Is Iran Headed for War? 96 by Salim_Chauhan

[For someone obsessed with ``facts,`` you are really going overboard with personal insults, profane statements, and angry responses.]

I NEVER cast the first stone.


[I noticed that almost every time Mr. Rsridhar presented you with undeniable facts,]

Such as?

[your response was either a personal insult or remarks such as ``You are a two-bit piece of garbage. ``Castigating`` him on a little-known two-bit website is only going to inflate your stupid delusional ego.`` and ``You have serious psychological problems. You should convert to Islam.``]

Nope. My insult was a counter-insult, but as always, based on facts. :)


[I thank Rsridhar bhai for his objectivity in this situation]

There is a saying in my language : ``Gems recognize other gems, while pigs recognize tubers under the ground``.


[and I hope that you try to study Sage Vivekananda, that great spiritualist, who had many words of wisdom. ]


You mean the great spiritualist Vivekananda, who, according to your ``prophet``, is headed straight for hell?

Or are those parts of the Koran made up by some bad person(s)?

:)

Is Iran Headed for War? #88 by rsridhar

I was going to post this one first. Anyway, don`t interact with me again unless you have concrete evidence in this matter.

I am not interested in your suppositions.


[Which article? Show me.)
This article damn it! ]

Read the article again. It says ``allegedly``. There are several things to be noted here:

1) Mr. Sreekumar bothered to bring his ``notes`` to the public ONLY AFTER he was denied a promotion.

2) Anyone can write anything in his personal notes. It does not constitute proof.


[Now, u are not going to catch Modi giving direct orders to murder someone. Only a hidden camera can catch him doing that. People in power play a different game. They always make sure their a$$ is not on the firing line.]

That is your supposition. YOU could be killing little babies in the privacy of your home. Only a hidden camera can catch you doing that. Most murderers are smart enough not to kill them in public. They make sure their a$$ is not on the firing line.


[Modi, as the head of state, is responsible for the murders. Period. ]

It`s an idiotic concept, of course. Because if that was true, you would have to put many previous Indian heads of state in jail for the many riots that have taken place in India.

Is Iran Headed for War? #87 by rsridhar

This is my last post addressing you.

[You were not a part of the discussion that took place in chowk soon after the Gujarat riots and the pogrom.]

That`s what I said.

[I had then severely castigated Modi and would continue to do so until the day justice is meted out to him either by court or by God Almighty. He can escape the former but can`t escape the latter. ]

You are a two-bit piece of garbage. ``Castigating`` him on a little-known two-bit website is only going to inflate your stupid delusional ego.


[There is a word for a person who criticises the acts of terror that seemingly come from across the border but silently acquiesces in a similar terror that is perpetrated by his community in his own country. The word is ``hypocrite``. I think that is what u are. ]

It is true that you are obnoxious, but your use of ``u`` instead of ``you`` is REALLY irritating.


[In India, courts are unable to mete out justice because of lack of proof. That does not mean proof does not exist. Only, proof is not presented to court and this is done by coercion, persuation etc. It is clear to those who have been reading the newspapers and editorials since the Gujarat riots that much was done to stifle justice.]

Is that why you never got jailed in India?


[I have no intension of going over all the details.]

That`s because you have no proof other than anectodal evidences, and stories such as that Sreekumar guy, who manufactured his own evidence because he was not promoted.

[It is all there if u are willing to ``google`` and assimilate the information without bias.]

I actually did, and read BOTH sides of the story. There are allegations by reporters from ``The Outlook`` and ``The Hindu`` and counter allegations by reporters from other newspapers.


[Perhaps that is asking for too much. You seem to have already made up your mind that Modi is not guilty. I, however, came to the conclusion that he is guilty after a long deliberation. ]

I`m happy for you. Except for the fact that for someone who has done such an exhaustive search, you don`t seem to remember any concrete evidence against Modi. You are not very different from Islamists.


[CM of a state, even if not guilty, should have owned moral responsibility for the incident and resigned.]

Bullshit. There have been many riots in India over the years. Nobody ever resigned.


[But Modi belongs to that class of human species who have no morals, no human values. He not only took advantage of deep polarisation that already existed in the state, but actually reaped electoral victory after the riots. If his way of electoral success had been successfully replicated in other states, India would today be having a civil war. Most Indians i am sure would have heaved a sigh of relief when Moditva did not spread outside Gujarat. ]

Not any Indian I know. He is very popular amongst Gujratis and non-Gujratis.


