Recent Terror in Egypt Manto,
Thank you for setting the record straight. Just because NYC has a high incidence of AIDS, it doesn`t give Haiti a license to blame any occurrence of that disease on New York. Egypt, of all countries in the world, should be the last one to raise a finger at others when it comes to Islamic terrorism. While Pakistan is exporting all its doctors to the west and middle east, the last thing it needs is for Dr. Hey Man Zawa Hairy to lurk around NWFP.

Also, you said ``Third and perhaps the most important lesson for Pakistanis: We must realize that Pan-Islamism is a spent force. Our Muslim brothers are always the first ones to sell us down the river and we have already been bitten one too many times. In recent times, Libya, Iran and now Egypt all have ratted the first opportunity they got.``

Amen, my friend, amen. That is why it makes more sense to abandon this Wahabbi pursuit of Zia`s and all that nonsense about Pan-Islamism. Our time and energy would be better spent on getting back with India. As you know in your heart, the Indians have usually stood up to the West and others - just notice the respect the US is finally showing them. I think Pakistan would be better off as a part and partner of India once again. I think eventually most Pakis will come around to this type of thinking.

Remember, I called it first. I also said that Indian IT companies would be coming to Pakistan for its cheap and talented labor - simply because India by itself cannot sustain the tremendeous growth it is experiencing. Also, cutting costs is good business everywhere.

Salim

Will Pakistanis Listen and Act? I reiterate. As detestable as they are, the illiterate Mullahs are NOT the problem. Rather, it is the so-called ``educated, liberal, quasi pro-western, progressive`` Pakis who have led the nation to ruin. The debacle of `71 was entirely created by them. This struggle has nothing to do with Islam, Pakistan, Kashmir, or anything else. It is a simple case of looting the poor country. These progressives want to get in power and establish their oligarchy. English for them, Urdu for the poor. Whiskey for them, polluted water for the poor. Meat for them, daal roti for the poor. US/UK higher education for them, madrassas for the poor. Comfortable heaven on earth for them, 72 houris in paradise for the poor. Servants for them, servitude for the poor. Birds of paradise for them, what the bird left on the rock for the poor.

Salim

Pakistan’s Choice Whether Jinnah was a failure or not is irrelevant. Pakistan is definitely a failure. If the events of `71 did not open people`s eyes then there is much more than failure at stake here. We are talking about basic comprehension. But then people who blow themselves up just for ``victory`` have a lot to comprehend.
Salim

Pakistan’s Choice Manto #72, {``Salim stop it. Just stop it. Enough already... bring some balance -- you were once sane. ``}

That`s the problem. When Pakis alienate their own, suppress their freedoms, and then expect unquetioned loyalty from those they ostracized and repressed.
First the Hindus and Sikhs, then the Bengalis, then the Ahmedis, now the Ismailis and Shias. ``You were once sane`` remark means that as long as I fought the Indians, I was OK. Well, I ``fought`` the Indians on the Gujarat issue. It doesn`t mean that I will not ``fight`` the Pakis when they are wrong.

However, what is causing this imbalance in my viewpoint is the constant deletion of my messages by the Paki Chowk Staff.

So, I must protest their very Paki actions.

I am, however, sorry that I upset you. I do respect you and your viewpoints.

Salim

Pakistan’s Choice Shishapa #69, {``No matter what we do, we get blamed.``}

That`s right. As the majority and the more sane and mature elder brother, you guys should have forcefully prevented us from committing suicide. :)
Just because a stupid crying infant wants to leap off the 45th floor doesn`t mean you let it.
Salim

Pakistan’s Choice Manto,
The more the Paki Chowk Staff suppresses my thoughts, the more convinced I become of the futility of supporting Pakistan - a nation of people who put up with tyranny, denial of human rights, and subjugation of individuality.
Salim

Mr. Rsridhar,
I apologize for using a nic similar to yours. It is meant to hide behind your esteemed name to get my own viewpoints past the Paki Chowk Staff.
Thanks,
Salim

Pakistan’s Choice #62, Manto, {``However there is absolutely no question of reunification. We don`t want it and they don`t want it I am sure.``}

They won`t give up Kashmir and our people won`t rest till we get what they will never give. Sounds like a Catch 22. We will continue to fight over what Pakistan should become. In any case, Muslims were never one since the 7th century and will never be one. It is useless to keep trying to attain what we can never accomplish.

Calculating percentages of Muslim populations in countries and provinces is useless. Muslims are also members of other groups - two legged creatures, mammals, short people, tall people, dark people, light people, poor people, rich people, and so on. Why should religion be a primary means of identification?

Even on Chowk, we are definitely not alligned by religion.
Salim

Pakistan’s Choice Vivek #64, {``Can`t understand why every time a Pakistani writes an article about Pakistan, he has to compare it with India``}

Vivek, my friend, the reason India is always brought into the discussion is that we started Pakistan with a dissection of the motherland, India, Hindustan, Bharat, Barr-e-Saghir - call it what you want. Whenever a calamity occurs, people tend to compare life before the tragedy. Nothing offensive is suggested when Pakis compare post-partition to pre-partition, even though the latter is no longer true.
Salim

Will Pakistanis Listen and Act? Interesting post by Mr. Premwalla that was filtered out by Chowk Staff. First thing that Pakis have to learn is to give up selective censorship - that is why they and their institutions have no credibility.

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#141 by premwalla on July 25, 2005 6:38am PT
Sushil, {``He said that the foundation of “real democracy” had been laid in the country and hoped that it would not be derailed. He said the focus would remain on transferring the benefits of economic development to the masses by reducing poverty, providing jobs and checking price-hike.

****It is far from certain. Until and unless there are three or four fair elections the jury is out on these claims.**** ``}

Couldn`t agree more with your comment above. Thanks for the timely article.
Good review with a point by point commentary.

Don`t forget that Pakistan never successfully established a democratic base. From its inception Pakistan, and even its mid-wife, All India Muslim League, were not really democratic, both have been run by various despots, some benign others ruthless. The real flaw in Pakistan stems from the so-called ``progressive liberals.`` These so-called ``westernized`` politicians had nothing in common with the West other than the occasional use of toilet paper interrupted frequently by scotch and soda. The utter failure of democracy in Pakistan led to an equally corrupt series of military dictatorships. Now the mullas want their turn at the helm for Pakistan`s final destruction.

To understand the failure of democracy in Pakistan, one must closely examine the so-called ``progressive liberal`` Pakis and their insidious plans for an oligarchy of the elite. The want women`s rights, but only for their spoiled, bored, and obese wives, daughters, and sisters. They want education, but only English-medium for the elite, the rest of the country can be educated in useless Urdu-medium dead end public and private madrassas or government schools. They want to train doctors and engineers, but only for export to the West and Middle East to bring in hard cash from remittances by this diaspora.

Unfortunately, the real solution to Pakistan`s problems lies in the destruction of this self-serving class of selfish epicureans. Let`s let the Mullas finish off these internal enemies before they themselves meet the same fate. Then the country can rejoin its rightful place in undivided India.

Salim

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Towards a shackled society, perhaps Premwalla,
Very logical posts.
Thanks,