. When the Israeli lobby coerces Fox News to erase the story about Israel`s spy ring, should I be less outraged at the concealment simply because the concealers are Israeli? To NOT speak out about a crime because the perpetrators are Israeli would be racist. Because this is EXACTLY what we are dealing with. Crimes. Espionage. Illegal wiretaps. Interference with investigations. Under the definitions in the USA Patriot bill, the coercion of Fox News to drop the espionage story is itself (technically) an act of terror.
Speaking of racism, the ideal held forth in the Constitution and Declaration of Independence is that no one race is superior to others; that no one race should rule by virtue of being a specific race. We even fought a civil war partly on that principle, and while the United States has not always lived up to that ideal, we have never surrendered it as our goal. So, when Arial Sharon openly bragged on October 3rd that, ``We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it``, why should I not find this statement objectionable, and anti-American? Why should I not feel something less than affection for the man who made that statement? Why should a reasonable citizen of this nation not wonder to what extent Sharon was speaking the truth, especially in light of the manner in which Fox News was forced to erase the Carl Cameron stories?
As seen in the subtitle above, the truth is ``hate speech`` only to those with something to hide. In the wake of the exposure of this latest spy scandal, the government of Israel might have expressed some public regret or shame over treating its purported friend, from whom it gets more foreign aid than is given to the entire continent of Africa, in such a shameful manner. Instead what we have seen is censorship of the American news by a foreign power, apparently with the permission of a compromised or complicit US Government, and the shrill cries of ``hate speech`` and ``anti-Semite`` hurled at anyone who dared presume to notice or comment on what Israel has been caught doing.
If you want to know why Israel is so much in the news it isn`t because of ``hate`` and it isn`t because of ``anti-Semitism``, it`s because foreign owned companies were caught bugging the phone system (including that of the White House) and foreign citizens have been arrested as part of the largest spy ring ever found in the United States. That is NEWS, no matter what nationality is involved. In the course of that reporting, it was revealed by a US official that evidence exists linking 9/11 to persons other than Muslim Arabs, but that this evidence is CLASSIFIED. That too is NEWS. Deal with it.
The good side to the Fox News incident is that for the first time, Americans got a good look at just how much power and influence over what we see and hear is being exercised. It doesn`t even matter who did it; that it was done at all is the lesson for our time.
And it is not ``hate`` to point that fact out.
The Taste of this Eid
Thank you for transporting us back home.When all the six senses dress up in word-costumes--they are called poetry.This was!
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 22, 2001 10:32 pm
Bina Shah:Thank you for transporting us back home.When all the six senses dress up in word-costumes--they are called poetry.This was!
Caste, Technology and Religious Conversions in India
The ONLY true learning is that of Language & its use .Just as numbers & the techniques to use them is the basis of ALL science.
Now what to read must be left to the individual.No government should ever prescribe or proscribe reading material as syllabii or curriculum.This is the curse of the modern times that vocations & skills(with their attendant monetary & authoritative power--or lack thereof) is being mistaken as knowledge/.When Commmisioners & Generals(&their minions) start presiding at mushairaas & mosques the one can safely predict that rot has set in a society.
__________________________________________________
The art of words & the science of numbers is the only knowledge/ there is to pursue.Anything other than that is just education/.
__________________________________________________
I`ve not read any Tolkeins` work,nor have I seen the movie as yet.I do pay a lot of attention to the script & dialogue of any movie or tvshow--even,the phlebian kind,and I must say that these folks go unsung most of the time.It is very sad that action(because of ADD these days),gaudy sets,and special effects have robbed the true worth of most productions.
You`ll be amazed how much effort the writers put into the scripts.
Yes it is the same Golem.
__________________________________________________
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 22, 2001 02:47 pm
Ansari--6The ONLY true learning is that of Language & its use .Just as numbers & the techniques to use them is the basis of ALL science.
Now what to read must be left to the individual.No government should ever prescribe or proscribe reading material as syllabii or curriculum.This is the curse of the modern times that vocations & skills(with their attendant monetary & authoritative power--or lack thereof) is being mistaken as knowledge/.When Commmisioners & Generals(&their minions) start presiding at mushairaas & mosques the one can safely predict that rot has set in a society.
__________________________________________________
The art of words & the science of numbers is the only knowledge/ there is to pursue.Anything other than that is just education/.
__________________________________________________
I`ve not read any Tolkeins` work,nor have I seen the movie as yet.I do pay a lot of attention to the script & dialogue of any movie or tvshow--even,the phlebian kind,and I must say that these folks go unsung most of the time.It is very sad that action(because of ADD these days),gaudy sets,and special effects have robbed the true worth of most productions.
