The Bubble Bursts Re: # 455 by kaalchakra

[Still, this focus on Muhammad, by Muslims and nonMuslims, is misguided. All of us should let the man rest in the hereafter.]

Totally wrong, the focus should be right there on the dude. I`ll tell you why.

If you took Muhammad out, and you compared Islam with Christianity, Sikhism, Buddhism, Hinduism or any religion/cult with codified sets of belief, you would find ideosyncratic crap stuck in timewarps everywhere in each of the beliefs. And additionally you will find that every religion has among their numerous pillars, the four specific islamic pillars: charity, fasting, pilgrimage and prayer.

What makes Islam what it is is the additional, unquestionable and the most important notion that you have to live *your* life by the *practices* of Muhammad in the social setting of *his* times.

And this being the first and the most important pillar, it means that you are tied to Muhammad and Muhammad`s baggage, and it is impossible to shake off that baggage except by apostacy. You can discard all the other pillars - no mullah would care a toot. Did anyone firebomb you because you never went to Mecca? But you are chained to your death to that first pillar, and every mullah & jihadi watches you on that.

That is why as much as the liberal in a ``zeemax`` wants to jump out and reject much of the nonsense he sees and tries to rationalize, he will be pulled back again and again. By himself. By the Muhammad chained to him.

The only way to begin reforming Islam is to demolish the myth of Muhammad. And the really ironic thing is that is the easiest thing to do. The Koran itself, the hadiths and all the supplementaries are shit full of contradictions and the personal picture of Muhammed in these is pretty pathetic. That is why spindoctors aka mullahs are so important in Islam. So that ``zeemax`` doesn`t see what ``khalid_ahmad`` sees so effortlessly.

Another time lets see how Muhammad himself allows a way for taking Muhammad out of Islam. But for now, the focus must be there right on him. It is important to demystify this character.

The Bubble Bursts Re: # 450 by dostmittar

[I have a radical and politically incorrect reaction to this. I think that all non-muslim countries should pass laws saying that their citizens can freely convert to any religion of their choice but conversion to Islam would be a criminal offence.]

Not likely to happen because non-muslim societies are also relatively liberal societies where principles of human equality, freedom and justice form unshakeable pinnacles of written constitutional law. Beyond empty sloganeering, these are truly alien and blasphemous concepts in Islam.

However to your point, western nations have completely failed in the theory that oppressed muslims granted asylum would somehow inspire beacons of democracy and human rights back in their muslim homelands. Instead, the cancer has spread within the west itself.

Hence, a more practical idea would be to
(i) totally deny asylum/immigration to muslims however prosecuted they may be
(ii) aid prosecuted muslims directly in their own lands.

This would prevent the whiskey drinking pork eating moderates from taking the easy flight out, and have them slog for their rights in their own lands. The Afghan and Iraq policies may wear vague resemblance to this. Besides the already asylumed moderates and their next generation have proven sufficiently that they can fight for muslim rights in western countries quite effectively, with bombs, flag burning, jihadis and all.

9/11 has made far too many people aware of Islam and its dark & dirty secrets. The reality of Islam can no longer hide behind the romantic flourishes painted by imaginative hollywood sagas. People are no longer buying bakwaas slogans such as ``this is a peaceful religion``, ``this is the fastest growing religion``, ``muhammed is mentioned in the bible, testament, vedas, upanishad``, etc.

So the decent muslims have created a new opening with a manifesto - to make muslim countries allow free conversion, among other things. This would be a good place to start.

Muslim Manifesto

I can bet some shape of form of this manifesto will make it - not to the OIC - but the UN. It would be tragedy if that didn`t happen.

Kibbutz Criminals
What happened suddenly? The jihadis seem to have vanished and we have a horde of sufi story tellers! Did I miss some celestial event?

Kibbutz Criminals Re: # 331 kaalchakra
[Like Kashmir, Palestine is both a territorial dispute and a religious dispute. For some it is more terroritorial than religious, for others it is more religious than territorial. ]

Kashmir is a dispute purely created by Pakistan, which never wants to play by the rules of any game. Religion is only an excuse used by the pakis. The whole Kashmir thing is based on the ridiculous paki premise that Hari Raja was the hindu ruler of a muslim majority state, so he had no say.