[You do your own calculations. I do not need proof but there is plenty proof out there for anyone with eyes and ears.]

Since you have eyes and ears, you should have been able to show some proof quite easily.

But you failed miserably.


[Did u hear about Jessica Lal case? I may not be living in India anymore but i do keep in touch with what is going on. This woman (a fashion model?) was murdered in broad daylight in a restaurant by son of a very powerful politician in Delhi many years ago. Key witnesses disappeared as time went by. Due to lack of evidence, a lower court recently acquitted the people involved in the murder. It is said that the jerk killed her because she refused to serve him a drink!
Did u also read about the flip flop statement of Zaheera Sheikh, a key witness in the Best Bakery case? Do u know that she was recently awarded 1 year jail sentence for perjury in court? Go and figure why she kept changing her statements.
This is what former Chief Justice of India Justice V N Khare had to say after her sentence:
``The majesty of law will be established only when those who coerced, threatened and/or bribed Zaheera Sheikh are brought to justice,”
This is India, where justice is not just delayed but, for those not in the loop of the power structure, often denied. The high and mighty in India walk free after a murder. ]

Yes, but there was a case registered against the perpetrator. Also, by the same token, I could say that you were a serial killer in India, and the court system has failed to put you in jail.


[So, don`t give me that ``where is the proof`` routine. That is a load of bull. I have been around and seen more ghastly things than u can ever imagine. As an intern in the Emergency Room (they call it Casualty in India), i was witness to the horribly mutilated bodies arriving at a major hospital in Delhi during the sikh riots. I can`t forget an elderly sikh gentleman who walked in with his right arm amputated (by the force of a bomb blast) that he held with his left hand. He died soon after. To this day, no politician involved in those riots have ever been prosecuted by court. Reason? Lack of evidence. ]

Yes, but nobody is saying that the Gandhi family is responsible. Now why is that?


[That is why, though India prides herself of being the largest democracy in the world, she is still a third rate democracy. ]

Then consider yourself lucky that you don`t have to set foot in India again.


[This Human Rights Watch Report accuses that key witnesses in Gujarat case have been systematically intimidated, threatened.
And this article talks about Human Watch Report putting the blame squarely on the politicians in the state. The Report implicates the state machinery and says that it orchestrated the riots.]

This proves you are a closet lefty. Human rights watch has more damning reports on the USA, a ``first rate democracy``.

[Read and weep.
Excerpts:
(In the highly critical report, the human rights watch alleged that state officials in Gujarat were directly involved in the killings of ``hundreds of Muslims`` since February 27 and were engineering a massive cover-up.
What happened, it says, was not a ``spontaneous uprising.`` It was a ``carefully orchestrated`` attack against Muslims planned in advance and organised with ``extensive participation of police and state officials.``

The 75-page report directly implicates police officials in all the incidents it documents. It alleges police personnel as telling Muslims that they have no order to save them and in many incidents even leading ``murderous mobs``, aiming and firing at Muslims.) ]

Yes, but if you actually bother to read those reports, you will find that there is no proof implicating Modi.

Is Iran Headed for War? #83 by nasah

[Ramanujan Ramanujan -- what are we going to do with you -- ]

Just provide evidence - that`s all you have to do.


[you spent all ur energy, time and intellect...]

Just like you are spending yours.


[...on rebutting rsridhar very thoughtful analytical introspective post line by line word by word -- defending that mass murderer modi and his goonda clan -- ]

``Thoughtful analytical introspective post`` without a shred of evidence. That tells me something about YOU.


[shame on you...... ]

I think it is the Muslims who should be ashamed.


[once a while have the security and courage to call your own goddam spade a goddam spade.......what happened in Gujarat was very unHindu and very unIndian..... ]

That`s what you guys do all day till the cows come home - CALL this and CALL that, but nary a sign of prooof of evidence. It`s all ``analysis``without any evidence.


[...and YOU have to speak out against some criminals of your OWN community -- ]

Well, I`ve always maintained that if they can prove Modi`s involvement in the Riots, he should be hanged first. But not without proof, and not because YOU or Sridhar FEELS so.


[blaming your own goddam community takes guts -- blaming the Muslims a cake walk for a Hindu like you -- you are a coward against the misdeeds of your own community -- but defnitely brave against the Muslims --]

I think you misunderstood (intentionally?). I did not comment on the rioters - only on Modi.