You`ll be amazed how much effort the writers put into the scripts.
Yes it is the same Golem.
__________________________________________________
Caste, Technology and Religious Conversions in India
[Hamzad Mian,
Your ``information`` and your ``knowledge`` never ceases to astonish me.
Have you ever been to the Middle East?]
__________________________________________________
I write a simple post without rancour or bile,for a change(;0) & now you confound me by putting quotation marks on /information & /knowledge .
Please provide context to what you said.
_________________________________.
What I ``understand`` is that you are perhaps referring to the way the third worlders are treated by the locals.Such `treatment` is also meted out to the Russians & East Europeans in Israel.
But this is an entirely different phenomenon & is NOT rooted in racism.
__________________________________________________
I`ve been to the middle-east & Israel--but as a tourist only.Speaking their language & dressing like them opens up a whole different world.The dollar-donkeys from Indo-Pak mistakenly think that by their Zero-level english they might pass themselves as brown-goraas(HA HA HA).The contempt for such kind is awaited wherever pride & honour are still considered virtues.
.
The Sabath practices I mentioned are as observed in the western world.
__________________________________________________
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 22, 2001 01:00 pm
Prem---4[Hamzad Mian,
Your ``information`` and your ``knowledge`` never ceases to astonish me.
Have you ever been to the Middle East?]
__________________________________________________
I write a simple post without rancour or bile,for a change(;0) & now you confound me by putting quotation marks on /information & /knowledge .
Please provide context to what you said.
_________________________________.
What I ``understand`` is that you are perhaps referring to the way the third worlders are treated by the locals.Such `treatment` is also meted out to the Russians & East Europeans in Israel.
But this is an entirely different phenomenon & is NOT rooted in racism.
__________________________________________________
I`ve been to the middle-east & Israel--but as a tourist only.Speaking their language & dressing like them opens up a whole different world.The dollar-donkeys from Indo-Pak mistakenly think that by their Zero-level english they might pass themselves as brown-goraas(HA HA HA).The contempt for such kind is awaited wherever pride & honour are still considered virtues.
.
The Sabath practices I mentioned are as observed in the western world.
__________________________________________________
Muslims and The West After 11th September
No my friend,I`m not under any illusions at all.
The Pakistani `geadership`(sic) with all its delusions about being `modern`,advanced` & `liberal` blah blah is getting back what it deserves--& should get even more!
If Indians are being welcomed by God-fearing practising muslims of Afghanistan then there must be some merit in it & the Indians must have earned it.Why a good Indian should not be preffered to a debauched & munafique Pakistani Muslim?
``Muslim aaeen hua kaffir tO milay hoor O qusoor``?
---- meaning:If a kaafir adopts the tenets of Islam(in the secular sense) then the rewards are there for him too--- a la Qura`an.This is not only good theory but we see the manifestation of it in our daily observations.
Maka`faat e amul is there for every one to see.One can never run away from the Truth until some toll is paid at the turnpikes.Wearing suit & tie,being invited to the masters` house(white),and pretending to be export material demeans not only the geader(sic) but also the nation.
Unless Pakistanis free occupied Pakistan(by its army,bureaucracy,& westernised elite)they have no right to talk about freedom of anykind anywhere.
__________________________________________________
Your anguish & mine and that of so many on chowk is no different except that the currencies of conversations have become devalued by alien interferences.
Sometimes I picture ourselves like the elephant seals(walruses?),blubber full,soaking the sun & water on the beach,making gurgling threatening trumpet-calls,dragging ourselves awkwardly only to pile-up on each other...and then everything is the same again.
What else we have to do?
__________________________________________________
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 22, 2001 01:00 pm
sigalph235---557No my friend,I`m not under any illusions at all.
The Pakistani `geadership`(sic) with all its delusions about being `modern`,advanced` & `liberal` blah blah is getting back what it deserves--& should get even more!
If Indians are being welcomed by God-fearing practising muslims of Afghanistan then there must be some merit in it & the Indians must have earned it.Why a good Indian should not be preffered to a debauched & munafique Pakistani Muslim?
``Muslim aaeen hua kaffir tO milay hoor O qusoor``?
---- meaning:If a kaafir adopts the tenets of Islam(in the secular sense) then the rewards are there for him too--- a la Qura`an.This is not only good theory but we see the manifestation of it in our daily observations.
Maka`faat e amul is there for every one to see.One can never run away from the Truth until some toll is paid at the turnpikes.Wearing suit & tie,being invited to the masters` house(white),and pretending to be export material demeans not only the geader(sic) but also the nation.
Unless Pakistanis free occupied Pakistan(by its army,bureaucracy,& westernised elite)they have no right to talk about freedom of anykind anywhere.