So frikkin what? Saddam was a Sunni ruler of a Shia majority country.
Mushy is a mohajir ruler of a pakjabi majority country.
JFK was a catholic ruler of a non-catholic majority country.
There are countless other examples.

So shall we tear up all the legal documents and treaties signed by all these guys? Pakistan is a poor loser in everything and the sickest whiners in the entire world.

Kashmir is not even worthy of a territorial dispute. Pakis can barely hang on to the land they have with absolutely no administrative control in vast parts of its existing land. It doesn`t deserve any more land.

Kibbutz Criminals Re: # 318

[I have said before, Palestine/Israel is a territorial issue, not religious. ]

Yes you have said it before and it has been refuted before as sheer nonsense. If it is territorial issue, what are the territories based on? Football teams?


[ I will venture to say that the Jews are as much being used by those `evil` forces (which Masadi often refers to), as Muslims. Only problem is that Jews know it and use them back; while most Muslims don`t even know what the entire game is all about. I say most because perhaps the Jehadis do.]

So, if you got that revelation, enlighten us mortals too.
- What is the ``entire game`` about?
- What are the ``evil forces``?
- Since you seem to know why are you not sharing with the non-jehadi muslims?
- How come jews know about the ``evil forces`` but muslims dont? Are you suggesting that the muslims are intellectually inferior to the jews?

Australia’s Muslim youth -- A Battle for their Hearts and Minds Lillie,

You meant ``7th Century behavior`` I presume?

The reason for this behavior is that Islam does not have inbuilt mechanisms for self-reform or keeping up with the times. Even the much vilified Catholic church periodically apologizes for the past misdeeds of its popes or members. That is an example of civilized attitude that muslims can emulate.

The Muslim Manifesto is a significant first step in the right direction. This needs to be ratified into an act by the UN and made binding on all Islamic republics and countries with any muslim population. This is a far more deadly and immediate danger to civilized human societies than possibly are AIDS or global warming.

You are right on the dot about Islam being an Arab enterprise. That`s what happens when a huge lot of money comes to fanatics without any effort. These arabs sit in their tents counting moolah from the holes in the ground leased to western oil companies. No hardwork has gone into this earning, and hence there is no responsible behavior in spending it.

Hence they start terror factories, outsource terrorism to countries like Pakistan, train pilots to ram into buildings, fund the families of suicide bombers and build retrogressive societies.

Free societies of the east and west should join hands to ruthlessly exterminate the pests of radical Islam before they turn our societies into theirs.

Australia’s Muslim youth -- A Battle for their Hearts and Minds Lillie,

You meant ``7th Century behavior`` I presume?

The reason for this behavior is that Islam does not have inbuilt mechanisms for self-reform or keeping up with the times. Even the much vilified Catholic church periodically apologizes for the past misdeeds of its popes or members. That is an example of civilized attitude that muslims can emulate.

The Muslim Manifesto is a significant first step in the right direction. This needs to be ratified into an act by the UN and made binding on all Islamic republics and countries with any muslim population. This is a far more deadly and immediate danger to civilized human societies than possibly are AIDS or global warming.

You are right on the dot about Islam being an Arab enterprise. That`s what happens when a huge lot of money comes to fanatics without any effort. These arabs sit in their tents counting moolah from the holes in the ground leased to western oil companies. No hardwork has gone into this earning, and hence there is no responsible behavior in spending it.

Hence they start terror factories, outsource terrorism to countries like Pakistan, train pilots to ram into buildings, fund the families of suicide bombers and build retrogressive societies.

Free societies of the east and west should join hands to ruthlessly exterminate the pests of radical Islam before they turn our societies into theirs.

Kibbutz Criminals
Re: # 310 ballukan
[There is no point trying to act like another Alsatian dog form the Indian side..you have matched Besharam Attabaksh very well so far....it is time for you to go to you leash]

Instead of your ``kuttay kaminay`` dialog inspired by c-grade pirated bollywood movies, how about taking me on the leash with your arguments?