[ and there is the difference between you and Dr. Sridhar -- rsridhar has guts you don`t....period]

That`s your ``analysis``. :)

I don`t blame without evidence. Show me the evidence against Modi instead of ``analyzing``.



You guys are quick to blame people of other religion without any evidence.

Shame on you. :)

Is Iran Headed for War? #79 by rsridhar

[I think we have discussed this in great detail in the past.]

I was not part of those discussions. Show me the news articles.


[Whatever u may say, there is no doubt in my mind that Modi presided over a pogrom wherein more than 1000 innocent muslims were killed. ]

Well that is YOUR mind.

And that well might be true, but I need proof.


[This article clearly pinpoints Gujarat govt`s culpability. Intelligence chief of Gujarat at the time has gone on record saying Gujarat govt was responsible for the massacre. ]

Which article? Show me.


[Excerpts:
(A police officer in India`s Gujarat state says the government there authorised the killing of Muslims three years ago.
RB Sreekumar made the allegation in notes he kept at the time while serving as Gujarat`s intelligence chief.)
(Officially more than 1,000 people, most of them Muslims, died in religious riots in Gujarat in 2002.

Human rights groups say many more were killed. ]

The less said about these lefty groups, the better. They are constantly fighting over the rights of terrorists captured. Somehow they don`t go to the terrorists and negotiate the rights of people they take hostage and kill. Cowardly hypocrites, I`d say.


[Mr Sreekumar was appointed intelligence chief in April, 2002. Sporadic violence was still occurring in Gujarat then, after the worst of the rioting in February and March. ]

So he was appointed AFTER the main riots were over. WHO appointed him?


[His allegations relate to his dealings with the Gujarat government after his appointment.)
(In the notes, Mr Sreekumar also says that senior government officials sent messages asking him to kill Muslim extremists who were involved in rioting.)
(In another entry in May 2002, Mr Sreekumar wrote that Narendra Modi asked him to concentrate on suspected Muslim militants as hardline Hindu activists are ``not doing anything illegal``.) ]

I can write notes in my notebook saying anything I want. Doesn`t prove anything. It has to be something more concrete than that.


[That Modi has not been found guilty means nothing. In India, witnesses can be bought and if not bought, they are easily intimidated. That was one reason why the venue was shifted outside Gujarat. Still, it is a tall order to prosecute Modi, who is all powerful in that state.]

BULLSHIT. The UPA government is in power and is pretty powerful. They can prosecute anyone. They prosecuted Advani. Whether justice would be done is a different story. But they could have filed suit against him if there was ANY tangible evidence, IF ONLY TO SCORE POLITICAL POINTS. The fact that they could not, speaks volumes to me.


[That is a shame that India has to live with.]

Any time innocents are killed, it is a cause for shame. But if Muslims burnt down a trainful of British people, you`d see educated Britishers behaving similar to the illiterate Gujarati mobs.


[It also shows India`s democracy has a long way to go. ]


I think we are doing just fine with all the troubles we have. As Guantanamo has shown, Indian democracy is one of the strongest in the world, if not the strongest, considering that we have more diversity, more problems, Pakistan and China as friendly neighbors, and terrorists for the last century, and Islamists for over a thousand years.

Apostasy and Islam #619 by Salim_Chauhan


[Ram Bhai,
Thank you for honestly stating that you don`t agree with Gandhiji`s philosophy of non-violence. After all, he was murdered by Hindus who felt as you do.]

Murdering someone for their viewpoint is an Islamic trait. Although Nathuram Godse had no right to take the law in his own gands, and was rightfully hanged, I do agree with his views on Gandhi. It is because of Gandhi that ``Succoolarism`` has beome such a buzzword in Indian politics - where, although Hindus are in the majority, it is open season on their citizens and places of worship, but never a bomb blast in a mosque.


[It is clear that you are representing the viewpoint of that hate-filled group of BJP/RSS/VHP/BD/SP/JS who are no better than the JI/LeT/Al-Kayda/JeM/SS nuts who go around blowing up themselves and others.]

It is the Islamists` fervent dream to be able to show that every religion is just as bad as Islam, and the Animist Shintos pose just as grave a threat to the world as do Islamists.

You are pretty adept at lying, because you have NEVER been able to back up ANY of your statements.

FOR EXAMPLE, why don`t you list out the activities of the BJP/RSS/VHP/BD/SP/JS on one hand, and the JI/LeT/Al-Kayda/JeM/SS on the other hand, and we shall see how they compare against each other.