__________________________________________________
Your anguish & mine and that of so many on chowk is no different except that the currencies of conversations have become devalued by alien interferences.
Sometimes I picture ourselves like the elephant seals(walruses?),blubber full,soaking the sun & water on the beach,making gurgling threatening trumpet-calls,dragging ourselves awkwardly only to pile-up on each other...and then everything is the same again.
What else we have to do?
__________________________________________________
Caste, Technology and Religious Conversions in India
I have a few basic questions:
1)Varna means colour,does it not.Then is the division not based on race,originally?How comw most brahmins are of fair complexion.How & when did the dark coloured brahmins start getting accepted?
2)I have a sneaking suspicion that the Brahmins have a Hebrew(not Judaic/bani-Islraeli!) origin.The western race-oriented ethos derives its ethos from the old testament(Ham,the son of Noah,& progeny,was cursed to serve Sam,semites,--& his progeny-- at the time of division of the Earth after the Flood).As most of us are aware Jews look down upon menial & manual work even today.Their idea of bliss is centered upon the concept of /Golem (origin of the word Ghulam in arabic).This mythical creature was a pre-historic Robot who was always at the Hebrews command to perform menial tasks.Manual Work,the hebrews think/thought was a curse & a punishment to Man by God for his infraction.
Even today the Jewish idea of observing Sabath,among other rituals,is not to do manual work.So much so that pushing any button is work.It is observed very diligently throughout the `civilised` world by a majority.Elevators & crosswalks are pre-programmed from friday to saturday dusk to move at stop/start each floor so the jews do not have to push any buttons.
______________________________.
The clear-cut absence of racism & egalitarianism west of Hindu-Kush & throughout muslim lands speaks volumes to us.Among muslims of Indian origins this diabolical practise has manage to cling under various traditions,practices,& ceremonies---especially in the Punjab.May Allah steer us on to the right path and guide us to put into practice the eternally `modern` message for all mankind.
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 22, 2001 12:37 am
An excellent article Anil.I have a few basic questions:
1)Varna means colour,does it not.Then is the division not based on race,originally?How comw most brahmins are of fair complexion.How & when did the dark coloured brahmins start getting accepted?
2)I have a sneaking suspicion that the Brahmins have a Hebrew(not Judaic/bani-Islraeli!) origin.The western race-oriented ethos derives its ethos from the old testament(Ham,the son of Noah,& progeny,was cursed to serve Sam,semites,--& his progeny-- at the time of division of the Earth after the Flood).As most of us are aware Jews look down upon menial & manual work even today.Their idea of bliss is centered upon the concept of /Golem (origin of the word Ghulam in arabic).This mythical creature was a pre-historic Robot who was always at the Hebrews command to perform menial tasks.Manual Work,the hebrews think/thought was a curse & a punishment to Man by God for his infraction.
Even today the Jewish idea of observing Sabath,among other rituals,is not to do manual work.So much so that pushing any button is work.It is observed very diligently throughout the `civilised` world by a majority.Elevators & crosswalks are pre-programmed from friday to saturday dusk to move at stop/start each floor so the jews do not have to push any buttons.
______________________________.
The clear-cut absence of racism & egalitarianism west of Hindu-Kush & throughout muslim lands speaks volumes to us.Among muslims of Indian origins this diabolical practise has manage to cling under various traditions,practices,& ceremonies---especially in the Punjab.May Allah steer us on to the right path and guide us to put into practice the eternally `modern` message for all mankind.
Muslims and The West After 11th September
But then there are others who do bring news--Good News too!
ENJOY!
__________________________________________________
BREAKING NEWS: BIG EXPLOSION IN MAZAR-E-SHARIF, 100s OF NORTHERN ALLIANCE MILITIA DEAD
There has been a big explosion in Mazar-e-Sharif, which has reportedly killed hundreds of General Dostum’s Northern Alliance militia. The exact number of dead has not been confirmed yet, but according to reliable sources they number in their hundreds with countless more injured. It is being assumed that this incredible operation was carried out by Taliban special forces. This fearsome attack on General Dostum`s stronghold, which has been the center of US terrorist activities, clearly marks the capability of the Taliban forces. This attack also verifies the utter falsity of the claims by the disbelievers who are continually stating that the Taliban have been defeated and that they are being routed. Rather, the reality of the situation is that the US led coalition are being hunted down by the Taliban.
