The “D” Word RE: 195 Zahra J

It is a relief for us all that your are now ending your barrage :) For a person to stigmatize and stereotype an entire nation of hardworking men and women I think not only is indecent but is inhumane.

May Allah help you through your psychological trauma and your difficult times. The same goes to you and Farzana. Though let me tell you, I have very close friends whose best friends were shot right in front of them, they did not go and blame it on the rest of humanity.

Hum mein aur un mein zameen aur asmaan ka faraq hai. We just had the qurbani eid fly us by, what lesson did we learn? That Hazrat Abraham was willing to sacrifice his son for Allah, that this was a test. Allah tests us all in different ways. Through trials and tribulations as the quran states. To speak out against injustice is definitely a right and is the right to do, but to blatantly stereotype an entire population I believe is not fair and is reprehensible.

I wish you the best in your life, you have not gone through even 1% of the pain that I did, but I`m not going to point my blame on the men and women of the world :) May Allah bless all of those men and women who are sincere in their beliefs and in their deeds.

Shabber

The “D” Word ZahraJ

Your Dad was a South Asian muslim male was he not? So is my Dad, so is the father of your father, so is the father of your mother, and so are all of the males in your family

Please be mindfull of your comments and of the honorable name `Zahra` the daughter of the prophet (pbuh)

The “D” Word >Last but not least, a progressive, independent and outgoing woman should stay 100 miles >away from the south asian male breed.

As long as the south asian male breed stays away from progressive, independent and outgoing woman such as yourself and as long as you move away at least 100 miles to an island in the middle of the indian ocean away from the mainlands of india, bangladesh, sri lanka, and pakistan, I`m sure you won`t end up marrying someone from the south asian male breed and thereafter every thing will be fine :)

Shabber

The “D” Word I`m not going to vouch for guys or girls, men or women, husbands or wives, I think this divorce issue is not restricted to the female gender. There are many men out there who have found themselves on the wrong side of the boat as well.

I think its our culture, its our lack of pure Islamic values, its our rapid immature modernization and westernization, and its a growing indication of individualism that has crept into our society.

Unfortunately, we will end up in a society with all of us divorced :) and the few remaining marriages will be based on political and economic alliances as opposed to mutual love and understanding.

Karma Camry I agree with you that up till this year the Camry had really attracted the hearts of those from the barrey sagheer, however, if god has given you any vision at all, even 10% :) I think looking at the 2005 Camry should make you throw up.

The design is abhorable and in terms of quality, I`m beginning to hear performance issues developing in that model.

Tsunami We are collecting funds to distribute to the disaster victims through the aid agencies. Our karachi-based charity organization KKF (www.kkfonline.org) regularly provides relief.

Please send your check or money orders to and write your SS# or National ID number on the check:

In Pakistan
ST-7, Block-14, Federal B Area, Karachi, Pakistan
Phone: ++92 21 6333811 – Fax: ++92 21 6323839

Account Title: KKF
Account No: 3650-0
Bank: Allied Bank of Pakistan Ltd.,
(Address: Dastagir Colony Branch, Federal B Area, Karachi)


In the UK
Account Title: MQF
Account Number: 3932079
Sort Code: 30-98-07
Bank: Lloyds TSB
(Address: 105 Station Road, Edgware, Middlesex, HA8 7JL)

In the US and Canada
Account Title: Khidmat-e-Khalq Committee
Account Number: 004125586890
Bank: Bank of America
(Address: 443 School Street, Woodbridge, NJ 07095)


Please indicate on check or money order South Asia Disaster Relief
A tax reciept will be mailed back to you as well.

Kind Regards
Shabber Abbas
shabber_abbas@hotmail.com

Punching Bag Dono matlabi, so what if the sex was fun? I feel sorry for the kids, aik kee maa dosrey key sath soney key lyea na sirf tayyar balkey adamant lol even though her father was in the vicinity, and 2. the man whose only aim was to get her back in bed. If he needed to go out of his way to get this done, then marriage is just another name for sex and i don`t agree with that.

But I do give the author full credit for illustrating what unfortunately is probably occuring with a number of Pakistani couples these days.

Judicial Murder of a Prime Minister ZAB, remember Bangladesh, idhar hum udhar tum, jo karta hai woh baad mein khudhee bhuggatta hai,

Altaf Hussain Visits India: His Keynote Speech nakhok carefull excluded the beginning portion of the essay, however I do give him credit for providing the link.

A love-hate relationship


By Ayaz Amir

The Muttahida (formerly Mohajir) Qaumi Movement (MQM) has had a love-hate relationship with the army.