But you won`t. Because you can`t. This is why lying, for Muslims, IS THE ONLY WAY OUT.



[The main difference between your kind and people like me is that we don`t don uniforms and then act mindlessly based on ``my side - right or wrong!``]

I`m not sure what that means.


[You ask for facts, but I cannot feed you the nonsense that you are accustomed to consuming - such as the facts from the ``Sword of Truth`` website. Such right-wing Hindu sources of information have all the facts about Gandhiji, the Holy Prophet (PBUH), Nehru, Indira Gandhi, Feroze (Khan) Gandhi :) Sanjay Gandhi, Rajiv Gandhi and others.]

:)

``I cannot feed you the nonsense that you are accustomed to consuming`` - then feed me sensible, good information. :))

I know, you cannot. Because your arguments are faith-based.



[Go ahead and live in your hate-filled world of Muslim-bashing.]

It is the FACTS that bash the Muslims - I merely state them. All you have to do is show how my facts are wrong.

But you are not able to.


[I have better ways to look at my fellow human beings.]

When I speak about Mohammed (with evidence and proof), I am Muslim-bashing.

When you speak about BJP/RSS/VHP/BD/SP/JS (without providing any evidence or proof), you are just being objective.


Strange, isn`t it?

Is Iran Headed for War? #72 by Salim_Chauhan

[Ram Bhai,
If that`s all you wanted, you should have said so earlier. I have no problem with you walking away with the trophy.]

I`m gald you agree that Muhammad was an evil man.


[In fact, we can call Bradrum Behram Bhai and let you engage in meaningful discussions where you two can cooperate in producing sugar.]

He is your brother, not mine.


[The record of Mr. Modi`s administration and collusion in the organized slaughter of thousands of innocent victims is well known and well documented. The automated lists of minority-owned businesses and residences, compiled by state authorities and supplied to the BJP/RSS/VHP/JS/BD/SP holy warriors were well-publicized. The complicity of the police in herding victims to their deaths is also quite well-known. In fact, it took the Indian Army to bring the killing to an end.]

So you are unable to come up with any concrete evidence. I don`t blame you, because I have looked quite hard at the available evidence. Other than speculations, no one has been able to come up with anything. It is not for nothing that the Congress party or anybody else was unable to sue Modi. Even the US State Department, whenn pressed about their reasons for denying Modi a visa, said that the only thing they had to go by was the Indian (UPA) Government`s statements.

As for the Indian Army, it was to Modi`s credit that he requested their help to stop the riots from spreading. By the way, did you know the ``fact`` that about 250 Hindus were shot dead by Modi`s police?

Interesting, eh?

[Anyway, you can defend these actions all you want, but most objective people, including the majority of non-Gujarati Indians thinks otherwise. ]

Do not believe polls published on ``Outlook`` or that other bird-cage liner - ``The Hindu``. I`m a Hindu Indian, with extensive contacts within the Indian community. Modi is EXTREMELY popular - in fact, so much so, that he could be the Prime Minister of the country one day.


[As for how you consider the Holy Prophet (PBUH), you are quite entitled to your opinions]

Facts, my dear Salim, facts. Not my opinions.


[ - I just don`t happen to share your views on this topic.]

You are a man of blind faith. So I`m not surprised.


[So, enjoy your hatred and may God give you pleasure in your pursuit. ]

Well, you enjoy your faith-based hatred for the BJP/RSS/VHP/JS etc. and for Modi. Have some fun.

Is Iran Headed for War? #62 by zeemax


[I see. Didn`t they freeze Iranian bank accounts during the embassy siege? How did the Iranians get paid for Oil sale on international market? In Dirhams? Playing Marbles? Sacks of potatoes? There wasn`t even Euro then ....!

Boy ... you`re really dumber than dumber. Peabrain would be too generous a definition for you ... ]


Yes. But ONLY bank accounts under THEIR control. Also, they were not militarily preventing Iran from exporting oil.

So you see, YOU are the numbnuts.

:)

Is Iran Headed for War? #58 by zeemax

[So what makes you think they won`t/can`t do the same now?

Haha ..confirmed .. birdbrain ......!]

Zeemax,

The Americans never tried to cut off Iran`s ability to sell oil on the international market, the last time around. This time they will.

Now who`s the bonehead?