NORTHERN ALLIANCE FORCES BUTCHER US AND UK SPECIAL FORCES IN KABUL
According to the latest reports, Northern Alliance forces have revolted against their American masters in Kabul. Reports state that the streets of Kabul have been littered with many US and UK special forces and personnel. Kabul is currently controlled by the Northern Alliance faction led by General Fahim, which is being backed by Russia. They had gained control of Kabul after the Talibans` peaceful withdrawal from the city. This revolt comes in the face of the oath taking ceremony of the American administered puppet government, which was bound to take place on the 22nd of December. Northern Alliance militia had been commanded by the puppet Prime Minister and American agent, Hamid Kirzai, to leave Kabul. This was a key part of the American plan to get the influence and power of the Northern Alliance out of Kabul and to install a CIA administered puppet government by the 22nd of December, backed by the so called international ‘peackeeping’ forces. In an unexpected and sweeping move, the Northern Alliance turned on its masters and savagely butchered a large number American and British forces present in the city. The exact number of US and UK casualties is yet to be confirmed.
TALIBAN REGAIN CONTROL FROM SPIN-BOLDAK TO TAKHTAPUL - GUL AGHA`S MERCENARIES ON THE RUN
It has been confirmed that Taliban forces have recaptured Takhtapul. They initiated their attack on the 19th of December and consequently regained complete control from Takhtapul to the border town of Spin-Boldak. Most of the American agent Gul Agha`s ragtag army has been routed from the area and a large number have deserted. Gul Agha`s forces mainly comprise of drug addicts and paedophiles. These people are so unpredictable that Gul Agha remains under the security of 50 US commandos all the time.
In an interview with the BBC Radio Service this week, Taliban official Mullah Abdur-Razzaq said that the Taliban forces are capable of regaining control of Afghanistan at their own accord and would only require 15 days at the most to do this. Every day that passes, Taliban forces are getting more organized and strong as their detachments are making way back to the south from the northern areas. (Kunduz, Mazar-e-Sharif, Takhar etc.)
100s of US SOLDIERS CONFIRMED DEAD AT JACOBABAD AIRBASE.
There will be no Christmas cheering for the 100s of famlies of US servicemen, whose mutilated charred bodies remain littered around Jacobabad’s airbase, accompanied with the most horrid stench. Reports have come in that the Americans have been supplied with truck loads of wooden planks to make coffins for their dead in Jacobabad. It must be pointed out that the American Government is not just lying to the whole world but also to its own people, whose sons have been butchered in the deserts and mountains of Afghanistan by the Mujahideen. The worst part is that these poor families in particular and the American public in general have been kept in total darkness about American casualties throughout this war. So many more American lives will be lost in vain for Bush`s terrorist campaign. So many American mothers will be left without their beloved sons for a war that is being fought for and bankrolled by the Zionist Jews. American families will suffer in the end and a defeated Bush Jr. will simply go back to his business, with his own family alive and well.
DESPITE SOPHISTICATED EQUIPMENT, US MILITARY INTELLIGENCE FAILS TO LOCATE USAMA BIN LADIN
KANDAHAR (Internet News): American Intelligence has failed to find Usama bin Ladin and have not succeeded in obtaining even a clue about his whereabouts after interrogating imprisoned Arab Mujahideen. At the completion of search operations for Usama bin Ladin and his companions in the Tora Bora mountains, the defence minister of the puppet government, Muhammad Faheem, stated that Usama Bin Ladin along with some of his companion had apparently left Afghanistan. The American Intelligence agencies have said that the arrested Al-Qaida members have told them nothing about Usama Bin Ladin or Ameer-ul-Mumineen. As a result of this it is thought that Usama Bin Ladin was not present in this region in the first place.Analysts say that US bombing together with their use of the latest sattelite based tracknig equipment have all failed in trying to find Usama Bin Ladin.
ARRESTED MUJAHIDEEN KNOW NOTHING ABOUT WHEREABOUTS OF AMEER-UL-MUMINEEN OR USAMA BIN LADIN
KANDAHAR (Islam News/Radio Report): The Northern Alliance have handed over two important Taliban leaders to America. According to details the vice minister of defence for the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan, Mulla Fazal, who had been arrested one month ago by General Dostum, broke an agreement with Mulla Fazal and arrested him along with thousands of his men. They were then handed over to US forces, whilst vice president of Taliban intelligence, Mulla Abdul Haq Waseeq, has handed to over to US forces by General Faheem. Mullah Abdul Haq Waseeq was betrayed by local commanders who handed him over to General Faheem, for the millions of US dollars promised to them by US forces. The US authorities have confirmed that Mulla Fazal and Mulla Waseeq have been shifted to the new American prison in Kandahar along with 15 Taliban and Al- Qaida members. This prison has been built at Kandahar airport. According to American authorities an eight member FBI team has reached Kandahar where they will interrogate these members about Ameer-ul-Mumineen and Usama Bin Ladin.