There is enough anecdotal evidence to show that General Ziaul Haq and the ``agencies`` - the catchall word most commonly used in Pakistan to denote the grim underworld of army intelligence - had a powerful hand in the birth of the MQM, the purpose of this benign exercise being to build, in Sindh, a counterweight to the Pakistan Peoples` Party.

Did the agencies know what they were doing, what genie they were letting out of the bottle? Outstripping the goals of its mentors, the MQM soon grew into a powerful organization in its own right, the uncontested voice of the Mohajir under-privileged in Karachi and Hyderabad.

The MQM`s theme, with its echoes of fascism: the victimhood of the Mohajir under-class. The MQM`s message: emancipation through collective self-assertion. Its leader: a firebrand orator, Altaf Hussain (soon a Pir to his followers), possessing to an uncanny degree the power to whip up the passions and frenzy of his followers.

In a famous speech, Altaf Hussain called upon the party faithful to sell their TV sets and buy guns instead. Mass mobilization and tactics aimed at instilling fear in the hearts of opponents - I am choosing my words carefully - became hallmarks of the MQM`s politics.

From 1990 when Nawaz Sharif became prime minister for the first time, until mid-1995 when Benazir Bhutto`s interior minister Naseerullah Babar launched a vicious crackdown against the MQM, Karachi remained in the grip of a reign of terror, far more sinister and all-embracing than any terror generated by any martial law. Dissidents went in fear of their lives. Armed gangs collected protection money across Karachi. Newspapers, including the most well-established, bowed before the prevailing winds.

General Aslam Beg, who became army chief on General Zia`s death, had an unmistakable soft corner for the MQM. Well-founded rumour had it that he helped pitch the MQM into the ranks of the opposition to then prime minister Benazir Bhutto.

General Asif Nawaz who stepped into Beg`s shoes had other ideas. Not long after his installation he decided to crack down on the MQM. Marked by half-measures, this move came to nothing, the MQM bruised but by no means incapacitated. In any event, the situation was sufficiently fraught to persuade Pir Altaf Hussain to leave Pakistan and take up self-exile in the United Kingdom.

As part of the anti-MQM campaign, the ubiquitous agencies, encouraged a splinter faction to break away from the parent body and challenge Altaf Hussain`s leadership. This splinter faction was known as the Haqiqis, or the real ones.

Naseerullah Babar`s mid-1995 crackdown, marked by a spree of extra-judicial killings of important MQM workers by the police (workers suspected of terrorism but convicted by no court of the crime) brought the organization to its knees. The Haqiqis ruled Karachi`s urban sprawl unchallenged.

This state of affairs continued until General Pervez Musharraf`s political requirements, allied perhaps with his intrinsic sympathies, brought about another turn of the wheel. At the time of the celebrated referendum in 2002 - an event famous for its long lines of phantom voters, voters spotted miraculously by no one except the eagle-eyed Chief Election Commissioner, Justice Irshad Hasan Khan - and the general elections in October the same year, in which the clear military interest was to manufacture a pro-Musharraf majority - Gen Musharraf needed all the political support he could get. One of the sources of that support was the MQM and its mercurial chief in London.

The basics of a deal settled, the rest fell into place swiftly. Overnight the agencies abandoned the Haqiqis, leaving them to their fate, while shifting their fickle favour once more to the mainstream MQM. The police and other security agencies helped physically evict the Haqiqis from their strongholds in Landhi, Korangi, etc. This change of favourites was carried out with all the ruthlessness and lack of sentiment typical of such turnarounds

The MQM`s share in the federal cabinet, and Ishratul Ibad`s appointment as Sindh governor, are part of this (informal) deal between the MQM and the powers that be.
.... continue on #108 nakhok

Altaf Hussain Visits India: His Keynote Speech Hey guys its batha time, now as your local MQM Gunda Badmash, I Order you to give me a batha or I will I wll lol I will go away lol.

And I assure you, we accept all batha`s in cash, money order, check, or credit card, and soon through the internet, though I`ve been pushing to get this through the higher uppers. Our bathas are tax deductable, (though I don`t know who pays taxes in Pakistan, they might as well get money refunded through our scheme :) and we always provide a receipt and send you a thank you letter for your generous bathas. We need internet bhatha schemes, so that when you`r busy surfing the net, the MQM Bhatta virus shows up lol. We have special rates for Punjabis, a very special rate for Yassir Hamdani :P, and nominal rates for the rest of the public. We have a direct line connection with the ISI, CIA, and Mossad in the event you want to make an inquiry. We do charge a nonrefundable Rupees 100,000,000,000.00 per second payable through indentured servitude.



www.kkfonline.org :)


For all those of you in this audience who have demonstrated tremendous concern on either side of the aisle, let me propose to you in all fairity to the topic, that you provide me your name, number, and address and one day we can all sit down and discuss this topic like civillized human beings.