Okay, okay, I`ll supply the answer - YOU are! :)

Is Iran Headed for War? #56 by Salim_Chauhan

[#51, Ramanujan {``When it is the case of Modi, I see Muslims domonising him without discussing any evidence for or against him. To this day, I have not seen ONE Muslim write articles or post any comment inviting discussion about him. It is always taken for granted that he is a monster. In sharp contrast, there have been MANY posts from Hindus on this board wanting to discuss the pros and cons about him....
Muslims need to come out of this kind of blinkered mode, and realize that in a civilized society, democratic discussions are needed before coming to conclusions.``}

Ram Bhai,
The truth comes out - I put the bait out and you fell for it, hook, line, and sinker. :) In an earlier post, you had no problem in giving an example of Hitler being the worst of them. But when the topic shifts to Modi, you are all defense with one too many men on the field.]


Heh heh. Good try. But you see, I have been dealing too long with tahmed32 and Mantolives to let false accusations bother me.

Watch me swat THIS ONE away:

You said: ``when the topic shifts to Modi, you are all defense``.

I said: ``When it is the case of Modi, I see Muslims demonising him without discussing any evidence for or against him.``.

So therefore I was not GLORIFYING him, like you do Muhammad, not even DEFENDING him, like you deo Muhammad, but merely pointing out that there is a complete absence of discussion about him - muslims go straight to calling him names. He might well deserve to be hanged - but I never see any discussion about evidence for or against him. IN COMPLETE CONTRAST, THERE IS DISCUSSION ABOUT THE PROS OR CONS REGARDING MUHAMMAD, FOR EXAMPLE.


[Come on, my friend, Modi was throughly responsible for his administration that gave us a state-sponsored massacre of thousands of innocents.]

And what evidence have you produced in this regard?


[Yes, Modi is a democratically-elected murderer as was Adolf. Now we know where you stand and what your motives are. You, like your hero, just want to shed Muslim blood. ]

This ``proves`` my ``motives``. :)

Therefore you don`t have to worry about not being able to logically refute my arguments. :)

Coincidentally convenient, isn`t it?

Apostasy and Islam #599 by Salim_Chauhan

[Ram by brother,
No problem - I fully understand what drives your viewpoint.]

Salim mere bhai,

I`m glad to see that you have regained your composure. But your ``understanding`` of motives driving my viewpoint is not relevant to our discussion. It is the usual way out for Muslims to discover motives ``driving`` whoever they are debating, and use these ``motives`` to opt out of the debate when they are no longer able to refute logical arguments. It is not because they are not smart. It is because they are always attempting to defend the indefensible.


[I will continue to honor my Holy Prophet (PBUH) and you can continue to demonize him.]

Facts, my dear Salim. It is the facts that ``demonize`` him, not me.


[On another board, you have shown the basic decency of identifying yourself as someone who holds Modi in high regard. That is sufficient reason for us to agree to disagree.]

Now don`t start acting like Tahmed32 or Mantolives. I NEVER made any such statement.


[Thanks for your company on Chowk and good luck with whatever it is that you are trying to accomplish.]

Motives, eh?


[While you continue to hate the Holy Prophet (PBUH), please take some time out to reflect on the life of a great human being and a great Indian - Mahatma Gandhi. Thanks. :)]

I`ve never understood this Muhammad-Mahtma Gandhi connection. I think it was cleverly introduced by Mantolives as a whipping boy to counter whatever it is that the Hindus are criticizing - Muhammad, Pakistan, Terrorism, Balochistan. And he exclusively uses lies and false information for this purpose.

But just because you raised this topic - most educated Hindus don`t care much about him. I think pakistanis spend more time thinking about him than do Indians. I personally think he was more pragmatic than intellectual (Gujratis are usually pragmatic - that`s why they do so well in business). I don`t agree with him about his policy of non-violence - it may have worked against the British, because their mounted soldiers hesitated to run over the Satyagrahis. If it was Muhammad`s army - they would all have been beheaded. The same is true for Hitler, but maybe to a lesser extent. He might have just sent them to concentration camps.

Is Iran Headed for War? #43 by zeemax


[I see. How much time does it take for oxygen depletion for the Iranians as against the Americans? Pray tell.

You forget birdbrain that the Iranians were fighting a ten-year war with the then american stooge saddam at the same time as against americans themselves. Their oxygen didn`t run out for ten years. So ....?]


No. You`re the birdbrain. Here`s why:

Iran was selling oil all through the Iran-Iraq war. So there was no question of oxygen depletion.

See?

No?

Ok....