Kibbutz Criminals Re: # 308 tahmed
[Even the earthquake victims are not beyond the scope of ridicule of these indian ``men``. ]

Oh yeah? What if I say that even holocaust victims are not beyond the scope of ridcule of these paki eunuchs? This whole thread would prove my point.

Kibbutz Criminals
Re: # 312

The world has already been violently communalised by Islam. What the whole world is looking for is the cure. But instead of looking inwards, blame is squarely laid on the jews, hindoos, bush,... everyone but themselves.

It is funny you never remembered Besharam so passionately until now. But it provides a clue. That is there is only one cure for this particular malady - the treatment of the criminals should be the along the same lines of the crimes. Any less, they begin to delude themselves that they are the ``sher``. Any less, they begin to wreak more havok emboldened by the ``geedarr`` attitude of the civilized world which would rather be getting along fine with its peace, secularism, democracy and respect for all living creatures. And the accompanying social troubles.

This thread is about jews and them playing victim. But has anyone thought - what was their great crime that millions had to be massacred by another historical g@ndu Hitler? What did they do so incorrigibly wrong to deserve this?

The Bubble Bursts
Re: # 442 by Zeemax

[go see someone to get an `enema`!]

You seem to be an expert on enemas. Did you issue this guideline by any chance:

2449. *If a woman wants to give an enema to another woman, or to a man other than her husband, or to clean her/his private parts with water, she should cover her hand with such a thing that her hand would not touch the private parts of the other woman or man. And the same applies to a man who wants to give an enema to another man or a woman other than his wife, or to clean his/her private parts with water.

How to do an Islamic Enema

Kibbutz Criminals Re: # 304 by malik99

[what if i were to suggest that there is a whole ``holocaust industry`` that is out there milking the european banks, insurance companies, manufacturing companies ]

If there is any industry out there doing the milking it has got to be the Paki IT (International Terror) industry that is blackmailing the whole civilized world by demanding money to control the terror tap. On the other hand, if the civilized world refuses to pay up, pakiland has another trick, that is to hold the gun to its own head and threaten mullah takeover.

More recently pakiland created a new industry, the Paki Earthquake Relief Industry and milked the world to its heart`s content. The world saw through this trick and despite the $$$ pledges only about 15 mil actually got raised, still enough free money for subsidising a good amount of hardware and labor for its flagship IT industry.

But nothing has beaten or can beat the Paki Begging Industry. Under the distinguished stewardship of a private banker this beggar nation goes from one national capital to the other begging for any scraps the world may care to throw at it. Prostituting itself in order to get loans rescheduled, it displays great pride in cooked up statistics about its paper economy - toiletpaper that is.

It is funny to see muslims ridiculing the jews for being at the most horrible crime in modern history, a similar crime once committed by hordes of frothing moghul invaders unleashing their g@ndu-inspired cult on India. But wait, the humor of the karmic cycle is not only going to be funnier but also will have a nice poetic ring to it.

The Bubble Bursts
How`s it pakis? With Afghans squeezing the balls on one side, and Indians on the other? Better than pet goats or 6-year-olds?

The Bubble Bursts Re: # 436 by Zeemax
[than dumping him in Ganga to turn bloated and blue and float around in the company of dead cows ]

Yes, yes... and mixed with hindoo piss and shit. And guess what, the same Ganga ends up straight in the taps of E. Pakistanis. The same water that the E. Pakis drank and beat the shit out of W. Pakis in 1971 like ``shers`` doing to ``geedarrs``.

The same bhindian peshab water flows into Paki. The pakis love it because they keep asking for more of the same water from India.

Everytime you pakis drink water, think of that bloated and blue guy who is now flavoring your water.

Kibbutz Criminals Re:299 by Ramanujan
[And I TRY not to buy anything that has the bedouin script on it]

But even if you tried, you couldn`t find anything that bedouins make. They need western and indian kafirs for everything. Even with all the desert, they wouldn`t be able to make a sandcastle. The only things they make and export with their harems and 6-year-olds are thoroughbred jihadis.

The Bubble Bursts
In short you have delusions that you are ``sher`` but you live your entire lives worse than a ``geedarr``.