Pakistans Permanent Revolution Reply to #283 by Mantolives:
[``1- General Yahya - alcohol loving womanizer
2- Bhutto - alocohol loving womanizer
3- General Niazi - alcohol loving womanizer``
So you think that 1971 did not happen because the Punjabi-Pathan oligarchy refused Bengalis their constitutional rights .... but because Pakistan`s leaders were not pious enough? Do you really think the alleged fondness of Yahya, Bhutto and Niazi for alcohol and women were the issue why Pakistan Army surrendered in 1971? That argument is neither here nor there.]

The root cause of the separation of East and West Pakistan was neither the “alcohol loving womanizers” nor the “Punjabi-Pathan oligarchy”. East and West Pakistan were separated by a 1000 miles of hostile Indian territory, this was the real problem. “Territorial contiguity” is an essential element of any nation state. But it is also a fact that “alcohol loving womanizers” and “Punjabi-Pathan oligarchy” compounded the problems. In 1971 it became quite obvious that East and West Pakistan can’t be kept together at least not as a quasi-Federation (in effect a unitary form of government). Had there been more able leader instead of those corrupt, inept and self-serving generals and politicians some sort of “confederate arrangement” could’ve been made, and the mismanagement and humiliation could’ve been avoided.

Pakistans Permanent Revolution @masadi
[The Quran is not about unreasoned dos and don`ts it is about REASON more so than anything else, comprendey??? Of course not because your professed ``belief`` in the Quran is just a cover for your real ``belief`` and that is your unconditional love for the white man and his system of oppression]

Traditionalism is of two kinds, deliberate traditionalism and unconscious traditionalism. Deliberate traditionalism is a set of rules, customs and traditions made by people for the benefit of the individual and the society with conscious effort and the application of our reasoning faculties. Unconscious traditionalism, on the other hand, is something which creeps into our minds unconsciously and sometimes we are not even aware of it, but it shapes our ideas and ways of thinking.

I consider religion to be a “reformed tradition”. In the 7th century Islam was a step forward from the primitive nomadic culture of Arabia. It united Arabia under one leadership and made it a force to reckon with. Because of this unity Arabs were able to conquer half the world. It gave women their rights. Though slavery was not abolished because it was impossible to do that at that time but the slave owners were ordered to take good care of their slaves and it was considered a virtuous act to liberate slaves. Certain rights were guaranteed to the minorities in an Islamic state. Islam even managed to prohibit gambling, prostitution and liquor which are always and everywhere regarded as immoral and a social nuisance. These were the examples of deliberate traditionalism. A set of laws, customs and moral values which were made for the good of an individual and the society.

But today we live in 21st century. 1500 years have elapsed since the establishment of the first Islamic state in Medina. The society, politics and economy of today’s nation state is much more complex than those simpler times. We cannot find the solutions to all our problems in the Sharia. Neither can we interpret and apply Islamic laws without going into their merits and demerits and using our reasoning faculties. Though Sharia are a set of deliberate traditions but even deliberate traditions are time bound. What holds good today may not hold good for all times and ages.

For example Islam liberated and emancipated women from the primitive tribal customs of Arabia and though it allowed polygamy but discouraged it. Today we cannot allow a male member of the society to have more than one wives because it will be unfair to more than half the population of the world. Similarly today we believe in secularism and the rights of the minorities. We cannot discriminate on the basis of caste, creed and religion. All citizens of a modern nation state must have equal rights and equal opportunities irrespective of their beliefs and religions. By applying our reasoning faculties and the golden rule “do unto others as you have them do unto you” it becomes clear that if you don’t want to get persecuted yourself or the people who hold views similar to your own in a society where they are in a minority then you must not force your views on others who hold opposite or dissimilar views in a society where you are in a majority. This is the essence of secularism. You can persuade people to adopt your views but you can not force people for this purpose.

Finally, I don’t have “an unconditional love for white man and his system of oppression”. The West is facing its own dilemma in the form of disintegration of the institution of family and social and moral evils like drugs, alcoholism, prostitution and pornography. Here in the East we respect our elders and sons continue to live with their parents even after getting married. They donot send their parents to Old Houses when they grow old instead they take care of them. I am not advocating that prostitution and alcohol should be legalized. Not because my faith dictates so. But because I know by using my reasoning faculties that prostitution, pornography, drugs and alcohol are bad for an individual and the society.

Society is in a state of evolution. We have not reached a state of perfection yet and we may never reach that stage. But this doesnot means that we should take a retrogressive stance. We should adopt what is best in time tested traditionalism and also what is good in modernism by applying our reasoning faculties.