It\'s Politics Uber Alles In Kashmir ..... And India DM wrote: There could be many alternatives. I am a believer in the Confucian concept of a harmonious society, whereas the British Parliamentary system is based on confrontational politics

Amazing :). So China is a 'harmonious society' now.

So your constitution will be the 'holy book of Confucious' eh ? :) But why should your Confucious book be any more
valid than a holy book from the mid-east ?

aah - that "harmonius society" where you can go to wagah , hold a candle, sway and sing with kuldip nayar. Maybe
Arundhati Roy will be there and sign a book for you.

It\'s Politics Uber Alles In Kashmir ..... And India Dostmittar,

You outdo yourself in inanities time and time again.
Thankfully people like you are not in the IFS.

For the past 60 years, its the folks in the valley asking for more and more, now for the first time, its the other way and demands are being made on them to give back land to Hindus.
This is indeed a dramatic turn of events and reflective of situation.

Btw, look at the quality of this Pak strategist
on Independence day :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_naVAiFByxw

Watch all the related vides for more humor and note
what he speaks is same as the usual delusions of YLH,Tahmed etc. This kind of hate talk would never be on the TV of any decent society,but then we are talking of pakistan here.

This fellow is the elite of Pakistan society !
Remember how Musharraf said that Pakis eat cows wheras
Indian worship cows. This is the level of talk of the self styled CEO/President of a country.

There is not even basic honesty, introspection and acknowledgement of facts. Its always about anger and finding someone else to blame and abuse.

No other country in the world suffers from such massive
societal delusions.

And then there was The Impeachment Issue…
Arjun#358.

Patanjali was from what is today's sialkot.
The Ashtadhyayi has about ~4000 rules. These can
be thought of being predecessors to the backus-naur form
of rules for compilers.
The works of Panini, Katyayana & Patanjali are the basis
for Samskritam and indeed influence all Indic languages.
Also, Panini himself states that he has drawn on the
knowledge of people before him.

Btw - Chomsky is totally different.Nothing that Chomsky
has done comes even remotely close to the genius of
Panini.

America\'s Opportunity in Pakistan\'s Tribal Belt Stuka:

Dont fall into the trap of creating equivalencies where none exist.

Do not be misled by looking at the arguments Pakis make. They claim that it was Zia who radicalized Pakistan.
That is not true !. Zia was only the result of a process that started long time ago.
Remember that 'mujahideen' invaded Kashmir in 1948.
The libraries in Pakistan were cleansed of all books published from India in the 1950's and 1960's.
The schools in Pakistan taught hatred against Hindus from the very beginning itself and massive numbers of Hindus were expelled in the 50's and 60's.
Also keep in mind,that Pakistan itself was a radical new islamic creation. It was economically large islamic state in 1947.

So Pakistani citizens bear full responsibility for their actions and cannot blame saudis, usa etc.

America\'s Opportunity in Pakistan\'s Tribal Belt
jayp,
you are proving right.

There was an article in 'The Nation' on how many
of the so called sectarian groups have made a big come
back in Karachi. These groups are now asking that
the shia in Karachi to start paying jizia of Rs.20000
per month.

Now Farzana Versey will probaly have to pay jazia
to visit her royal cousins in Karachi.
Even Rs350 coffee may have some jazia added on top -
but to Persian royalty that should be nothing.

An Ode Called Amritsar #70 Mystic,

Sure, compare the record of India with Pakiland.
The number of victims of riots in India is nothing compared to the genocidal nature of the Pakistani government and establishment.

In this century, the achievements of India in building a decent society is superior to that of any other country. Considering the poverty, illiteracy, 500 kingdoms etc that challenged India in 1947, building a billion people democracy with diverse people is an achievement of the monumental proportions. Tip your turban to the people of the dharmic civilization.
Since the American constitution of the 18th century, The Indian Constitution is the most egalitarian of the world.

When it came to civil rights the Indian Constitution was better than America (only in 1965 did the US catch up).
When it comes to womens suffrage, India was ahead many european nations. Same with affirmative action etc etc..


wake up from your delusion about India and Pakistan being equal-equal.

An Ode Called Amritsar Guru,

Just a suggestion: Long posts are beyond the comprehension of the average pakistani interactor on this site.

It makes sense to keep every post to less than 15-20 lines (max) and provide a link wherever necessary.

Keep focus on one topic at a time, else, you will be giving your detractors opportunity to change the topic.

An Ode Called Amritsar articulating:

I am not talking of Bangladesh (even in Bangladesh, there is an outlflow of hindus slowly and the govt of Bangladesh with its Vested Properties Act - has refused to return Hindu property back to Hindus. ).

In West Pakistan - the outflow of Hindus into India was not just during partition!. But, a larger outflow of millions of Hindis India happened in the years between 1948 & 1960 !! . The Govt of Pakistan was highly instrumental in driving out Hindus by all means of intimidation.

Finally, The Dharmic Traditions do not have a 'God' as you see in islam/christianity or judaism.
All the Dharmic traditions are based on principles of yoga and gaining moksha/nirvana, not with whether there is a some moon good Lah or not.

Its interesting that in your responses you still try to equate India & Pakistan as being equally complicit - that shows that people like you and Ras are really only looking for peace of convenienc and, not acknowledging facts.
There is no honest introspection and contriteness in folks like you.

An Ode Called Amritsar #52 articulating,
You are truly displaying your k for kafir education.

Look up the definition of genocide at UN Convention on prevention of genocide.