Is Iran Headed for War? #47 by Salim_Chauhan


[When I meet Indians who are peaceful, objective, and non-violent, I see the benign face of Mahatam Gandhi. When I encounter Indians who are gloating about the prosepct of Muslim blood and drooling at the mouth for violence, destruction, and death against Muslims, I see Modi without his dhoti. ]

When it is the case of Mohammed, I see Muslims glorifying him without discussing any evidence for or against against him. When it is the case of Modi, I see Muslims domonising him without discussing any evidence for or against him. To this day, I have not seen ONE Muslim write articles or post any comment inviting discussion about him. It is always taken for granted that he is a monster. In sharp contrast, there have been MANY posts from Hindus on this board wanting to discuss the pros and cons about him.


Muslims need to come out of this kind of blinkered mode, and realize that in a civilized society, democratic discussions are needed before coming to conclusions. But then this is the legacy of Islam - complete submission without questioning.

Apostasy and Islam #578 by Salim_Chauhan


[Ram betay,
Now that you have full ``spectrum vision,`` it is amusing how you are able to pronounce judgments about Hitler and the Holy Prophet (PBUH). Either you are one hell of an old dude or you have been knighted by the ``Sword of Truth.``]


Salim my son,

One doesn`t have to have been Hitler`s contemporary to come to the conclusion that he was a monster. One can look at loads of historical documents and other evidence and arrive at conclusions. To suggest otherwise would be idiotic, no?

By that same token, one can pronounce judgements on Pol Pot, Nelson Mandela, M.L. King, Genghis Khan, Alexander the Great and most other people. INCLUDING YOUR MOHAMMAD.

Your use of ``full spectrum vison`` as an attempt at sarcasm doesn`t nullify that. As always, you have run out of any logical statements.

And that`s because you are trying to defend the indefensible.


[I would be very interested in your opinions about Ariel Sharon, Menchem Begin, Sardar Patel, Nehru, Indira, Rajiv, Sanjay, Bhagat Singh, Netaji, and various other people who are no longer here to speak for themselves, but of course you are. ]

This piece of sarcasm is also futile. Just because someone is not there to defend themselves, does not mean that they cannot be judged. You have been judging Modi and RSS leaders for the longest time. He is not going to come to Chowk to defend himself, is he? And would you say that you cannot speak one way or the other about Pol Pot because he is not here to defend himself?

A VERY nonsensical attempt at an argument.



[As I said somewhere else to you - When I meet Indians who are peaceful, objective, and non-violent, I see the benign face of Mahatam Gandhi. When I encounter Indians who are gloating about the prosepct of Muslim blood and drooling at the mouth for violence, destruction, and death against Muslims, I see Modi without his dhoti. ]

Good. Keep up your hallucinations.


And btw, your anger is showing. And anger comes from fear. Are you afraid that I just might be right?

Is Iran Headed for War? #41 by zeemax

[Pray tell us how Iran survived after Khomeini`s revolution though the `jugular` had been cut as well as all foreign assets frozen for a whole year when they occupied the american embassy and fed dates to all those diplomats till Nixon made a deal with them?]


....frozen for a whole year when they....

ONE YEAR - not enough time for oxygen depletion.

Is Iran Headed for War?
Is Iran headed for war? In my opinion, almost certainly.

The cynic in me thinks things will start escalating about a year before the next Presidential elections in America. This will help the Bush administration garner the election-publicity machinery that usually goes into overdrive about a year before the elections, to gain support for the war against Iran, and thus for the Republican party. As before, the Democrats will sheepishly second all ``patriotic`` motions raised in Congress.

America is not going to tolerate Iran`s don`t-care attitude. America is the biggest gorilla on the block, and will not take Iran`s very public and not-so-veiled counter-threats lightly, if only for maintaining it`s public image.

I think the war will begin with sanctions and blockades to Iran`s oil exports. That IS Iran`s jugular, and it will be cut first. Those countries that recieve oil from Iran (including the US) will be compensated with Saudi/Mexican oil. And then there will be Iraq-style no-fly, no-access zones carved out consisting of large and vital oil-producing areas in Iran, which will cripple the Mullahs further. The reason that Mushy and Karzai will be able to save face with their respective people is because there would be only sanctions in the beginning, and not full-fledged war. The aerial bombings of nuclear facilities would come next, depriving Islamists of any potential access to nuclear weapons.

While democratic countries should have every right to own nuclear weapons (as long as at least one other country already has them), mullah-run theocracies and other Islamic autocracies certainly should not. And this war could bring to an end an Islamic theocracy.

So I would support this war effort.