I`ve been working with our local MQM unit for a while now and I`ve never met a more jolier, brotherly, and dedicated team. If Pakistan was organized along the discipline and organization demonstrated by the MQM, we wouldn`t be kissin up to America`s ass.

Altaf Hussain Visits India: His Keynote Speech Salam alaikum labyrinth1 bhai,

Shabber from NJ, joint-in-charge

I second your thoughts and inshallah all of Pakistan shall prosper in the days to come.

Would you be kind enough to give me your contact info. shabber@gmail.com

We met Faisal Sabzwari bhai just a month ago in new york, and these days Wasim Ahmed bhai is here so we`re gonna check him out tomorrow.

Inshallah umeed hai baqee sab khairiat hogee

KH

Altaf Hussain Visits India: His Keynote Speech She Must Be A Terrorist As Well :)

Deshpande, Altaf call for easing travel restrictions

NEW DELHI: Eminent human rights activist and member Rajya Sabha Nirmala Deshpande and the founder leader of the Muttahida Qaumi Movement Altaf Hussain jointly appealed to their respective governments on Monday to ease travel facilities, and exempt senior citizens of over 6o years of age from visa restrictions.

They made the appeal at their formal meeting here, stressing that such a step would promote people-to-people contact between the two neighbours. The Indian leader, who had called on Altaf at his hotel suite, emphasised the need to strengthen ties with Pakistan.

Deshpande recalled that she had demanded on the floor of the house that the two countries should reduce their armies. India should take the lead. That would help build confidence, she said.

Extending Altaf a hearty welcome, she described his visit as a ``good omen``, expecting it to be harbinger of an enduring peace between New Delhi and Islamabad. Lauding the gesture for the distinguished leader, Altaf agreed that friendship between the two countries on a permanent basis would help resolve the basic problems of their respective residents.

Separately, the Muttahida chief, Altaf Hussain, offered his life as price for a permanent peace between India and Pakistan. ``Let me stand at the border, and be shot dead by Indian and Pakistani soldiers. I hope that the blood from my body would demolish the wall of hostility, tension and conflicts of the last 50 years, and in its place help erect a new and solid wall of love, affection, trust and sincerity between the people of India and Pakistan,`` he told his party’s special cell members in Karachi late Sunday night.

He said he had made that offer during the course of his speech at the two-day international conference that concluded in the Indian capital on Saturday but somehow some of his remarks had gone unreported in the press.

A party spokesman, recalling his speech, said Altaf was the only leader to raise the question of human rights, Kashmir, Palestine, and the situation in Iraq. He told the audience that if removal of Saddam Hussein, despot and dictator, was the objective, then why hundreds and thousands of innocent civilians are being massacred now that the he has been incarcerated.

During the telephonic talk with special cell members in Karachi, Altaf disclosed that Indian Foreign Minister Natwar Singh with whom he had a detailed meeting two days ago, had assured him that visa facilities would soon be made available in Karachi. About opening of Khokhrapar route, Natwar said we are serious about it. There are perhaps some difficulties on the Pakistani side. If it relates to completion of the unfinished portion of the railway track up to Indian border, Delhi is ready to complete that portion of the railway track.

The Rational Warrior Two Points Worth Considering

1. The ethnic complextion of the Pakistani army that committed these atrocities.

2. “For example, the saddest situation today is that of the Muhajirs [Biharis]. Imagine, a child who was born in 1970, that child is thirty-some years old. These are the people who wanted to keep Pakistan. They were persecuted by Bengalis and hoped they would one day be taken back by Pakistan. They cannot be citizens of either Bangladesh or Pakistan.

“I feel incredibly sad, even in this time we do not see the injustice that is happening. My heart bleeds for them, their suffering and misery. Perhaps if there are good relations between these two countries....”

I for one salute this man`s courage, bravery, and good heart.

Church vs Mosque Common sense my dear friend.

Is it not possible that the man has enough money, but just not enough to support a wife?

``What is there to customize when someone has nothing to customize?`` This statement basically defines the world into the haves and the have nots? What kind of classification is this? There are millions of people with money who can only afford for themselves or not even that. ``Under muta, as I had mentioned in a previous post, the requirements and contributions are customizable, flexible unlike permanent marriage.`` For instance, the requirement is $1000.00 per month to maintain a wife. A man can only provide half of that, in a permanent marriage you cannot marry the woman unless you have the $1000.00. In the temporary marriage say you have $500, it can be stipulated that you will contribute that much and the woman can if she wants say she will contribute so and so. What happened to your logic? Please explain yourself.