A very close companion to Ameer-ul-Mumineen informed Daily Islam’s correspondent by satellite phone from an undisclosed location that the US investigating team will not be successful in this interrogation with these members. He further added that Mulla Fazal had been in North Afghanistan for more than a month and he was unaware of Usama Bin Ladin and Ameer-ul- Mumineen’s whereabouts. As far as Mulla Waseeq is concerned, then he was primarily attached to the Department of Intelligence in Kabul and was never involved in planning activities or movements of Ameer-ul-Muminee. He added that Mulla Umar is safe and Insha-Allaah the Americans will never find or capture him. He added that even Mulla Umar’s close companions do not know where he is, so what help will Mulla Waseeq be?
WESTERN JOURNALISTS FAIL TO GET STATEMENTS FROM RESIDENTS OF KANDAHAR OF THEIR OWN WILL
KANDAHAR (Islam News): Nowadays more than 70 journalists are seen roaming the streets of Kandahar and they are interested in reporting anti- Taliban comments from the people, young and old. Accoridng to one of the journalists, most of the number of old people who have been questioned about the period of Taliban rule, have termed it as being the most peaceful time where their wealth and lives were protected and safe. Furthermore, the people seeminly denied the fact that Hamid Karzai could implement peace and justice in their land. After hearing all this, the journalists got into their cars and left disappointed. Hence, anything broadcasted on the international media always show anti-Taliban rhetoric and we advise the Muslims to boycott all of these media outlets, for witholding the truth and propogating falsehood is a major weapon always used to demoralise the Muslims. Will then the Muslims take heed of this?
__________________________________________________
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 21, 2001 06:54 pm
CNN---Certainly Not News.But then there are others who do bring news--Good News too!
ENJOY!
__________________________________________________
BREAKING NEWS: BIG EXPLOSION IN MAZAR-E-SHARIF, 100s OF NORTHERN ALLIANCE MILITIA DEAD
There has been a big explosion in Mazar-e-Sharif, which has reportedly killed hundreds of General Dostum’s Northern Alliance militia. The exact number of dead has not been confirmed yet, but according to reliable sources they number in their hundreds with countless more injured. It is being assumed that this incredible operation was carried out by Taliban special forces. This fearsome attack on General Dostum`s stronghold, which has been the center of US terrorist activities, clearly marks the capability of the Taliban forces. This attack also verifies the utter falsity of the claims by the disbelievers who are continually stating that the Taliban have been defeated and that they are being routed. Rather, the reality of the situation is that the US led coalition are being hunted down by the Taliban.
NORTHERN ALLIANCE FORCES BUTCHER US AND UK SPECIAL FORCES IN KABUL
According to the latest reports, Northern Alliance forces have revolted against their American masters in Kabul. Reports state that the streets of Kabul have been littered with many US and UK special forces and personnel. Kabul is currently controlled by the Northern Alliance faction led by General Fahim, which is being backed by Russia. They had gained control of Kabul after the Talibans` peaceful withdrawal from the city. This revolt comes in the face of the oath taking ceremony of the American administered puppet government, which was bound to take place on the 22nd of December. Northern Alliance militia had been commanded by the puppet Prime Minister and American agent, Hamid Kirzai, to leave Kabul. This was a key part of the American plan to get the influence and power of the Northern Alliance out of Kabul and to install a CIA administered puppet government by the 22nd of December, backed by the so called international ‘peackeeping’ forces. In an unexpected and sweeping move, the Northern Alliance turned on its masters and savagely butchered a large number American and British forces present in the city. The exact number of US and UK casualties is yet to be confirmed.
TALIBAN REGAIN CONTROL FROM SPIN-BOLDAK TO TAKHTAPUL - GUL AGHA`S MERCENARIES ON THE RUN
It has been confirmed that Taliban forces have recaptured Takhtapul. They initiated their attack on the 19th of December and consequently regained complete control from Takhtapul to the border town of Spin-Boldak. Most of the American agent Gul Agha`s ragtag army has been routed from the area and a large number have deserted. Gul Agha`s forces mainly comprise of drug addicts and paedophiles. These people are so unpredictable that Gul Agha remains under the security of 50 US commandos all the time.
In an interview with the BBC Radio Service this week, Taliban official Mullah Abdur-Razzaq said that the Taliban forces are capable of regaining control of Afghanistan at their own accord and would only require 15 days at the most to do this. Every day that passes, Taliban forces are getting more organized and strong as their detachments are making way back to the south from the northern areas. (Kunduz, Mazar-e-Sharif, Takhar etc.)
100s of US SOLDIERS CONFIRMED DEAD AT JACOBABAD AIRBASE.