The Govt of Pakistan has intentionally, in whole or part:
a) killed hundreds of thousandas Hindus of east pakistan in 71
b) expelled or converted millions of hindus in west pakistan significantly after the 47 partition !
c) actively encouraged the expulsion of hundreds of thousands of kashmiri hindus from the valley
c) killed tens of thousands the shias in northern areas
and turned them into a minority by settling panjabis.
d) has instituted bigoted laws discriminating against
small groups within the country and marginalized them.
e) supported, encouraged the illegal occupation,
,encroachment and destruction of hundreds of temples
since 1947.

What else - dude ?
The paki govt fits the definition of a genocidal govt perfectly. Every head of govt of Pakistan since 1947 fits requirements for being put on a Nuremberg type trial.

"articulating" - its people of your ilk, the disciples of TNT, who indulge in orwellian doublespeak and call others
hateful for pointing out the truth.

Pakistan can improve only after acknowledging the truth,
but then to the children of Jihnabhai, truth is of no consequence. You guys were pretty happy to support terrorism and kill Indian citizens, but now when things are turning against you, you squeal and become doves.


ps: JihNabhai changed his typical gujju name to sound more
arabic and thus became Jinnah.
Truth can be stranger than fiction indeed !

An Ode Called Amritsar Ras #26 writes:
"If only the governments of India and Pakistan would come
to their senses.. the peace dividend would be enormous."

Ras - I am amazed at your gall to equate the governments
of India and Pakistan.

For most Indians, Pakistan is a terrorist state that has conducted multiple wars against India, pushed in terrorists and killed Indian citizens for 60 years one way or another.
Pakistan is a genocidal state that has literally wiped out its hindu population. Pakistan is a unethical state that has institutionalized bigotry on its lawbooks.

Get out of your delusion.

A Journey Interrupted: Being Indian in Pakistan by Farzana Versey
As I pointed out in #143, #145 & #146, the elites had indulged in a land grab in pakistan while holding onto property in India.
FV posts some irrelevant article about Aga Khan supporting the british. What is important is the Agakhan being president of the muslim league and advocating pakistan!

Coffee at 225Rs is probably needed, to mask the stench of hypocrisy.

Swat: Can the deal work?
Satya,

You should first notice that the name 'Senna'
its ibn Senna - the persian :)

Of course, ibn senna was influenced by charaka samhita and
ayurveda - but its preferable to go to arabia.

A Journey Interrupted: Being Indian in Pakistan by Farzana Versey
Arjun -

It is not just Bangladesh, Pakistan has massacred tens of thousands of Balochis in the 1980's , eliminated thousands of shias in the northern areas completely pakjabized Pakistan-occupied-kashmir and changed demographics.[This is one of the reasons a plebiscite cannot be held ]
This is also why many Punjabis claim to be of kashmiri origin!

Musharraf was also instumental in massive massacres of locals in gilgit, northern areas.

So next time - remind pakistanis about
a) massacres of many tens of thousands of balochis
in mid to late 70's
b) elimination of the shias from northern
areas/gilgit.
c) elimination of shias and massive army killings
in karachi.

A Journey Interrupted: Being Indian in Pakistan by Farzana Versey
One has to keep in mind that in 1940' and 50's the
middleast was nothing. The Indian Rupee was accepted and
major currency in Saudi Arabia till 1965.

Only when oil really started flowing in the 1960's and
dollarization in the 70's the middleast really matter.

So in 1950's who ever was the leader of muslims in the subcontinent could claim leadership of the ummah. That is why many pakistanis have this delusion of the ummah and they being leading nation of the ummah etc. But since 1950's the world has changed but pakis still remain in the past.

A Journey Interrupted: Being Indian in Pakistan by Farzana Versey Arjun/Mohar et al

You should know about the contributions of Aga Khan to the pakistan movement. The aga khan Sultan Shah was the first president of the Muslim League.
people like FV consider themselves to be from Iranian
royalty (this is true among some of the elite muslim folks in Hyderabad, Andhra pradesh). Wherever this elite class of muslims live in India, you will notice that there are no-go areas and riots.

So if one thinks of oneself as being of persian royalty then 100rs coffee is nothing.

When partition happened, many members of rich muslim families left for pakistan while other members stayed back to protect the property in India. This way
they maintain ownership of property in India and at the same time go and take over property of hindus kicked out of pakistan.

The ismailis, ahmedis were all for partition, because they thought they could takeover leadership of pakistan and islam. But, things turned out otherwise and the devbandis who followed them to pakiland had other ideas.

This is the reason farzana's , yasser hamdanis hate the Mahatma and dislike India.
Now you know the rest of the story.

A Pakistani-American in India
Dost-Mitter,

You are extremely unethical individual. You like to sugarcoat your comments to the pakistanis, while at the sametime trying to demonize Arjun.

Your knowledge of history is minimal to non-existent. You make false statements like "This did not happen on a large scale during the Mughal rule, in Nizam's Hyderabad, Bhopal or under many Muslim rulers where, I believe, major Hindu festivals were observed as holidays"

What are you smoking ?
Would you care to define what is 'large destruction' under Mughals rule ? - Babur, Aurangzeb ? Even Akbar had his share of destruction. The Golconda/Bahmani kings in 14-15th century indulged in destruction as well.

Let alone your knowledge of history - your economist skills are fairly limited as well.
Thankfully, the new India is more confident and does not need the pusillanimity of your type.

See what Tasleema Nasreen says:
"These people are more dangerous than Muslim fundamentalists. You know fundamentalists, but this section is crafty and wears a mask and it is difficult to unmask them".

See the full interview here:
href="http://www.deccanherald.com/Content/Aug122007/national20070812 18613.asp

Dost-Mitter, put in an effort to learn facts.
Even you have hope.