And then when you talk about inheritence, you again jump to conclusions without thinking before what you are saying.

Inheritence means everything even a penny, your argument is totally ridiculous. Even that penny will go in inheritence according to sharia. Furthermore, say the man improves later economically becomes the richest man in the world? How can you say that there is no possibility of this? According to you, he will die broke lol. Wishfull thinking eh.

Please think before you respond, this is a public forum, and what you write seriously impacts your reputation and your critiquing capability.

Church vs Mosque Your ignorant, biased, and clearly crappy response does not warrant a response by me :)

So take care and peace out.

PS Thanks for letting the world know of your utter ignorance, haha.

Church vs Mosque ``So I would request you to carry on this debate only if you want to do it in the spirit of learning and education. I do not want to offend anyone either. `` During your discussion, you use the term `business` as derogatory, please stick to your word.

1. ``This contract is verbal where a man and a woman agree verbally to perform muta`a for mutually agreed payment/dowry. No witness is required to attest that contract. In other words no one has to know who is doing what and with whom at a certain time.``

The Islamic marriage contract consists of an offer (ijab) and acceptance (qabul) that occur at the same meeting. In order for the contract to be valid, the man and woman must both hear and understand the offer and acceptance. In all schools except the Hanifi school, the general consensus among jurists is that a woman must have a legal guardian to conclude the marriage contract on her behalf even if she possesses full legal capacity. According to all the Sunni schools, the marriage also must be witnessed by two male witnesses, or one male and two female witnesses. The Shia, however, do not require witnesses. There is no requirement under any school that the marriage contract be made in a particular form or ceremony; although the Quran recommends that marriage contracts be in writing, oral contracts are valid. Furthermore, there is no quranic injunction that stipulates that witnesses are required for nikah, however the quran clearly mentions the need for witnesses in surah talaq ayat 3. ``When their waiting period is about to end, keep them or separate from them lawfully. Let two just people witness the divorce and let them bear witness for the sake of God. Thus does God command those who have faith in Him and the Day of Judgment``.
In the Sunni, madhab there is no such requirment for divorce. I ask the questioner to prove where does it say that witnesses are required for nikkah and not required for talaq???

2. ``This sounds like an open conduit to regulated prostitution to me. `` Again a nonacademic arguement, I fail to understand which University of standard will approve your thesis if it is based on such sentiments.

One cannot pursue muta if they have the means for permanent marriage. Let me remind you that permanent marriage has certain constraints, 1. Financial and household obligation on the husband for the wife and kids 2. The payment of mahr (dowry) by the groom to the bride 3. Fullfillment of tamkeen by the wife (providing sexual and reproductive access to the husband) 4. Following the commands of the husband with regard to Islamic law. Therefore, if either a man or a woman is not able to fullfill their end of the deal, then according to both sunni and shia jurisprudence, they cannot marry. Therefore, according to your claim, such people do not have the right to marry? Let me also make it clear that Islam advocates early permanent marriage, and therefore, muta is not a resource for undued pleasure? Furthermore, if according to your formula, every male would be able to have countless wives, etc, I don`t see in what society would muslim girls opt for this arrangement and not get married permanently if they had the resource to do so.

3. You said there is no obligation with regards to the man but you state this as if this is defined somewhere? Under muta, as I had mentioned in a previous post, the requirements and contributions are customizable, flexible unlike permanent marriage. The woman has a right to stipulate what she wants, and so does the man. Is there any woman in her right mind who would not choose to stipulate expenses, maintenance, etc? Furthermore, according to sharia, children born in Muta inherit the fight of inheritence, and are the responsibility of the father.

I would ask that before you make your biased remarks and conclusions, claiming to be a student of this topic, please do some research before you make your opinions known.

I don`t even want to comment on these remarks ``Let me explain my point with an example - suppose the New York port authority today announces that from now on all rides on the buses and subways are free, but there is a voluntary 3 dollar a trip ticket. Who and how many people will then buy the ticket. It is anybody`s guess. But this is exactly what has happened in Western societies these days. People only marry to each other because of their judeo-christian values only, other than that they prefer to just `live together`. Which means that the only real loser in this whole affair is the woman and woman alone who as a single mother is stuck with children. I know that condoms have been invented but isn`t it a fact that after her marketable age a woman is always a loser without a man. ``

I invite the readership to judge them in the light of what I have written in response. There is a clear distinction between permanent and temporary marriage, and the latter has been provided not as an escape but as a rescue option. Those who cannot marry permanently can temporarily. Its as simple as that. :)



Salam alaikum

Shabber