There will be no Christmas cheering for the 100s of famlies of US servicemen, whose mutilated charred bodies remain littered around Jacobabad’s airbase, accompanied with the most horrid stench. Reports have come in that the Americans have been supplied with truck loads of wooden planks to make coffins for their dead in Jacobabad. It must be pointed out that the American Government is not just lying to the whole world but also to its own people, whose sons have been butchered in the deserts and mountains of Afghanistan by the Mujahideen. The worst part is that these poor families in particular and the American public in general have been kept in total darkness about American casualties throughout this war. So many more American lives will be lost in vain for Bush`s terrorist campaign. So many American mothers will be left without their beloved sons for a war that is being fought for and bankrolled by the Zionist Jews. American families will suffer in the end and a defeated Bush Jr. will simply go back to his business, with his own family alive and well.
DESPITE SOPHISTICATED EQUIPMENT, US MILITARY INTELLIGENCE FAILS TO LOCATE USAMA BIN LADIN
KANDAHAR (Internet News): American Intelligence has failed to find Usama bin Ladin and have not succeeded in obtaining even a clue about his whereabouts after interrogating imprisoned Arab Mujahideen. At the completion of search operations for Usama bin Ladin and his companions in the Tora Bora mountains, the defence minister of the puppet government, Muhammad Faheem, stated that Usama Bin Ladin along with some of his companion had apparently left Afghanistan. The American Intelligence agencies have said that the arrested Al-Qaida members have told them nothing about Usama Bin Ladin or Ameer-ul-Mumineen. As a result of this it is thought that Usama Bin Ladin was not present in this region in the first place.Analysts say that US bombing together with their use of the latest sattelite based tracknig equipment have all failed in trying to find Usama Bin Ladin.
ARRESTED MUJAHIDEEN KNOW NOTHING ABOUT WHEREABOUTS OF AMEER-UL-MUMINEEN OR USAMA BIN LADIN
KANDAHAR (Islam News/Radio Report): The Northern Alliance have handed over two important Taliban leaders to America. According to details the vice minister of defence for the Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan, Mulla Fazal, who had been arrested one month ago by General Dostum, broke an agreement with Mulla Fazal and arrested him along with thousands of his men. They were then handed over to US forces, whilst vice president of Taliban intelligence, Mulla Abdul Haq Waseeq, has handed to over to US forces by General Faheem. Mullah Abdul Haq Waseeq was betrayed by local commanders who handed him over to General Faheem, for the millions of US dollars promised to them by US forces. The US authorities have confirmed that Mulla Fazal and Mulla Waseeq have been shifted to the new American prison in Kandahar along with 15 Taliban and Al- Qaida members. This prison has been built at Kandahar airport. According to American authorities an eight member FBI team has reached Kandahar where they will interrogate these members about Ameer-ul-Mumineen and Usama Bin Ladin.
A very close companion to Ameer-ul-Mumineen informed Daily Islam’s correspondent by satellite phone from an undisclosed location that the US investigating team will not be successful in this interrogation with these members. He further added that Mulla Fazal had been in North Afghanistan for more than a month and he was unaware of Usama Bin Ladin and Ameer-ul- Mumineen’s whereabouts. As far as Mulla Waseeq is concerned, then he was primarily attached to the Department of Intelligence in Kabul and was never involved in planning activities or movements of Ameer-ul-Muminee. He added that Mulla Umar is safe and Insha-Allaah the Americans will never find or capture him. He added that even Mulla Umar’s close companions do not know where he is, so what help will Mulla Waseeq be?
WESTERN JOURNALISTS FAIL TO GET STATEMENTS FROM RESIDENTS OF KANDAHAR OF THEIR OWN WILL
KANDAHAR (Islam News): Nowadays more than 70 journalists are seen roaming the streets of Kandahar and they are interested in reporting anti- Taliban comments from the people, young and old. Accoridng to one of the journalists, most of the number of old people who have been questioned about the period of Taliban rule, have termed it as being the most peaceful time where their wealth and lives were protected and safe. Furthermore, the people seeminly denied the fact that Hamid Karzai could implement peace and justice in their land. After hearing all this, the journalists got into their cars and left disappointed. Hence, anything broadcasted on the international media always show anti-Taliban rhetoric and we advise the Muslims to boycott all of these media outlets, for witholding the truth and propogating falsehood is a major weapon always used to demoralise the Muslims. Will then the Muslims take heed of this?
__________________________________________________
The Passion of The Pacifist
Like the Roman Catholic church they are constantly trying to convince others that given enough gallup-polling the church will fine-tune itself to the Satanic religion of Secular Humanism.
These witch doctors want to practice medicine & insist that the rules of the medical establishment are too rigid to be accomodate these innovative methods.If Asghar Ali Engineer wants to acquire some learning he must enrol at some reputable madrassah & sit at the feet(very humbly,mind you)of some maulana [they speak read & write better english,french,german--can explain science better than hawkins AND know more than any Harvard/Cambridge type).In case the poor fellow is deluded that most people who follow Maulana Tahir Saifuddin are stupid or ``common folk``,he is sadly mistaken.It is just that they write him off even when they take a look at such secularistic bimbaas.
Such as his kind appeal to a dwindling ``uneducated`` contituency which for one reason or another want legitimacy of a fatwa for letting their kids drink,date,fornicate,appear foreign at home,be homos,spurn eastern superior values for inferior western ones & not adopt superior western values.
If they get rejected & ostracised by their community community it does not mean that because of this persecution complex he is right----so many illegals get deported from US but they themselves have to be blamed.ASghar Ali(& his ilk) must be treated with the same contempt as that for an illegal alien.
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 21, 2001 01:17 am
Bufoons like Asghar Ali Engineer are a dime a dozen.These are the unqualified,uneducated,street people who are mistaken for having acquired some learning simply because they are making every effort to mould themselves into western norms & practices.Like the Roman Catholic church they are constantly trying to convince others that given enough gallup-polling the church will fine-tune itself to the Satanic religion of Secular Humanism.
These witch doctors want to practice medicine & insist that the rules of the medical establishment are too rigid to be accomodate these innovative methods.If Asghar Ali Engineer wants to acquire some learning he must enrol at some reputable madrassah & sit at the feet(very humbly,mind you)of some maulana [they speak read & write better english,french,german--can explain science better than hawkins AND know more than any Harvard/Cambridge type).In case the poor fellow is deluded that most people who follow Maulana Tahir Saifuddin are stupid or ``common folk``,he is sadly mistaken.It is just that they write him off even when they take a look at such secularistic bimbaas.
Such as his kind appeal to a dwindling ``uneducated`` contituency which for one reason or another want legitimacy of a fatwa for letting their kids drink,date,fornicate,appear foreign at home,be homos,spurn eastern superior values for inferior western ones & not adopt superior western values.
If they get rejected & ostracised by their community community it does not mean that because of this persecution complex he is right----so many illegals get deported from US but they themselves have to be blamed.ASghar Ali(& his ilk) must be treated with the same contempt as that for an illegal alien.
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 21, 2001 01:17 am
THANK YOU AMERICAURSTRULY---204
[Those who still dont understand what globalization is should look into the news of what is happening in Argentina. People have taken to the streets and they are looting ration depots, burning down shops, and attcking anyone who seems to belong to the elite class. Argentina is the first and a Domino effect will ensue in coming month with most of the Third World countries. This is Globalization.]
Next time you watch any cartoon,comedy show,or read a lampooning magazine please look for any ridicule directed at any of the honchos of multi-nationals.No you will not find,ever!.That the US is being run by the army & CIA to be in the vanguard of the corporate types.The mortgage-term democracy is nothing but seasonal sport to keep the stadiums full & populace ignorant.Less than 30% popular vote is cast,so if the winning is photo-finish he represents ONLY 15% of adult VOTING AGE Americans only.Is the real number close to 7%?(THINK & THINK hard).
The Drama of Democracy is on & the public is happy as long as the garbage-dumps of conscience & morality are across the oceans.Never forget that the wives & children of Mafiosis think very highly of their husbands & fathers.There is never a doubt in their minds that what the godfathers are doing is ``in their best interest``.
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 20, 2001 11:45 pm
Bijli---211Now who can escape a thunderbolt?
And you did manage to blind me with your light & expose my residence.Not that it is so important or worrisome.Feels good to feel at home in UK,the efforts to Islamise gorra-lands are paying off.In much less time than it took them to colonise the world,they themselves will be metamorphosised.The prediction of George B.Shaw seems to be on the dot.
Maybe by then TNT would be redundant & Hindostaan could be revisited.;).
You are Indira in hindi & Saiqua & Ra`ad in arabee(radiation).....hint,hint ;).
Good Show!Thanx.
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 20, 2001 08:15 pm
What they do not report in the Untied States.CNN--Certainly Not News,the Voice of I`mreekin`,never tell you this.
ENJOY!
________________________________________________
Institute of Islamic Research and Studies
18 December 2001
Reports have come in of a huge explosion of an ammunition dump at Kandahar Airport on the morning of Eid-ul-Fitr, Sunday 16 December 2001, which is said to have claimed some 200 US casualies.
Pro-Taliban mujahideen say that they booby trapped an ammunition store at the airport and exploded it while US forces approached.
After the loss of one soldier killed and three seriously injured last week, in a landmine explosion, the US Marines have been taking extra care in clearing and checking Kandahar Airport and the surrounding areas for mines and booby traps.
They tried to approach the airport grounds from no-man`s land, thinking that it was the least likely area to have been booby-trapped. But pro-Taliban forces were watching them from the peaks of nearby mountains.
The Mujahideen had wired an extremely large amount of explosives for detonation by radio remote control.
Once a large party of US troops were inside the detonation zone, the they exploded the device causing a huge ball of flame to engulf Kandahar Airport. Approximately 200 US soldiers were claimed by the Mujahideen to have been either killed or injured.
US soldiers were reported to be lying on the ground requesting help and water with survivors unwilling to help out of fear of more booby traps. Only several hours later did the US soldiers begin evacuating their dead and injured.
The dead were carried in boxes whilst the injured were evacuated on stretchers. Mujahideen intelligence was sent nearer to the area to obtain exact information on the US casualties. The Americans said only three of their soldiers were injured.
Meanwhile, as eastern Alliance and US forces claim victory in flushing out Al-Qaeda forces from Tora Bora, the Mujahideen say they wiped out an entire unit of US Navy Seal Special Forces.
The troops were attempting to reach a Mujahideen position. As the troops approached the Mujahideen surrounded them and blocked off their escape routes.
The Seals attempted to run but were cut down to the last man. Their identification as Navy Seals was obtained from the identity cards found on their bodies.
__________________________________________________
Posted by
hamzadafaqui
Dec 20, 2001 08:15 pm
Is this the world we want to create?Make no mistake---the Satanists(read:secular humanists) are rearing their ugly head again....Firauns,Shaddads,& Nimrods have always been amongst us.Like Moses,the liberator would come from amongst those raised within the precincts of the palace of the Firaun.The slaves(Brownies)are busy toiling at the pyramids.__________________________________________________
Refugees meeting hears proposal to register every human in
GENEVA, Dec 13 AAP|Published: Friday December 14, 7:18 AM
Every person in the world would be fingerprinted and registered under a universal identification scheme to fight illegal immigration and people smuggling outlined at a United Nations meeting today.
The plan was put forward by Pascal Smet, the head of Belgium`s independent asylum review board, at a roundtable meeting with ministers including Australian Immigration Minister Philip Ruddock this afternoon.
Mr Smet said the European Union was already considering a Europe-wide system, using either fingerprints or eye scanning technology, to identify citizens.
But he said the plan could be extended worldwide.
``There are no technical problems. It is only a question of will and investment,`` he said.
``If you look to our societies, we are already registered from birth until death. Our governments know who we are and what we are. But one of the basic problems is the numbers of people in the world who are not registered, who do not have a set identity, and when these people move with real or fake passports, you cannot identify them.
``It`s a basic rule of management that if you want to manage something, you measure it. It`s the same with human beings and migration.
``But instead of measuring it, you have to register them.``
Mr Smet said the scheme would give people dignity by giving them an identity if their papers had been lost or destroyed.
And he said it would allow countries to open their borders to genuine travellers or asylum seekers, because they would be able to prove the identity of any over-stayers and deport them without argument from their home country.
Mr Ruddock appeared unconvinced by the merits of the plan.
``In principle we would be supportive of a system which would crack down on multiple asylum claims, but a universal identification system would be taking it too far,`` he said through a spokeswoman.
By Maria Hawthorne
[so now one would have to forge a finger print or chop someones finger to use `identity`;rig the retinas & decieve the DNA to exercise freedom?)--The entrepreneur(drop-out)would always beat the MBA or Phd type,the mujahid would always have a higher IQ than a career-enslaved General and one from a madressah would always outshine the Zero(O)-level professional.]---They might look the same & glide the same sky but a vulture & an eagle dwell worlds apart....Iqbal]
Rdesikan:This is to rattle you even more.Pakistanis & Indians(the Zero-level types) are even worse than the US.They are at the receiving end of the thuggery & lo & behold they love every S&M practised on them if only in english! Your post does not deserve an answer.
``Chootyon kee kumee naheen Ghalib
Eik dhoondo hazaar miltay hain
jitnay chaaho Bihar(1)sey lailo
Lutf yeh hai,UDHHAAR miltay hain``
(1) Fill in your domicile.
Indo-Pakis,the zero(O)-level kind are the only ones in the world who want to be banged for bucks--even on credit.But the banger MUST be a goraa(``no blacks please,we are Indo-Pakis``)& service them in ENGLISH(for baghwan`s sake).
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